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Pretty Thoroughly Bored of Attila

Strategist6Strategist6 Senior MemberRegistered Users Posts: 141
edited April 2015 in Multiplayer
*sigh*

I've gotten extremely bored of Attila MP. So much that I have no desire to play in any tournaments or anything. Its much more fun to play noobs and bring fun builds now. I've recently been playing all of the other total wars, as many other people have. Even youtubers seem very bored of it. Many clans are losing activity or even dying. Its just sad. I've found rome 2 multiplayer to be much more interesting and balanced despite the barbarian levy freemen sword rush spams. At least there are still romans, greeks, and easterners, right? I just can't stand the armies that I have to bring for competitive matches. If CA keeps mistreating the multiplayer fans, I think they will lose us.

One thing I really hope does not happen is that they give us little bribes here and there. This applies to the whole game. A nice DLC here or there. A nice little update/patch. A little FLC that should have just been included in the game at the start (like what they did with Seleucids and Baktria and maybe even Massalia). I thinks its time that we stop accepting little things like that as repentance from CA, cuz its obviously not. Attila MP should be balanced by now. I understand it won't reasonably be balanced from the start, but this is just laziness. And now our attention is being drawn away to things like Arena and Warhammer. CA seems too busy looking ahead that they don't care about the NOW.

*more sighs*
Post edited by Strategist6 on

Comments

  • AKKF32AKKF32 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 193
    edited April 2015
    Did u ever think atw was just a bridge game b/w Rome 2 and Warhammer? Cuz it most def is.
    And yeah the game is boring as **** and repetitive as ****. Ive been saying this right from the start in these forums. The boring meta will just completely kill the mp community. But of course, some didnt see it that way and bashed me for that lol. Now, look who was right this whole time!! lol
  • SnipingAchillesSnipingAchilles Senior Member BelgiumRegistered Users Posts: 290
    edited April 2015
    That is strange, I'm having a lot of fun with Atilla.

    ATW best Total War Evah.
    AggonyAchilles on Steam.

    YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/snipingachilles
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    It really seems that they have a lot going on at CA at the moment. Maybe a bit to much to maintain a decent quality control of their games.
    Another issue i see is that there isn´t a decent channel of comunication between CA and the community. At the moment information goes only one way, from us to them. Their youtube channel is only for anouncing stuff. The forums are more a place for players to change ideas between each other. When live streaming they simply ignore questions about mechanics and balancing.
    When there is an event and youtubers have the chance to talk to them, their questions are way to superficial and ovious.
    It would be nice to have a platform or whatever where we actually could get some feedback from the developers and have some in depth discussions about the game with people actively working on it.
    I remember a very nice post by one of the CA guys explaining point by point what the different graphic settings affect in rome 2. But regarding to balancing, stats, hidden stats, abilities, their thinking about game balance...not a word.
    If there is something off topic posted here, they are pretty fast in moving it, so they are actually paying attention, but why not better comunicate with the community regarding the game and the way it works.
  • BelialxvBelialxv Senior Member SteppesRegistered Users Posts: 1,627
    edited April 2015
    I fear that CA decided to make TW sp only and just dont give a **** about us.

    They said that Warhammer had the same multi as Attila and that it was sp focused (no surprise, just sadness)
    It's like if they had a meeting after S2 and decided to let mp die slowly.

    They dont seem to understand the importance of a multiplayer community.

    It makes me sad, because I think that TW have way more potential mp wise than sp wise. I dont get how people can pay 60$ to destroy a ******ed AI.

    A strategy game is at its best where the most strategical thinking happen and thats not in sp at all.
    ajz9uoslnqoi.jpg


    HUITZILOPOCHTLI

    god of war

    LIZARDMEN #makelustriagreatagain
    Clan Moulder #masterclan
  • TheokolesOfRomeTheokolesOfRome Senior Member The Highlands in me kilt.Registered Users Posts: 1,485
    edited April 2015
    AKKF32 wrote: »
    Ive been saying this right from the start in these forums. The boring meta will just completely kill the mp community. But of course, some didnt see it that way and bashed me for that lol.

