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Total War: WARHAMMER Dev Blog – Chaos Warriors, Pre-orders and DLC

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  • Karl FranzKarl Franz Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 40
    edited November 2015
    I don't agree 100% with your vision ( having a team for developing 4 races and then boom, another one suddenly appears it doesn't make any sense) I will support your game, but not at the current state, too soon to preorder, we have to see more ongame videos.
    Warhammer Empire player ( 10 years ago, still having my army.)

    Demigryph on Steam and Twitch
  • GoslingGosling Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,887
    edited November 2015
    I find a lot of the self entitlement just sickening. I think you are getting your money's worth for this.
    "I'm gonna stomp 'em to dust. I'm gonna grind their bones. I'm gonna burn down dere towns and cities. I'm gonna pile 'em up inna big fire and roast 'em. I'm gonna bash heads, break faces, and jump up and down on the bits that are left.


    An' den I'm gonna get really mean."

    Grimgor Ironhide, Black Orc Warboss.
  • BadWoIfBadWoIf Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 131
    edited November 2015
    Gosling wrote: »
    I find a lot of the self entitlement just sickening. I think you are getting your money's worth for this.
    I would agree, anyone who just wants it WoC for free is perhaps like that, but I think the fact that they are asking for preorders at all, after having shown so little of the game, and after the disaster that was the launch of Rome 2, that I have a big big problem with.
  • NeverBackDownNeverBackDown Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,862
    edited November 2015
    yoyo369874 wrote: »
    And also, I doubt you care CA, but because of this I will not be buying the game. I was very interested before I heard all of this, but I cannot support a company that not only has these practices but then defends them. I will happily watch Angry Joe's review of it but I will spend one penny on the game.

    The fact you think Angry Joe is someone to watch reflects well in your posts. He's literally only going so far over the top to make money. You're paying him everytime you watch a video to be as negative as possible. That's far worse then what CA has done. At least they are honest. He's not.
  • FrontlinerDeltaFrontlinerDelta Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,549
    edited November 2015
    Well, it was a nice try CA but judging by a lot of these responses, it didn't work.

    So here's my solution. Just take out Chaos completely, remove any hint of their existence in the game, thus they are not just "locked out" but not included in any shape, manner, or form. People were happier with only four factions and your goal to try and surprise people with an earlier implementation of Chaos has, unfortunately, backfired.

    So just remove them, no DLC, not in the main game as an NPC, nothing. Save them for the last title, make the entire title revolve around Chaos and maybe you won't get senseless hate.
  • ValergainValergain Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1
    edited November 2015
    The problem for me is not that there is day one DLC in so much as what is Day 1 one DLC. Chaos costs extra on day one? That is wrong. Choas is one of the most important races in Warhammer. Not so important that they MUST be in the game, but they're really close. I'd understand if chaos came out later and you had pay for it. But for Chaos to day one DLC? That is wrong. This "From the Ashes" all other again. Yes technically this might not be cut content but it sure as hell feels like it.

    The only thing CA can do to win back good will is make Chaos free. Bit of advice CA? Next time make the vamps the preorder Bonus.

    Also the whole it's alright, Chaos is still in the game you just can't play as them makes the whole argument worse for me, because that is definitely cut content then.
  • BadWoIfBadWoIf Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 131
    edited November 2015
    Well the anti-DLC crusaders would rather have no content at all. Sorry.
    mate some of us would just like proof that the game actually works before they start asking for preorders, seeing that this is the company that released Rome 2 I dont think that is too much to ask
  • yoyo369874yoyo369874 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4
    edited November 2015
    The fact you think Angry Joe is someone to watch reflects well in your posts. He's literally only going so far over the top to make money. You're paying him everytime you watch a video to be as negative as possible. That's far worse then what CA has done. At least they are honest. He's not.

    First off, I never denied Angry Joe makes money from me watching him. I like his reviews because they are funny. I don't care honestly what his opinion is of the game. 2nd of all, no CA is not honest. They are coming up with excuses on why to perform this action, and if you honestly believe them then you are delusional and represents what is wrong with the gaming industry.

    I was very professional in my view. I stated obvious reasons as to why they're doing it. I'm sorry if because I watch Angry Joe that for some reason to you means I'm a moron or I can't have views on things. Instead of attacking something as silly as that why don't you come up with actual valid responses to my views?
  • CoveredfiresCoveredfires Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,066
    edited November 2015
    Well, it was a nice try CA but judging by a lot of these responses, it didn't work.

