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Lizardmen Roster Extremely Un-Loreful Units

HolyRhinoHolyRhino Registered Users Posts: 3
edited May 2017 in General Discussion
So the Lizadmen roster just dropped and the only issue with it is that there are "feral" Cold Ones, Carnosaurs, Stegadons and Bastilladons in the roster. The Lizardmen aren't "one" with the jungle; the creatures that they use as mounts are raised from birth and will usually go through several generations of Skins raising and training them before they are ready to be used in battle.

If "feral" creatures were in their army then they would turn on the Lizardmen just as quickly as their opponents. The only approximation to feral creatures that fight in the Lizardmen army are Jungle Swarms and Salamanders/Razordons and the latter have a nasty habit of eating their handlers and going berserk but those haven't even been included, presumably saving them for Tehenhauin's (spelled it right first try, that's a first) Rat and the Serpent DLC.

Also worth noting that should a Carnosaur, Stegadon or Bastilladon lose its rider/crew in battle there is a decent chance that you will lose control of it on the Tabletop and it can be just as likely to attack your own army as the enemy; to think they could send them in without a rider/crew in the first place is ridiculous.

I really hope CA remove these units from the game before it is released but if not then we're going to need a new Lorehammer mod to do it for us.
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Comments

  • JavorJavor Registered Users Posts: 910
    They won't remove them, rightfully so.
  • Ancalagon74Ancalagon74 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 222
    edited May 2017
    If it bothers you don't use them and enjoy the game in its pristine lorefulness.
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,406
    Squig Herds are also not having their Goblin Herders in Total War: Warhammer, so it's too late already, also it's clear that CA doing it because it's an quite easy way to add more units to the roster.

    http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Squig_Herd
  • RodentofDoomRodentofDoom Registered Users Posts: 588
    Un-loreful has a varying degree of interpretation apparently.

    GW release the army books
    Other companies release extra stuff that isn't in the army book's
    CA falls under the latter category, btw, just in case your a little confused about that.

    There are several posts on these forums denigrating CA for leaving many different units out of their list, oddly most of those unit omission complaints are about units that don't exist in the 8th edition army book.

    That's the nice thing about mods.
    If you want TW-WH:TT ....
    there is a good chance that someone with the patience will make that mod.
    download it, play it

    quietly please

    I'm too busy enjoying CA's interpretation of wh:tt

  • EizoEizo Registered Users Posts: 1,016

    is this a strawman? troll-post? I don't even...


    anyway, those units are nice, have entirely new mechanics, and they are free

    I really hope CA hardcodes these units into the game to prevent sour partypoopers from having fun, after trying to poop the party

    agree but the unit are technically not free because we still have to pay for game 2

    But seriously if people really have a problem with them don't use them or mod them out but don't be ungrateful for any sort of extra content, your just cutting the hand that feeds you. they also had a good reason is that they want player to get Dinosaur units earlier in the game instead of rushing toward the late game or leveling out a scar-vet to get a carnisaur.
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 15,480
    Also, Urgat has pointed out you could use binding scrolls from Storm of Magic to get "feral" Lizardmen monsters in 8th Edition. So... not actually un-loreful. Necessarily. Also, how do the Slaan control the Dread Saurian? With magic. So...
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  • MemnonSBMemnonSB Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 595
    Im understain Your point @HolyRhino but You must understain one important think-this mix Total War and Warhhamer.
    Im fan Total War and for me many aspect wich CA make for Warhammer looks bad,im not happy with this or many aspect looks like step back from previous Total War game...but im understain its mix TW and W so im hve to accpet this...same like You must accept its TW:W will be not fully accuracte with lore.
  • CnConradCnConrad Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,194
    Actually it's 100% loreful.

    All CA created units must be accepted by GW.

    GW owns and can rewrite the lore as they see fit. So anything CA adds to TW:W becomes as much a piece of lore as your plastic figures.
  • alex33alex33 Registered Users Posts: 1,269
    CnConrad said:

    Actually it's 100% loreful.

    All CA created units must be accepted by GW.

    GW owns and can rewrite the lore as they see fit. So anything CA adds to TW:W becomes as much a piece of lore as your plastic figures.

    QFT. I'm a real hardcore lore guy but tbh this does not concern me at all. The only thing i disliked is that they said "spawning" a lot during the stream even about creatures that are not spawned but born naturally. Grymloq for example. Their dinos are born naturally
  • NazredNazred Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 980

    If they only followed the lore, there would just be the 10% hardcore fans left. I like invention and creativity. Give me Araby, Kislev give me fun units which may not excist. Ca go nuts and be CREATIVE Assemble!
  • Horus38Horus38 Registered Users Posts: 934
    I love these posts popping up with people bashing on this "feral" concept which is actually part of the lore:

    * Storm of magic supplement: Mazdamundi uses a herd of stegadons to trample demons spilling out of a rift.
    * It's stated Slann will take control of lustria's denizens. Examples being nudging thunder lizards out of the way so they don't walk through a temple city, or summoning Dread Saurians to battle.
  • EizoEizo Registered Users Posts: 1,016

    it easy to make them lore friendly since Feral Dinosaurs do exist in the lore, really just say a Slann Mage priest (strongest caster in the world and technically they did make the jungle in the first place) used the Lore of Beast or other form of magic to reel the feral beast to fight for them but are not a 100% willing to do so hence why they are loose cannon in with the rampage mechanics and then BOOM it's lore friendly
  • EizoEizo Registered Users Posts: 1,016
    alex33 said:

    CnConrad said:

    Actually it's 100% loreful.

