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Get some lesson from Paradox

13

Comments

  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7 said:

    Goatforce said:

    Say what you want about Paradox's DLC policy, but with Stellaris at least the free patches have been second to none, the free updates alone have made it a completely different game to what came at launch, in my opinion anyway

    I admit, Stellaris is now a different sort of garbage than it was at launch.
    Both journalists and customers on metacritic disagree with you. It's the best space strategy game on the market and I strongly suggest people to try it (also Endless Space 2, because Amplitude is great).
    Never gotten into Endless Space. I bought it off the CA/Amplitude sister-studio deal, but then spent all my time playing Total War anyway! Maybe it's because I'm not sure how everything works in it yet...
    Some mechanics (like politics) are gimmicky, but if you can handle TW, it's not much more complicated. I recommend trying it.
  • daelin4#9896daelin4#9896 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 16,521
    edited September 2018
    If you'e going to end up buying their products, then it is clear in CA's eyes that their communication works just fine. The lack of updates don't seem to negatively affect sales to them. So why should they change?

    Especially when you consider that in the past, when CA community managers have been more outspoken and interactive on the forums, the sales did not seem particularly different than if they were silent. So if community managers just end up wasting their time giving updates that don't help, why bother?

    You're upset at the lack of updates and presumably the lack of information due to this method of communication. But if you still end up buying their products when it is released, perhaps it's already accomplished its purpose- a suitable balance of info given to entice buyers, and the lack of info so they don't get turned off by the content- which just means CA doesn't need to take lessons from someone else.

    If Paradox's communications policy actually serves to boost sales, then that might have an influence on CA. But just because one store does a thing you like doesn't always mean you won't buy from other stores.

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • #28957#28957 Registered Users Posts: 2,768

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    Now I am known as "numbers".
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    That's the exact same argument review bombers made back in WH1 times. So much good it did to the series. Thank you very much, folks.
  • harngerstein#5553harngerstein#5553 Registered Users Posts: 1,029

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
    Fair points.

    The main reason CA shouldn't be like Paradox is because context is -like my little brother Kong- king.

    As I've said I'm quite happy to say CA can, and should communicate better. That should come in the form of openness, telling us when things are coming, and revealing what they are sooner.

    What it shouldn't be is in the mould of Paradox. Paradox release DLC far more regularly than CA. There's no way to stretch a single DLC into 16 weekly blogs. Nor would that be effective. Tell us when it's in the works, tell us when it'll be announced and then start the hype a month before. EZ.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • harngerstein#5553harngerstein#5553 Registered Users Posts: 1,029

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
    Fair points.

    The main reason CA shouldn't be like Paradox is because context is -like my little brother Kong- king.

    As I've said I'm quite happy to say CA can, and should communicate better. That should come in the form of openness, telling us when things are coming, and revealing what they are sooner.

    What it shouldn't be is in the mould of Paradox. Paradox release DLC far more regularly than CA. There's no way to stretch a single DLC into 16 weekly blogs. Nor would that be effective. Tell us when it's in the works, tell us when it'll be announced and then start the hype a month before. EZ.
    It doesn't need to be information about the DLC. It could involve things like:
    -balancing team discussions
    -changes being made to old races
    -lore stuff
    -them telling us explicitly why the high elves don't get an archmage but the dark elves do
    -community content
    -Ghorgons
    -bug fixes that are or aren't on their radar
    -AMAs with the devs
    -AMAs with the programmers
    -AMAs with the Alan the Intern
    -blog posts on the ethics of selling a product without being transparent about what it contains
    -a "Khazrak in the Kitchen: cooking Razorgor chops" culinary special
    -mod spotlights
    -doing a live Beastmen or Skarsnik Let's Play with a Dev so they can look at us with a straight face and say "this is working as intended"
    -painting minis with Alan the Intern
    -AMAs with Ghorgon
    -and more

    Mostly just so that we can see what the WH team is up to, as many of us think it's been defunct or a skeleton crew
  • Reeks#2417Reeks#2417 Registered Users Posts: 10,378
    @harngerstein that post right there made me lol





    Nurgle is love

    Nurgle is life

    #JusticeForNurglingForumAvatars
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
    Fair points.

    The main reason CA shouldn't be like Paradox is because context is -like my little brother Kong- king.

