An Open Letter To Creative Assembly

heysexy

I love this game, never bought any game that's $60 if I didn't think it was worth it. I bought all the DLCs at their full price.

Now here are the things that matter to a player like me:
A healthy community of modders and players.

Total War: Warhammer is becoming like Diablo 3. A huge success that progressively alienated it's players with every update. Cmon Creative Assembly! What the heck are you doing? You can do better than this!

I understand that you want to make money and create more content while paying your staff. I know engineers and designers are not cheap, but consider your players. Say you don't care about poor players who can't afford your DLCs, then you don't care for the rest of your players. Why? You are alienating not just the people who can't and won't afford your DLCs, you are alienating players like me as well.

Games like these are fun with people playing it! With modders making awesome mods. Some of the best modders left the community for other games after you Beastman DLC that was $20+ at first. Read the comments http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=714796477

Money to you means more than your players. Your success will be only short-term. I am not just talking about this one game, I am talking about your company as well. What happens when there are no players left to buy your games because of your reputation that you are building? You know what makes Blizzard and LoL so popular? They care so much for their players. They will and are enjoying much longer success then your company will unless you wisen up and make a change.

If you divide the player base by DLC and make multiplayer incompatible, and you think people will pay for that continually. Think again. You are digging your own grave.

Think of a better way to monetize than DLC. Please. For $20, people can get a whole new game, some can buy 4 new games at $5. You live on Steam, adapt to the Steam alternative competition or die.

I know you are wondering how to get my and other player's money to keep the lights on. I get it. Here's a couple of ways:

If you want the $$$ for additional content and DLCs, make this game freemium. Base game free and DLC will be paid, at this point the only things that can save TW:W is a big influx of players. If you want to earn the players trust, I would recommend giving Beastman DLC away for FREE or at least at 90 percent discount as an apology to the players who left. People who could afford it already bought it, people who couldn't left. A lot of people just left because of principle. I am on a verge of leaving because the game is no longer fun, depending whether you respond to this message or just make us feel like you don't give a damn.

People will pay for content, but they won't pay for additional content if they already had to flush out $60 for the base game! You are not World of Warcraft or freemium MMO, what the f*** are you thinking? Whoever is your monetization lead. WAKE UP! $20 to you means nothing. For players around the world, that could be their whole month's savings.

Furthermore, all your updates break my game for some time. The latest one just broke it for good. I run a big modding collection for games I truly love and think they are worth the time to help other players. I want to play the game with mods and with people. I want to help you, the creators of this awesome game, BUT you break mod compatibility every update with the last one making it impossible for us to check compatibility because the game launches even though some mods are not compatible with each other. *facepalm*

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=716794585

Blood for Blood God DLC was great! Not that many game-breaking bugs. The community flourished even though you had haters. Beastmen DLC confirmed the hate and that's one nail to your coffin. Great content shouldn't come with more game breaking bugs than content. My game crashes now even on selecting a town, for no reason. Or the can't end your turn Chaos invasion. 100+ turns. Well, I have already gotten used to this. Re-create the game if you have having issues, mostly because of mods. Yes, that's the price I pay, but at least before Beastmen DLC, I had a way to figure out which mod caused the problem! Not I don't, so starting a new game won't fix anything.

If you are building a product and improving features, do you do any customer research? Where the heck is your product manager, customer research? Cmon guys!

I highly advise you to go freemium, or significantly lower the cost of the base game if you plan on continual support for $20 a DLC pop. Make your DLC releases better with more testing. Like with CS:GO or League of Legends, character skins and designs are what people will pay for. Graphics, more battle maps, don't change the game dynamics and can be made compatible on multiplayer. Support your modding community and make some guidelines. Make this shift a priority for this game and any future games if you want a proven method of long-term success. Heck, combine freemium with a premium subscription model of a one, two, or even three dollars a month. Charge a lot of people, a little money and you will have a lot. That's what WhatsApp did and got acquired for $$,$$$,$$$,$$$.$$. Save yourself.

Do you agree/disagree? What are your thought CA?

AetaosRauKeres

stop being poor, mate

TheShiroOfDalton

If you want the $$$ for additional content and DLCs, make this game freemium.

Makes a post complaining about TWWH's prices, then suggests this.

By this point I'm almost inclined to consider this a parody.

Conflictions

Money talks, as far as I've read the beastmen DLC sold well. The source is from these forums mind you so take that as you will, but if people purchased it then they feel it was worth the price tag in one way or another. CA's been around since 87', Blizzard since 91', and Rito is relatively new when it comes to behemoths.

Your problems honestly sound more like personal ones then CA's. Updates breaking mods? This is almost universal, its up to modders to update their creations to keep up with the current games version not the other way around. Check it bruh.