    All CA created units must be accepted by GW.

    GW owns and can rewrite the lore as they see fit. So anything CA adds to TW:W becomes as much a piece of lore as your plastic figures.

    QFT. I'm a real hardcore lore guy but tbh this does not concern me at all. The only thing i disliked is that they said "spawning" a lot during the stream even about creatures that are not spawned but born naturally. Grymloq for example. Their dinos are born naturally
    just wondering how come their dinosaur are immortal in the lore or at least Grymloq seems to be immortal
  • PhiloslothicalPhiloslothical Registered Users Posts: 859
    We all know what happens when people have such fanatism towards a book.
    Praise the sun ! \[T]/
  • Horus38Horus38 Registered Users Posts: 934
    Eizo said:

    just wondering how come their dinosaur are immortal in the lore or at least Grymloq seems to be immortal

    Their dinosaurs are not immortal. The book says Grymloq is like the 5th mount Kroq-Gar has had.
  • SaurianDruidSaurianDruid Registered Users Posts: 1,601
    There's already a thread about the feral dinosaurs ongoing as we speak. You could've posted there.

    I thought this would be about the crystal or the fact the Lizardmen can now super regenerate.
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Registered Users Posts: 1,037
    Nah, those things take research other than watching Arch's videos to find out about.

  • JavorJavor Registered Users Posts: 910
    And yes, as has been stated you could indeed use feral units (cold ones etc) in storm of magic (or whatever it was called).

    So in conclusion; there is nothing un-loreful about any of these units.
  • BlaeysBlaeys Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,188
    First, they consulted with - and gained the go ahead from - Games Workshop before they created these units.

    Second, its easy enough to consider them lore-friendly regardless. The Lizardmen are simply using the tools they have available at low levels.

    Third, none of it means anything - because it sounds like a fun concept, and that is all that really matters.
  • ShaddShadd Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 458

    If it bothers you don't use them and enjoy the game in its pristine lorefulness.

    That doesn't exactly stop the AI from spamming them.

    I'd like to fight some actual lizardmen and not a swarm of wild dinosaurs.
  • epic_159733007811cHJwei4epic_159733007811cHJwei4 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,549
    The title is quite the exercise in hyperbole.

    Considering these units are all mounts, I don't know how you say it's "extremely unloreful". They do exist. Extremely unloreful in my mind would be something made up that doesn't even fit, like Battle Rabbits or something, lol.

    Maybe the word feral is throwing everyone off but to me "feral" units have always felt more like "slight trained" monsters. Not paired with a rider and wouldn't let anyone ride it but trained enough to be sent in the direction of the enemy to munch on them.

    Personally I'm glad Lizardmen are not limited to only mounts for monsters.
  • JavorJavor Registered Users Posts: 910
    Shadd said:

    If it bothers you don't use them and enjoy the game in its pristine lorefulness.

    That doesn't exactly stop the AI from spamming them.

    I'd like to fight some actual lizardmen and not a swarm of wild dinosaurs.
    I like how you are ignoring that these units existed in the actual TT game.

    Just say it as it is - it's not that they are unloreful, you just don't like them. There's no shame in that.
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Registered Users Posts: 1,037
    Haha, never thought I'd read battling a swarm of dinosaurs as being unfun.
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Registered Users Posts: 5,217
    Devs unfortunately have their hands tied by budget constraints.
    I am optimistic there will be more units via DLC/FLC.
  • UrgatUrgat Registered Users Posts: 996
    edited May 2017
    That again.
    Unloreful?
    This is false.
    You can field all the lizardmen dinos riderless in 8th ed. It's called binding scrolls, they're in the Storm of Magic supplement.
    Actually, that's true of nearly all the mounts and monsters in Warhammer.

    So there.

    I'd post a pic, but my book is in French, that wouldn't be very helpful I guess.
  • hendo’hendo’ Registered Users Posts: 2,833
    Horus38 said:

    Eizo said:

    just wondering how come their dinosaur are immortal in the lore or at least Grymloq seems to be immortal

    Their dinosaurs are not immortal. The book says Grymloq is like the 5th mount Kroq-Gar has had.
    Not to be particular, but grymloq will be immortal in TWW2 ;)
  • HondlisHondlis Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,245
    Go home please...
  • PhaonixPhaonix Senior Member Georgia, USARegistered Users Posts: 1,297
    Horus38 said:

    Eizo said:

    just wondering how come their dinosaur are immortal in the lore or at least Grymloq seems to be immortal

    Their dinosaurs are not immortal. The book says Grymloq is like the 5th mount Kroq-Gar has had.
    They retconned that in 8th edition, the Grymloq Kroq-Gar rides in the current time is the same one he rode during the fall of Xhotl
    "And you spoke of being an heir to the throne, did you not, mother? Vasusen needs no throne. He has his seat in the hearts of the common people. That is the best throne a man can ever look for. I need no other." Karna to his mother Kunti on the eve of the battle of Kurukshetra
  • KayosivKayosiv Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,753
    Did they? As I recall he was the 10th Grymloq.
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