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Steam: nonsense review-bombing strikes WH1 & WH2 ~ honest reaction

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Comments

  • RockNRolla92RockNRolla92 Posts: 730Registered Users
    I agree with CA's stance on this. They are under no obligation to change the game simply because a group of people disagree with part of it.

    There are far bigger problems in this world than a game adding female generals. If you disagree with it fine but there has to be a point where you accept that it's a difference of opinion and move on.
  • HoneyBunHoneyBun Senior Member Posts: 4,203Registered Users

    HoneyBun said:

    HoneyBun said:

    All in all it's a storm in a teacup. It's a bunch of losers lead by a no name youtuber. It's not going to hurt CA i n any way, all it does is mildly irk us, the fans.

    Hopefully this is the last thread on this.

    Stop.

    Don't do this. Don't pick a side. Don't be human and think the best way to solve conflict is more conflict.

    There are people on both sides. Good, wholesome human people. All with the capacity for kindness and altruism. There are no monsters and if we fight each other, the only losers are us.

    My whole life everyone has been obessed with WW2. I found it dull. But they are right. I have seen this before. 100 years ago in the 20s. People picked sides. Nazis or Communists. Each convinced they were right - both monsters.

    We need to calm down and break the circle.

    Yeah, this isn't anything nearly as serious as that. This is one group of losers upset over lies they told themselves banging their heads against the wall that is CA. That's it. There's no grand message to be had here, there's no finding mutual ground, there's nothing good here.

    And while we're at it, no, there isn't always good people on both sides.
    There is good in all people.

    I promise you.

    My message is not grand. It is boring and quiet. Fighting: hating, they are the grand message. They are attractive and cool and satisfying.

    Peace? Peace is dull. Choose peace.
    What I don't like about that attitude is it serves to justify people who act badly. What's worse is it encourages this moral ambivalence where every side gets to claim they're in the right. It's not the case. Most of the time one time is acting badly and should be told so. Tip toeing around and pretending everyone is equally to blame only serves to embolden those at fault.
    I trust @dge1 will close this thread when ever he notices it. I trust and respect him.

    I am 'slightly' pushing things because I have long valued you as a person and I want to reach out to you now.

    I am old. So is DGE. He can tell you that policing the behavior of other humans is a thankless task. It is not as fun as you might think. My 'attitude' does not 'justify' any behavior. That is just wrong. My attitude is to review the behavior, and try if possible to stop it if it is bad.

    Part of being as old and wrinkly as DGE and I are (I am definitely better looking) is to realise this.

    All sides are 'in the right' because all sides are flesh and blood humans trying to make their way through being alive. More communication: less condemnation.

    They are making an FPS. Who knew a company could have a mid-life crisis ...

  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USAPosts: 18,017Registered Users, Moderators, Knights
    Folks. leaving this thread here for now. Don't forget the Forum T&C when making your comments. Thanks.
    "The two most common things in the universe are Hydrogen and Stupidity." - Harlan Ellison
    "The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously." - Hubert H. Humphrey
    "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin
  • vintagepurplevintagepurple Posts: 617Registered Users
    The thing is, there is no functional communication to be had with alt-right trolls like this- they aren't operating rationally and they aren't interested in communicating in good faith.

    You can ignore them, and no doubt they deserve respect as human beings, but provoking people into engaging with their diatribe is their goal. They're trolls.


  • HoneyBunHoneyBun Senior Member Posts: 4,203Registered Users

    The thing is, there is no functional communication to be had with alt-right trolls like this- they aren't operating rationally and they aren't interested in communicating in good faith.

    You can ignore them, and no doubt they deserve respect as human beings, but provoking people into engaging with their diatribe is their goal. They're trolls.


    Look, ten thousand years ago we learned how to farm. That meant we had more food than we needed.

    Since then we have just been inventing ways to occupy the extra time we used to spend trying to get food.

    I like gaming. So do most of us here. Politics/Fighting, is much less fun.

    They are making an FPS. Who knew a company could have a mid-life crisis ...

  • Whiskeyjack_5691Whiskeyjack_5691 Posts: 1,975Registered Users
    HoneyBun, as much as I can understand where you're coming from, I'm with VanillaGorilla, Canuovea and VintagePurple on this. I'm sure Dge1 knows it too; being a forum moderator, he's probably seen plenty of it.

    It's the internet. Few, if any, listen to reason. Fewer still listen to facts if it doesn't align with what they think they know. Really, none of those types even care. It doesn't matter about who's right or wrong to them.

    Even if Arch, OneAngryGamer, and this alt-right site all miraculously stood up tomorrow and said "we got a lot of stuff about this wrong and we apologize", there's still going to be a **** tonne of people who will just bombard the steam page with negative reviews and attack the community manager, and still rattle off the same baseless statements.

    The only positive thing in this (if any) is that most of them will (hopefully) just move on to the next thing on the internet to rant about, and this non-story will be forgotten about and we can all get back to playing some goddamn video games.
  • CaffynatedCaffynated Member Posts: 1,071Registered Users
    This was a nontroversy until CA stuck their foot in their mouth. What on Earth possessed you to get uppity and attack your own customers?



