Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Categories

Will Dark Elves have slave soldiers from other factions?

2

Comments

  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,898
    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.
    Lore unfriendly? I don't care if it is or is not.

    But Elves are not and should not field chaff. I'd rather they have a feel of their own.
    -Forum Terms and Conditions: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
    -Using all caps is the equivalent of shouting. Please don't.
    -The "Spam" flag is not a "disagree" flag. Have a care.
    -...No, no the "Abuse" flag isn't a "disagree" flag either!
    -5.7 Summon a moderator if someone seems to be out of line, or use the report button. Do NOT become another party to misbehaviour
  • DalakhDalakh Senior Member FranceRegistered Users Posts: 1,937
    There are examples in lore lore of slaves being fielded as drugged up chaff and there as always talk of DE possibly getting slaves before any new edition of their armybook.

    The reason they didn't is simple, it's not part of the race feel and design. Elven armies are not supposed to be able to field expendable trash in TT, so GW didn't do it.

    Now like many said it's definitely not against the lore and CA has shown they are willing and able to straight up invent new units which make sthe whole "It's not in 8th edition" argument devoid of any substance.

    All of that being said a valid argument could be made that it would be like giving Vampire Counts skeleton archers.
    "We shall strike down our foes with sharp steel and cold hearts. The weak die so that the strong prevail and none shall be spared. Then and only then will our enemies know the true meaning of fear."

    — Malekith, Witch King of Naggaroth
  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,899
    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.
    name a instance form the lore where that concept was used by the dark elves.
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • JaggsauceJaggsauce Registered Users Posts: 387
    SiWI said:

    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.
    name a instance form the lore where that concept was used by the dark elves.
    that has already been done earlier in the thread, albeit elf slave soldiers - not ones from other factions, like greenskins, dwarf or empire... but hey, it counts?
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    edited June 2017
    Jaggsauce said:

    SiWI said:

    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.
    name a instance form the lore where that concept was used by the dark elves.
    that has already been done earlier in the thread, albeit elf slave soldiers - not ones from other factions, like greenskins, dwarf or empire... but hey, it counts?
    I have strong doubts as to it's canonicty. The Darkblade series is old, and we're given no context as to how they managed to keep an entire army pacified, and no mention of it or any other armed slaves exists in 8th Edition.
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • SaurianDruidSaurianDruid Registered Users Posts: 1,050
    I imagine Dark Elf slaves will be entirely economic in their use. Say you have a slave population bar, and the higher it is the more massive economic buffs you get, but the lower it gets the worse your economy becomes until it's worse off than the Greenskins. Then maybe add a mechanic where having a really high, possibly capped, slave population creates an "order" penalty in which a slave rebellion eventually goes off. Slave rebellions could be a mixed race army like the new Rogue Armies composed of the lowest tier units of human, dwarf, high elf, or orc rosters.

    Maybe to keep your slave population from getting too high you need to either sacrifice them in rituals for magic buffs or sell them for coin. Selling them would be a lump sum of gold that is big for now but less than you'd have gotten by keeping the slaves around and just quelling the rebellions.

    Maybe make a building that suppresses slave revolt chances, and if an enemy agent damages it they can incite the rebellion prematurely. It'd make for a neat way to hurt the Dark Elves and distract them long enough to get an upper hand.
  • kilijankilijan Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 475
    It would be interesting if they showed this in the roster but they won't. Slavery is a PC no no that a company like ca can't tolerate in any extreme.
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,571
    kilijan said:

    It would be interesting if they showed this in the roster but they won't. Slavery is a PC no no that a company like ca can't tolerate in any extreme.

    we had slavery in Rome II and I think also Attila.

    Slavery is quite a big part in the culture of:
    Rodents of unusual size (heck one of their units are called Fabled man-sized-rat slaves)
    Dark Elves
    Dawi Zharr

    and I doubt that CA would leave them out
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN! TOTAL WAR TROY FOR ONE YEAR EXCLUSIVELY ON THE EPIC GAMES STORE!"

    The Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. We need Marius Leitdorf of Averland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him? For a Middenland DLC with Boris and the Ar-Ulric!