    As I've said I'm quite happy to say CA can, and should communicate better. That should come in the form of openness, telling us when things are coming, and revealing what they are sooner.

    What it shouldn't be is in the mould of Paradox. Paradox release DLC far more regularly than CA. There's no way to stretch a single DLC into 16 weekly blogs. Nor would that be effective. Tell us when it's in the works, tell us when it'll be announced and then start the hype a month before. EZ.
    It doesn't need to be information about the DLC. It could involve things like:
    -balancing team discussions
    -changes being made to old races
    -lore stuff
    -them telling us explicitly why the high elves don't get an archmage but the dark elves do
    -community content
    -Ghorgons
    -bug fixes that are or aren't on their radar
    -AMAs with the devs
    -AMAs with the programmers
    -AMAs with the Alan the Intern
    -blog posts on the ethics of selling a product without being transparent about what it contains
    -a "Khazrak in the Kitchen: cooking Razorgor chops" culinary special
    -mod spotlights
    -doing a live Beastmen or Skarsnik Let's Play with a Dev so they can look at us with a straight face and say "this is working as intended"
    -painting minis with Alan the Intern
    -AMAs with Ghorgon
    -and more

    Mostly just so that we can see what the WH team is up to, as many of us think it's been defunct or a skeleton crew
    Your list mocks itself. My point is proven.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • FinishingLast#1402FinishingLast#1402 Registered Users Posts: 4,860

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
    Fair points.

    The main reason CA shouldn't be like Paradox is because context is -like my little brother Kong- king.

    As I've said I'm quite happy to say CA can, and should communicate better. That should come in the form of openness, telling us when things are coming, and revealing what they are sooner.

    What it shouldn't be is in the mould of Paradox. Paradox release DLC far more regularly than CA. There's no way to stretch a single DLC into 16 weekly blogs. Nor would that be effective. Tell us when it's in the works, tell us when it'll be announced and then start the hype a month before. EZ.
    It doesn't need to be information about the DLC. It could involve things like:
    -balancing team discussions
    -changes being made to old races
    -lore stuff
    -them telling us explicitly why the high elves don't get an archmage but the dark elves do
    -community content
    -Ghorgons
    -bug fixes that are or aren't on their radar
    -AMAs with the devs
    -AMAs with the programmers
    -AMAs with the Alan the Intern
    -blog posts on the ethics of selling a product without being transparent about what it contains
    -a "Khazrak in the Kitchen: cooking Razorgor chops" culinary special
    -mod spotlights
    -doing a live Beastmen or Skarsnik Let's Play with a Dev so they can look at us with a straight face and say "this is working as intended"
    -painting minis with Alan the Intern
    -AMAs with Ghorgon
    -and more

    Mostly just so that we can see what the WH team is up to, as many of us think it's been defunct or a skeleton crew
    Your list mocks itself. My point is proven.
    It really isn't, but a bunch of people telling you that your opinion isn't fact hasn't changed your mind yet. And as for Paradox cranking out the DLC's, as someone else pointed out above, their release schedules were less aggressive than Total War Warhammer 1 so not really seeing the argument there. They sell more DLC overall, but that's because they support their games for much longer and I can't see how that's a bad idea. If you don't want to keep playing the game then don't, but don't try and shut down DLC for all of the people happily buying it.

    It's an extremely rare opinion on these forums that CA shouldn't support the WH games for longer with more content. And don't worry, you'll contradict yourself soon enough and when someone points it out you'll pout and say that it either never happened or it doesn't matter. Feel free to contact the moderators to get whatever posts you don't like deleted as you are wont to do.
    SiWI: "no they just hate you and I don't blame them."
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    edited September 2018

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    Dude come on, you have to see the irony in this. PDX games are well-liked and well-reviewed. The warhammer TW series has been well-liked and well-reviewed. Both of them, as you say, have a business model involving "mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit." That's unfortunately the state of the market in 2018. However, this isn't an argument about the DLC practices; I am assuming you read the OP since you have been so kind to mention to your detractors when they've been off-topic. This is an argument about community communication and transparency, which CA engages in objectively less of than PDX. It's documented, the sources are readily available. The OP thinks CA should learn from them. I agree
    Fair points.