    Jesus, man/woman/other. What were you thinking?

    Wolfenstein's sales tanked by half from the previous game after they went down this road.

    Battlefield 5 pre-orders are lagging 85% behind Call of Duty's after they attacked their fans.

    Foolish is the strongest word that the forum will let me use, but frankly, this deserves a much stronger term. The only advice I will give you is to just get off social media if you can't handle it in a sensible fashion. Don't destroy the only company making historical wargames with decent (barely) battles.


  • Whiskeyjack_5691Whiskeyjack_5691 Posts: 1,975Registered Users
    edited September 2018
    And I just want to chime in here about the "mod it or don't play" comment.

    People are comparing this to what EA said, but the context is completely different.

    The original thread that started this got nasty. I mean, really nasty. It was abandoned for about 2 months, before people started it up again. Then they started shouting racial slurs, saying stuff like "women in this period were only used for (fill in the BLANK yourself)". These guys were literally the basest internet trolls just trying to get a rise out of people, and probably didn't even care about the original topic.

    They were warned numerous times before the community manager locked the thread. It was then that she said "mod it out or don't play" if they disliked female characters that much.
    This wasn't an Executive Vice President calling his company's players "uneducated" for not liking the addition of female characters to a game. This was a Community Manager responding to some really nasty comments from a handful of internet trolls.

    To me, she's entirely justified in that response. Sure, she could have chosen her words better, but honestly, who among us hasn't eventually been baited by internet trolls in our lives? Especially when part of her job is to trawl through this kind of filth every day and try and clean it up somehow. I sure as hell couldn't do that for a living and remain the consummate professional 24/7.

    This all happened 6 or 7 weeks ago, and nobody even considered it worth bothering about until Arch picked it up a few days ago and started off. Hell, even his own viewers have started saying he got a lot of details wrong, didn't do any research into the context of the comment, filled in the blanks with his own political commentary, went way off the rails with it, and now "looks like an uninformed idiot" (his viewers' words, not mine).

    Look, if you don't believe me, just look up any of the dozen or so articles that have popped up in recent days. Read through the original thread; it's still in the Steam forums.
    Post edited by Whiskeyjack_5691 on
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Posts: 3,124Registered Users
    I won't take credit but this was posted by someone called Welsh Dragon:

    Here's a rundown.

    1. Back in March, CA added female Important Characters to the game in an update. (Important Characters are those that can serve as Generals, Admirals or Politicians.) In many factions (Rome, Carthage, Hellenic/Greek except Egypt, Eastern) the female Important Characters can only take part in the political and family parts of the game. They can never lead an Army or Navy. In others they can also be generals/admirals, based on their culture/history. (Barbarians because of people like Boudicca, Egypt because of their Queens such as Cleopatra, Masaesyli because they're Nomads and Kush because it's kind of their "hat.")

    The spawn rates for female characters was (and still is) fairly low. Kush it's 50%, other factions which can have Female Generals it's 10-15%, and factions who can't have Female Generals it's something like 6% (and they can never be Generals.)

    2. In August, CA released another update (Ancestral Update) which added family tree, political intrigues etc. This also added the family tree retroactively to campaigns people had which were already in progress.

    One of the effects of this was that spouses of Important Characters now themselves became Important Characters (having previously only represented them with a "card" on the Important Character's details.)

    Reason this is important, is that if you loaded an old save, the game had to turn all those wife and husband "cards" into Important Characters. So if I was playing say Egypt, and I had 5 married male Generals before the update, when I loaded after the update I'd now have 5 new female Important Characters (the wives.) And because Egypt can have female Generals, they will all also appear as possible choices whenever I appoint a General.

    So it appeared that peoples campaigns were being flooded with new female characters, when in actual fact they'd been there all along, just in a different form.

    3. Because of this, as well as there being new ways to create characters (male or female) such as the Seek Spouse political intrigue, people started seeing more female characters appearing in the campaigns.

    4. Someone shared a screenshot which "appeared" to show them only having the option to recruit female Generals. I say "appeared" because if you play and are familiar with the game you can clearly see they have more than the 5 candidates they are showing and at least one male candidate. Also if you read what they wrote about how they were playing, that's also likely a contributing factor. Finally, as randomness and probility are involved, you end up with results that are on the extreme ends of the range. Just because Player A ends up with 5 female candidates, doesn't mean Player B isn't going to have 5 male candidates under the same conditions, and Players C through Z will mostly end up somewhere in between.

    5. Also around this time there were a spate of threads about female leaders, almost all of which quickly devolved into insults and namecalling, escalating to some particularly nasty stuff, often by the same small group of people.

    CA Ella and other moderators handled this in a professional manner, warning them and ultimately some bans were handed out, to people who had repeatedly or very seriously violated the Steam Rules we all agreed to when we joined the forums. Despite what some have claimed, from what I saw (as I was following those discussions) nobody was banned for objecting female leaders, only for violating the Steam rules due to their abusive language (and in some cases saying they were going to aquire the games in a non-legal fashion in future, which is a straight ban by the Steam Rules.)

