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Wood Elves Seasons, Forest "Corruption", World Roots, Wild Hunt mechanic?

GreyKnightDanteGreyKnightDante Registered Users Posts: 339
edited August 2016 in General Discussion
So to those that might not know, in the lore there are a few certain things which make the Wood Elves very uniqe and I feel like when they come out, the mechanics of seasons, world roots and Wild Hunt will be used to represent them.

Seasons

I'd expect the Wood Elves to follow a season mechanic where during the Summers and Spring, the Wood Elves are at their most strongest, while during Winter the Wood Elves are at their most weakest. It follows the lore very closely so I'd expect this to atleast come to the game. Each season should last for around 4-5 turns, which would give you ample time to do something. I suggest winter to last for no mroe than 2 or 3 turns.

Summer/Spring

  • Faster Recruitment speed
  • Longer March Range
  • Faster Replenishment
  • Able to recruit Forest Spirits (dryad, treemen, treekin)

Fall

  • Normal Recruitment speed
  • Normal March Range
  • Normal Replenishment
  • Able to recruit Forest Spirits (dryad, treemen, treekin)

Winter

  • Slower Recruitment Speed
  • Shorter March Range
  • No Replenishment
  • Snow Attrition (Wood Elve army must be encamped or in city)
  • Unable to recruit Forest Spirits (lorewise, they are asleep during this time)

Forest "Corruption"

Now the second mechanic they could add is a possible Forest "Corruption" mechanic similar to the Vamp and Chaos corruption, but instead of making things dead, it makes the forest grow.

Forest Corruption Mechanic

  • Allows recruitment of Forest Units (requires % of Forest corruption to recruit certain units)
  • Possible attrition for enemy armies
  • Counter to Chaos/Vamp Corruption
  • Allows for more possible ambush (since its forest terrain)
  • Allows the use of World Roots (will speak more about it later)

World Roots

Another key feature of the Wood Elves is their ability to use the World Roots. Now if CA gets lazy, they would do another carbon-copy of Under-way stance, but if they would put a little effort in originality, they probably could give the ability for certain Wood Elves armies to "teleport" themselves to specific areas on the map. A possible use may be where an army can teleport to any settlement with a high % of Forest Corruption anywhere on the map.

World Root Mechanic

  • Can teleport to settlements with high % of Forest corruption
  • An army needs to be in a Wood Elven settlement with high % as well (that is of course if they will not be a horde faction)

Wild Hunt

And finally, we have the wild hunt, which is an integral part of Wood Elven society and military. The wild Hunt is in many ways a crusade of sort, where Orion would lead the Elves on a hunt against the enemies of Athel Loren. So I'm guessing, this wild hunt feature will probably follow a crusade style mechanic, where Orion would lead an NPC army towards a Goal and if you were to aid him on the hunt, you get currency and public order benefits.

Wild Hunt Mechanic

  • Every Summer Orion (or the player) could call forth a Wild Hunt on a random nearby enemy faction (Factions already at war with you)
  • You have the ability to join him on the hunt and aid him in his efforts
  • Orion and his NPC army must survive and complete objective
  • If won, you get a hefty reward, public order benefits and maybe a small increase in Forest corruption.
  • Of course, this Wild Hunt MUST be finished before the start of winter, otherwise it has failed (since Orion dies every winter and gets reborn during spring)




So this is what I have for a possible Wood Elves mechanic. What is your guy's opinion? I hope CA might look at this and find some nice ideas for the Wood Elven expansion. And if you have questions, ask, because I know much about the Warhammer lore and is an admin of the Warhammer Wiki site
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Post edited by GreyKnightDante on
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Comments

  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,895
    edited August 2016
    Seasons? Yes, could work simiar to "Morrslieb", thou I would be care full not to cripple a race too much for 25-50% of the time.

    Corruption? No. Sorry, but I have no idea why this become such a popular though to begin with. It makes no sense lore wise, is gameplay wise not new and does now every one needs they own corruption? Do Lizardmen get "jungle corruption"?

