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Cult of Sigmar - Unique Faction for Volkmar the Grim as new playable faction.

ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89
edited August 2022 in Warhammer Campaign Feedback

Cult of Sigmar


Unique Faction for Volkmar the Grim

Hello everyone. I like the service CA did with Karak Kadrin. Giving the Slayer King the Slayer Faction was a good move and makes every Legendary Lord unique. New possibilities and new mechanics arises from them, giving this game even more replay value.

Today I want to make suggestion for the Empire. Even though I know that some people don’t like the idea of separating the legendary lords and bring them to a totally new location, I want to make suggestion which would add more replay value for the Empire. The Cult of Sigmar , would be played a little different then other Empire factions, and they would change the gameplay meaningful. Maybe some people might want a different new Empire Lord or location but I advice to first read about the cult :)

The cult of Sigmar is the legimitate church of the Empire, even though their practices are sometimes extreme and fanatic. Volkmars as the Great Theogonist of the cult, would not only fulfill the needs of the Empire, but also serve in name of their god, at any cost.

The story

Recently, the Vampirecourts seem to gain power in the eastern empire lands. Vampirism is spreading over the country and there seems no other cure than steel and fire. Therfore Volkmar is sent to the monastery of Siegfriedhof [edit, see comments previously Averheim]to join the fight of the Ravenknights to purge the land from the filthy corruption.

While in the North barbarian norsemen are preparing to pillage the Empire, recently the tomb kings awaked, in the far south lands.
Volkmar needs to decide, after he cleaned the lands from vampirism, to either start an expedition to the south reeducate the Border Princes and destroy the tomb kings, or heading north, in favor of fulfilling sigmars will. He is the Hand of Sigmar and sigmar will guide is path.

Gameplay

fanaticism



The Cult of Sigmar is very similar to the Ikko Ikki clan of Shogun 2. Instead of “purity” the cult is spreading “sigmar fanaticism”. This is even powerfuller than just cleaning corruption. In addition, if the town starts to rebel, the Cult of Sigmar is able to take directly control over the 'sigmar rebel army' which can be used as help or directly conquer a town. Unluckily, the Army is dissolved after the town is conquered. While spreading Sigmar fanaticism in enemy factions is seen favorable in other (friendly) empire factions, spreading it in friendly empire cities can have diplomatic consequences. If a rebellion occurs in the said provinces, Cult of Sigmar is directly declared war. Be careful, which lands need to be purged in the name of sigmar.

It doesn’t need to be explained, that the Cult of Sigmar is immune to this type of ‘Corruption’ and even gets public order bonus from it.

fanaticism is spread inside the province as well as it’s environs. So make sure it only "spreads" towards the right direction.

New Buildings



The cult can directly built a shrine of sigmar(tier 1). With it, the cult can recruit new flagellants. Also, it cleans corruption.

The shrine can be upgraded in a tier 3 city to a temple of sigmar which will allow to recruit either a new witchhunter or warpriest. Headhunters (see below) are now recruit able. Also, this province is now spreading fanaticism
The temple can be upgraded to a cathedral if the city reached tier 5. The cathedral reduces the upkeep cost of Headhunters (see below) and Flagellants globally, also it increases the hero limit of witch hunters and war priest about 2. Ravenknights [ edit. previously Knights of the blazing sun] (if the necessary buildings are build) are now recruit able. It spreads a massive amount of fanaticism.


Raven Knights



originating from the order of the Fellowship of the Shroud in Tilea these Knights made their path in the heart of the Empire in order to destroy any undead creature and Vampire they could find. Eventhough they serve the Cult of Morr, their sacrificial behaviour against the Vampire Courts can only be in sense of sigmar.