    Well you deserved to be bashed. You were saying all these things when the player count for MP was still sustainable. The attitude didn't help any. You put people down and mp down, so of course they will defend it because they want things to get better. You're like eeyore from winnie the pooh.
    Now, look who was right this whole time!! lol

    So, congrats I guess.
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  • Pine89Pine89 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 580
    edited April 2015
    hey, I got a weird dejavu going on.. oh yeah, it's like when rome 2 came after shogun 2 all over again! except this time the playerbase was already small and it got even smaller. CA saw the opportunity for tw mp when shogun 2 came out, and probably have decided to switch that whole side of things on a dedicated mp game.. Arena. but Arena from what I know so far isn't your regular tw war experience, they had to make it somewhat similar to some of the most successiful mp games atm, mobas. that's why I'm not so sure about it.

    so who knows, maybe warhammer coming out could actually be something good for more actual tw mp :o
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,737
    edited April 2015
    Pine89 wrote: »
    hey, I got a weird dejavu going on.. oh yeah, it's like when rome 2 came after shogun 2 all over again! except this time the playerbase was already small and it got even smaller. CA saw the opportunity for tw mp when shogun 2 came out, and probably have decided to switch that whole side of things on a dedicated mp game.. Arena. but Arena from what I know so far isn't your regular tw war experience, they had to make it somewhat similar to some of the most successiful mp games atm, mobas. that's why I'm not so sure about it.

    so who knows, maybe warhammer coming out could actually be something good for more actual tw mp :o
    if arena was more like mobas the better in my opinion.
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • BelialxvBelialxv Senior Member SteppesRegistered Users Posts: 1,627
    edited April 2015
    jonasnee wrote: »
    if arena was more like mobas the better in my opinion.

    Are you serious?
    ajz9uoslnqoi.jpg


    HUITZILOPOCHTLI

    god of war

    LIZARDMEN #makelustriagreatagain
    Clan Moulder #masterclan
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,737
    edited April 2015
    Belialxv wrote: »
    Are you serious?
    yes, but my mouth is shut about why :)
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • BelialxvBelialxv Senior Member SteppesRegistered Users Posts: 1,627
    edited April 2015
    jonasnee wrote: »
    yes, but my mouth is shut about why :)

    ILLUMINATY!!!! :p

    :)
    ajz9uoslnqoi.jpg


    HUITZILOPOCHTLI

    god of war

    LIZARDMEN #makelustriagreatagain
    Clan Moulder #masterclan
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    Its going to sound a bit crazy but i actually took the time to talk to a psychiatrist about this and after having shown her Rome 2 and Attila she completely agrees with this theory...

    Even liking the battles in Attila as much as the ones in Rome 2, i can´t force myself to play or watch more than 3, max 5 battles in a row without starting to get bored. In Rome 2 this wasn´t the case and i started to wonder if there isn´t a deeper reason other than balancing or similar rosters. It seems that there is...
    One of the main reasons so many of us find the battles to be boring to play/watch in Attila are the banners. It´s always yellow against red no matter which factions we are playing with or against.
    It happens in a subconcious level where, since nothing changes with this banners, no facton symbol, no color changes, we are plaiyng the same battles over and over again without variety. Add to this the fact that most of the factions have similar rosters, the balancing is still very poor, the color pallette is very one sided and battles are played zoomed out, this results in a lot of players don´t even standing a chance other than be bored after some games.
  • BelialxvBelialxv Senior Member SteppesRegistered Users Posts: 1,627
    edited April 2015
    Its going to sound a bit crazy but i actually took the time to talk to a psychiatrist about this and after having shown her Rome 2 and Attila she completely agrees with this theory...

    Even liking the battles in Attila as much as the ones in Rome 2, i can´t force myself to play or watch more than 3, max 5 battles in a row without starting to get bored. In Rome 2 this wasn´t the case and i started to wonder if there isn´t a deeper reason other than balancing or similar rosters. It seems that there is...
    One of the main reasons so many of us find the battles to be boring to play/watch in Attila are the banners. It´s always yellow against red no matter which factions we are playing with or against.
    It happens in a subconcious level where, since nothing changes with this banners, no facton symbol, no color changes, we are plaiyng the same battles over and over again without variety. Add to this the fact that most of the factions have similar rosters, the balancing is still very poor, the color pallette is very one sided and battles are played zoomed out, this results in a lot of players don´t even standing a chance other than be bored after some games.