    Queek could smell their hatred, ratcheted to a degree that even he could not evoke in their simple hearts. He stepped over the old orange-fur’s body, eager to see for himself what it was they saw. But he heard it first.
    'Waaaaaaaggh! Gorfang!'
  • LordTorquemadoLordTorquemado Registered Users Posts: 1,410
    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.

    "You stumble about in darkness. There is no light here, no mercy. Naggarond has claimed the souls of better heroes than you."
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,571
    edited June 2017
    Did I just read... HERESY?


    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN! TOTAL WAR TROY FOR ONE YEAR EXCLUSIVELY ON THE EPIC GAMES STORE!"

    The Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. We need Marius Leitdorf of Averland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him? For a Middenland DLC with Boris and the Ar-Ulric!

    Queek could smell their hatred, ratcheted to a degree that even he could not evoke in their simple hearts. He stepped over the old orange-fur’s body, eager to see for himself what it was they saw. But he heard it first.
    'Waaaaaaaggh! Gorfang!'
  • DalakhDalakh Senior Member FranceRegistered Users Posts: 1,937
    SiWI said:

    Jaggsauce said:

    Canuovea said:

    Two words: "Pls no."

    why do you say that like i am speaking heresy??
    slave soldiers wouldn't be that insanely lore unfriendly.
    name a instance form the lore where that concept was used by the dark elves.
    6th edition page 62, "With the navy of Ulthuan crippled our long-prepared counter-offensive was unleashed, spearheaded by drugged and screaming human slave warriors."

    This is what we are talking about, not the difficult terrain slave corpses.
    "We shall strike down our foes with sharp steel and cold hearts. The weak die so that the strong prevail and none shall be spared. Then and only then will our enemies know the true meaning of fear."

    — Malekith, Witch King of Naggaroth
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,898
    edited June 2017
    Though Izzy has said that in 8th they're probably not canonical.

    I could care less if it canonical or not, but it would be difficult to do so. My main concern is how I don't want to see Dark Elf armies filled with slave units running about. I want to play as Elves, not drugged up slaves. More importantly, I want to murder Elves, not drugged up slaves.
    -Forum Terms and Conditions: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
    -Using all caps is the equivalent of shouting. Please don't.
    -The "Spam" flag is not a "disagree" flag. Have a care.
    -...No, no the "Abuse" flag isn't a "disagree" flag either!
    -5.7 Summon a moderator if someone seems to be out of line, or use the report button. Do NOT become another party to misbehaviour
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    edited June 2017
    Canuovea said:

    Though Izzy has said that in 8th they're probably not canonical.

    I could care less if it canonical or not, but it would be difficult to do so. My main concern is how I don't want to see Dark Elf armies filled with slave units running about. I want to play as Elves, not drugged up slaves. More importantly, I want to murder Elves, not drugged up slaves.

    Nor were instances widespread before 8th Edition - there's one example of it in 6th Edition, and one in 7th. The major problem that I have with it, beyond it being non-canon, is that when it did happen it happened not because the Dark Elves thought it would be useful, but because they needed aid. This theme of Dark Elf military weakness thankfully no longer exists in the 8th Edition.
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • Red_DoxRed_Dox Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,359


    I have strong doubts as to it's canonicty. The Darkblade series is old, and we're given no context as to how they managed to keep an entire army pacified, and no mention of it or any other armed slaves exists in 8th Edition.

    What context do you need? The Black Ark of Naggor waged war to Hag Greaf since Malsu stole a orb in book II and slayed some prominent charakters along that way. At the end of book III Hag Graef they defeated the Naggor army on the battlefield and Malus slew their Witchking leader.
    In book IV while Storm of Chaos story part, Malekith orders a full invasion of Ulthuan and Malus as the Dracau of Hag Graef is one of his generals. Which obviously brings with him the slave troops from the defeated Naggor Black Ark. As the comic lists first what parts Malus army has and who his lieutnants are, it contains

    and to add maybe a bit more context from the later plot of book IV, showing that the slaves (as slaves do) are not so fond of their destiny


    but fear, can keep them in line

    And we talk about a whole society based around slavery, treachery and deceit. Is the concept of treating defeated enemies (even if Druchii) as slaves so hard to swallow? I mean the next step would be discussing if Chaos Dwarfs can really use greenskin slave troops if we follow that road.