Headhunters



A new unit for the empire, and so far, I know, not directly integrated in Warhammer Fantasy battles. In Warhammer Vermintide II Victor Saltz pyre has the ability to choose the path of a bounty hunter. I would like to bring this idea as a unit of the Empire. Another inspiration would be the classical vampire hunters of literature and films. Think of heavy armored vampire hunters equiped with crossbows.
Headhunters are special range Infantry of the Empire in the service of the holy cult of sigmar. They are shooting armor piercing bolts with half automatic crossbows. They are devastating against armored targets, even though their reduced soldier count (60) makes them easier targets against other ranged infantry. They are slower than archers and they also have a slightly reduced range than other range infantry of the empire. However, they are acceptable melee fighters since they are in possession of armors and swords. They spread fear against Vampire Units.

Torches




Volkmar and Arch Lectors are now able to skill a torch perk.

Every non-flagellant unit is equipped with torches (2-4 torches for a unit). While they have no impact on fight with “purity” factions, torches are powerful against Vampires, chaos and Skaven. Also, the lances of the knights of the blazing sun were counted as “torches”. Multiple Torches will stack their effect

E.g. The light of the torch affecting undead units which are fighting the Unit. If the Torch wielders are able to surround e.g. a zombie horde, the zombie horde starts to crumble very fast. The other way around, if the Zombies are able to surround a torch wielding company, it won’t have much effect on the horde.

This effect works on every undead unit (tomb kings, undead) as well as chaos units (they start to lose moral) or skaven.
Enemy players can get rid of the torches by cavalry charges (if the wielder is touched/killed the unit directly loses the torch) or magic (shadow magic can “blow out” the torches) or tries to surround the company. A single zombie Mob directly attacking the company from the front side, is not effective at all.

Note: a nice feature for every faction would be that banners were held by one banner holder of the unit. (with a very similar animation like the ones of the torch wielders)

AI faction

If the faction is not played by the player itself, it still has its own psychology. For example, the cult of sigmar hates every non-purity faction. The Cult of Sigmar would even start to declare war on factions, if their corruption is too high. Making friends with them is always a risk, but they are kind of a bane for every vampire or tomb king faction. After the vampire Courts are destroyed they head agressively towards the tomb kings


last words

Hope you enjoyed reading, maybe you have different thoughts or have feedback for me. I would like to hear them. As you can imagine you would need to own the Grim and the Grave DLC to play this faction. . I don't see any other option to make it fair to play them.

Also, maybe somebody has already post a similar suggestion, please see this thread as an extension of yours, and maybe link your post in the reply :). Sorry if I haven't read it.

Edit: I changed the post, since most people are concerned with idea of the starting position(averheim), I think that there is still a way to put something like to this to the game.


Note that the Undead faction would need to be bolstered as well. Maybe Ghorst needs to be set to Essen, or other surround provinces, so Grim has a hard time, to take control over the eastern parts of the Empire provinces. Since I am not a Vampire Court Player, maybe someone with better ideas should write something.



Sources

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammerfb/images/2/25/Witch_Hunter_Generic.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20170120024902

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammerfb/images/e/e9/Twin-Tailed_Comet.png/revision/latest?cb=20150528065408

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammerfb/images/6/6c/Imperial_Cross.png/revision/latest?cb=20150529075549

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammerfb/images/8/8f/Great_Temple_of_Sigmar.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160804172645

https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/vermintide2_gamepedia_en/thumb/c/c1/Hero_bounty_hunter.jpg/300px-Hero_bounty_hunter.jpg?version=764627bbd20d5aaeb652f17c4ce39ca1
Post edited by CA_Will#2514 on

Comments

  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,368
    Can't be their own "race" since they are of the Empire.
    TBH Volkmar is better suited as a Horde like he acted during Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos if he is moved away from Altdorf that's if they don't make Toris Bodbringer startable on campaign. It would add to the whole purge the heretics with less building more purging.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • daelin4#9896daelin4#9896 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 16,521
    edited June 2018
    Ungrim only worked because there was an existing faction located somewhere.
    This idea requires making up a new faction that would also have to replace another faction due to the need of a starting position that is not Altdorf.
    All other Legendary Lord changes and additions go by this route- Alith Anar and Allareile were just new characters added to existing factions of Nagarythe and Avelorn.