    World Roots? Yes and no. They should do something with it, but every time I read "should teleport" i think people did only thinking about this feature to play as WE, never to play against WE.

    Wild Hunt? Yes but since Orion is most likely the race leader, you probably will play him yourself, making him unplayable would inconsequential. Hence I would suggest that it works differently.
    Perhaps similar to a Jihad in Medieval 2 or Crusade. Randomness would be fitting (thou it is implied that WH have a system behind them, which is just not understandable from the outside) , but is problematic gameplay wise, since you can end up in war with everyone, forced by the game.
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • GreyKnightDanteGreyKnightDante Registered Users Posts: 339
    SiWi said:

    Seasons? Yes, could work simiar to "Morrslieb", thou I would be care full not to cripple a race too much for 25-50% of the time.

    Corruption? No. Sorry, but I have no idea why this become such a popular though to begin with. It makes no sense lore wise, is gameplay wise not new and does now every one needs they own corruption? Do Lizardmen get "jungle corruption"?

    World Roots? Yes and no. They should do something with it, but every time I read "should teleport" i think people did only thinking about this feature to play as WE, never to play against WE.

    Wild Hunt? Yes but since Orion is most likely the race leader, you probably will play him yourself, making him unplayable would inconsequential. Hence I would suggest that it works differently.
    Perhaps similar to a Jihad in Medieval 2 or Crusade. Randomness would be fitting (thou it is implied that WH have a system behind them, which is just not understandable from the outside) , but is problematic gameplay wise, since you can end up in war with everyone, forced by the game.

    I made some edits to the OP.

    For the seasons, I'm expect Summer and Spring to be benefits, while Fall is normal and Winter is negative (abliet at a sorter timefram, maybe for just 2 or 3 turns)

    For the Wild Hunt bit, by randomness, I mean a random faction that is already at war with you. I don't expect the Wild Hunt to be attacking neutral or allied factions at all.
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  • SetrusSetrus Senior Member SwedenRegistered Users Posts: 18,767
    I too would love to see seasons. Could even change the appearance within the forest and any battles within it. :)

    Well corruption HAS a place in the Wood elf lore, but the thing is that the Wood Elf corruption is something that is dark and evil and dangerous, especially to them, making them strive to contain it. As such, I'd see any corruption for them being a negative thing that is like a rot within them when the player mess up. (much like the dwarf grudges pilling up, perhaps? ) :)

    World Roots would to me only work if there's still ways to strike back into Athel Loren. This means beast path attacks, underway attacks and for humans and vampires possibly a way to go in through any such "gates" with the right conditions. (maybe a certain time after an elf force has opened it? ) or it'll be annoying. So I'm pretty much in agreement with Siwi.

    On Orion and the Wild hunt...I'm really hoping he actually dies and gets reborn all the time but that you control him and the army you gather for him for a swift Wild Hunt where of course the diplomatic repercussions have to be weighted for the downside of not doing enough. I also hope he's NOT the faction leader. As far as lore goes Ariel is a notch above, now her rules and model is horribly out of date but she could easily be replaced by the Twilight Sisters seeing as how they speak with her voice.
    Or maybe even Durthu, he IS a vital figure in the Wood Elf lore, after all. (also, treeman LL sounds badass)

    Don't worry.
  • GreyKnightDanteGreyKnightDante Registered Users Posts: 339
    SiWi said:

    Seasons? Yes, could work simiar to "Morrslieb", thou I would be care full not to cripple a race too much for 25-50% of the time.

    Corruption? No. Sorry, but I have no idea why this become such a popular though to begin with. It makes no sense lore wise, is gameplay wise not new and does now every one needs they own corruption? Do Lizardmen get "jungle corruption"?

    World Roots? Yes and no. They should do something with it, but every time I read "should teleport" i think people did only thinking about this feature to play as WE, never to play against WE.

    Wild Hunt? Yes but since Orion is most likely the race leader, you probably will play him yourself, making him unplayable would inconsequential. Hence I would suggest that it works differently.
    Perhaps similar to a Jihad in Medieval 2 or Crusade. Randomness would be fitting (thou it is implied that WH have a system behind them, which is just not understandable from the outside) , but is problematic gameplay wise, since you can end up in war with everyone, forced by the game.

