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The Rise of the Republic balance patch is now live!

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  • GreenKing1GreenKing1 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 639
    edited September 2018

    Family tree bmembers or Other Noblesn from your party?

    Yea, they were generals, not family members, my mistake.

    I have had the faction leader leave though and join a different family.

    Got a screenshot of it here: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/225440/faction-leader-left-to-join-other-family#latest
  • MarcusIuniusBrutusMarcusIuniusBrutus Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 1,739
    Your family members still can be bribed, which was prepatch 20 also possible.
  • GreenKing1GreenKing1 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 639

    Your family members still can be bribed, which was prepatch 20 also possible.

    Surely the faction leader shouldn't just up and leave to another family though?
  • MarcusIuniusBrutusMarcusIuniusBrutus Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 1,739
    edited September 2018
    Was the faction leader the heir or a family member?

    I think a son in law is no family member.
  • GreenKing1GreenKing1 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 639
    edited September 2018


    The faction leader was "Hermes", when the Heir "Diodotos II" died, "Hermes" joined the other family and the game spawned a new faction leader "Prochoros".
  • MarcusIuniusBrutusMarcusIuniusBrutus Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 1,739
  • MarcusIuniusBrutusMarcusIuniusBrutus Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 1,739
    edited September 2018
    Sorry, seems to be a mod conflict with a 4 tpy mod, as i got this picture, when i start a bactria campaign:

    image
  • GreenKing1GreenKing1 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 639
    Diodotos died in battle quite some way in, diodotos II remained heir but the game spawned in Hermes as new faction leader. Then for some reason when Diodotos II died, Hermes changed family and the game spawned in a new faction leader in.
  • MarcusIuniusBrutusMarcusIuniusBrutus Senior Member GermanyRegistered Users Posts: 1,739
    edited September 2018
    Hermes has 400 gravitas! So you must have played more than 20 Turns with him. Diodotus II would have been an adult without a more tpy mod. Sorry mod cause this problem.

    And i think he left, because he spawned as emergency leader, no real family by birth.
  • GreenKing1GreenKing1 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 639

    Hermes has 400 gravitas! So you must have played more than 20 Turns with him. Diodotus II would have been an adult without a more tpy mod. Sorry mod cause this problem.

    And i think he left, because he spawned as emergency leader, no real family by birth.

    Yea, have a 12 tpy mod on. Will disable the mods and see if the same thing happens.
  • HolyTacoBarHolyTacoBar Registered Users Posts: 5

    Send Diplomat will only grant a region where a border is shared between the player and the faction to whom a diplomat is sent.


    Do Corsica and Sardinia have a shared border?

    Or any of the land borders containing a small waterway pass (thracia, brittania / corsentia , syracuse / gadira tingis, ect.)
  • jamreal18jamreal18 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 9,521



    The faction leader was "Hermes", when the Heir "Diodotos II" died, "Hermes" joined the other family and the game spawned a new faction leader "Prochoros".

    I remember Mithridates.
    Really want to see Mithridatic Wars.
  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17
    Hello, thank you for continuing to work on the game and make us happy with your fans.
     Can we expect a new DLS with an advanced AI against which it will be interesting to play? To design it as a new, increased level of complexity, for example "divine" or something in this spirit. I would gladly buy it.
     Is it possible to edit the system of summing up after the battle? Make it more variable, so that each solution has its pluses and minuses.
    For example: "Get a ransom" - a good mechanic, but one-sided. It should have both pluses and minuses - getting money is a plus, but then let the losing party get half the amount of the ransom to hire free troops out of turn + 50% chance of resurrecting the general who died in battle. Otherwise, this mechanics used in the game simply does not work and all players automatically take a ransom, before the players just killed the prisoners.
     If you still decide to continue working on improving AI, create a theme on behalf of the CA, I think players from all over the world will gladly try to help you in this and voice a whole sea of ​​suggestions and options.
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 25,929
    mrdeadmen said:

    Hello, thank you for continuing to work on the game and make us happy with your fans.
     Can we expect a new DLS with an advanced AI against which it will be interesting to play? To design it as a new, increased level of complexity, for example "divine" or something in this spirit. I would gladly buy it.
     Is it possible to edit the system of summing up after the battle? Make it more variable, so that each solution has its pluses and minuses.
    For example: "Get a ransom" - a good mechanic, but one-sided. It should have both pluses and minuses - getting money is a plus, but then let the losing party get half the amount of the ransom to hire free troops out of turn + 50% chance of resurrecting the general who died in battle. Otherwise, this mechanics used in the game simply does not work and all players automatically take a ransom, before the players just killed the prisoners.
     If you still decide to continue working on improving AI, create a theme on behalf of the CA, I think players from all over the world will gladly try to help you in this and voice a whole sea of ​​suggestions and options.

    Define "advanced AI".