    This does give me an idea: perhaps similar to Hellebron's mechanic, choosing Volkmar allows you to summon Cult of Sigmar armies that try to purify corrupted/ corruption factions similar to Blood Voyage? Would be a great way to jumpstart wiping out the VC to the east and Norsca to the north.

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
  • TheShiroOfDaltonTheShiroOfDalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 34,001
    The Grand Theogonist's office is in Altdorf and they have been supporters of the Reikland Lords since forever so he's exactly where he should be.

    Ripping Averheim, home to one of the few unique elector counts and one of the most colorful to boot, from his rightful owner would stink to the high heavens. Marius Leitdorf has a much more justification to lead an Empire subfaction than Volkmar.
  • ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89
    edited June 2018

    The Grand Theogonist's office is in Altdorf and they have been supporters of the Reikland Lords since forever so he's exactly where he should be.

    Ripping Averheim, home to one of the few unique elector counts and one of the most colorful to boot, from his rightful owner would stink to the high heavens. Marius Leitdorf has a much more justification to lead an Empire subfaction than Volkmar.


    Marius Leitdorf dies in the year 2520. Since it is not really clear when Warhammer Total War is set, It would be plausible that recently the Elector Count passed away. While the town suffering from riots and public disorder dued to power struggles within the town , other electorcounts- even the Vampire Courts, are reaching their hands for the control over the city. Volkmar leaves his Office in Altdorf to keep the town where it belongs to... within the hands of the empire and with the belief of sigmar.

    I could imagine that Volkmar is confronted with riots. the former supporters of Leitdorf are not accepting the "occupation" by the church of sigmar. Therefore the player is more often confronted with riots of former Averland rebels within his city. In Grenzstadt the last followers of Averheim prepare to reconquer their city, or if the player is able to keep a good diplomatic balance, he is able to form an aliance with them against the border princes and Vampire Courts.

    Note that Volkmars start position/playstyle is very hard. He can only gain public order with certain shrines or fanaticism. So the purge against the Vampire, won't be as easy as it sounds. Accompanied by the riots and a possible attack of Averheim's former leaders, he is in the middle of a big conflict.

    Lorewise such a situation would also underline the mistrust in the empire.Draconian measures sending the Theogonist as a temporar leader could end in rebelions against Karl Franz or Volkmar. Volkmar is less accepted than Averheim. Attacking Averheim as Volkmar will have politic consequences. On the other side, Karl Franz might looking forward to confederate with the cult in order to reestablish order on the long run or - against every conventions- side with the electorcounts to fight the fanatics. I hope you could imagine how complicated the diplomatic relations could get

    So yeah, I can understand that it is a bit different then just adding a lord to an existing faction. But there were already big changes and hopefully will be. E.g. the occupation of the bretones of Araby is plausible but not perfect. Norsca with Wulfric and Throgg is a lot more interesting than the lame factions they were before. Changing a minor factions position in order to get a new mayor faction is in my opinion a good move. In my games, Averland never last longer than 15 rounds since they are overwhelmed by the Vampire Courts. Putting there another big faction would lead to longer lasting conflicts and more diversity. What I want is this diversity and conflicts rather than a rather uninteresting "unified" empire.

    I hope you can now understand why it would be cool, if Volkmar could be a faction for himself. :). Same could be done for Gelt obviously, but this would need a lot more consideration, and I think it needs to be as "original" as this approach for Volkmar...
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,368
    Zerca said:

    The Grand Theogonist's office is in Altdorf and they have been supporters of the Reikland Lords since forever so he's exactly where he should be.

    Ripping Averheim, home to one of the few unique elector counts and one of the most colorful to boot, from his rightful owner would stink to the high heavens. Marius Leitdorf has a much more justification to lead an Empire subfaction than Volkmar.