    Also, for the Forest Corruption thing, it would make sense in a gameplay perspective. Unless you want the Wood Elves to be a horde faction, it would make sense that once a Wood Elven army has taken over a settlement, it would make sense for the surrounding lands to be flourishing with alot of nature magic (can't remember the Winds of Magic)......the world after was once covered in its entirety by a magical forest


    Also, lorewise, many of the Forest Spirits of Athel Loren WANT to spread and return the world back to a time when the forest covered much of the world. An example would be the Drycha and to a lesser extent Durthu (though Durthu has mostly given up on that and simply wishes to protect what is left of the forest)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,895

    SiWi said:

    Seasons? Yes, could work simiar to "Morrslieb", thou I would be care full not to cripple a race too much for 25-50% of the time.

    Corruption? No. Sorry, but I have no idea why this become such a popular though to begin with. It makes no sense lore wise, is gameplay wise not new and does now every one needs they own corruption? Do Lizardmen get "jungle corruption"?

    World Roots? Yes and no. They should do something with it, but every time I read "should teleport" i think people did only thinking about this feature to play as WE, never to play against WE.

    Wild Hunt? Yes but since Orion is most likely the race leader, you probably will play him yourself, making him unplayable would inconsequential. Hence I would suggest that it works differently.
    Perhaps similar to a Jihad in Medieval 2 or Crusade. Randomness would be fitting (thou it is implied that WH have a system behind them, which is just not understandable from the outside) , but is problematic gameplay wise, since you can end up in war with everyone, forced by the game.

    Also, for the Forest Corruption thing, it would make sense in a gameplay perspective. Unless you want the Wood Elves to be a horde faction, it would make sense that once a Wood Elven army has taken over a settlement, it would make sense for the surrounding lands to be flourishing with alot of nature magic (can't remember the Winds of Magic)......the world after was once covered in its entirety by a magical forest
    Sorry, but even if you just want to take cities, corruption is unnecessary and only add to the illogical would city conquering brings.

    Fact is:
    it makes no sense for Wood Elves to take over cities.
    They never done or even tried.
    They have no intensive to do.
    Lorewise, everything they want is in Athen Lorel. The rest of the world is only interesting in the sense that it can be manipulated to protect Athen Lorel.

    Now for a TW game you will have to "break" some of they lore, most likely. But if "conquering cities" it is, why add the nonsense with "corruption"?
    Empire Witchhunters have hunted Vampires, Deamon, Chaos Worshippers, Necromancer and so on. Because both the undead and chaos do such things in the lore.
    How many times did they hunt down WE trying to spread Athen Lorel?
    I think that number is zero.



    Also, lorewise, many of the Forest Spirits of Athel Loren WANT to spread and return the world back to a time when the forest covered much of the world. An example would be the Drycha and to a lesser extent Durthu (though Durthu has mostly given up on that and simply wishes to protect what is left of the forest)

    Really? Then were are the efforts to make Athen Lorel grown?
    All what I read was: Athen Lorel is very special place and WE want to keep left alone, were the majority of they efforts go to.
    All they do outside of AL is for protecting AL.
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • LodisLodis Registered Users Posts: 10
    I'd be happy with most of these suggestions. Protecting/restoring the forests must be a large factor in their campaign, so I'd agree with the world roots being used as teleporters, they figure massively in their lore and let them travel across the entire world.