  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17

    mrdeadmen said:

    Hello, thank you for continuing to work on the game and make us happy with your fans.
     Can we expect a new DLS with an advanced AI against which it will be interesting to play? To design it as a new, increased level of complexity, for example "divine" or something in this spirit. I would gladly buy it.
     Is it possible to edit the system of summing up after the battle? Make it more variable, so that each solution has its pluses and minuses.
    For example: "Get a ransom" - a good mechanic, but one-sided. It should have both pluses and minuses - getting money is a plus, but then let the losing party get half the amount of the ransom to hire free troops out of turn + 50% chance of resurrecting the general who died in battle. Otherwise, this mechanics used in the game simply does not work and all players automatically take a ransom, before the players just killed the prisoners.
     If you still decide to continue working on improving AI, create a theme on behalf of the CA, I think players from all over the world will gladly try to help you in this and voice a whole sea of ​​suggestions and options.

    Define "advanced AI".
    Describe in more detail what is meant by the term "advanced AI"? Are you asking about this?
  • SelviusElCaristioSelviusElCaristio Registered Users Posts: 4
    edited September 2018

    Family tree members or Other Nobles from your party?

    Other Nobles are no family members. They still will separate, which is good.

    ¡Hombre! ... Siempre está bien que te traicione un hermano, o un hijo, te hunde la moral incluso a nivel humano real.
    Post edited by SelviusElCaristio on
  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17
    There was a question about the "advanced AI", I do not know if it is relevant now, but I will write anyway.

    Advanced AI is an AI that will be eliminated:

    1. Weaknesses in behavior on the strategic map.

    a.) Suicide attacks - teach AI to attack only in those cases when it has an advantage, or at least the author's score gives AI victory, and not merge their armies in unsuspecting attacks where even the author's account is on the player's side. Also, if the auto-settlement was on the side of AI, but he lost in the future with the same ratio to retreat and collect more troops for an attack - for example, AI attacks the city autocrossing 60% to win AI 40% to win the player, the AI ​​loses. At the following attacks, AI attacks with a 70% strength ratio of 30%. Or if the AI ​​attacks the city with one army and is defeated, then the next time it comes again 1 army instead of taking 2 or 3 and merging again.

    b.) Teach AI to retreat, rebuild and collect forces into one fist for attack. (for example, AI runs to the city to attack it on the next turn, the player moves the city to the city, the capture of the city becomes impossible for the AI, moreover, the approaching army threatens with the destruction of the AI ​​army.) AI enters the camp (instead of retreating and recruiting troops) and The player destroys it for the next turn.

    c.) Ignore AI run on a fast march about and without.

    d.) Teach AI to defend its territory (leave the army for protection, and not send all the troops to the enemy's territory)

    e.) Teach AI to plan its actions (seizure of territories or capture for the purpose of robbery) - it often happens that AI seizes cities (occupies) and does not build anything in them because of a lack of resources. Then runs further leaving the city with 0 garrison.

    f.) Withdraw the AI ​​to attack the fleet with cargo ships (here the fault is the fault of the auto account for which it has a global advantage), but the experienced player has only a couple of ballistics and 3-4 cheapest ships to drown the whole stack of trucks. If the ballista is 6 or more, then the battle turns into target shooting.

    g.) Teach AI to use ambushes.

    h.) Give the AI ​​a short-term memory (say 5 turns). For example: If a player enters the territory of the AI ​​and ambush, then the computer believes that there is no one, turns on a quick march and happily rushes into the trap.

    i.) Teach AI when hiring a general to put him in the city and immediately begin recruiting (in the same way that the general was hired).

    k.) Teach AI to recruit the maximum possible number of armies and fleets of the best quality from possible options. (For example, in late and middle game AI has the opportunity to collect 8 armies and 6 fleets, but more than 4 complete and one gnawed army and 2 fleets, he will not recruit, although diplomacy shows that he has a huge amount of money.

    l.) Teach AI to recruit troops of the best quality (in accordance with the scheme used to build it for battle). For example, in the DLC "Ascent of the Republic, Carthage having a barracks of the 3rd level continues to recruit homeless people and low-level troops, or in general recruits troops where barracks do not exist.)

    m.) Teach AI more literate urban development (for example, construction of barracks at key points to protect borders).

    n.) Teach AI to form correctly the army. (In this direction, you have done a lot of work for which many thanks to you, but there are still some shortcomings). For example, when picking up the cavalry army, the AI ​​necessarily takes 1 or 2 detachments of foot troops (most often level 1 spearmen). Because of this, the army is losing mobility.

    o.) Teach AI to run off on a quick march after the defeat or dismiss the remnants of the troops (1-2 squads of 20 soldiers) and collect a new army (all in one move).
  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17
    2. Weaknesses on the tactical map (here it is clear that the work is underway, the changes are cool sometimes even zubodrobitelnye (as the AI ​​began to scatter from the pikemen and go to them in the flank, and sometimes (if the stars converge) and in the rear - it's just super, but still many lacks remained.) for example:

    a.) The arrows are knocked together and do not shoot (only one unit shoots, the rest are - this is the cool mechanics invented by you, but the AI ​​apparently does not know about it and does not pull its troops out by losing firepower).

    b.) Horse archers (especially light ones) do not know how to retreat after consuming ammunition (this would be reasonable for equestrian armies, if after an ammunition firing the majority is still on the player's side). This method allows you to save the army without unnecessary losses and finish off the army by attacking again.