    Marius Leitdorf dies in the year 2520. Since it is not really clear when Warhammer Total War is set, It would be plausible that recently the Elector Count passed away. While the town suffering from riots and public disorder dued to power struggles within the town , other electorcounts- even the Vampire Courts, are reaching their hands for the control over the city. Volkmar leaves his Office in Altdorf to keep the town where it belongs to... within the hands of the empire and with the belief of sigmar.

    I could imagine that Volkmar is confronted with riots. the former supporters of Leitdorf are not accepting the "occupation" by the church of sigmar. Therefore the player is more often confronted with riots of former Averland rebels within his city. In Grenzstadt the last followers of Averheim prepare to reconquer their city, or if the player is able to keep a good diplomatic balance, he is able to form an aliance with them against the border princes and Vampire Courts.

    Note that Volkmars start position/playstyle is very hard. He can only gain public order with certain shrines or fanaticism. So the purge against the Vampire, won't be as easy as it sounds. Accompanied by the riots and a possible attack of Averheim's former leaders, he is in the middle of a big conflict.

    Lorewise such a situation would also underline the mistrust in the empire.Draconian measures sending the Theogonist as a temporar leader could end in rebelions against Karl Franz or Volkmar. Volkmar is less accepted than Averheim. Attacking Averheim as Volkmar will have politic consequences. On the other side, Karl Franz might looking forward to confederate with the cult in order to reestablish order on the long run or - against every conventions- side with the electorcounts to fight the fanatics. I hope you could imagine how complicated the diplomatic relations could get

    So yeah, I can understand that it is a bit different then just adding a lord to an existing faction. But there were already big changes and hopefully will be. E.g. the occupation of the bretones of Araby is plausible but not perfect. Norsca with Wulfric and Throgg is a lot more interesting than the lame factions they were before. Changing a minor factions position in order to get a new mayor faction is in my opinion a good move. In my games, Averland never last longer than 15 rounds since they are overwhelmed by the Vampire Courts. Putting there another big faction would lead to longer lasting conflicts and more diversity. What I want is this diversity and conflicts rather than a rather uninteresting "unified" empire.

    I hope you can now understand why it would be cool, if Volkmar could be a faction for himself. :). Same could be done for Gelt obviously, but this would need a lot more consideration, and I think it needs to be as "original" as this approach for Volkmar...
    The game starts when Karl Franz is elected Emperor which is 2502.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • TheGuardianOfMetal#3661TheGuardianOfMetal#3661 Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 14,701

    Zerca said:

    The Grand Theogonist's office is in Altdorf and they have been supporters of the Reikland Lords since forever so he's exactly where he should be.

    Ripping Averheim, home to one of the few unique elector counts and one of the most colorful to boot, from his rightful owner would stink to the high heavens. Marius Leitdorf has a much more justification to lead an Empire subfaction than Volkmar.


    Marius Leitdorf dies in the year 2520. Since it is not really clear when Warhammer Total War is set, It would be plausible that recently the Elector Count passed away. While the town suffering from riots and public disorder dued to power struggles within the town , other electorcounts- even the Vampire Courts, are reaching their hands for the control over the city. Volkmar leaves his Office in Altdorf to keep the town where it belongs to... within the hands of the empire and with the belief of sigmar.

    I could imagine that Volkmar is confronted with riots. the former supporters of Leitdorf are not accepting the "occupation" by the church of sigmar. Therefore the player is more often confronted with riots of former Averland rebels within his city. In Grenzstadt the last followers of Averheim prepare to reconquer their city, or if the player is able to keep a good diplomatic balance, he is able to form an aliance with them against the border princes and Vampire Courts.

    Note that Volkmars start position/playstyle is very hard. He can only gain public order with certain shrines or fanaticism. So the purge against the Vampire, won't be as easy as it sounds. Accompanied by the riots and a possible attack of Averheim's former leaders, he is in the middle of a big conflict.