    It's simply a way of making the wood elves relevant to the larger game. Lizardmen magically teleport across the world regularly to retrieve artifacts and protect their stones, dark elves have sea caverns through the world, High elves have the best/fastest ships. This is all to allow them to interact with the other races.
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,406
    @SiWi the Empire didn't taken over Bretonnia in the lore, but it don't mean that it's not reasonable to believe that the Empire can do it, and that's why the Empire can do it in Total War, the same goes for the Forest Spirits who want to return the world back to a time when the forests had covered bigger parts of the world, Drycha and the Old Man with the Bird would combine forces and make it happen, each for their own motives, it's Making Enough Sense in the lore, and it would save Total War Players from yet another horde faction or being stuck Only One Province(which is Not Fitting for a Total War Game). Making the Wood Elves an horde faction would be the most cheap and boring solution, the Wood Elves should be able to take over the existing forests and/or make more forests/make the forests much bigger.
  • GreyKnightDanteGreyKnightDante Registered Users Posts: 339
    Tayvar said:

    @SiWi the Empire didn't taken over Bretonnia in the lore, but it don't mean that it's not reasonable to believe that the Empire can do it, and that's why the Empire can do it in Total War, the same goes for the Forest Spirits who want to return the world back to a time when the forests had covered bigger parts of the world, Drycha and the Old Man with the Bird would combine forces and make it happen, each for their own motives, it's Making Enough Sense in the lore, and it would save Total War Players from yet another horde faction or being stuck Only One Province(which is Not Fitting for a Total War Game). Making the Wood Elves an horde faction would be the most cheap and boring solution, the Wood Elves should be able to take over the existing forests and/or make more forests/make the forests much bigger.

    you hit it in the nail for that one!
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  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered Users Posts: 178
    I think seasons, like Morrslieb, should have pros and cons attached to both. Even Winter should have bonuses attached to them, and there should be things your best off waiting until it isn't Spring or Summer.

    Rather than corruption, I'd rather see them be anti-corruption, with extra ways to get rid of Chaos/Undead/whatever else CA thinks of corruption rather than create their own, even the corruption of neighboring settlements they do not control. This is something I would want to see High Elves, when they show up, be capable of as well.

    As for the horde/settlement/conquer quandary, I want to see one of two things done.

    1.) Athel Loren has it's own map, ala continents in Empire Total War. The idea that armies might spend several turns in a region they could walk around in a couple of turns might seem odd, but it's perfectly in line with the lore, as there have been many stories of people being stuck for months, or even years trying to get to a place that's only a couple days walk away. This would give the WE a large, connected place that they would have to defend from invaders and fight over with Drycha and/or other Wood Elf factions that would fit with their lore.

    2.) The addition of new settlements in forests and other locations across the Old World which Wood Elves can occupy. IMO these should be hidden to non-WE and Beastmen factions at first, and the exact location of the settlement within it's region should change with each campaign so you never quite know where it is. These would basically be outposts for the WE that they can use to watch out for things that might threaten Athel Loren and take them out before they ever become a threat.

    In both cases, the Wild Hunt, Grand campaign, and other faction mechanics (Weave?) will be your main excuse to travel out and fight wars far from Athel Loren, with grudge-like penalties to make sure you don't just turtle until the End Times.

    Wood Elves taking over Human settlements makes about as much sense as Greenskins taking them over, and for about the same reasons; Wood Elves simply do not have the patience or desire to set up a government and start taxing the humans that live there, and on top of that, Elves as a whole are simply not populous enough to migrate and set up roots (pun unintended) somewhere new.

    As for Worldroots, I wouldn't be shocked (though I would be disappointed) if it worked just like beastpath and underway travel. What I would like to see is it let you travel to settlements and/or forests you control. Have it be only Settlement-> settlement, and disable the ability to do so to settlements that are under siege.
  • Combat_WombatCombat_Wombat Registered Users Posts: 4,092
    edited August 2016
    Hope for it all, expect nothing. That way the disappointment doesn't set in as hard. You'll also be pleasently surprised if CA decides to do something different or actually good.
  • karge068karge068 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,411
    This is incredible

    Would create a truly unique faction

    Great ideas, thanks for posting
  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,895
    Tayvar said:

    @SiWi the Empire didn't taken over Bretonnia in the lore, but it don't mean that it's not reasonable to believe that the Empire can do it, and that's why the Empire can do it in Total War, the same goes for the Forest Spirits who want to return the world back to a time when the forests had covered bigger parts of the world, Drycha and the Old Man with the Bird would combine forces and make it happen, each for their own motives, it's Making Enough Sense in the lore, and it would save Total War Players from yet another horde faction or being stuck Only One Province(which is Not Fitting for a Total War Game). Making the Wood Elves an horde faction would be the most cheap and boring solution, the Wood Elves should be able to take over the existing forests and/or make more forests/make the forests much bigger.