    The main reason CA shouldn't be like Paradox is because context is -like my little brother Kong- king.

    As I've said I'm quite happy to say CA can, and should communicate better. That should come in the form of openness, telling us when things are coming, and revealing what they are sooner.

    What it shouldn't be is in the mould of Paradox. Paradox release DLC far more regularly than CA. There's no way to stretch a single DLC into 16 weekly blogs. Nor would that be effective. Tell us when it's in the works, tell us when it'll be announced and then start the hype a month before. EZ.
    It doesn't need to be information about the DLC. It could involve things like:
    -balancing team discussions
    -changes being made to old races
    -lore stuff
    -them telling us explicitly why the high elves don't get an archmage but the dark elves do
    -community content
    -Ghorgons
    -bug fixes that are or aren't on their radar
    -AMAs with the devs
    -AMAs with the programmers
    -AMAs with the Alan the Intern
    -blog posts on the ethics of selling a product without being transparent about what it contains
    -a "Khazrak in the Kitchen: cooking Razorgor chops" culinary special
    -mod spotlights
    -doing a live Beastmen or Skarsnik Let's Play with a Dev so they can look at us with a straight face and say "this is working as intended"
    -painting minis with Alan the Intern
    -AMAs with Ghorgon
    -and more

    Mostly just so that we can see what the WH team is up to, as many of us think it's been defunct or a skeleton crew
    Your list mocks itself. My point is proven.
    It really isn't, but a bunch of people telling you that your opinion isn't fact hasn't changed your mind yet. And as for Paradox cranking out the DLC's, as someone else pointed out above, their release schedules were less aggressive than Total War Warhammer 1 so not really seeing the argument there. They sell more DLC overall, but that's because they support their games for much longer and I can't see how that's a bad idea. If you don't want to keep playing the game then don't, but don't try and shut down DLC for all of the people happily buying it.

    It's an extremely rare opinion on these forums that CA shouldn't support the WH games for longer with more content. And don't worry, you'll contradict yourself soon enough and when someone points it out you'll pout and say that it either never happened or it doesn't matter. Feel free to contact the moderators to get whatever posts you don't like deleted as you are wont to do.
    What makes you think I think my opinions are undisputed facts? They're opinions, that's not how opinions work. You can tell it's not a fact because it's a stated opinion, not a fact. Regardless this isn't the place for that discussion.

    Don't assign me views. Nowhere have I said I want less support, or less content. I've simply pointed out that the Paradox model doesn't work for TWW. That's my point here.

    In future keep any and all personal remarks out of your commentary and respond to points I have made.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • steam_164510928748qF8o2besteam_164510928748qF8o2be Registered Users Posts: 1,766
    edited September 2018
    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.

    ofc they have made good dlcs to, but that dosent excusse them for charging money for 3d models that i could have done better myself in a week.

    look at the content that comes wich each warhammer dlc, the complexity and poly count of the models, and the depth of the mechanic. and compare it to paradox portrait and cosmetic skins dlc.

    portraits and skins of units should have been a part of thier larger dlcs, but they split them up to make more money. CA dont do that.

    im saying this couse you trying to make paradox look in a better light then creative assembly. so i need to put you down to the ground and show you the wrong of your ways.

    im not saying paradox is greedy. im just saying they arent better or worse.

  • WarlockeWarlocke Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,083
    Yekdo21 said:

    Warlocke said:

    Yekdo21 said:

    That sounds terrible. I don't want meaningless fluff, if there's news give me news, if not don't. Simple.

    What exactly is meaningless fluff in those dev diaries?

    Paradox blogs are so numerous because they are a publisher as well as a developer and deal with many games and even their Paradox interactive titles are so riddled with tiny DLC's they need to constantly market them.

    So no.

    Dev diaries is not purely marketing, They even do it for free updates.

    My point is. I want some updates. And they should keep in touch with their players more.
    FLC is in itself a marketing strategy. Companies don’t update games for free without expecting to gain something for their work.
    Lol i really dont understand how can people so annoyed when somebody simply asks for more updated information.

    I never said make dlc every month but at least monthly or weekly let us know what the hell is going on. Once Grace said something like ‘we have different teams, unless you dont believe it’ showing her frustration. Well its because we dont have damn clue what the hell is going on. Leaks, secret contents are in the past. Players wants to get involved and feel more included
    Was that addressed at me? I’m not annoyed by anything here.