    Lorewise such a situation would also underline the mistrust in the empire.Draconian measures sending the Theogonist as a temporar leader could end in rebelions against Karl Franz or Volkmar. Volkmar is less accepted than Averheim. Attacking Averheim as Volkmar will have politic consequences. On the other side, Karl Franz might looking forward to confederate with the cult in order to reestablish order on the long run or - against every conventions- side with the electorcounts to fight the fanatics. I hope you could imagine how complicated the diplomatic relations could get

    So yeah, I can understand that it is a bit different then just adding a lord to an existing faction. But there were already big changes and hopefully will be. E.g. the occupation of the bretones of Araby is plausible but not perfect. Norsca with Wulfric and Throgg is a lot more interesting than the lame factions they were before. Changing a minor factions position in order to get a new mayor faction is in my opinion a good move. In my games, Averland never last longer than 15 rounds since they are overwhelmed by the Vampire Courts. Putting there another big faction would lead to longer lasting conflicts and more diversity. What I want is this diversity and conflicts rather than a rather uninteresting "unified" empire.

    I hope you can now understand why it would be cool, if Volkmar could be a faction for himself. :). Same could be done for Gelt obviously, but this would need a lot more consideration, and I think it needs to be as "original" as this approach for Volkmar...
    The game starts when Karl Franz is elected Emperor which is 2502.
    Exactly. Karl Franz at more than one point is mentioned to have been freshly coronated. Otherwise the Empire would be far more stable, since KF would've already proofed himself to be an exceptionaly competent Ruler and General.
    The Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. We need Marius Leitdorf of Averland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him? For a Middenland DLC with Boris and the Ar-Ulric!

    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD!

    Queek could smell their hatred, ratcheted to a degree that even he could not evoke in their simple hearts. He stepped over the old orange-fur’s body, eager to see for himself what it was they saw. But he heard it first.
    'Waaaaaaaggh! Gorfang!'
  • ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89
    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,368
    Zerca said:

    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.

    Games date IS 2502 because the Elector Count of Wissenland isn't female as in 2503 Emmanuelle von Liebwitz comes to power in Wissenland and Marius Leitdorf ingame is still the Leader of Averland never mind him being a 8th edition Legendary Lord.

    Volkmar again is best suited as a Horde if he is moved away from Reikland like he has done during the events of Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos especially given that the Cult of Sigmars seat of power is Altdorf.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • TheGuardianOfMetal#3661TheGuardianOfMetal#3661 Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 14,701

    Zerca said:

    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.

    Games date IS 2502 because the Elector Count of Wissenland isn't female as in 2503 Emmanuelle von Liebwitz comes to power in Wissenland and Marius Leitdorf ingame is still the Leader of Averland never mind him being a 8th edition Legendary Lord.

    Volkmar again is best suited as a Horde if he is moved away from Reikland like he has done during the events of Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos especially given that the Cult of Sigmars seat of power is Altdorf.
    iirc The guy who is the leader of Wissenland was, in Game 1, Calle something like "Leader of the court" or something. Iirc people assumed that, like with Kislev, he's a cost cutting replacement character who takes over the ruling and interacting with others FOR Countess von Liebwitz, while she is still the official Elector Countess
    The Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. We need Marius Leitdorf of Averland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him? For a Middenland DLC with Boris and the Ar-Ulric!

    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD!

    Queek could smell their hatred, ratcheted to a degree that even he could not evoke in their simple hearts. He stepped over the old orange-fur’s body, eager to see for himself what it was they saw. But he heard it first.
    'Waaaaaaaggh! Gorfang!'
  • ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89
    edited June 2018

    Zerca said:

    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.

    Games date IS 2502 because the Elector Count of Wissenland isn't female as in 2503 Emmanuelle von Liebwitz comes to power in Wissenland and Marius Leitdorf ingame is still the Leader of Averland never mind him being a 8th edition Legendary Lord.

    Volkmar again is best suited as a Horde if he is moved away from Reikland like he has done during the events of Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos especially given that the Cult of Sigmars seat of power is Altdorf.

