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The Organ King's Balance Suggestions

TheOrganKingTheOrganKing Junior MemberRegistered Users Posts: 989
So this is essentially just a big old post about all the things that could help iron out some of the imbalances currently in the game. If I happen to suggest something that someone has already asked for then I apologize for accidentally stealing your idea. Also any suggestions that I make to do with an increase in unit numbers is done at Ultra unit sizes, because that's what I play at.

For VC.
So this is more or less just a little housekeeping. But it has been a big annoyance to me that VC units don't automatically start crumpling as soon as their lord or necromancers go down. On more then one occasion I have brought down the VC lords and necromancers, only to find that a Wight King, who is a skeleton with no necromancy powers, is keeping himself and those near him in a stable state through what I can only assume is a gratuitous consumption of Calcium. If you lose everyone capable of raising and sustaining the unlife of your units, then it stands to reason that your units should start crumbling, regardless of their morale.

The fix is simple. For as long as your lord is alive, your units only crumble when their morale is low. If your lord dies, then any unit further then 45m of a Necromancer or Vampire hero should automatically start crumbling, no matter how much morale they have. If all of those go down then the entire army suffers from Crumbling. This should make it so that protecting or sniping a VC lord far more important then it is to other races (like it should be), and also makes it so that Necromancer or Vampire heroes have the important job of troubleshooting in case your lord goes down.

For WoC.
Archaon: So Archaon, like most or the Launch LL, is pretty weak compared to some of the newer lords, but that is a large argument in of itself. What I feel is more pressing though, is that he is missing a few skills that he should have. First of all is that Archaon should automatically come with all 4 marks of Chaos, yet he has none in game unless you equip one on the Campaign, and he can't get any in Custom/MP. Second is that Dorghar Causes fear, and that by Equiping him Archaon should Cause fear as well. Third, much like the Second, Is that the Crown of Dominion is supposed to give Archaon the Terror ability, but doesn't.

Exalted hero: So there are several problems with the chaos roster, but personally i believe that most could be solved pretty much the same it was solved for the dwarfs. In the form of AOE Buffs on heroes. The Exalted hero already has the perfect equip for this task, In the form of the Mark of Khorne. By changing it so that it applies it's bonus in a 45m AOE, it could give the increase to combat strength that a lot of WoC need, but also gives your oponent a means of cancelling them out. Of course the item would need quite the increase in cost, I suggest raise it's price up to 250-300 gold.
Chaos Sorcerers: Chaos needs their Sorcerer of Shadow.

Chaos Knights: Increase their speed up to 70. It is weird that they as a heavy cav are slower then their counterparts, but aren't actually any heavier. Hell, they aren't even riding normal Horses, there's no reason for them to be slower.

For Beastmen:
Lore of the Wild: The beastmens signature lore is honestly one of the worst in the game. It's full of Mostly weak damage spells. It's only buff spell not only causes damage to the unit it buffs, but the units you want to put it in, Bestigors and Minotaurs, barely get a buff out of it because it doesn't increase their AP damage, which is the majority of their damage type. Savage dominion summons a Cygor which has barely enough time to throw a third of his rocks, yet still drains most of your pool of magic. I propose a few simple solutions, Make it so that Mantle of Ghorrok also buffs AP damage by 44%, but increase it's magic cost up to 18, also give it an overcast that gives it a 25m AOE, for an increased cost of 24 magic. Change Savage Dominion so that the Cygor doesn't Crumble Passively, but also has no Ammo.

Bestigors: Bestigors are, as a Beastmen player from the TT, probably one of the most disappointingly implemented units in the game. They are The Beastmen's only heavy infantry, In the TT if you were going to bring them, you brought them in a massive block, sent them barreling down the field and use them to hold whatever the enemy will send against them until they could be overwhelmed by units you send around the flank. That is their one job, and they are the best ones in the army you can rely upon to do it. In TW however, they can't do any of that. They have an incredibly low unit count, equal to that of Chosen. And such a low melee defense that they often trade cost ineffectively against many units that they shouldn't. Both these things together mean that they struggle to hold anything down for a meaningful amount of time. Standard gors are better at holding a unit down. And on Campaign they cost an extra turn to recruit, considering it's usually around 5000 gold for a late game Beastmen horde to stand still for a turn. Bestigors are simply not worth the cost, especially when a mix of Gors and Minotaurs do their job better, and are also more versatile. I would suggest that the unit size is increased up from 80 to 120, with a corresponding health increase in total from 8080 to 12120, and a cost increase from 1000 to 1450. This brings them up to a formidable unit size, capable of confidently holding down several enemy units, but with their MD still being low they will still trade ineffectively and can be slowly ground down if not supported properly.

