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Legendary cannot issue order in pause

Ângelo CossaÂngelo Cossa Junior MemberRegistered Users Posts: 12
edited May 2011 in Total War: SHOGUN 2
Hi i'm new to the foruns.

I like very much the features of the legendary (no minimap and so on), they increase the dificult and are reasonable on a realistic point of view (ok, i know this is a game)

The only thing i don't like is the fact you cannot give orders to your units on pause, i don't see how being quickier on the mouse is more 'cool'.

I think that it could be replaced by a commanding system like other games had done (the only one that comes in mind now is SPWW), you could for example enable the player to change the order only of the units that are in the radius of a general, so if you send your ashigaru to atack someone and want the to retreat or stop following the routed unit to atack someone else, your general have to go there to issue the order.

this would improve strategy, as to flank a unit for example you will have to give composite orders (use the 'alt' to send the unit to the rear before it make the atack). and it would increase the utility of a general in battle.

More things can be done to improve the idea but it could become complex to implement in an alread finished game. (in SPWW for example you have command points that you spend to change the order of a unit for example).

I think that this kind of system is more like a strategy game, to have quicker click is good for action games (or multiplayer, i am refering to single player campaing)

This of course is a matter of taste but i think it would greater improve the game.
Post edited by Ângelo Cossa on

Comments

  • Rastafari_KenRastafari_Ken Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 903
    edited May 2011
    Hi Angelo.

    I don't think the devs were trying to make it more cool. They were trying to make it more difficult.

    My beef with legendary it the save system. I want to be able to save game at any point, because I never know when real life is going to intrude on my game time.

    Anyway, that is why it is like that.
  • MisiokMisiok Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 18
    edited May 2011
    Legendary mode is called the hardest mode for a reason, you know.
  • Ângelo CossaÂngelo Cossa Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 12
    edited May 2011
    Hi Angelo.

    I don't think the devs were trying to make it more cool. They were trying to make it more difficult.

    My beef with legendary it the save system. I want to be able to save game at any point, because I never know when real life is going to intrude on my game time.

    Anyway, that is why it is like that.

    Yes i understand and agree with you, my point is that is possible to make it more dificult without turning the battle into an action game (it is how it feels when you have full armies battle without issues order on pause). maybe at least an option to play in legendary with the other features but able to give order on pause.
  • King RufusKing Rufus Senior Member HispaniaRegistered Users Posts: 1,681
    edited May 2011
    Welcome to the forums :).

    What that feature tries to do is that in a real battle, you cannot stop the battle to issue orders. You have to issue them in real time, and that is what Legendary difficult does. Apart from making it the most difficult it also is the most "realistic" in the way you have to command your armies. Pause is there in case you have to leave the computer for whatever reason, but you will have to give orders and react in real-time just like a real general would need to do, and just like you have to do in multiplayer. In multiplayer you can (nearly) never pause and this makes you have to react in real time.

    Hope it helped ;).

    P.S. Oh and I just remembered. This was also done because in the current system the AI cannot think while the game is paused, so when giving orders in pause it gave the player a great advantage.
  • RaduRadu Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 421
    edited May 2011
    You should be thankful enough it gives you the option to pause and think in the first place.
  • Rastafari_KenRastafari_Ken Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 903
    edited May 2011
    Actually, the reason behind the Legendary mode, from what I understand, was to get rid of the normal crutches that gamers use, like multiple saved games and issuing orders while paused.

    So to put back in save games and orders while paused, you would be undermining the reason they made Legendary mode in the first place.

    If it becomes too much of a distraction, you might have to revert back to VH.
  • ranknfileranknfile Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,099
    edited May 2011
    It would be nice to have the more realistic battle map features of Legendary Mode in lower difficulty modes. That way more logical ("realistic") diplomacy, etc. by the AI clans would be matched with more realistic battle play. All that said, I think the game is fine "as is" - but I am waiting for the patch to start a new campaign.
    "Whoever desires is always poor" - Claudian
  • spicykoreanspicykorean Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,632
    edited May 2011
    LOL
    I usually like to think that there is no such thing as a dumb question but Angelo proved me wrong.
    Just go and play in Very Hard mode. Easy solution.