    Except that the Empire tries it lore wise ( to a certain extend), but just can't manage it. They fight over cities and it would be beleive that the nation which runs human cities would run human cities in Bretonnia.
    Show me were the Wood Elves even tried it. Show me why they would be even interested in taking over Altdorf.
    For all the talk about how the Wood Spirits want to bring back the old times (usually a anti elv sentiment btw, so you take your WE mechanics base on those who HATE the WE ironically enough), they NEVER seem to do it. Can you point at incidents were the Empire needed to fight Wood Spirits that tried to spread Athen Lorel into the Empire? That the Witchhunters needed to stop they plans deep in the woods, similar to that of the Undead or Chaos? All the things "wood corruption" implies?

    And talking point without evidence number 12 is also back:
    show me EVIDENCE that horde is actually "cheaper" then regular mechanics.

    Classic case of:
    If CA does something I don't like, they are lazy.
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,406
    @SiWi do the Greenskins Run An Dwarfs Population? do the Dwarfs Run An Greenskins Population? No They Replace it with their own, also the Empire, Bretonnia and the Vampire Counts Cities Aesthetic Looks Quite Different, and yet in less then turn in the game they can Change Their Style. The Wood Elves should not control over Human Population, unless they would do it Through Bretonnia and/or in the Style that they are Manipulating Bretonnia., the Wood Elves would simple Magically/Arcadeclly Replace(in less then one turn) the Population and the City With The Forest Spirits and the Wood Elves Population, and the City Style into a Wood Elves Settlement Style(with Much More Trees Around), and all the building who can't be converted(like Walls) would be destroyed.
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,959
    The problem with forest corruption is that in the lore they are actively trying to prevent the forest from spreading and this is a source of acrimony between them and some of the more aggressive spirits.

    Also, I can't think of any situation where wood elves would ever want to conquer an empire settlement; they have the same enemies, and the Empire has nothing the Wood elves want.

    The only exception I can think of is if CA expands the snippets of lore that hint at wood elf communities in the drakwald and other empire forests.

    In that case I could see them warring against human "interlopers"
  • GaussiaGaussia Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,260
  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered Users Posts: 178
    edited August 2016
    Tayvar said:

    @SiWi do the Greenskins Run An Dwarfs Population? do the Dwarfs Run An Greenskins Population? No They Replace it with their own, also the Empire, Bretonnia and the Vampire Counts Cities Aesthetic Looks Quite Different, and yet in less then turn in the game they can Change Their Style. The Wood Elves should not control over Human Population, unless they would do it Through Bretonnia and/or in the Style that they are Manipulating Bretonnia., the Wood Elves would simple Magically/Arcadeclly Replace(in less then one turn) the Population and the City With The Forest Spirits and the Wood Elves Population, and the City Style into a Wood Elves Settlement Style(with Much More Trees Around), and all the building who can't be converted(like Walls) would be destroyed.

    Most Dwarf holds have a population of night goblins and other greenskins hiding in the tunnels beyond where the Dwarfs actually control and live, and many lost holds controlled by the greenskins have a clan of dwarfs who are too stubborn to leave and are working tirelessly to try and take it back (like Belegar Ironhammer, True King of Karak Eight Peaks) When the Skaven show up, if they fight over Holds like the others, they'll be in the same boat: in fact in the lore, Karak Eight Peaks is ruled by the Night Goblin Skarsnit on one level, Clan Mors Warlord Queek beneath that, and Belegar on the surface.

    When a Dwarf or Greenskin faction take over a settlement from the other race, it's less their people moving in from somewhere else and more their people already there can now come out of hiding.

