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What exactly do you call a spam?

romanimperialXXIXromanimperialXXIX Senior MemberPosts: 229Registered Users
edited October 2014 in Total War Eras Multiplayer
So the other day after an online barbarian brawl between Lusitani vs Suebi (me as the Lusitani) my opponent politely accused me of using a spam army, I was gonna ask him what was I spamming but he left right after that.

My army composition was:

1 Lusinati Nobles as the general (only choice)
5 Veteran shield warriors
2 Iberian Swordsman
4 Lusitani Guerrillas
and 7 Scutarii Cavalry

So was it the extra unit of Scutarii Cavalry that made my army a spam?
I allways like to bring a lot of cav to online battles, and since the lusitani don't have any shock cav my logical conclusion was to spend the rest of the talents on the best cav available to them, if I brought 2 units of Iberian Cavalry instead of that extra one of scutarii my army would stop being a spam?
Post edited by romanimperialXXIX on
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Comments

  • DetailedEyesDetailedEyes Senior Member AustraliaPosts: 4,715Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    I assume you won? He was probably just mad he lost, play how you want. I wouldn't consider that spam at all seeing as factions like Parthia could regularly bring 7 (or more) cav so you're just exchanging any skirmish power for more mobility.
    "We shall have peace. We shall have peace when you answer for the burning of the Westfold, and the children that lie dead there. When the lives of the soldiers, whose bodies were hewn even as they lay dead against the Gates of the Hornburg are avenged! When you hang from a gibbet, for the sport of your own crows, we shall have peace."

    Theoden to Saruman at Orthanc, also my total war philosophy.
  • SetrusSetrus Senior Member SwedenPosts: 18,045Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    What was he using then? I see nothing that looks really spammy...lots of scutarii cavalry, yes, but what other type does Lusitani have? :p
  • romanimperialXXIXromanimperialXXIX Senior Member Posts: 229Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    I assume you won? He was probably just mad he lost, play how you want. I wouldn't consider that spam at all seeing as factions like Parthia could regularly bring 7 (or more) cav so you're just exchanging any skirmish power for more mobility.

    I did, the veteran shield warriors and one wing of cav just crushed all his infantry and the Lusitani nobles along with my other wing of cav costly killed all his own cav and missiles, man the lusitani really give a punch when it comes to melee, to bad they just melt to missiles.

    And my opponent didn't sound mad, he had lost before and was extremely nice and polite so I though I was doing something wrong.
  • montejoconquerormontejoconqueror Senior Member Posts: 284Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Just enjoy their tears!!! What I hate are the cowards that drop-draw battles, I wish there was a way to permanently ban their steam accounts from my games, if there is a way please tell me how!!!
  • romanimperialXXIXromanimperialXXIX Senior Member Posts: 229Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Setrus wrote: »
    What was he using then? I see nothing that looks really spammy...lots of scutarii cavalry, yes, but what other type does Lusitani have? :p

    Iberian cav, and Cantabrian cav but the last one is missile cav.
  • SetrusSetrus Senior Member SwedenPosts: 18,045Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Iberian cav, and Cantabrian cav but the last one is missile cav.

    Well yes, that's my point...not exactly useful cav in many situations. (Cantabrian cav might be good though, given some stuff of Heir of Carthage's I've seen)
  • romanimperialXXIXromanimperialXXIX Senior Member Posts: 229Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Setrus wrote: »
    Well yes, that's my point...not exactly useful cav in many situations. (Cantabrian cav might be good though, given some stuff of Heir of Carthage's I've seen)

    aahhhh... I see I'm not good at spotting rhetorical questions :p
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Posts: 1,737Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    usually more than 6 of the same is exceeded as spamming.
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • 59tiger9559tiger95 Senior Member Posts: 681Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Yeah this is cav heavy, but It is hardly a spam build.
    "A man who will not die for something is not fit to live"- Martin Luther King Junior

    Hey if you have the time check out my YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/59tiger95
  • LanceClanLanceClan Senior Member Posts: 138Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Whatever your opponent says is spam is spam. You must accept their declaration at all times.
  • CagatayKhanCagatayKhan Senior Member Posts: 814Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    New Noob Faction is "Lusitani" in Barbarian vs Barbarian
  • BMNOBLE981BMNOBLE981 Senior Member Posts: 1,194Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    More than half the army are the same unit type.
    Dr Zoidberg "We fight over matters of honour, and whether or not abbreviations count in scrabble. THEY DON'T"

    “My fault. What I said in the guild was incorrect: rather than ‘death is certain if you follow me’, I actually meant ‘come along and I shall slaughter the lot of you’.”