    We already knew that you know...

    Banners makes the game more fun and diverse. Especially if they are well made.

    Dont need a spy to realise that, but its nice that you confirmed it :)
    ajz9uoslnqoi.jpg


    HUITZILOPOCHTLI

    god of war

    LIZARDMEN #makelustriagreatagain
    Clan Moulder #masterclan
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    Belialxv wrote: »
    Banners makes the game more fun and diverse. Especially if they are well made.

    Dont need a spy to realise that, but its nice that you confirmed it :)

    Apparently CA has no idea about this obviousness.

    I was saying that the banners may be the main reason for people getting bored so fast playing the game.
    Sorry if i missed the thread in which you already posted about it:)
  • DiplomattDiplomatt Senior Member Preston, UKRegistered Users Posts: 1,136
    edited April 2015
    I think the banners with a symbol for the type of unit was fine. I can see the idea behind these icons but who seriously got unit types mixed up in Rome II? Banners add a bit of aesthetic diversity.

    Also there a lots of instances where one unit icon is hidden behind the other because of the shape which makes it very difficult to issue attack order like here for example http://cloud-4.steamusercontent.com/ugc/32989976931732004/7DED8CBC8CC964B2B2225447443106EEE597368A/
    [WOLF]Diplomatt

    Moderator of www.reddit.com/r/totalwar
  • Strategist6Strategist6 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 141
    edited April 2015
    I thought that the Rome 2 Banners were pretty ******, too, but I'd totally take them over the stupid icons. The Rome 2 Banners looked very unrealistic.

    I have another idea, though. But it honestly is probably not practical. What if we changed multiplayer balance ourselves? If we had a competitive player willing to mod it and if we could get everyone (the impractical part) to use it, maybe the game would get more interesting. I don't know how we could get nearly everyone that plays multiplayer to download and use it. But would it be worth a shot? We could have a discussion where we all give input on how to balance, and if the modder is a good guy, he should listen and not put in his own personal balancing (unless most agree with it).

    It does pain me that I'm even considering the idea that the modders fix CAs game for them. With all the stuff going on about paid mods and how companies are always working on their NEXT game, maybe game devs should just hire modders to fix their games. Its a win-win-win for the company, modders, and players.
  • vaensonvaenson Member Registered Users Posts: 45
    edited April 2015
    I think that humans find something boring they did for a while is not a separated experience for atw. Maybe you could ask the question why people still say that s2 was perfect for mp (what caused some of them playing it for many 100h- 1000h). In s2 there was no faction variety. Just some various builds that where good for some maps. But there was the ladders (people love numbers) and little nice special retainers u can get to give u an edge ...uuuhhhhhh. And that's why mp will get what they want...Arena...grinding, buy some nice special stuff and and ladder that shows how good u are. Dunno what happened...back in the days games like med ll made me happy for many hours without alot of rings and bells...I guess the needs of gamers just changed over time...and CA is adapting
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    memccann wrote: »
    I think the banners with a symbol for the type of unit was fine. I can see the idea behind these icons but who seriously got unit types mixed up in Rome II? Banners add a bit of aesthetic diversity.

    Also there a lots of instances where one unit icon is hidden behind the other because of the shape which makes it very difficult to issue attack order like here for example http://cloud-4.steamusercontent.com/ugc/32989976931732004/7DED8CBC8CC964B2B2225447443106EEE597368A/

    Happens a lot. If its only 2 units involved its not that bad because you can click directly on the unit but in a blob its very annoying since youre not even sure if you atacked the right unit. It always make you loose time. Also sometimes its hard to give atack orders even clicking directly on the banner. Its like you give a move order to the area behind that banner.
  • IdioManiacIdioManiac Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 330
    edited April 2015
    to people talking about banners and what not
    Its going to sound a bit crazy but i actually took the time to talk to a psychiatrist about this and after having shown her Rome 2 and Attila she completely agrees with this theory...