    ...and it's like what SiWi said, the whole forest corruption/spread nature through the cities is ultimate goal of spirits like Drycha and Coeddil, who not only hate the Wood Elves (and are probably going to be the leaders of the initial at-war faction if Athel Loren has any settlements to take over), the reason the WE were allowed into the forest and to be their protectors by the Treeman Ancients in the first place is so the spirits of Athel Loren wouldn't have to resort to exactly that to protect the forest (mainly because they knew it would blow up in their faces if they made a serious try on it.)
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,406
    Foefaller said:

    Tayvar said:

    @SiWi do the Greenskins Run An Dwarfs Population? do the Dwarfs Run An Greenskins Population? No They Replace it with their own, also the Empire, Bretonnia and the Vampire Counts Cities Aesthetic Looks Quite Different, and yet in less then turn in the game they can Change Their Style. The Wood Elves should not control over Human Population, unless they would do it Through Bretonnia and/or in the Style that they are Manipulating Bretonnia., the Wood Elves would simple Magically/Arcadeclly Replace(in less then one turn) the Population and the City With The Forest Spirits and the Wood Elves Population, and the City Style into a Wood Elves Settlement Style(with Much More Trees Around), and all the building who can't be converted(like Walls) would be destroyed.

    Most Dwarf holds have a population of night goblins and other greenskins hiding in the tunnels beyond where the Dwarfs actually control and live, and many lost holds controlled by the greenskins have a clan of dwarfs who are too stubborn to leave and are working tirelessly to try and take it back (like Belegar Ironhammer, True King of Karak Eight Peaks) When the Skaven show up, if they fight over Holds like the others, they'll be in the same boat: in fact in the lore, Karak Eight Peaks is ruled by the Night Goblin Skarsnit on one level, Clan Mors Warlord Queek beneath that, and Belegar on the surface.

    When a Dwarf or Greenskin faction take over a settlement from the other race, it's less their people moving in from somewhere else and more their people already there can now come out of hiding.

    ...and it's like what SiWi said, the whole forest corruption/spread nature through the cities is ultimate goal of spirits like Drycha and Coeddil, who not only hate the Wood Elves (and are probably going to be the leaders of the initial at-war faction if Athel Loren has any settlements to take over), the reason the WE were allowed into the forest and to be their protectors by the Treeman Ancients in the first place is so the spirits of Athel Loren wouldn't have to resort to exactly that to protect the forest (mainly because they knew it would blow up in their faces if they made a serious try on it.)
    Almost no one care if the conquering more territories is going to backfire in a Total War Game, so Drycha might as well be One Of The Legendary Lords for her will to Spread The Forest, also it's the freaking End Times, at this point the Treeman Ancients Have Nothing To Lose, and they would do almost everything to Become Strong Enough to stop the Warriors of Chaos and the Beastmen, even if it's means making huge part of the world much more forestry. A horde playstyle is too aggressive for the Wood Elves, Defending Forests/Defending An Huge Forest While Chaos Comes, would be Much More Fitting for them, and Much More Entertaining for most Total War Players. So by all means, let Drycha to Make Forests Great Again.
  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered Users Posts: 178
    Personally, I want to see a TW faction that is not set on conquering/burning the whole world, that sounds like something new and different, something that really has never been seen before in a TW game (though you see such playstyles all the time in 4X/grand strategy games)

    Heaping military conquest on a race that in the lore is as much likely to do that as the Greenskins are likely to send an ambassador to the Empire for a trade deal just because "that's how Total War is" isn't a compelling argument for me personally. If you want to convince me it's the way to go, you'll have to explain why it can't be something else.
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,959
    Tayvar said:

    Foefaller said:

    Tayvar said:

    @SiWi do the Greenskins Run An Dwarfs Population? do the Dwarfs Run An Greenskins Population? No They Replace it with their own, also the Empire, Bretonnia and the Vampire Counts Cities Aesthetic Looks Quite Different, and yet in less then turn in the game they can Change Their Style. The Wood Elves should not control over Human Population, unless they would do it Through Bretonnia and/or in the Style that they are Manipulating Bretonnia., the Wood Elves would simple Magically/Arcadeclly Replace(in less then one turn) the Population and the City With The Forest Spirits and the Wood Elves Population, and the City Style into a Wood Elves Settlement Style(with Much More Trees Around), and all the building who can't be converted(like Walls) would be destroyed.