Sephirex

Considering the DLC races are getting added to your game as opponents whether you buy the content or not, you can already pretend you're getting freemium treatment. You even bought the starter package for $15 a race.

Once people stop buying the additional races, they'll stop making them. Then I'll be sad because I was hoping they'd get the funding to finish the whole Warhammer experience, and you'll be happy because there's no more DLC I guess?

Also, how is the game no longer fun? Did they go in and snip some parts away of what you'd bought?

Setrus#7519

Multiplayer isn't incompatible by DLC as far as I know.

Ah yes, the good old "give things away for free and you'll make money". It's true that there's a tendency to get increased sales when lowering price, but there's a limit on how many sales you get, and an even lower limit when you compare lowered price, number of projected buyers in comparison to what's profitable. My thought on that is that I'm convinced CA's professional marketers and economics with access to all the data and all the tools have a better grasp than anyone on this forum. (I suspect every dlc in CA's history by now has had someone claim it should be free, at least half the time as some form of apology)

People paying for reskins? I thought everyone said they hated those and that those were lazy and so on? Giants, anyone? Spawns? Heck, there's a thread on the first page about concerns about the coming dlc having reskins...maybe this is more one of your opinions?

CA cannot be held accountable for your game crashing when you have a ton of mods on that have yet to be updated. They fought for us to get to mod at all, and now you complain that your heavily modded game, altering game-files, don't work because CA happened to alter the same files?
So then it follows that CA should never patch, update or add anything to the game? No game 2 or 3 or say added Skaven or Wood Elves? Because perish the thought that your current campaign fails to work?
Seriously!?

Yes, make it fremium now, CA, I'm suuuure all those people paying for it on release won't be in the least upset.

Mukip#5273

CA adds FLC, and the paid-DLC (Beastmen) showed up in the game as an adversary faction even if you didn't buy them. You are getting stuff even when you don't buy anything more than the base game. You will continue to benefit from additional free content for years to come even if you don't spend another penny. You are petulant.

"Go freemium", lol. Is this peak gamer entitlement? What I find insufferable about them is that they are made aware of the reasons for why things cost money, but they simply don't care. They don't want to pay so they stomp their feet and tantrum.

salsicha

Who's piggy bank is so small it got broke for $20? Go to a games store and look at the prices for painted minis. I'm saying there are more expensive habits.

Nigrinus

Again someone who obviously has no idea how much work all this is. 20 Dollars or Euros, really I do not give a damn, because this is what I like to spend my money on. You don't have to buy it you know.

TheShiroOfDalton

So, what if TWWH was "freemium"?

You get the basegame for free, but only with Karl Franz and a bunch of basic empire state troops available. Want Reiksguard, cannons, Demigryph Knights or anything? $2.99 per piece. Building or recruiting stuff takes six real life hours but can be accelerated by spending $.99 to have it finished immediately. The Chaos Invasion is triggered but the game stops and asks you to buy the "Chaos Invasion" event for $4.99. Want heroes and lords to level beyond rank 10? That's another $1.99 for the unlock.

Yeah, I can see people flocking to this. Total War: Warhammerfarmville.

RowYerboat#9411

Setrus said:

CA cannot be held accountable for your game crashing when you have a ton of mods on that have yet to be updated. They fought for us to get to mod at all, and now you complain that your heavily modded game, altering game-files, don't work because CA happened to alter the same files?
So then it follows that CA should never patch, update or add anything to the game? No game 2 or 3 or say added Skaven or Wood Elves? Because perish the thought that your current campaign fails to work?
Seriously!?

Point #1 quoted above.

Point #2, I personally thought that Beastmen were priced higher than I wanted to pay, so I didn't buy them. Many people agreed, but many others thought it was fair and bought it. This topic has been beaten to a pulp in these forums.

BUT: I completely disagree about the updates in general. Overall I think the game, while very stable and an excellent experience at launch, has improved noticeably with the two major patches, in terms of balance and AI behavior (although there is still room for even more improvement, of course).

Point #3: You complain that TW is going the way of Diablo 3 (implying that D3 was "anti-player"), then hold up Blizzard as a company that is successful because they really care about their fans...whaaa?? You mean the same Blizzard that charges for packs of 5 totally random virtual Hearthstone cards, then down the road makes those cards you bought completely useless? Sorry, but despite my feelings about CA's DLC approach, Blizzard is far more cash hungry, and obviously so.

And finally, a giant NOOOOOOOO to "freemium."

boyfights

If you're that hard up for money then I would advise against buying $60 games on release, particularly ones that are known to get discounted deeply not long after release

Also given CA's track record on making fun freemium games I'm gonna have to give that suggestion a solid nope

boyfights

CA your game too expensive. I have good idea though, make it free.