    So here's my solution. Just take out Chaos completely, remove any hint of their existence in the game, thus they are not just "locked out" but not included in any shape, manner, or form. People were happier with only four factions and your goal to try and surprise people with an earlier implementation of Chaos has, unfortunately, backfired.

    So just remove them, no DLC, not in the main game as an NPC, nothing. Save them for the last title, make the entire title revolve around Chaos and maybe you won't get senseless hate.

    That would be a HORRIBLE idea, it would only worsen the situation. People would not only complain about completed content being added in as a pre-order bonus, but would then get furious that completed content was taken OUT of the game to be sold for money ( which is the central issue here anyway).

    I for one am excited to play as Chaos Warriors when the game launches, on the launch day - not weeks/months later.

    While I also was completely mortified and hated what happened to Rome II ( a few things they did lie about and the game was in an abysmal state when launched) I do think CA has learned from that experience and is striving to make Warhammer:Total War the best it can be.
    Sometimes by losing a battle you find a new way to win the war.
    Donald Trump

  • sordurarsordurar Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1
    edited November 2015
    Gosling wrote: »
    I find a lot of the self entitlement just sickening. I think you are getting your money's worth for this.

    they messed up with chaos dlc
    and the blog even proves

    yes il admit they are honest sure thats a good thing
    but its still bad wat they did

    but my hype has died horribly for this
  • BadWoIfBadWoIf Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 131
    edited November 2015
    Kirkilius wrote: »
    That would be a HORRIBLE idea, it would only worsen the situation. People would not only complain about completed content being added in as a pre-order bonus, but would then get furious that completed content was taken OUT of the game to be sold for money ( which is the central issue here anyway).

    I for one am excited to play as Chaos Warriors when the game launches, on the launch day - not weeks/months later.

    While I also was completely mortified and hated what happened to Rome II ( a few things they did lie about and the game was in an abysmal state when launched) I do think CA has learned from that experience and is striving to make Warhammer:Total War the best it can be.
    I wish I could have your optimisem, but I have seen nothing to indicate that they have learned anything. I dont want this game to come out more bugged then an anthill, but from looking at their past releases it most likly will be, chances are it wont be playable until months in, maybe half a year like all the other games they make
  • John Magnum FidelisJohn Magnum Fidelis Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 102
    edited November 2015
    That definantly helps CA. I look forward to your success.
  • Yolo SwagginsYolo Swaggins Member Registered Users Posts: 31
    edited November 2015
    The problem here is that the price point of games has not changed in so long. i remember buying the original command and conquer for £40 way back in 1995 and i am still paying close to that 20 years later despite games taking longer and costing far more to produce.


    Not only that but games now have to be supported long after they are released. People who complain about content being cut to make DLC i don't feel fully appreciate the realities of running a business, Sega is here to make money, CA is here to make fantastic games, when you bash those two idea's togther there has to be compromise in both directions and i feel sure that we will see a fair share of FreeLC.



    Personally i am more than willing to pay for quality content over time and the Warhammer universe lends its self perfectly to the DLC model.
  • CoveredfiresCoveredfires Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,066
    edited November 2015
    BadWoIf wrote: »
    I wish I could have your optimisem, but I have seen nothing to indicate that they have learned anything. I dont want this game to come out more bugged then an anthill, but from looking at their past releases it most likly will be, chances are it wont be playable until months in, maybe half a year like all the other games they make

    Well, I am optimistic - but, I still harbor some doubt. I've played every single Total War game ever released ( I remember when I bought Shogun: Total war when it came out and loved it) However, ever since Empire:Total war there have been some major bugs in all of their releases, shogun II wasn't TOO bad, Rome II by far the worst.

    This game though will make or break their future in Fantasy series. I would hope they do it well.
    Sometimes by losing a battle you find a new way to win the war.
    Donald Trump

  • yoyo369874yoyo369874 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4
    edited November 2015
    The problem here is that the price point of games has not changed in so long. i remember buying the original command and conquer for £40 way back in 1995 and i am still paying close to that 20 years later despite games taking longer and costing far more to produce.