    Lorewise this might suit good, but gameplay wise this might develop strange situations. While the aspect of a mobile headquarter might be understandable, Horde factions need constantly to pillage settlements to gather enough upkeep for their troops. Volkmar's quest should be the cleaning of corruption within the empire rather than directly start to plunder norsca settlements. Also I wouldn't like to see Vampire Courts directly confronted with a Horde faction. I would even say, Volkmar wouldn't be able to "pillage" a region, but "purging" it. This new movement stance spreads a lot of fanaticism but the cult is not gaining any money from it.


    I had a more Nagarythe-esque faction in mind, which has a headquarter, but is still mobil with a reduced recruitment time. Maybe even the Term "new race" is used wrong. I had unique faction in mind, like Nagarythe is still High elven faction. Karak Kadrin is still a dwarf faction. the Cult of Sigmar would still be an empire faction, but with certain unique abillities.



    The Cult of Sigmar would see the Siegfriedhof as some kind of a temporary base of Operations. They are present in any Empire region, but here they have some kind of a special task force with the sole aim of cleaning the empire from Vampirism and Chaos. In late game, the Empire and the cult of sigmar can be "confederate" into one faction again. I would even like to see that in any case, the player takes the color of the Empire afterwards. The Headquarter is then shifted again back to Altdorf. If the Crusade of the Cult fails and the Vampire Courts conquered the Siegfriedhof, Volkmar can be recruited in Altdorf, if the player is playing as Karl Franz.

    Basically I think , off course Volkmar and Karl Franz share the same thoughts and goals for the Empire, but in my opinon, uniting the empire is not his business. During the Endgame or "endtimes" , a lot of factions starts to confederate into bigger ones, that's the time Volkmar and Franz should be on the same site. And obviously, if they kept a good relation this will happen and they confederate. I think this would create a cooler immersion than just pretend that Volkmar's aims are the same like Karl's. If a war is set between Empire faction, the player or the Empire AI would consider to have peace with Vampire Courts. Something which is completely not suitable for a man like Volkmar.


    Post edited by Zerca on
  • ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89

    Zerca said:

    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.

    Games date IS 2502 because the Elector Count of Wissenland isn't female as in 2503 Emmanuelle von Liebwitz comes to power in Wissenland and Marius Leitdorf ingame is still the Leader of Averland never mind him being a 8th edition Legendary Lord.

    Volkmar again is best suited as a Horde if he is moved away from Reikland like he has done during the events of Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos especially given that the Cult of Sigmars seat of power is Altdorf.
    I can understand the point of a moving headquarter for a faction like this could be seen as most suitable for this faction, but otherwise it has some odd consequences. Horde factions need to constantly pillage villages and destroy factions in order survive. This would lead to situations that players would need to move directly to norsca and pillage it. Another payment system could be very strange to implement. In addition, a direct confrontation with a horde faction for the vampire courts could be really unbalanced. After he purged, Volkmar wouldn’t have an easy time to find directly new enemies.

    What I have in mind is that the Cult of Sigmar is occupying the Siegfriedhof as a base of operations in order to clean the land from vampirism. This special task group is only concerned with cleaning the land. This faction is basically “the Empire” with certain different mechanics, maybe a bit Nargarythe-esque with a reduced recruitment time. Still it would need some diplomatic achievements to bring them back into the empire.

    This might be lorewise a bit odd to explain why Volkmar is leaving Altdorf in order to purge the land, it might even be a bit strange why he might disagree to follow the orders of the empire, but it is possible that he don’t care about this dispute with the elector counts. He is not a King, he is a religious leader. It gives the game logic a lot more plausibility. Even though Volkmar shares generally the same aim for the Empire as Karl, I don’t think that uniting the Empire is really his business. With a new start position directly in the heart of Sylvania he is directly fighting vampirism rather than rebels of the empire.