Sephirex

boyfights said:

CA your game too expensive. I have good idea though, make it free.

I can't believe we've been staring at the solution, the WHOLE TIME.

lightgemini

Seriously, I was respecting the OP point of view till I reached the freemium part. Any credibility in defending his opinion just dissapeated with that and what came after.


Think it better and try again.

Sephirex

I feel like I'm beginning to build a slight prejudice to the posters with the default 'Chaos Infected Light Wizard' avatar.
You can almost flip a coin to see whether it'll be a decent post, or yet another directionless rant about not wanting to spend money on future content.

boyfights

Lol yeah there are a few avatars that are starting to make me twitch before I read the post, this forum could really use custom avatars

SetheusIX

freemium is a complete joke. Please never do this CA, this guys been smoking crack or something

krunsh

"An open letter to SEGA"

Horus168

Base games haven't really got any more expensive side I started buying them 25 years or so ago, but inflation means that most other things have got more expensive. If the market won't support game prices to rise with inflation, it makes sense that publishers will look to other methods to monetise. ...

octavian1127

Their game makes top 10 steam sales for pre-order multiple weeks in row. Their DLC makes the top 10 during pre-order also. They're obviously doing something wrong...

Egonic#4784

This thread is hilarious!
I am certain that CA will make giant copies of this and post in their office to make everyone smile
Wonder if I can get a T-Shirt with this printed on it.

Sephirex

horus168 said:

Base games haven't really got any more expensive side I started buying them 25 years or so ago, but inflation means that most other things have got more expensive. If the market won't support game prices to rise with inflation, it makes sense that publishers will look to other methods to monetise. ...

Spot on. And a strategy game with real time battles having 4 completely different factions is absolutely at market value. Games certainly exist just to be DLC vehicles for overpriced content, but TW:WH doesn't fall into that category. The base game is a full $60 experience, on par with any Warhammer games that have come before, and the fact that they plan to keep building on it should be exciting.

I don't understand the viewpoint of "A full game is worth $60. If any content is developed after the release of the game, it is no longer a full title and is now an episodic title and is no longer worth $60."

boyfights

Also I am going to compare the dlc price to the parent game price, and I refuse to take things into account such as now having twice as many balance issues to consider. I will also probably decide that it is $2-5 too expensive in the end no matter what

sbbodybuilder

RowYerboat said:

Setrus said:

CA cannot be held accountable for your game crashing when you have a ton of mods on that have yet to be updated. They fought for us to get to mod at all, and now you complain that your heavily modded game, altering game-files, don't work because CA happened to alter the same files?
So then it follows that CA should never patch, update or add anything to the game? No game 2 or 3 or say added Skaven or Wood Elves? Because perish the thought that your current campaign fails to work?
Seriously!?

Point #1 quoted above.

Point #2, I personally thought that Beastmen were priced higher than I wanted to pay, so I didn't buy them. Many people agreed, but many others thought it was fair and bought it. This topic has been beaten to a pulp in these forums.

BUT: I completely disagree about the updates in general. Overall I think the game, while very stable and an excellent experience at launch, has improved noticeably with the two major patches, in terms of balance and AI behavior (although there is still room for even more improvement, of course).

Point #3: You complain that TW is going the way of Diablo 3 (implying that D3 was "anti-player"), then hold up Blizzard as a company that is successful because they really care about their fans...whaaa?? You mean the same Blizzard that charges for packs of 5 totally random virtual Hearthstone cards, then down the road makes those cards you bought completely useless? Sorry, but despite my feelings about CA's DLC approach, Blizzard is far more cash hungry, and obviously so.

And finally, a giant NOOOOOOOO to "freemium."

Preach on brother. Couldn't have said it better myself. Btw, you never have to pay full price for any games at launch. There are numerous sites out there that will regularly give you roughly 20% off and it gets you a Steam code so you're set. I bought the game at launch (pre ordered even) and paid 20% less. I thought the Beastmen DLC was slightly overpriced, but again I got 20% off and paid roughly $16, which is how much I thought i was worth.

Simply put, if you don't think something is worth it then don't pay it. Once the price is in your range, then get it, or don't.... the beauty of human choice.

Sephirex

Open Letter to my Wallet:

Why are you always empty? It's your job to provide money for me to spend. No one's going to use a wallet that doesn't have anything in it.

Open Letter to my Parents:

Please send money. I'm sorry about what I said in the last letter to you.

Wolfshart79

OP, you do realize the company has been around since 1987...dlc much less one game will hardly be the end of them even if your over blown, exaggerated doom and gloom were true.