    Not only that but games now have to be supported long after they are released. People who complain about content being cut to make DLC i don't feel fully appreciate the realities of running a business, Sega is here to make money, CA is here to make fantastic games, when you bash those two idea's togther there has to be compromise in both directions and i feel sure that we will see a fair share of FreeLC.



    Personally i am more than willing to pay for quality content over time and the Warhammer universe lends its self perfectly to the DLC model.

    Well first of all, actually the prices have changed recently. It wasn't that long ago that here in the states all games were $50 at release, now they are all $60. 2nd of all, the gaming community has grown exponentially within the last few years. It's such a big market now that even smaller developers are growing quickly. New game sales are being shattered every year. So translation = more customers to buy CA's game.

    Yes you're right that obviously they're here to make money. But stripping out something essential to the universe when it's already been created to force people to buy DLC goes beyond trying to make money. This game is going to make millions regardless of whether they did this or not, and all it's doing is sending a sour taste to its customers.

    And lastly yes you're right that games have to be supported longer, but there's also way more individuals out there who develop mods that essentially fix the game. That didn't exist nearly as much 10 years ago. Developers can often trust these individuals to iron out the issues or even improve the game.

    The fact is people have nothing against DLC as long as its value-added DLC or something non essential. But this fits neither of those.
  • CaffynatedCaffynated Member Registered Users Posts: 1,332
    edited November 2015
    TL;DR: "Sorry, not sorry."

    That isn't a response that's going to shift a 1:13 like:dislike ratio. Whatever sales may have been gained by cutting Chaos from the main game to entice pre-orders have more than been lost by the backlash.
  • BadWoIfBadWoIf Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 131
    edited November 2015
    The problem here is that the price point of games has not changed in so long. i remember buying the original command and conquer for £40 way back in 1995 and i am still paying close to that 20 years later despite games taking longer and costing far more to produce.


    Not only that but games now have to be supported long after they are released. People who complain about content being cut to make DLC i don't feel fully appreciate the realities of running a business, Sega is here to make money, CA is here to make fantastic games, when you bash those two idea's togther there has to be compromise in both directions and i feel sure that we will see a fair share of FreeLC.



    Personally i am more than willing to pay for quality content over time and the Warhammer universe lends its self perfectly to the DLC model.
    I would have no problem at all with paying for DLC down the line, when I know if the game is good, or even works, but asking for it before substantial gameplay has even been shown. That requires a lot of trust, trust that quite frankly I dont have after the relase of Rome 2
  • NeverBackDownNeverBackDown Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,862
    edited November 2015
    yoyo369874 wrote: »
    First off, I never denied Angry Joe makes money from me watching him. I like his reviews because they are funny. I don't care honestly what his opinion is of the game. 2nd of all, no CA is not honest. They are coming up with excuses on why to perform this action, and if you honestly believe them then you are delusional and represents what is wrong with the gaming industry.

    I was very professional in my view. I stated obvious reasons as to why they're doing it. I'm sorry if because I watch Angry Joe that for some reason to you means I'm a moron or I can't have views on things. Instead of attacking something as silly as that why don't you come up with actual valid responses to my views?

    I never said you did. Even if you didn't care what his opinion is, everything he says will stay influence your future opinions because you listen to him so often. CA is being honest. What excuses? You mean the things they have done from that start? It's been done already, it's not an excuse, it's anm explanation on how the whole development process has gone. If it was an excuse they wouldn't have even put up a blog to address people's concerns simply because they would have something to hide. The fact you instantly refer to personal attacks makes everything you say moot. I think it's gamers like you who think they know everything and instantly start pointing fingers that are delusional. It's you guys that ruin the industry's image. I'd like for you to take some higher level business and economic classes before you go around shouting how dishonest they are. You'd quickly learn how ignorant you sound when you find out the actual details of things.

    I don't think it was professional as well as this current sarcasm and worthless insults. Pointing fingers and calling them dishonest is far from that. You can watch him all you want, however I think it's you who should take your own advice and not attack other members in addition to make your own responses instead of relying on some famous Youtuber.
  • Wonderboy2402Wonderboy2402 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 116
    edited November 2015
    Well I have preordered titles since Empire total war all the way up to Rome total war. I totally skipped Attila, and I would not consider ordering total war Warhammer. However this time around we have steams refund policy which I will not hesitate to use If you decide to release a Nother unpolished buggy mess of the game.