    Most Dwarf holds have a population of night goblins and other greenskins hiding in the tunnels beyond where the Dwarfs actually control and live, and many lost holds controlled by the greenskins have a clan of dwarfs who are too stubborn to leave and are working tirelessly to try and take it back (like Belegar Ironhammer, True King of Karak Eight Peaks) When the Skaven show up, if they fight over Holds like the others, they'll be in the same boat: in fact in the lore, Karak Eight Peaks is ruled by the Night Goblin Skarsnit on one level, Clan Mors Warlord Queek beneath that, and Belegar on the surface.

    When a Dwarf or Greenskin faction take over a settlement from the other race, it's less their people moving in from somewhere else and more their people already there can now come out of hiding.

    ...and it's like what SiWi said, the whole forest corruption/spread nature through the cities is ultimate goal of spirits like Drycha and Coeddil, who not only hate the Wood Elves (and are probably going to be the leaders of the initial at-war faction if Athel Loren has any settlements to take over), the reason the WE were allowed into the forest and to be their protectors by the Treeman Ancients in the first place is so the spirits of Athel Loren wouldn't have to resort to exactly that to protect the forest (mainly because they knew it would blow up in their faces if they made a serious try on it.)
    Almost no one care if the conquering more territories is going to backfire in a Total War Game, so Drycha might as well be One Of The Legendary Lords for her will to Spread The Forest, also it's the freaking End Times, at this point the Treeman Ancients Have Nothing To Lose, and they would do almost everything to Become Strong Enough to stop the Warriors of Chaos and the Beastmen, even if it's means making huge part of the world much more forestry. A horde playstyle is too aggressive for the Wood Elves, Defending Forests/Defending An Huge Forest While Chaos Comes, would be Much More Fitting for them, and Much More Entertaining for most Total War Players. So by all means, let Drycha to Make Forests Great Again.
    It's not the end times, it's just another chaos incursion, theyve always threatened to end the world, but have thus far been repelled. This is a different timeline, and unless CA foolishly gives WTW an injection of the dog**** marketing department memo that is end times lore, it will remain apart from the events that ended the WHFB world. So saying what one faction did or didn't do in the end times dosent carry any water here.

  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,406
    @Mr.Finley7 didn't you read the texts in Total War: Warhammer? while playing as Archaon or against him? they clearly saying the 'End Times', and they clearly saying 'Archaon the Lord of the End Times', so yes, the End Times is in Total War already, but you can stop Archaon in the game. Yes there was multiply chaos incursions, but with Different Everchosens, the Everchosen can die, he is powerful, but he is still Moral, the End Times as the first and the last time that Archaon attacked the civilized world, as it's an Retcon for the Storm of Chaos.

    http://warhammeronline.wikia.com/wiki/Everchosen

  • shinrosshinros Registered Users Posts: 1,536
    I don't consider it end times until I see my home boy nagash in 3d and mannfred on the awesome dread abyssal.
    Nagash: When Nagash reaches out to crush his enemies, it is with a million hands. When Nagash seeks out his prey, it is with a million eyes.....
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,959
    Tayvar said:

    @Mr.Finley7 didn't you read the texts in Total War: Warhammer? while playing as Archaon or against him? they clearly saying the 'End Times', and they clearly saying 'Archaon the Lord of the End Times', so yes, the End Times is in Total War already, but you can stop Archaon in the game. Yes there was multiply chaos incursions, but with Different Everchosens, the Everchosen can die, he is powerful, but he is still Moral, the End Times as the first and the last time that Archaon attacked the civilized world, as it's an Retcon for the Storm of Chaos.

    http://warhammeronline.wikia.com/wiki/Everchosen

    Lord of the end times was a title he had just to make him sound more menacing. He had the title as far back as 6th edition, when he was accomplishing precisely nothing, and when they had absolutely no intention of implementing a world ending event.