    It's funny how so many posts on the forum already have a solution but folks refuse to use them and instead come and whine in here for the game to be changed. Go figure.
  • GuffazGuffaz Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 20
    edited May 2011
    Am I the only player that doesnt bother using pause no matter the difficulty?
  • Rastafari_KenRastafari_Ken Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 903
    edited May 2011
    Guffaz wrote: »
    Am I the only player that doesnt bother using pause no matter the difficulty?

    The only time I use pause is when my mom brings me my hot pockets.
  • Ângelo CossaÂngelo Cossa Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 12
    edited May 2011
    LOL
    I usually like to think that there is no such thing as a dumb question but Angelo proved me wrong.
    Just go and play in Very Hard mode. Easy solution.

    It's funny how so many posts on the forum already have a solution but folks refuse to use them and instead come and whine in here for the game to be changed. Go figure.

    If there was the option "no minimap" and "no save game" i would gladly play on vh (as i play now), and in case if you dind't understand or did not read at all the post, i am not "whining" i am sugesting a comand system like the ones implemented on hard core turn based strategy games, that makes the thing much more dificult than learn to "click fast", as i think (personal option) that "click fast" is not the goal of an strategy game.

    Anyway aside from that answer "P.S. Oh and I just remembered. This was also done because in the current system the AI cannot think while the game is paused, so when giving orders in pause it gave the player a great advantage.", there were no good anwser for my stupid question.
  • vallu751vallu751 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 22
    edited May 2011
    If there was the option "no minimap" and "no save game" i would gladly play on vh (as i play now)

    There's a key to turn off the minimap and nobody's forcing you to do save/reloading to backtrack on VH.
  • spitzveldmuis_wspitzveldmuis_w Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 27
    edited May 2011
    IF you have the self restraint you can toggle the battle minimap on/off and you can just keep using the same save game.
    It requires restraint though.
  • Ângelo CossaÂngelo Cossa Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 12
    edited May 2011
    IF you have the self restraint you can toggle the battle minimap on/off and you can just keep using the same save game.
    It requires restraint though.
    Well, that "IF" is the problem lol

    And i don't understand why people is so agressive, is not like i am saying the game is bad, os proporsing super changing game modifications.... 3 simples checkboxes on the options before start game saying
    - No minimap
    - No save game
    - No Command while paused

    Things that are alread implemented in the game and should not take more than one or 2 hours of development would enable anyone to use theses features on any level of play (on legendary just disable the options)
  • Rastafari_KenRastafari_Ken Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 903
    edited May 2011
    Well, that "IF" is the problem lol

    And i don't understand why people is so agressive, is not like i am saying the game is bad, os proporsing super changing game modifications.... 3 simples checkboxes on the options before start game saying
    - No minimap
    - No save game
    - No Command while paused

    Things that are alread implemented in the game and should not take more than one or 2 hours of development would enable anyone to use theses features on any level of play (on legendary just disable the options)

    You're right, Angelo - there is no reason your suggestion should have generated such heat.

    But as it has been pointed out, it is well within your power to limit these features manually without it being hard coded.
  • Ninja PirateNinja Pirate Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 349
    edited May 2011
    Not being able to pause is good practice for multiplayer, I've been solely playing multiplayer for about a month now, and just started my first single player legendary game, and after MP you don't ven miss the pause button. (forgive my run on sentence too much coffee)

    The save thing does bother me, but it makes me really take more ownership of my generals, and play with a bit more caution, as there are no redos
  • IvaneIvane Registered Users Posts: 1
    Hello. I can beat nearly all total war legendary dificulty games. I won shogun 2, fall of the samurai, Attila, rome 2, Warhammer 1.... WHITHOUT MODS! I can win all of them. But this is not the issue. I like gamesave mecanics on legendary, but I hate play whitout pause. I can win fckng game but this makes battle boring. you need take bunch of heavy inventary and support them with skirmishers. forget about cavalery, forget ebout horse archers, forget ebout interesting flanking manouvers, not to mention 2 fronts. just take units attack and support them with archers, so enemy cavalery and archers do not kill them. it is BORING! And if I make game on hard mode, you can allways quicksave. this makes game also boring. We need mods which remooves this **** "battle realism" from game but leaves gamesave mecanisms so we can enjoy the game..
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