    In the later game, when the growing Empire unites with several elector counts, the Cult of Sigmar could rejoin it, since they are now following the same goal (e.g. they purged the vampirism, now they fight chaos within the empire). I would like to see that in any case of confederation, the player of the cult of sigma gets again the colors of the empire, since from that point they are “joined” again. Also e.g. if the Cult of Sigmar(AI) is destroyed by the Vampire Courts, Volkmar is recruitable in Altdorf again, if the player started as Karl Franz.
    And this is another reason, why I wouldn't like to see him as Horde faction. The Player wouldn't be able to "reunite".

  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,368
    Zerca said:

    Zerca said:

    This might be true for Warhammer I but there are some consistency errors between Warhammer I and II. I doubt that Tyrions reunion of Ulthuan and the election of Karl Franz is pretty much on the same date. But this is completely fine, it is a persistent world , with different outcomes every playthrough. Eventhough I can understand that , since the Empire Lore should be as consistent as possible, I might withdraw the idea of putting him there.

    I am not really concerned with placing Volkmar to Averland. It needs to be in a area close to Vampire Courts though. Creating a new, very small region which has no big part in the lore to point would be fine aswell. Like maybe a monastery in the region around Averheim, Stirland or Ostermark. Generally the regions north from the vampire courts are sparsely habitated.

    My quick research bring me to "Siegfriedhof" Which is currently occupied by the order of the Raven knights. While I don't see a point in creating a faction from them , they could be appear at least as a replacement of the Knights of the Blazing sun. The Order is as fanatic , as I would consider the Cult of Sigmar, so they might just joined the Crusade of the Cult of Sigmar in order to clean the lands from the undead.


    So yeah. Maybe we keep a little bit the track from the "Averheim lore thingy, and more consider the gameplay elements of such a faction.

    Games date IS 2502 because the Elector Count of Wissenland isn't female as in 2503 Emmanuelle von Liebwitz comes to power in Wissenland and Marius Leitdorf ingame is still the Leader of Averland never mind him being a 8th edition Legendary Lord.

    Volkmar again is best suited as a Horde if he is moved away from Reikland like he has done during the events of Sigmars Blood and Storm of Chaos especially given that the Cult of Sigmars seat of power is Altdorf.
    I can understand the point of a moving headquarter for a faction like this could be seen as most suitable for this faction, but otherwise it has some odd consequences. Horde factions need to constantly pillage villages and destroy factions in order survive. This would lead to situations that players would need to move directly to norsca and pillage it. Another payment system could be very strange to implement. In addition, a direct confrontation with a horde faction for the vampire courts could be really unbalanced. After he purged, Volkmar wouldn’t have an easy time to find directly new enemies.

    What I have in mind is that the Cult of Sigmar is occupying the Siegfriedhof as a base of operations in order to clean the land from vampirism. This special task group is only concerned with cleaning the land. This faction is basically “the Empire” with certain different mechanics, maybe a bit Nargarythe-esque with a reduced recruitment time. Still it would need some diplomatic achievements to bring them back into the empire.

    This might be lorewise a bit odd to explain why Volkmar is leaving Altdorf in order to purge the land, it might even be a bit strange why he might disagree to follow the orders of the empire, but it is possible that he don’t care about this dispute with the elector counts. He is not a King, he is a religious leader. It gives the game logic a lot more plausibility. Even though Volkmar shares generally the same aim for the Empire as Karl, I don’t think that uniting the Empire is really his business. With a new start position directly in the heart of Sylvania he is directly fighting vampirism rather than rebels of the empire.

    In the later game, when the growing Empire unites with several elector counts, the Cult of Sigmar could rejoin it, since they are now following the same goal (e.g. they purged the vampirism, now they fight chaos within the empire). I would like to see that in any case of confederation, the player of the cult of sigma gets again the colors of the empire, since from that point they are “joined” again. Also e.g. if the Cult of Sigmar(AI) is destroyed by the Vampire Courts, Volkmar is recruitable in Altdorf again, if the player started as Karl Franz.
    And this is another reason, why I wouldn't like to see him as Horde faction. The Player wouldn't be able to "reunite".

