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Ogre kingdoms what are your thoughts

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  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Registered Users Posts: 7,900
    Personally, I'm inclined to agree that Ogres should retain a vulnerability to anti-large weapons. They are Large, after all, and let's face it - it's part of the nature of the game that some armies are going to be more vulnerable to a certain thing than others. As one existing example, consider the Bretonnians. Most of their army is cavalry, and thus susceptible to anti-large weapons. Should they get a special resistance to anti-large weapons?

    Of course not. Relying largely on monstrous infantry is part of the character of the army, and that comes with the natural weaknesses of doing so. It makes sense that an army preparing to fight Ogres might want to make heavy use of spears and polearms: long weapons that give a human-sized soldier half a chance of striking an Ogre before they get mashed to a pulp.

    The challenge for an Ogre player will be in finding ways to offset this weakness. Is it blowing away enemy anti-large troops with artillery and ranged attacks? Is it tying them up with Gnoblars? Is it simply being so tough that they can tough it out anyway? Note, on that last, that ogres don't rely a lot on armour, so halberdiers might be at a loss on that account, and there are very few elite spearmen units in Warhammer. As a result, there are probably not that many units that have both anti-large and a large amount of damage against lightly armoured opponents.
  • saberslash117saberslash117 Registered Users Posts: 223
    people here are worrried that they might suck whilst I see them as the ultimate counter to Vampire Counts....


    An army of large monsters with Ogres the size of Crypt Horrors? Good bye Vampire !
  • saberslash117saberslash117 Registered Users Posts: 223

    If they are hordes I'll be disappointed because it's in their name what they are I mean come on they were really good farmers before the cathay emperor made the maw come or whatnot

    and Farmers? Where in the entirety of the books did it ever mention them as farmers? They were HERDERS. Yaks and Gnu Beast.

    Basically, they are nomads through and through.
  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Registered Users Posts: 7,900
    edited July 2017

    If they are hordes I'll be disappointed because it's in their name what they are I mean come on they were really good farmers before the cathay emperor made the maw come or whatnot

    and Farmers? Where in the entirety of the books did it ever mention them as farmers? They were HERDERS. Yaks and Gnu Beast.

    Basically, they are nomads through and through.
    Ogres are naturally nomadic, but the eponymous Ogre Kingdoms are settled. Ogres within a settled tribe often exercise their wanderlust by moving around within their tribe's territory.

    One could compare them to some concepts of nomads that have a central settlement which acts as a meeting place and seat of government.

    These tribes would clearly be suitable as a 'conventional' faction. Mind you, there may also be some less settled tribes that are hordes, and it would be reasonable for the player to have the choice of playing a horde or a non-horde faction.
  • RocketlegionRocketlegion Member Registered Users Posts: 655
    Cant wait for this beauty.



  • Mech_4Mech_4 Registered Users Posts: 228
    I guess characters like Greasus Goldtooth live in pretty much one location, not because they farm, but because they collect tribute (in food) from everyone that passes by, and eating those who can't pay. If/when they run out of food they'd be forced to migrate but I believe Greasus sits on the main trade route between the Empire and Cathay.

    From what I remember of the Ogre Kingdoms, they relied a lot on their initial impact hits. During prolonged combat they had rather average armour and weapon skill and their small unit number meant they were prone to being overrun by more numerous enemies that didn't break from the Ogres opening charge. Gnoblars would give numbers, not damage, to a melee helping the combat result in the Ogres favour.
  • TherenTheren Registered Users Posts: 296
    I think they can be balanced. They should be wunerable against ranged fire, but the greapshoot of leadbelchers ogre wielded ballistas, and fast moving scraplounchers, Ironblasters can make the enemy worry about firepower.
    The mele units can't charge against halberds, but their great monsters may can break the lines. Also I want to see how they will implement the dammed "ninja ogres", and gnoblar trappers.

    I waiting for some Great Maw mechanics. Ogres are going to great jurnies from their homland. We see how bretonnians can go to large jurnies to destroy a far away enemy. And how they can win without destroy the empire or the dwarves. Maybe ogres will get some similar stuff. May they will have one "holy place" and every army will be nomadic, but I see no reason why they can't move into a Karak if they are able to conquer it. The maneater groups can work for chaos dwarves, empire, orks etc.
    Thats why I would love to see Golgfag maneater like a LL more like anybody else. Becouse he realy can go to any direction and fight on any side and change the side in the war, if its advantageous in any moment.
  • goliath55goliath55 Registered Users Posts: 713
    a "feasting" stance to replace raiding stance that increases the global "meat" income but also buffs the army's units stats to the point that they become major siege threats. feed meat to the great maw for increased stat buffs of your choosing or use it to sustain warbeasts... or something... might be a bit too boring!
  • FifthOfSpaghettiFifthOfSpaghetti Registered Users Posts: 1,630
    would CA change the siege mechanics or allow Ogres on to the walls? Perhaps Ogres would have something to attack walls directly, because as it is now they would never be allowed ontop of the walls... They would be awful against walled settlements.
  • IchonIchon Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 5,042
    edited July 2017

    would CA change the siege mechanics or allow Ogres on to the walls? Perhaps Ogres would have something to attack walls directly, because as it is now they would never be allowed ontop of the walls... They would be awful against walled settlements.

    The Leadbelchers carry cannons that should be able to knock down walls and CA could simply make them available a bit earlier so that sieges aren't a huge pain for Ogres (they can still knock down gates) but even if Leadbelchers are a high tier late unlocked unit, Ogres have Scraplauncher and Ironblaster which at least one or both can knock down walls the Ogres should be fine in sieges for humans. Thundertusks also have stone thrower so Ogres have some ranged options.

    The AI will have some issues until it unlocks Leadbelchers as it will stand its entire army in range of towers while the walls are being knocked down but if having some Mournfangs or Thundertusks trying to block a fallen wall gap with infantry is going to be a terrible idea. Mournfangs have about the highest charge in the game, area attack, and really only vulnerable to AP ranged or high mass anti large units like Demigryphs.
    YouTube, it takes over your mind and guides you to strange places like tutorials on how to talk to a giraffe.
  • KGpoopyKGpoopy Registered Users Posts: 2,009
    Ogres break and knock stuff down. So CA should fix and improve the crumbling animations with or before the Ogre release, because there's going to be a lot of it in Ogre sieges. Or they could improve sieges overall, but they seem to be avoiding siege battles.

    Mind you many of us auto-resolve sieges anyway for many reasons expressed before. So I guess it's pointless to discuss siege battles and many other battle types at this point.
  • Xenos7Xenos7 Registered Users Posts: 5,661
    seienchin said:


    They dont built stuff (ok greenskins dont built a lot either... ever wondered if Ogres are just big orcs anways?)


    They are actually kinda like big Halflings, or at least many in-world scholars hold this theory.
  • KrilralKrilral Member Registered Users Posts: 910
    Regarding ogre balance:

    I don't think the ogres will suffer too much from being an all-large faction. It will only really be a problem for them if they run into armies specifically designed to counter them, and that already goes for a lot of factions. Also, being large means they will be strong against other kinds of units, such as dedicated anti-infantry units. They could essentially invalidate many factions' late-game infantry units such as the Empire, Vampire Counts and Brettonia whose late-game infantry all specialize in dealing with other infantry.

    You also gotta remember that a bonus vs. large is not a guarantee to win. For units like spears and halberds it's a straight-up damage bonus, that isn't always so impressive once you take a closer look at it. And side- and rear-charging will still work just fine, as will their not inconsiderable ranged options.

    Now I obviously don't know if the ogres will be meta in the regular online multiplayer, but in single-player they should be OK.
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