    Also in spirit of the "how can they control the slaves", the Warhammer Online plot had his own idea how Malekith guided the Orcs to do further his plans.





    -----Red Dox
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    edited June 2017
    Directing Orcs to attack something is not quite making them slaves in your army. It's doing what a lot of people do to Orcs.

    As for Malus? Well, he's the Drachau of Hag Graef in the 8th Edition, but how he actually got there beyond the six artifacts is up for debate. Chaos Cults aren't widespread in Naggaroth anymore, and Naggor may not have happened precisely according to the novels for that reason.
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • Red_DoxRed_Dox Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,359


    As for Malus? Well, he's the Drachau of Hag Graef in the 8th Edition, but how he actually got there beyond the six artifacts is up for debate.

    I am not so firm with Druchii lore, but is Malus in the 8th book really confirmed as Drachau? By glancing over his page, I see his title as "Scion", which would fit if his 8th edition "rule" adaption lists him after book II.

    If there is mentioning of him as Drachau, and that is a title I would grant him, that story is not up to debate. It is clearly the comic book III story. No ifs, no buts, no coconuts.
    You can't deny the comic book stories, since that is literally where Malus was born. He started not in GW armybook lore or novels, his first appearance was in Warhammer Monthly comic 1. And after he gained greater popularity some genius at GW thought it would be easy money to re-tell that comic book stories (with some added pieces to brush out the pages. Like we needed three entire lengthy movies to re-tell a 150 pages book called "The Hobbit"). The novel series stopped for unknown reasons after comic book II. I probably could check dates to see if comic book III was still a work in progress then or if it corresponds with Kirbys monumental "save money" campaign but since comic book III had no ties to "retconned" lore (like comic book IV), that is Malus further story until he is Drachau of Hag Graef.

    ------Red Dox
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    edited June 2017
    Red_Dox said:


    As for Malus? Well, he's the Drachau of Hag Graef in the 8th Edition, but how he actually got there beyond the six artifacts is up for debate.

    I am not so firm with Druchii lore, but is Malus in the 8th book really confirmed as Drachau? By glancing over his page, I see his title as "Scion", which would fit if his 8th edition "rule" adaption lists him after book II.

    If there is mentioning of him as Drachau, and that is a title I would grant him, that story is not up to debate. It is clearly the comic book III story. No ifs, no buts, no coconuts.
    You can't deny the comic book stories, since that is literally where Malus was born. He started not in GW armybook lore or novels, his first appearance was in Warhammer Monthly comic 1. And after he gained greater popularity some genius at GW thought it would be easy money to re-tell that comic book stories (with some added pieces to brush out the pages. Like we needed three entire lengthy movies to re-tell a 150 pages book called "The Hobbit"). The novel series stopped for unknown reasons after comic book II. I probably could check dates to see if comic book III was still a work in progress then or if it corresponds with Kirbys monumental "save money" campaign but since comic book III had no ties to "retconned" lore (like comic book IV), that is Malus further story until he is Drachau of Hag Graef.

    ------Red Dox
    The novels are the expended retelling of the comics, as you say. However, most were written in 6th Edition, with one from the early 7th. The 8th Edition Army Book confirms some details, but not all, and indeed retcons others. :) However, given the events of the novels, the 8th Edition's confirmation of Malus' success in the Quest he undertook and indeed the lack of any alternative candidates for the position, Malus Darkblade is indeed Drachau.
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 24,612
    edited June 2017
    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

  • ThanquolThanquol Senior Member SkavenblightRegistered Users Posts: 2,018

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    Pretty much this, wouldn't be surprised if the Dark Elve's slave trade had something to do with their campaign mechanics though.
    "Fear me for I am Grey Seer Thanqol, Greatest TWW player in all of Skavendom."