    Ainz Ooal Gown Overlord Light Novels
  • BebechoBebecho Member Posts: 55Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    This is a strong rush bulid. This is not spam, but use of Lusitani strengths. 8 Swords, 7 cavalry, 4 spears it is a normal army. Easy to beat by pikes and missles or horse army or Rome. Fighting as a barbarian should have armored spearmen. 4-5 troops missles, good cavalry on the flanks and a lot of swords.
  • TheGeorgianOneTheGeorgianOne Senior Member Posts: 145Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    When people loose they tend to get frustrated. Calling your army a spam is one of the ways to ease the frustration.

    I recently heard that my suebi army was 'trolly' and my opponent kindly rage quitted aftrerwards. He was clearly loosing a battle with his fairly balanced roman army. I had 4 spears, 4 roundshield swordsman, 4 jav cav, 2 sword masters, 2 berserkers and 4 horse runners. By all means not a trolly army. I was successful pulling off fast charge with pride though and he committed all of his infantry at once, which lost him the battle...

    Frustration, that's it.
  • CipirekCipirek Senior Member Posts: 324Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Spam 8 same units its simple

    Ardiaei spam of 8 same units, like sparta .. box and way to win
  • AggonyDuckAggonyDuck Senior Member Posts: 3,641Registered Users, Smiley
    edited October 2014
    Spam tends to be a good excuse when a player doesn't want to admit responsibility for their own defeat. It's vague and flexible enough to be applied to everything and carries the notion of unfair play, yet while being totally within the rules of the game.
  • CipirekCipirek Senior Member Posts: 324Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    mhm.. thts true, in real battles all great generals use " spam" :D
  • RiemannRiemann Senior Member Posts: 126Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    New Noob Faction is "Lusitani" in Barbarian vs Barbarian

    Show some respect to the faction that you lose to!
  • 59tiger9559tiger95 Senior Member Posts: 681Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Cipirek wrote: »
    Spam 8 same units its simple

    Ardiaei spam of 8 same units, like sparta .. box and way to win

    well ardiaei and sparta don't have to many options for front line units
    "A man who will not die for something is not fit to live"- Martin Luther King Junior

    Hey if you have the time check out my YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/59tiger95
  • romanimperialXXIXromanimperialXXIX Senior Member Posts: 229Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    New Noob Faction is "Lusitani" in Barbarian vs Barbarian

    If what you really wanna say is "the Lusitani are easy to use vs barbarians" then I agree, their infantry is great at melee, veteran shield warriors win against all the sword units of the same tier and Lusitani nobles are f*****g BEASTS, bring Oathsworn or Pretorians doesn't matter, they still lose to these nobles, the best way to beat the Lusitani is bringing a skirmish army because their armor is pure ****.

    The only reason I'm playing as them is because I "bought" HatG during that 75% promotion, my main online faction right now is actually Carthage for some reason...
    (Yes I'm aware that kinda contradicts with my username..)
  • Pine89Pine89 Senior Member Posts: 580Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    there's no way to find a common definition of spam. but yes, generally more than 6 of the same unit is considered spam by many (especially in tournaments). your army comp is not that spammy imo, considering that you have at least 3 different units types in substantial numbers in your build. I mean, it's not like I'm gonna count all your units and cry spam if I find 7 instead of 6, not that much of a big deal. on the other hand I admit I'm going to get irritated if I see single unit spams or stuff like 10 of the same and 10 of another. spam can also depends on the faction.. sparta, ardiaei and the nomads are pretty much forced to spam because of their roster, nothing to say there.

    spams are disliked mainly because you can't really predict them and there have been times during this game life when you could spam a single elite infantry unit, right click and win. regardless of any maneuvering or skill involved. it's the easy way out, it's kinda like giving up the strategy part in a strategy game and relying purely on the fact that you spammed that unit instead of on how to use your units.

    but then again, people will blame even their mother before blaming themselves for a defeat.:p
  • FriedrichSFriedrichS Member Posts: 33Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    AggonyDuck wrote: »
    Spam tends to be a good excuse when a player doesn't want to admit responsibility for their own defeat. It's vague and flexible enough to be applied to everything and carries the notion of unfair play, yet while being totally within the rules of the game.

    This.

    Most rule sets I've seen limit max 6 of the same unit. But I would hardly call the army in question spam or unfair. Seems that the player who lost was frustrated and came up with a lame excuse. I wouldn't worry about it.
  • CagatayKhanCagatayKhan Senior Member Posts: 814Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Max 6 units always dont spam.. Do 7 torax spam for Athens? Roma pick 6 principes and + 1 legion same thing...
  • GabeedGabeed Junior Member Posts: 4Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Max 6 units always dont spam.. Do 7 torax spam for Athens? Roma pick 6 principes and + 1 legion same thing...