IncubusDragon#5311

I'm soooooo tempted to troll this guy

jgmaster

heysexy said:

I love this game, never bought any game that's $60 if I didn't think it was worth it. I bought all the DLCs at their full price.

Now here are the things that matter to a player like me:
A healthy community of modders and players.

Total War: Warhammer is becoming like Diablo 3. A huge success that progressively alienated it's players with every update. Cmon Creative Assembly! What the heck are you doing? You can do better than this!

I understand that you want to make money and create more content while paying your staff. I know engineers and designers are not cheap, but consider your players. Say you don't care about poor players who can't afford your DLCs, then you don't care for the rest of your players. Why? You are alienating not just the people who can't and won't afford your DLCs, you are alienating players like me as well.

Games like these are fun with people playing it! With modders making awesome mods. Some of the best modders left the community for other games after you Beastman DLC that was $20+ at first. Read the comments http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=714796477

Money to you means more than your players. Your success will be only short-term. I am not just talking about this one game, I am talking about your company as well. What happens when there are no players left to buy your games because of your reputation that you are building? You know what makes Blizzard and LoL so popular? They care so much for their players. They will and are enjoying much longer success then your company will unless you wisen up and make a change.

If you divide the player base by DLC and make multiplayer incompatible, and you think people will pay for that continually. Think again. You are digging your own grave.

Think of a better way to monetize than DLC. Please. For $20, people can get a whole new game, some can buy 4 new games at $5. You live on Steam, adapt to the Steam alternative competition or die.

I know you are wondering how to get my and other player's money to keep the lights on. I get it. Here's a couple of ways:

If you want the $$$ for additional content and DLCs, make this game freemium. Base game free and DLC will be paid, at this point the only things that can save TW:W is a big influx of players. If you want to earn the players trust, I would recommend giving Beastman DLC away for FREE or at least at 90 percent discount as an apology to the players who left. People who could afford it already bought it, people who couldn't left. A lot of people just left because of principle. I am on a verge of leaving because the game is no longer fun, depending whether you respond to this message or just make us feel like you don't give a damn.

People will pay for content, but they won't pay for additional content if they already had to flush out $60 for the base game! You are not World of Warcraft or freemium MMO, what the f*** are you thinking? Whoever is your monetization lead. WAKE UP! $20 to you means nothing. For players around the world, that could be their whole month's savings.

Furthermore, all your updates break my game for some time. The latest one just broke it for good. I run a big modding collection for games I truly love and think they are worth the time to help other players. I want to play the game with mods and with people. I want to help you, the creators of this awesome game, BUT you break mod compatibility every update with the last one making it impossible for us to check compatibility because the game launches even though some mods are not compatible with each other. *facepalm*

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=716794585

Blood for Blood God DLC was great! Not that many game-breaking bugs. The community flourished even though you had haters. Beastmen DLC confirmed the hate and that's one nail to your coffin. Great content shouldn't come with more game breaking bugs than content. My game crashes now even on selecting a town, for no reason. Or the can't end your turn Chaos invasion. 100+ turns. Well, I have already gotten used to this. Re-create the game if you have having issues, mostly because of mods. Yes, that's the price I pay, but at least before Beastmen DLC, I had a way to figure out which mod caused the problem! Not I don't, so starting a new game won't fix anything.

If you are building a product and improving features, do you do any customer research? Where the heck is your product manager, customer research? Cmon guys!

I highly advise you to go freemium, or significantly lower the cost of the base game if you plan on continual support for $20 a DLC pop. Make your DLC releases better with more testing. Like with CS:GO or League of Legends, character skins and designs are what people will pay for. Graphics, more battle maps, don't change the game dynamics and can be made compatible on multiplayer. Support your modding community and make some guidelines. Make this shift a priority for this game and any future games if you want a proven method of long-term success. Heck, combine freemium with a premium subscription model of a one, two, or even three dollars a month. Charge a lot of people, a little money and you will have a lot. That's what WhatsApp did and got acquired for $$,$$$,$$$,$$$.$$. Save yourself.

Do you agree/disagree? What are your thought CA?

this isn't gonne change wen people buy this BS DLC packs for the starting price (I'm just waiting for this DLC until it is 5 euros or less) and CA isn't gonne change their prices because most of the people are walking into the trap again and again. I have rushed 160 hours of TWW gameplay and I don't really give a **** anymore at the moment, I quitted MP because of the borring ass taktics, character snipping and all the unbalanced stuff. SO altough I like the WE I DON'T gonne buy that stuff at 10 euros or more. I KEEP MY CHARLEMAGNES IN MY POCKET

boyfights

You should have kept that post in your pocket too lol

boyfights

Just for you I'll pre-order an extra copy of the next dlc and donate it to somebody