    I'm sure Asavar Kul had similarly colorful titles before his death which GW could have expounded upon if they so choose.
  • shinrosshinros Registered Users Posts: 1,536
    edited August 2016
    Well yes in a sense but actually the lore reason is why he took that title since he actually wants to destroy everything even the chaos gods. That's his main title that title is his goal.

    All the other everchosen's never had such a goal and served the will of the gods hence why they did not bare such a title as lord of end times.
    Nagash: When Nagash reaches out to crush his enemies, it is with a million hands. When Nagash seeks out his prey, it is with a million eyes.....
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,959
    Shinros said:

    Well yes in a sense but actually the lore reason is why he took that title since he actually wants to destroy everything even the chaos gods. That's his main title that title is his goal.

    All the other everchosen's never had such a goal and served the will of the gods hence why they did not bare such a title as lord of end times.

    I guess, but that justification was invented as part of the end times lore which is 70% worthless. Originally he was just another commander of chaos undivided looking to wipe out civilization, which might as well be the same thing as ending the world.
  • shinrosshinros Registered Users Posts: 1,536
    edited August 2016

    Shinros said:

    Well yes in a sense but actually the lore reason is why he took that title since he actually wants to destroy everything even the chaos gods. That's his main title that title is his goal.

    All the other everchosen's never had such a goal and served the will of the gods hence why they did not bare such a title as lord of end times.

    I guess, but that justification was invented as part of the end times lore which is 70% worthless. Originally he was just another commander of chaos undivided looking to wipe out civilization, which might as well be the same thing as ending the world.
    No it's in Archaon's novel which is not an end times novel. He wants to destroy all "false" gods even the chaos gods. They found this amusing of course and bestowed the everchosen title(Plus gathering the treasures of chaos and destroying all other champions the chaos gods only had him to go with which was his plan.).

    Archaon named himself the lord of the end times. Yet now in AOS(Even if you hate it) the chaos gods are starting to sweat a little since they even have tried to assassinate him since he is getting too big for his boots.
    Nagash: When Nagash reaches out to crush his enemies, it is with a million hands. When Nagash seeks out his prey, it is with a million eyes.....
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Cair Andros GarrisonRegistered Users Posts: 11,459
    Guys, this isn't an Archaon thread. :p
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  • shinrosshinros Registered Users Posts: 1,536

    Guys, this isn't an Archaon thread. :p

    Sorry. D: I will try to stay on topic.

    Now I do really like the seasonal idea I hope it get's added to the campaign.
    Nagash: When Nagash reaches out to crush his enemies, it is with a million hands. When Nagash seeks out his prey, it is with a million eyes.....
  • GRAY_HATGRAY_HAT Senior Member UKRegistered Users Posts: 5,394

    The problem with forest corruption is that in the lore they are actively trying to prevent the forest from spreading and this is a source of acrimony between them and some of the more aggressive spirits.

    Also, I can't think of any situation where wood elves would ever want to conquer an empire settlement; they have the same enemies, and the Empire has nothing the Wood elves want.

    The only exception I can think of is if CA expands the snippets of lore that hint at wood elf communities in the drakwald and other empire forests.

    In that case I could see them warring against human "interlopers"

    It was elves united (pre-WotB) or possibly some god that put the stones that restrict ALs growth the wood elves would probably try and help remove them if there was an opotunity.

    While low down on the list empire humans are still enimes of the forest and replacing those settlements with forest is a long turn goal.

    I think those communities have been retconed into expeditions (some long term)
    Team Wood Elves

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  • chirishman343chirishman343 Registered Users Posts: 106
    the only reason people are mentioning the forest corruption thing, is we want a plausible reason to leave the forest barring a wild hunt every year. i know there is someone out there who wants to do nothing more than sit in the forest and do nothing until the next wild hunt comes around, but most total war players are used to having to go out and expand. or raze if a horde. a faction that does nothing for 3/4 of the game is not an interesting faction, lore be damned.
  • GreyKnightDanteGreyKnightDante Registered Users Posts: 339
    all and all, I have to agree on this.......The Wood Elves is going to be a HELLA boring faction if they don't allow them more options than to defend a small patch of territory at the corner of Bretonnia.
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