    Indeed. The "spam rules" one hears reference to from time to time in multiplayer are laughable and completely arbitrary. They favor factions with fairly diverse unit rosters and/or great elite units and thus relatively small armies. My main Ardiaei army gets flak occasionally since I use seven Illyrian Marines in it, have few cavalry, have no true skirmishers, and always am at 20 units overall. And as their Evocati go down in these moments, pincushioned by javelins and surrounded by jabbing spears, the foe doesn't think "I brought a small army full of expensive units and couldn't protect my flanks well," or "Hmm, spending over 1000 denarii on terrible Illyrian cavalry or slingers levied up from the slave population is oft money wasted indeed," but rather, "He spammed." The "default" balanced build of 4-5 heavy cavalry , 3-4 elite archers/slingers, and the rest heavy infantry, elephants, etc should be constantly challenged. It works for the powerhouse factions but certainly not for all.
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Posts: 1,737Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Gabeed wrote: »
    Indeed. The "spam rules" one hears reference to from time to time in multiplayer are laughable and completely arbitrary. They favor factions with fairly diverse unit rosters and/or great elite units and thus relatively small armies. My main Ardiaei army gets flak occasionally since I use seven Illyrian Marines in it, have few cavalry, have no true skirmishers, and always am at 20 units overall. And as their Evocati go down in these moments, pincushioned by javelins and surrounded by jabbing spears, the foe doesn't think "I brought a small army full of expensive units and couldn't protect my flanks well," or "Hmm, spending over 1000 denarii on terrible Illyrian cavalry or slingers levied up from the slave population is oft money wasted indeed," but rather, "He spammed." The "default" balanced build of 4-5 heavy cavalry , 3-4 elite archers/slingers, and the rest heavy infantry, elephants, etc should be constantly challenged. It works for the powerhouse factions but certainly not for all.
    and i assume you have some tournament replays that proves such ideas?
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • GabeedGabeed Junior Member Posts: 4Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Why would I participate in tournaments when they implement the very rules I just decried? I've got a pretty solid rank on the Leaderboard via my aforementioned Illyrian strategy (and thus a good many replay victories from quick battle to boot), but I profess I have no idea what the legitimacy of that might be to you. Maybe none.
  • ReydeReyde Senior Member Posts: 337Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    I think many people have a problem with the no true skirmisher armies, which got more popular and viable in the latest patch.
    In my opinion they make the game a lot more diverse, but you could argue that these type of builds are not blanced, because they
    dont use a whole category of units (same way people complained about cav/skirmisher armies in the last patch).
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Posts: 1,737Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Gabeed wrote: »
    Why would I participate in tournaments when they implement the very rules I just decried? I've got a pretty solid rank on the Leaderboard via my aforementioned Illyrian strategy (and thus a good many replay victories from quick battle to boot), but I profess I have no idea what the legitimacy of that might be to you. Maybe none.
    i don't care about your leaderboard rank, its broken and filled with cheaters, i stopped doing it after i got to place 64, i'm not just asking about your experience, i'm asking you to find proof, oh i see there is non cause elites are viewed as largely useless.
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • GabeedGabeed Junior Member Posts: 4Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Reyde wrote: »
    I think many people have a problem with the no true skirmisher armies, which got more popular and viable in the latest patch.
    In my opinion they make the game a lot more diverse, but you could argue that these type of builds are not blanced, because they
    dont use a whole category of units (same way people complained about cav/skirmisher armies in the last patch).

    You definitely have a point, but each faction should play its strengths, and "balance" is a relatively restrictive and arbitrary concept, especially when certain factions can function with it better than others.
    jonasnee wrote: »
    i don't care about your leaderboard rank, its broken and filled with cheaters, i stopped doing it after i got to place 64, i'm not just asking about your experience, i'm asking you to find proof, oh i see there is non cause elites are viewed as largely useless.

    This is nigh incomprehensible. I'm sorry, but I don't know what you're trying to say, or what "proof" you're demanding I find.
  • Nelorix,the CaledonianNelorix,the Caledonian Senior Member Serbia,Jagodina/Finland,JyväskyläPosts: 2,163Registered Users
    edited October 2014
    Jonasnee is trying to say that if you can`t show some video/screenshot of you beating a true competitive player with your unorthodox ( but i have to say,sexy army since i`ve been using something similar with the Ardiaei and it works like a charm) army build,your opinion ,to him,is worth nothing. And that elites don`t have a prominent part in the meta compared to ages ago,for any faction.

    When it comes to my opinion of the discussion between you two,you raise a gud point,non meta builds are surprisingly viable this patch,though meta can still adapt better and be more flexible ( in most scenarios,it all depends on the factions)

    On topic now,spam is..well..uh...for some people,if they call you a spammer even though you brought a balanced rush build it means they are being a sore loser.

    Personally,i consider spam something like 20 horse archers,or 4 chariots in the same army.

    And just a general complaint,cut the Lusitani **** out :D They`re a great faction,they can adapt to a lot of stuff now,but they`re incredibly easy to counter if you just...try it.
    Reptilicus #1 Nomadic Warlord,multiple tournament winner and slayer of basement dwellers.

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