    Even liking the battles in Attila as much as the ones in Rome 2, i can´t force myself to play or watch more than 3, max 5 battles in a row without starting to get bored. In Rome 2 this wasn´t the case and i started to wonder if there isn´t a deeper reason other than balancing or similar rosters. It seems that there is...
    One of the main reasons so many of us find the battles to be boring to play/watch in Attila are the banners. It´s always yellow against red no matter which factions we are playing with or against.
    It happens in a subconcious level where, since nothing changes with this banners, no facton symbol, no color changes, we are plaiyng the same battles over and over again without variety. Add to this the fact that most of the factions have similar rosters, the balancing is still very poor, the color pallette is very one sided and battles are played zoomed out, this results in a lot of players don´t even standing a chance other than be bored after some games.

    that is an easy theory to disprove, I dont know how many people are familiar with Age of Empires 2, but there is very little visual difference you have 8 colours for all units, blue red green yellow teal purple grey and orange.

    99% of 1v1 game are red and blue. and after 15 years thousands of people still play the multiplayer and do not find it boring.

    For proof of this visit www.voobly.com

    the banners have nothing to do with it. I think the biggest problem with atilla is that you kinda feel like what you do dosen't really matter in the end.

    You charge your troops and you wait and see which unit wins. Same faction matchups especially. player input in the battles is in so many ways minimal. It makes it quite tedious.
    Me
    [-DF-] Skritshell: Hey whats up?
    [-DF-] Chaos: about to start a tourney game
    [-DF-] Skritshell: cool guy any good?
    [-DF-] Chaos: Should win 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: and?
    [-DF-] Chaos: lost 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: ahhh
    [-DF-] Skritshell: well done
    [-DF-] Chaos: ty
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    Age of empires disproves absolutely nothing. The game is completely different. There are no banners at all. Maps are bigger and full of buildings, castles and peasants running around. It´s a totally different game mechanic.
    You could as well have used chess as an example. It´s mostly black and white and people are playing it for centuries
    Your second argument is much better though, but it doesnt disprove, it adds instead.
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,737
    edited April 2015
    IdioManiac wrote: »
    to people talking about banners and what not that is an easy theory to disprove, I dont know how many people are familiar with Age of Empires 2, but there is very little visual difference you have 8 colours for all units, blue red green yellow teal purple grey and orange.

    99% of 1v1 game are red and blue. and after 15 years thousands of people still play the multiplayer and do not find it boring.

    For proof of this visit www.voobly.com

    the banners have nothing to do with it. I think the biggest problem with atilla is that you kinda feel like what you do dosen't really matter in the end.

    You charge your troops and you wait and see which unit wins. Same faction matchups especially. player input in the battles is in so many ways minimal. It makes it quite tedious.
    those stats are flawed, there are atleast 500 in age of empires 3 asian dynasty at any given time (and it can easily peak to 1.5k).

    also AOE is different, it has a lot more strategy too it, attila is at the bottom line a microgame added with a mind game.
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • IdioManiacIdioManiac Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 330
    edited April 2015
    jonasnee wrote: »
    those stats are flawed, there are atleast 500 in age of empires 3 asian dynasty at any given time (and it can easily peak to 1.5k).

    also AOE is different, it has a lot more strategy too it, attila is at the bottom line a microgame added with a mind game.

    Well since I wasn't talking about aoe 3 I'm not sure how this effects me at all. Besides including steam there will usually be 2 - 3000 people playing Age of empires 2 online at any point in time. and I still do not see how this flaws any stats.

    He said that the lack of banners made teh battle worse. I was merely pointing out that same color schemes and visuals didn't effect it at all. For example look at age of empires 2.