    ) When attacking cities, the cavalry rushes ahead of all to slaughter (instead of going to the rear and after the infantry enters the battle to attack or guard their riflemen from the cavalry squads of the player.

    ) When storming, 1 maximum of 2 approaches to the center of the city is used and instead of surrounding the enemy AI attempts to pass in one place and throws the whole army instead of surrounding and destroying (to shoot at the shooting advantage) the enemy.

    etc.) Not always adequate behavior on the part of AI when it has reinforcement. He will just stand and die under the arrows without undertaking anything and waiting for reinforcements to come up. Although it should be noted that here you also worked well and such situations do not happen often, and the AI ​​began to act more literate.

    If the AI ​​attacks the city with walls from the sea, and in reinforcements it will have a foot army, the reinforcements will approach the walls and die from the towers and arrows, instead of departing and waiting for the sailors to seize the gate and open the road and retreat if the seamen will not do anything. Instead, the AI ​​loses for free and the army and navy.

    3. Change the system of diplomacy and interaction of AI with each other. (for example: military allies act as one state, fines for militarism and the destruction of factions should be increased so that the AI ​​can organize a worthy cumulative resistance, etc.)

    4.Add more variability in the AI's actions both on the company's map and on the battlefield (for example, recruit troops into the army under the tactics you have already developed and implemented, and act on the battlefield according to these schemes, based on the results of battles with the player draw conclusions and choose the most effective tactics and balance of power balance in the attack of armies and player cities.

    Of the obvious weaknesses of AI like everything, if you meet something else I will try to tell you, and other fans of the game I think with pleasure pouchavstvuet in this process if you invite them to help you.
  • hoomhoom Registered Users Posts: 83
    Basically no we can't expect hugely better AI.
    AI in many ways hasn't changed since Shogun1.

    Its learned some tricks in how to do stuff with new game features but its arguably gone backwards in other things.
    maybe those guys should be doing something more useful...
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 25,929
    The first part of your suggestions of "advanced AI" was already tried in WH1. It lead to the AI avoiding field battles like a plague unless it could triple-team the player and being overly "prudent" by always trying to sneak behind the player and attacking his least defended settlement.

    It. Was. Not. fun. Not at all.

    The second part of your suggestions will result in paralyzed AI armies which are spending most of their time sitting still and changing around their army composition because it requires near human intuition to actually figure out when the most opportune moment to do so is.

    All in all, these suggestions would make the game worse.

  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17
    I do not exclude that some of the proposed changes may be controversial. But the resolution you passed is very similar to the "for a tick" reply. I specifically on points painted weaknesses in the behavior of AI. It would be desirable to hear the answer too more concrete, on points a, b, с etc.

    The latest patches showed that you can change a lot and improve or just make others. Everything depends only on the desire and, well, from the superior authorities))).
  • RewanRewan Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,207
    teach AI to attack only in those cases when it has an advantage


    You should play Total War Attila, the AI is an expert at being overly prudent to the point of not doing anything in that game already
    TW : Three Kingdoms. Units not running in battles ? You probably came down to a bad case of floor is caltrops. Use this miraculous cure to make your soldiers hoppity happy again : https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2132907090
  • mrdeadmenmrdeadmen Registered Users Posts: 17
    Rewan said:

    teach AI to attack only in those cases when it has an advantage


    You should play Total War Attila, the AI is an expert at being overly prudent to the point of not doing anything in that game already
    Being "circumspect" and "doing nothing" are different concepts. At the moment, AI is just busy "doing nothing", because there are no instructions and models of behavior laid by the developers. AI only mimics "stormy activities," the task of winning and ways to solve this problem, he does not. As one of the representatives of the СA said, AI should entertain the player, imitate the activity, he had no problems to win and no. And judging by the answer to my letters, no one is going to set such a task for him. How long will you personally be interested in competing with an opponent who can not and will not win you?

    And going back to prudence, why do we need hundreds of nothing meaningless, monotonous battles that turn the game into a routine? It is better to let the battle be less frequent, but the enemy will force the player to sweat and use all their knowledge and skills for victory, which (victory) to the player will be absolutely not guaranteed and it still needs to be able to deserve.
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