    Team Skaven

    Which team are you? Post in your signature

    Team Empire Team Bretonnia Team Kislev Team Dwarf Team Chaos Dwarf Team High Elves
    Team Dark Elves
    Team Wood Elves Team Warriors of Chaos Team Daemons of Chaos
    Team Beastmen
    Team Vampire Counts Team Tomb Kings Team Orcs and Goblins
    Team Ogre Kingdoms
    Team Lizardmen Team Skaven




  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Registered Users Posts: 7,900


    Nor were instances widespread before 8th Edition - there's one example of it in 6th Edition, and one in 7th. The major problem that I have with it, beyond it being non-canon, is that when it did happen it happened not because the Dark Elves thought it would be useful, but because they needed aid. This theme of Dark Elf military weakness thankfully no longer exists in the 8th Edition.

    I never had the impression that the example in question was due to weakness - simply making use of a resource they had. The fact that they (apparently) stopped doing it after Morvael's reign as Phoenix King suggested that it wasn't as successful as they might have hoped, but there's nothing to indicate it was an act of desperation.

    Directing Orcs to attack something is not quite making them slaves in your army. It's doing what a lot of people do to Orcs.

    The 8E O&G book explicitly uses the terms 'captives taken by the Dark Elves' and 'enslaved armies'. I know you don't like it, but the wording indicates that they did actually take greenskins captive and employed them as slave soldiers, rather than just manipulating greenskin leaders into attacking a target of the choosing of the Dark Elves.

    Said O&G book also explicitly says that it happened thousands of years ago and that it was a mistake that has cost them more than they gained - so they're not doing it now. But they did.
  • JaggsauceJaggsauce Registered Users Posts: 387
    edited June 2017
    kilijan said:

    It would be interesting if they showed this in the roster but they won't. Slavery is a PC no no that a company like ca can't tolerate in any extreme.

    well maybe they could until you came along and forbade it in the name of SJW'ism.
    seriously, its almost more dishonorable to ignore slavery as if it wasn't a very modern day problem in certain parts of the world.

    i mean, come on.. its like trying to forget certain other historical events - its disrespectful to the victims not to acknowledge it, which is why we must.
  • JaggsauceJaggsauce Registered Users Posts: 387

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    Jaggsauce said:

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
    If the slaves don't outnumber the Druchii, there isn't actually a point to fielding them. They would just die, having taken only a few volleys.
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • DalakhDalakh Senior Member FranceRegistered Users Posts: 1,937

    Jaggsauce said:

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
    If the slaves don't outnumber the Druchii, there isn't actually a point to fielding them. They would just die, having taken only a few volleys.
    If we forget the lore, army theme and everything and only focus on the usefulness of slaves for the DE on the TW battlefield, they would be an absolutely amazing tool to have for an elite and fragile army like the DE.

    You don't need too many of them, just a handful of units l to stand before your mainline and soak up some arrows, take punishing monster/elite cav/inf charges right in the face so that they never trample your deadly yet fragile elves with full force.

    They would be truly amazing, filling a very useful role that is (likely intentionally) left vacant of utterly expendable meatshields.
    "We shall strike down our foes with sharp steel and cold hearts. The weak die so that the strong prevail and none shall be spared. Then and only then will our enemies know the true meaning of fear."

    — Malekith, Witch King of Naggaroth
  • Neolucifer2000Neolucifer2000 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 956
    I will like slave soldiers


    Demand more love for Empire and Beastmen! Playable Middenland with Cult of Ulric! Built-in RoR like Hochland Long Rifles and Knightly orders! Doombull, Wargor, Ghorgon, Jabberslythe, Tuskboar chariot and God-specific Gors! #MakeOldWorldGreatAgain
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 24,612
    Jaggsauce said:

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
    So, only small slave regiments? What's the point then? You still need someone to look out after them and divert their attention from the enemy which is just stupid. Whenever a culture on earth gave slave soldiers a run, it backfired in some way, re: the Mameluks.