    Also I think many people would agree that the chaos faction is one of the essential factions in Warhammer just like the empire. To withhold it as preorder DLC is a bit abusive in my Opinion.

    Frankly I am more likely just to wait and see the previews and reviews from people I trust like you mentioned. I just pick it up on sale with DLC and patches a month or year later.
  • MurandilMurandil Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 5
    edited November 2015
    I am not going to say I do not respect the effort you made to make this answer, but I am really disappointed in the way you thought this would make sense. If it is making sense to you guys, it is because the numbers add up. But when making a game catered to a community of, as I consider it, above the minimum lines of intelligence, I thought you would be more conscious of the previous game releases.
    Maybe making this comment before, therefore preventing the big waterfall of horrible rants and terrible reasons, coupled with true rants and true reasons behind the pre-ordering DLC practice, you could have saved yourself from losing a couple of fans, customers, consumers.
    I as one, will not pre-order or buy the game. I have been a fan of your work for the past 13 years. All I can say is that I still feel the carpet burn when you launched Empire and the subsequent games. I do respect the opportunity to try to mend your mistakes, but knowing how the community is going right now, I think you needed to do something for us. We are the ones supporting you through the years. We buy your products. I hope that you change the pre-order DLC race to something else, because there are many options out there on what you could have added as a pre-order bonus.
    Doing the PR move of showing a pre-order race without even showing the 2 lingering main playable factions was a slap to my face to tell me I have to pre-order it. In the end, my question would be: Why did you not wait until you finished showing the four playable factions? this would have saved you from a lot of trouble. I believe Mr. Bartholomew is the one in charge of Public Relations? maybe talking to him directly would change his way of viewing the Chaos Warriors DLC to be either after release DLC or simply to be added to the game and then a skin pack or something different for pre-ordering? I just don't know. I am not an expert.
  • Welsh_DragonWelsh_Dragon Senior Member Great BritainRegistered Users Posts: 2,914
    edited November 2015
    One of the things I take from this is about how CA is using DLC.

    DLC is a way to keep initial costs to the player down and overall quantity (and quality) of content up.

    The alternatives as I see it would be either:

    To increase the cost of the base game further (and we already have people for whom the increased price tag for Warhammer compared to the last few titles is making a non-sale purchase unaffordable.)

    Or to reduce quantity of content (only having the four races and not having Chaos in the first game at all, whether AI controlled or player controlled.)

    Or reduce the quality of the content (possibly more races, but with less uniqueness to them. Smaller rosters, more repeated units between races, less unique mechanics and cultural identities etc.)

    As a player, none of those alternatives appeal to me I must say.

    The way that CA seem to be doing it with Warhammer and have done with the past few titles, I can buy a fully playable game for a reasonable price and then add to it as I go on. My initial expenditure is less, which on a tight budget can be very important, but over time I get to have a much bigger and more expansive game.

    In much the same way that in a table top game such as Warhammer, I can buy a fully playable starter and then add to it by buying additional miniatures and "expansions," but for a fraction of the price. (To compare, an Warhammer Age of Sigmar Starter Set will set me back £85 and I only get 47 models/soldiers representing two races. Warhammer: Total War costs £49.99 or less, so at least £35 less than tabletop for battles involving hundreds if not thousands of soldiers, from at least four races.)

    Given the alternatives, I prefer the way CA is doing it's DLC.

    All the Best,

    Welsh Dragon.

    EDIT: One other thing I like about it is summed up in one sentence in the blog/Original Post. "Even if you don’t pre-order, you get Chaos as an Ai opponent." Even when I don't buy the DLC, I still get something new added to my game. :)
    CraigK CA wrote:
    I think Welsh Dragon knows too much...
    "You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment."
  • yoyo369874yoyo369874 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4
    edited November 2015
    I never said you did. Even if you didn't care what his opinion is, everything he says will stay influence your future opinions because you listen to him so often. CA is being honest. What excuses? You mean the things they have done from that start? It's been done already, it's not an excuse. If it was an excuse they wouldn't have even put up a blog to address people's concerns. The fact you instantly refer to personal attacks makes everything you say moot. I think it's gamers like you who think they know everything and instantly start pointing fingers that are delusional. It's you guys that ruin the industry's image. I'd like for you to take some higher level business and economic classes before you go around shouting how dishonest they are. You'd quickly learn how ignorant you sound when you find out the actual details of things.