    ò_ó
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    edited September 2018
    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.

    ofc they have made good dlcs to, but that dosent excusse them for charging money for 3d models that i could have done better myself in a week.

    look at the content that comes wich each warhammer dlc, the complexity and poly count of the models, and the depth of the mechanic. and compare it to paradox portrait and cosmetic skins dlc.

    portraits and skins of units should have been a part of thier larger dlcs, but they split them up to make more money. CA dont do that.

    im saying this couse you trying to make paradox look in a better light then creative assembly. so i need to put you down to the ground and show you the wrong of your ways.

    im not saying paradox is greedy. im just saying they arent better or worse.
    You are right.

    Thing is those micro DLC's is why they can have such regular updates. They're always trying to shift DLC.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038
    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
  • SiWI#8629SiWI#8629 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 12,014
    Xenos7 said:

    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
    this is a bit rich...
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038
    SiWI said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
    this is a bit rich...
    What's your problem with that?
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    Xenos7 said:

    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
    Yet you're pushing for CA to sell more DLC.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • DarkLordDDarkLordD Registered Users Posts: 2,579
    Some folks say ; if there isn't news, say nothing.

    I see it a tiny bit different. I also feel that disappointment when I log in and hope for some news and there is nothing, I would lie if I say I don't.

    Anyways, in my eyes C.A. could also be better in there communication part. If there is no news maybe nice quizzes, Nice quotes, anything to keep the communication part between customer and producer up and running.

    I dare say this would improve relations with the customers and developers A LOT. That way we will all be a bit more patient and forgivable if something takes a while.

    So yes, I agree. Better communication is kind of key in my eyes.
    Dark Lord D the Fearsome (I) ~~~ First Dark Lord of the Old World.

    --~~ let them hate me as long as they fear me ------------------------- Gaius Julius Caesar Augustus Germanicus, Roman Emperor
  • SiWI#8629SiWI#8629 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 12,014
    DarkLordD said:

    Some folks say ; if there isn't news, say nothing.

    I see it a tiny bit different. I also feel that disappointment when I log in and hope for some news and there is nothing, I would lie if I say I don't.

    Anyways, in my eyes C.A. could also be better in there communication part. If there is no news maybe nice quizzes, Nice quotes, anything to keep the communication part between customer and producer up and running.

    I dare say this would improve relations with the customers and developers A LOT. That way we will all be a bit more patient and forgivable if something takes a while.

    So yes, I agree. Better communication is kind of key in my eyes.

    They do a little bit of that on they twitter (today with how motion capturing works).

    Grace one had a series with developer interview which never got far... maybe it could be revive?
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • Reeks#2417Reeks#2417 Registered Users Posts: 10,378
    Hmm is VG truly a bot, me starting to think so!



    Nurgle is love

    Nurgle is life

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  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USARegistered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 23,787
    Game industry discussion now. Moved to Chat.
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  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7 said:

    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
    Yet you're pushing for CA to sell more DLC.
    We've already had this discussion, and I already explained you why asking for more is qualitatively different from asking for less. I care not about what specific race or unit CA sells, I just want them to sell *something*.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    edited September 2018
    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Brakier said:

    Enforest said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Madae said:

    Whatever CA does, never ever adopt the paradox DLC model for god's sake.

    I always find these comments hilarious. The reason there is so much DLC for Paradox games is because they typically try to expand the life of their game well past its release date by releasing new content to keep it interesting, whereas most games these days are released, get a DLC pass a few times, and then get dropped for the next big thing. When is the last time you saw a DLC for Shogun 2? Oh, right.....

    FYI, Shogun 2 and Crusader Kings 2 were released about a year apart, and CK2 is still one of their most played games, which I'm sure has nothing to do with the constant updates and content (snarky smiley face)...

    And if it just so happens to be about that oh so lame excuse "they nickle and dime you!", then I have news for you, buddy; they work for a living, and if you want them to keep making content, they need to be paid for it. It's a business, not a charity. Forego that next cheeseburger and eat some ramen, there's your money.