  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,571
    Dalakh said:

    Jaggsauce said:

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
    If the slaves don't outnumber the Druchii, there isn't actually a point to fielding them. They would just die, having taken only a few volleys.
    If we forget the lore, army theme and everything and only focus on the usefulness of slaves for the DE on the TW battlefield, they would be an absolutely amazing tool to have for an elite and fragile army like the DE.

    You don't need too many of them, just a handful of units l to stand before your mainline and soak up some arrows, take punishing monster/elite cav/inf charges right in the face so that they never trample your deadly yet fragile elves with full force.

    They would be truly amazing, filling a very useful role that is (likely intentionally) left vacant of utterly expendable meatshields.
    sounds more like Dawi Zharr tbh... cheap gobbo and Orc units to soak up damage and stout Chaos Dwarfs and warmachines to crush the enemy
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN! TOTAL WAR TROY FOR ONE YEAR EXCLUSIVELY ON THE EPIC GAMES STORE!"

    The Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. We need Marius Leitdorf of Averland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him? For a Middenland DLC with Boris and the Ar-Ulric!

    Queek could smell their hatred, ratcheted to a degree that even he could not evoke in their simple hearts. He stepped over the old orange-fur’s body, eager to see for himself what it was they saw. But he heard it first.
    'Waaaaaaaggh! Gorfang!'
  • IzzyStradlinIzzyStradlin Senior Member Karaz BrynRegistered Users Posts: 11,132
    edited June 2017
    Dalakh said:

    Jaggsauce said:

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    yeah sure, the outnumbered slave regiments would take up arms against all those swarms of dark elves right behind them. (the slaves are usually used as canon fodder)
    that would result in more deaths than if they sided with them for the sake of their lives.
    If the slaves don't outnumber the Druchii, there isn't actually a point to fielding them. They would just die, having taken only a few volleys.
    If we forget the lore, army theme and everything and only focus on the usefulness of slaves for the DE on the TW battlefield, they would be an absolutely amazing tool to have for an elite and fragile army like the DE.

    You don't need too many of them, just a handful of units l to stand before your mainline and soak up some arrows, take punishing monster/elite cav/inf charges right in the face so that they never trample your deadly yet fragile elves with full force.

    They would be truly amazing, filling a very useful role that is (likely intentionally) left vacant of utterly expendable meatshields.
    Elves aren't a do-everything force. They're not supposed to have multitudes of chaff units. I don't see for a moment why this situation is so unappealing.
    Dalakh said:



    Please people, read.

    I read your post first, you know. :p
    "Raise them, Necromancer. Set brother against brother. Let's give our hosts something worthy of recording in their pathetic book of complaints, shall we?"
    The Queen of Mysteries, on the Book of Grudges.

    Her voice was as rustling silk. "In the darkness I dreamt of you, cousin."
    "Hawk no longer. My wings are dust and bone. I crawl through time now, like an asp."
    "You took my wings, Neferata. You made me crawl. Now I return the favour. Crawl, cousin. Crawl."

    Team Elize von Carstein


    Warhammer Lore, by Sotek!

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH4nPsl2ctS365aEfFBwxbg

    For ease of memory, if we're not talking about cavalry, everything the High Elves have is better than everything the Dark Elves have.

    Izzy's More-Loreful Stats Mod

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1279441247&searchtext=
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 24,612
    Hey, it backfired for them too when they bred the Black Orks who promptly rebelled.

  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 11,851

    The first thing the armed slaves would do is kill their minders and run away, or defect to the enemy. It would be monumentally stupid for the DE to do this. Please don't make the DE any stupider than they already are.

    Well it's basically what happen to the Chaos Dwarves, the Chaos Dwarves was smart enough to not give their Greenskin Slaves weapons that are too good, but they make the mistake of trying to make "better slaves" by creating the Black Orcs, who tend to be Stronger and Smarter then Normal Orcs, and the Black Orcs lead a Slave Revolt that almost lead to the total destruction of the Chaos Dwarves, if the Hobgoblins didn't had turned on the Greenskin Rebels at the last moment. Now the Hobgoblins the enjoy higher status than most slaves, and they also have their fate more tied with the Chaos Dwarves, because other Greenskin hate them.
Sign In or Register to comment.