    Issue is Siegfriedhof is not ingame and CA are unlikely to add new settlements that aren't on the Vortex map, If Volkmar ever went to purge Slyvania of Vampires then it's a Sigmars Blood rehash which is again Volkmar as a Horde in which Volkmar starts off from Altdorf heading towards Slyvania while picking up troops that were ordered to help Volkmar by order of the Emperor.

    The main problem is you've chosen Volkmar which would only really appear as a horde when not apart of Reikland due to how he works especially since he was added by a Sigmars Blood themed DLC in which all those units added by the DLC went with him during those events.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • ZercaZerca Registered Users Posts: 89



    Issue is Siegfriedhof is not ingame and CA are unlikely to add new settlements that aren't on the Vortex map, If Volkmar ever went to purge Slyvania of Vampires then it's a Sigmars Blood rehash which is again Volkmar as a Horde in which Volkmar starts off from Altdorf heading towards Slyvania while picking up troops that were ordered to help Volkmar by order of the Emperor.

    The main problem is you've chosen Volkmar which would only really appear as a horde when not apart of Reikland due to how he works especially since he was added by a Sigmars Blood themed DLC in which all those units added by the DLC went with him during those events.

    Well, Sartosa was added, and yes, it is on the Vortex Map, but the Point is that changes on the map are possible (and CA is doing so). During Warhammer I, when Woodelves were added, they changed/added complete new ways to the games. The World is built in progress, and this is fantastic. My cult of sigmar suggestion is not a complete revamp of the existing empire/ creation of a race like adding wood elves, but it is an addition which enriches the world around Sylvania. Adding a new city (maybe even just a city, not a whole province) won't hurt. So far, I read in the lore, it is around Essen, the small town close to the Vampire lands, and close to river seperating the provinces. I think it would even enhances the balancing, since e.g. the vampire courts were in my last 5 playthroughs in Mortal Empires too successful while the empire was never be able to get out of it's home region without help. Vampire Courts expanded too fast. A purging Volkmar would definately push the balance.
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 7,368
    Zerca said:



    Issue is Siegfriedhof is not ingame and CA are unlikely to add new settlements that aren't on the Vortex map, If Volkmar ever went to purge Slyvania of Vampires then it's a Sigmars Blood rehash which is again Volkmar as a Horde in which Volkmar starts off from Altdorf heading towards Slyvania while picking up troops that were ordered to help Volkmar by order of the Emperor.

    The main problem is you've chosen Volkmar which would only really appear as a horde when not apart of Reikland due to how he works especially since he was added by a Sigmars Blood themed DLC in which all those units added by the DLC went with him during those events.

    Well, Sartosa was added, and yes, it is on the Vortex Map, but the Point is that changes on the map are possible (and CA is doing so). During Warhammer I, when Woodelves were added, they changed/added complete new ways to the games. The World is built in progress, and this is fantastic. My cult of sigmar suggestion is not a complete revamp of the existing empire/ creation of a race like adding wood elves, but it is an addition which enriches the world around Sylvania. Adding a new city (maybe even just a city, not a whole province) won't hurt. So far, I read in the lore, it is around Essen, the small town close to the Vampire lands, and close to river seperating the provinces. I think it would even enhances the balancing, since e.g. the vampire courts were in my last 5 playthroughs in Mortal Empires too successful while the empire was never be able to get out of it's home region without help. Vampire Courts expanded too fast. A purging Volkmar would definately push the balance.
    Except for Warhammer 2 they have said they aren't doing what they did with as shown with Tomb Kings settlements and one of the Lizardmen ones in the south western part of the map even then those are for game 2 races in game 2 areas and they haven't added anything to the old world aside from move one Lord to his rightful place at Slayer Keep.

    And again Volkmar can only be moved out in a horde due to how the lore shows him and the theme of the DLC in which he was added by which is Sigmars Blood in which the units added by Sigmars Blood were apart of his force hunting down Mannfred.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

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