    Also your last line proves my point. Atilla is boring not because of its "banners" Which i actually like quite a bit. But because its game-play is lack luster.
    Me
    [-DF-] Skritshell: Hey whats up?
    [-DF-] Chaos: about to start a tourney game
    [-DF-] Skritshell: cool guy any good?
    [-DF-] Chaos: Should win 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: and?
    [-DF-] Chaos: lost 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: ahhh
    [-DF-] Skritshell: well done
    [-DF-] Chaos: ty
  • IdioManiacIdioManiac Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 330
    edited April 2015
    Age of empires disproves absolutely nothing. The game is completely different. There are no banners at all. Maps are bigger and full of buildings, castles and peasants running around. It´s a totally different game mechanic.
    You could as well have used chess as an example. It´s mostly black and white and people are playing it for centuries
    Your second argument is much better though, but it doesnt disprove, it adds instead.


    Ahhh i see I wasnt refereing to OP i was referring to the guy who talked to a grief counsoler....

    Honestly the chess point adds to "it" being my point quite nicely. Colours dont really matter, simplistic is fine. It is the fact that the game sucks that makes it boring. :P


    Edited my OP to clarify. hopfully now people will understand who i was replying to.
    Me
    [-DF-] Skritshell: Hey whats up?
    [-DF-] Chaos: about to start a tourney game
    [-DF-] Skritshell: cool guy any good?
    [-DF-] Chaos: Should win 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: and?
    [-DF-] Chaos: lost 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: ahhh
    [-DF-] Skritshell: well done
    [-DF-] Chaos: ty
  • jonasneejonasnee Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,737
    edited April 2015
    IdioManiac wrote: »
    Well since I wasn't talking about aoe 3 I'm not sure how this effects me at all. Besides including steam there will usually be 2 - 3000 people playing Age of empires 2 online at any point in time. and I still do not see how this flaws any stats.

    He said that the lack of banners made the battle worse. I was merely pointing out that same color schemes and visuals didn't effect it at all. For example look at age of empires 2.


    Also your last line proves my point. Atilla is boring not because of its "banners" Which i actually like quite a bit. But because its game-play is lack luster.
    well your scours is flawed because it also mentions aoe 3 and stats less than 50 are playing it.

    if you can't trust 1 of the numbers then you can't trust any of the numbers.

    and yea the gameplay is a bit lagging, but well don't underestimate the power of banners, i loved my shogun 2 banner :P
    put your actions where your mouth is.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=TJpmII-kxuM
    Total war is best when it is kept simple and not overly complex
  • IdioManiacIdioManiac Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 330
    edited April 2015
    jonasnee wrote: »
    well your scours is flawed because it also mentions aoe 3 and stats less than 50 are playing it.

    if you can't trust 1 of the numbers then you can't trust any of the numbers.

    and yea the gameplay is a bit lagging, but well don't underestimate the power of banners, i loved my shogun 2 banner :P

    plz read what u quoted I said aoe 2

    also he was comparing rome 2 and atilla, between the 2 i prefer atillas. I too loved my shogun 2 mons.

    Hot pink 4 lyf.
    Me
    [-DF-] Skritshell: Hey whats up?
    [-DF-] Chaos: about to start a tourney game
    [-DF-] Skritshell: cool guy any good?
    [-DF-] Chaos: Should win 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: and?
    [-DF-] Chaos: lost 2-0
    [-DF-] Skritshell: ahhh
    [-DF-] Skritshell: well done
    [-DF-] Chaos: ty
  • obelixthegreatobelixthegreat Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 228
    edited April 2015
    Following your logic, one could argue that rome 2 is also a good example: There are at least three times more people playing Rome 2 at the moment. Rome 2 has more colors and faction banners. Therefore the game is less boring.
    But it is not that simple. Banners and colors do help to create a more sympathetic, visual friendly and less boring gameplay.
    How big of a part this plays in making people get bored so fast with Attila is almost a question for a thesis to respond.
    But my opinion is that the part it plays is more on the high than the low side.
  • AKKF32AKKF32 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 193
    edited April 2015
    Well you deserved to be bashed. You were saying all these things when the player count for MP was still sustainable. The attitude didn't help any. You put people down and mp down, so of course they will defend it because they want things to get better. You're like eeyore from winnie the pooh.



    So, congrats I guess.

    yeah somehow I rlly doubt what I said made any difference lol. This game was a game in dying and I was the only one smart enough to point this out. Its really too bad ATW has come down to this, I was hoping it would be much better but u take what u get.
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