Vanguard: The nerf to Vanguard deploy hit Beastmen the hardest. The Basic Beastmen strategy is to surround and overwhelm the enemy, and the ability to vanguard deploy is an important tool in their arsenal. Sadly, Vanguard was nerfed, now on many maps, you can't even Vanguard deploy around the sides of the enemy. and as far as I can tell it happened entirely because Vlads ability to vanguard deploy an entire army was too strong. Considering how often Single only players say they don't want MP to affect their single player, so too should MP not have to deal with something that is only broken in Campaign affecting MP. I suggest that Vanguard gets returned back to it's state at launch. Secondly, a lot of Beastmen units that should have Vanguard deploy don't. Mostly the different variants of Gors and Ungors, they should be given their vanguard deploy back at least.

Dwarf Warriors: Basic Dwarf warriors have probably been a bit over buffed. I suggest that their cost gets increased by 50, since I would rather see Dwarfs, who are supposed to be a low unit number elite army, have a small number of more elite troops rather then a large army of regular troops.

Rune of Wrath and Ruin: Increase the cooldown of the Rune of Wrath and ruin by 30 seconds, change Master rune of wrath and ruin to have the same damage as the basic version, but with a the current cooldown.

Wood Elves:
Arrow of Kurnos: it is far too easy to just kite around using the ability, especially against the slower races. Give it 3 charges so that it can't be spammed.

WildWood Rangers: Remove their overbuff back to the intended values. I believe that it was already planned, but just in case.

Waywatchers: Currently waywatchers struggle to make back their cost, unless it's in campaign with a ton of buffs. Increase their unit size up to 100, but leave their health at the same total. This way they are still susceptible to getting hunted down by fast units, but can now bring a large enough volume of fire to pay back their cost.

Glade Guard: Reduce their range back to 160. They are not elite or expensive enough to warrant their extra range.
"Chaos strong. Gors strong. Humans, Elves, Dwarf — weak. We win. We fight, we kill, one day we win. One day soon. You — if you lucky, we eat you, make you into part of us, make you better than you, stronger than any of you, stronger than all of you. Once this arm weak, like you. I eat many of your kind, now I strong."
—Karzog, Beastigor Charioteer.


    hello mate just looked at your thoughts on WE i have about 250 hours of WE on ladder now and i do agree arrows of kurnos is a bit op but it has to stay that way till they fix the dwarf vs WE match up without extreme skirmish and the early destruction WE will never win as long as the Dwarf player has some functioning brain cells.Me personally I don't like skirmishing the dwarves into oblivion but it is the only way to currently win that match up if they give WE a fair way to kill dwarves then you can do what you want with the arrows but until then its not going anywhere fast.In other match ups i only take it on the Glady it does okay but not extremely well to warrant a Nerf.

    Wildwood rangers
    The Wild woods are being reduced but i think they need to be reworked into a anti infantry as their is no infantry that elves have that is meant to counter infantry and they are only good vs heavy armour currently anyway as they have no armour themselves making them weak to missiles and anything that is good vs no armour which most people will bring vs elves as they have no units in the infantry that has more than 40 armour.

    Waywatchers I do agree that way watchers do need some tuning but i think its more of a game flaw than a balance one as 2 glade guard will do the same damage as the waywatchers even vs armoured targets which is kind of wrong its similar to peasant bows if their is enough of them they do the same job because if you put enough arrows into something it going to do about the same damage as the way-watchers would but at a lower or same cost and putting your eggs in one basket is a bad idea as they are vulnerable to missiles if you can spot the waywatchers.

    Glade Guard
    Glade guard are fine its an infantry focused faction that like saying greens skins have too good melee and should be put down like everyone else when its their faction focus and its a strength that gets balanced with faction overall so in another region they would be lacking.
  • wingren013wingren013 Registered Users Posts: 999
    Killing the general = killing the army would need to be accompanied by a major buff to Vampire characters (not that I'm against this, characters were probably the greatest strength of VC on TT and its been weirding me out sonce day 1 that a Vampire Lord loses to an Empire General when that fight should be overwhelmingly in favor of the Vampire going by both lore and TT)

    For dwarf balance, yeah Dwarf Warriors and Wrath and Ruin both need adjustments, although I think your Wrath and Ruin changes are too harsh. Magic resistance also has to be changed to only apply to spells or the Dwarf vs WE matchup will never be balanced, and later the same with Dwarfs vs DoC. Hilariously this is the exact same balance mistake that ruined the HE vs DoC matchup on the TT as Banner of the World Dragon rendered a unit nearly immune to magic attacks, and now CA decided to implement that on an army wide basis...
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