    I don't think it was professional as well as this current sarcasm and worthless insults. Pointing fingers and calling them dishonest is far from that. You can watch him all you want, however I think it's you who should take your own advice and not attack other members in addition to make your own responses instead of relying on some famous Youtube.

    Okay well first off I'll be the first one to admit I don't know everything. 2nd of all I think I understand how business works considering I'm a triple major in economics, finance, and accounting. 3rd of all how do guys like me who ask that developers not go out of their way to screw their customers give the industry a bad image? 4th of all I never attacked you personally. I said your views damage the industry. For all I know you could be a very good and intelligent person. But because I disagree with you you automatically assume I'm a moron and have no right to every say anything. 5th of all, I wasn't being sarcastic. I was being 100% honest and I never once spouted out something because Angry joe says it. They are all my own opinion. Just because two people agree on something doesn't mean one of them is copying the other. And lastly you still have no once responded to my reasons why I disagree with CA's "reasoning."
  • ThartahkThartahk Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1
    edited November 2015
    If warriors of Chaos where not a day one DLC and if it where not for the censorship that you have been using on your forums,
    i might not have been angry about it if Warriors of Chaos where a DLC that you would be making at the end of the development cycle
    i would not be so annoyed. Giving us the first DLC after the games release in the way Blood Bowl 2 did it for them Lizardmen and Elves
    where not day one DLC but we still got it for pre ordering.

    And no matter what you say cut content is cut content dont go saying we started making it before the game came out 6 months in advance
    to be a DLC and then say naa its not cut content
  • Allhail201513Allhail201513 Banned Banned Users Posts: 1
    edited November 2015
    I never said you did. Even if you didn't care what his opinion is, everything he says will stay influence your future opinions because you listen to him so often. CA is being honest. What excuses? You mean the things they have done from that start? It's been done already, it's not an excuse, it's anm explanation on how the whole development process has gone. If it was an excuse they wouldn't have even put up a blog to address people's concerns simply because they would have something to hide. The fact you instantly refer to personal attacks makes everything you say moot. I think it's gamers like you who think they know everything and instantly start pointing fingers that are delusional. It's you guys that ruin the industry's image. I'd like for you to take some higher level business and economic classes before you go around shouting how dishonest they are. You'd quickly learn how ignorant you sound when you find out the actual details of things.

    I don't think it was professional as well as this current sarcasm and worthless insults. Pointing fingers and calling them dishonest is far from that. You can watch him all you want, however I think it's you who should take your own advice and not attack other members in addition to make your own responses instead of relying on some famous Youtuber.

    You act like he's an idiot and accuse him of attacking you personally simply because he disagrees with you and because he watches Angry Joe. I think if anyone's opinion on this manner is moot it's yours.
  • AbonzoAbonzo Member Registered Users Posts: 318
    edited November 2015
    CA, i think its nice you even give an explanation. Your games are fantastic and you don't need to justify your business strategies with people that don't understand business.
    Pre Steam Hours On Total War Franchise - Un countable - played every game and expansion since shogun

    Steam Hours On Total War - 3618 and counting

    Steam Hours Breakdown
    Rome 2 - 1451
    Atilla - 1015
    Shogun 2 - 743
    Warhammer - 376
    Empire/medieval 2 ( got in sale, played on disk mainly) - 33

    i think i have a addiction.


    *please excuse my bad English*
  • AsrahnAsrahn Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4
    edited November 2015
    Here's the thing; I wouldn't even blink if this was done by Firaxis or some other studio of that caliber. The reason pre-order culture is considered so very toxic by many people is due to the state a lot of games are launched in; bugged, broken, overhyped or whatnot, and Creative Assembly have become the posterboys for poor game launches in later years. Empire was chaos, Rome 2 was just plain **** at launch, and so on.

    You literally hired a team to create content to serve as a bait for a business practice that you again and again have shown you cannot be trusted with actually pulling off. THAT is the issue, and the reason people are so **** angry.
  • VuorinorriVuorinorri Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,532
    edited November 2015
    amen @ Welsh Dragon,glad to see real brain work.