    Additionally, Paradox has sales for their games with ALL of their DLC for a well below reasonable price often enough to make these comments stink of entitlement.
    I've been playing since CK1 sir smuglord. I don't WANT them zombifying old games far past their lifespan and churning out 200 bucks worth of endless DLCs with random, seemingly-unrelated features locked behind DLCs. CK2 and EU4 are both bloated messes and if you don't keep current with dev diaries and leave the game for a while it's a pain to figure what DLCs do or which you should buy. Knock that crap off and just release new games.
    Their policy is very simple: they keep doing DLC as long as people keep buying them. If people buy them then it means they like the game being expanded for years in every possible way. There is a demand, the developer meets it. CA should definitely do that.
    I'd rather they focus on making good games.
    PDX games are good games, as confirmed by sales, critics and customers ratings. Vanilla Gorilla opinion is not a comparable metric.
    Sure, if you want to pay full price for a game then pay for a bunch of DLC. Still, I'd rather a company focus on making good games rather than mindlessly making dlc as long as it spins a profit.
    You've just described TWW 1. And frankly, nobody here complains about its enormous amount of DLCs.
    no he describe EU 4, they charge people for portraits, cosmetic skins even the ingame music "yes to get other music ingame". thier focus is microtransaction in micro dlc forms.
    So what's the problem? Never purchased a single music DLC for any game. Still their existence is doing no harm to me, and someone likes them. Stop trying to decide what companies should sell and what people should buy.
    Yet you're pushing for CA to sell more DLC.
    We've already had this discussion, and I already explained you why asking for more is qualitatively different from asking for less. I care not about what specific race or unit CA sells, I just want them to sell *something*.
    By your logic it's bad to push for companies to do what you want unless it's what you want. Pick one. Either it's okay for people including you to push companies or it's not okay for people including you to push companies. Thinking it's okay for you to push but not others is a simple double standard.
    Post edited by Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 on
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    edited September 2018
    Repeat, delete.
    Post edited by Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 on
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    I thought everyone was joking when they said CA should do DLC like Paradox. I'd rather not pay for key game mechanics :-/
  • daelin4#9896daelin4#9896 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 16,521
    The conversation is a bit muddied because Paradox DLC is used as an example- they are, apparently, the primary source of the information given in frequent (re "weekly") updates.
    Using that logic, CA would have to do the same thing in order to generate similar levels of content to communicate to the consumer base. The problem is, what advantages does Paradox actually have in this comparison? The presumption is that Paradox is doing better because they have X and Y.

    ....but is there even proof of that? Because if not, there's no reason to replicate their strategy in the first place. If there's a lesson, it's to NOT do any of those things.

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
  • Nyxilis#3646Nyxilis#3646 Registered Users Posts: 7,726
    There are plenty of companies ies that straight up tell the dlc coming or keep hidden but talk about their game all the time. Those games also end up with a lot more minor bug fixes because they frequently communicate with their gamers. Even if it's not outright saying what's coming.

    They also tend to avoid the whole oops, what do you mean you'd rather have rosters than minicampaigns? Even without saying what's coming they could have still gotten a clue on that.

    Communication here is low, period. And I can't fathom the weird arguement against it here. With other devout fosters a lot of good will and more understanding when things go wrong and better launched products.
  • Michael4537Michael4537 Registered Users Posts: 2,377
    Xenos7 said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Goatforce said:

    Say what you want about Paradox's DLC policy, but with Stellaris at least the free patches have been second to none, the free updates alone have made it a completely different game to what came at launch, in my opinion anyway

    I admit, Stellaris is now a different sort of garbage than it was at launch.
    Both journalists and customers on metacritic disagree with you. It's the best space strategy game on the market and I strongly suggest people to try it (also Endless Space 2, because Amplitude is great).
    Never gotten into Endless Space. I bought it off the CA/Amplitude sister-studio deal, but then spent all my time playing Total War anyway! Maybe it's because I'm not sure how everything works in it yet...
    Some mechanics (like politics) are gimmicky, but if you can handle TW, it's not much more complicated. I recommend trying it.
    Hmm... I do own and I have ten hours dumped into it. Thinking back, the biggest turn off was that I only fought about two battles in that ten hours. Don't know if I'm doing something wrong or what, but those big space battles with pretty ships was one of the biggest selling points for me.
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