    I don't want to pay 100€ for regular edition of game,I rather pay 60€ for it and get those DLC if I want them.

    edit: I do agree hiding entire race behind paywall isn't most optimal thing to do,especially this early. I would rather make all races playable from begin and add extra legendary lords as pre-order bonus/DLC. but I still want Warriors of Chaos to my game. just need to see more stuff from TW:Wh to pre-order


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  • NeverBackDownNeverBackDown Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,862
    edited November 2015
    yoyo369874 wrote: »
    Okay well first off I'll be the first one to admit I don't know everything. 2nd of all I think I understand how business works considering I'm a triple major in economics, finance, and accounting. 3rd of all how do guys like me who ask that developers not go out of their way to screw their customers give the industry a bad image? 4th of all I never attacked you personally. I said your views damage the industry. For all I know you could be a very good and intelligent person. But because I disagree with you you automatically assume I'm a moron and have no right to every say anything. 5th of all, I wasn't being sarcastic. I was being 100% honest and I never once spouted out something because Angry joe says it. They are all my own opinion. Just because two people agree on something doesn't mean one of them is copying the other. And lastly you still have no once responded to my reasons why I disagree with CA's "reasoning."

    Should go back and read. I already answered why they aren't being dishonest.




    People love to assume so many things. It's unreal the things people come up with:p
  • Commissar_GCommissar_G Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,318
    edited November 2015
    Asrahn wrote: »
    Here's the thing; I wouldn't even blink if this was done by Firaxis or some other studio of that caliber. The reason pre-order culture is considered so very toxic by many people is due to the state a lot of games are launched in; bugged, broken, overhyped or whatnot, and Creative Assembly have become the posterboys for poor game launches in later years. Empire was chaos, Rome 2 was just plain **** at launch, and so on.

    You literally hired a team to create content to serve as a bait for a business practice that you again and again have shown you cannot be trusted with actually pulling off. THAT is the issue, and the reason people are so **** angry.

    Do you actually think after they have paid for the license to Warhammer with two more games planned in the future they would be inept as to let the first instalment flop? You combine that with the Rome 2 launch disaster.

    If they stuff up again the company is done. This needs to be for them, the crowning glory of the Total War franchise. Anything less is inadequate.
    "As a sandbox game everyone, without exception, should be able to play the game exactly as they see fit and that means providing the maximum scope possible." - ~UNiOnJaCk~
  • Yolo SwagginsYolo Swaggins Member Registered Users Posts: 31
    edited November 2015
    yoyo369874 wrote: »
    Well first of all, actually the prices have changed recently. It wasn't that long ago that here in the states all games were $50 at release, now they are all $60. 2nd of all, the gaming community has grown exponentially within the last few years. It's such a big market now that even smaller developers are growing quickly. New game sales are being shattered every year. So translation = more customers to buy CA's game.

    Yes you're right that obviously they're here to make money. But stripping out something essential to the universe when it's already been created to force people to buy DLC goes beyond trying to make money. This game is going to make millions regardless of whether they did this or not, and all it's doing is sending a sour taste to its customers.

    And lastly yes you're right that games have to be supported longer, but there's also way more individuals out there who develop mods that essentially fix the game. That didn't exist nearly as much 10 years ago. Developers can often trust these individuals to iron out the issues or even improve the game.

    The fact is people have nothing against DLC as long as its value-added DLC or something non essential. But this fits neither of those.

    I hear what you are saying but i respectfully disagree. Prices have increased its true to £50 recently, however when you take into account inflation over the past 15 years you would be looking at paying nearly £58 just to be comparable with the £40 price point back in 2000.


    You couple this with the increase in time and cost of making a game (not to mention the 30% cut steam takes off the top) and i would not be surprised if the return over investment has not remained fairly static. Of course you could argue that there have been savings also, the massive rise in digital sales reducing the cost of manufacture and recent tax breaks for games companies based in the uk for example however without financial data all we can do is speculate.


    I have faith that CA's financial plan is sound though it may have upset a very vocal portion of their customer base. This is a Public relations issue rather than anything else, If CA had waited till two months before release before announcing that "the Chaos warriors pack was going to be after market DLC, but hey you know what we love you guys so much everyone who preorders gets it for free" then people would be a lot less angry.
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