    Threads about the topic which had not devolved like this, and people who had expressed their opinions on it without violating the Steam Rules weren't locked/banned.

    6. On August 13th (more than six weeks ago!,) after yet another one of these threads had gone exactly the same way, with more insults, namecalling, abusive language etc CA Ella locked the thread with the following:

    "This thread is a mess so I'm locking it (and bans have been issued for those who repeatedly violated Steam community guidelines).

    As has been said previously: Total War games are historically authentic, not historically accurate - if having female units upsets you that much you can either mod them out or just not play."

    Source: https://steamcommunity.com/app/214950/discussions/0/1698293068433895118/?ctp=8#c1746720717351059516

    The final parts been quoted a lot in isolation, but I think it's worth keeping in mind the context of it, as well as the fact it was directed at a small group of people not the entire community.

    Also note that the authentic vs accurate quote comes from an article released in 2013 before Rome 2 was even released: https://www.pcgamesn.com/totalwar/placing-authenticity-over-accuracy-total-war-rome-ii

    It's also worth noting this got barely any attention at the time.

    7. In the past week, a Youtuber (ArchWarhammer,) a gaming blog (OneAngryGamer,) and a far-right website (The Daily Stormer,) all did pieces about the addition of female leaders (often getting the facts wrong,) the screenshot (again getting the facts wrong and in some cases cropping it to be just the female candidates) and CA Ella's post (without the context.)

    8. Over the weekend we suddenly saw on Steam and some other forums a rush of people complaining about the female leaders (which had been in the game for 6 months,) the current patch (which had been out for 6 weeks,) about CA Ella's post (from 6 weeks ago,) and such a huge spike in negative reviews that it actually triggered Steam's mechanism for alerting people to a possible review bombing.

    9. Finally yesterday (September 25th,) CA released an official response:

    https://steamcommunity.com/app/214950/discussions/0/1735465524721186900/

    ***

    So that's basically it.

    I've tried to keep this as unbiased as possible, but I think it's only fair to state that I personally like the way CA has implemented female leaders, and the only real issue I have with CA Ella's post is she forgot to mention you can also roll back the game to an earlier patch using the Betas tab.

    Hope that helps.

    All the Best,

    Welsh Dragon.
  • FranzSaxonFranzSaxon Posts: 2,357Registered Users
    Christ people , can we stop talking about this stupid **** already. Don't waste anymore thoughts or oxygen on these people. Its a **** video game. There's no justification for the way they are acting. Its a video game. There's people that are forced into sex slavery and that are starving literally to death. And people argue about this garbage. Lets move on , stfu and wait for our DLC
  • CrajohCrajoh Member Posts: 1,303Registered Users

    HoneyBun said:

    HoneyBun said:

    All in all it's a storm in a teacup. It's a bunch of losers lead by a no name youtuber. It's not going to hurt CA i n any way, all it does is mildly irk us, the fans.

    Hopefully this is the last thread on this.

    Stop.

    Don't do this. Don't pick a side. Don't be human and think the best way to solve conflict is more conflict.

    There are people on both sides. Good, wholesome human people. All with the capacity for kindness and altruism. There are no monsters and if we fight each other, the only losers are us.

    My whole life everyone has been obessed with WW2. I found it dull. But they are right. I have seen this before. 100 years ago in the 20s. People picked sides. Nazis or Communists. Each convinced they were right - both monsters.

    We need to calm down and break the circle.

    Yeah, this isn't anything nearly as serious as that. This is one group of losers upset over lies they told themselves banging their heads against the wall that is CA. That's it. There's no grand message to be had here, there's no finding mutual ground, there's nothing good here.

    And while we're at it, no, there isn't always good people on both sides.
    There is good in all people.

    I promise you.

    My message is not grand. It is boring and quiet. Fighting: hating, they are the grand message. They are attractive and cool and satisfying.

    Peace? Peace is dull. Choose peace.
    What I don't like about that attitude is it serves to justify people who act badly. What's worse is it encourages this moral ambivalence where every side gets to claim they're in the right. It's not the case. Most of the time one time is acting badly and should be told so. Tip toeing around and pretending everyone is equally to blame only serves to embolden those at fault.
    Yea but the caution is not to act badly on both sides. A lot of good people die when two sides think they are right. Hold the moral high ground. Of course in TW the moral high ground doesn’t help, much better to hold a warp thrower
    Live your life and try to do no harm.

    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Evelyn Beatrice Hall
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    What's happened here is:

    Triggered people: "You increased the number of females you SJW'S!"
    CA: "No, the rate's exactly the same as it has been for months, don't like it then mod it out"
    Triggered people: "I don't like how you said that! Now I'm mad at how you spoke to me!"

    These people were always going to jump onto whatever they could to attempt to justify their upset.
    HoneyBun said:

    HoneyBun said:

    HoneyBun said:

    All in all it's a storm in a teacup. It's a bunch of losers lead by a no name youtuber. It's not going to hurt CA i n any way, all it does is mildly irk us, the fans.

    Hopefully this is the last thread on this.

    Stop.

    Don't do this. Don't pick a side. Don't be human and think the best way to solve conflict is more conflict.

    There are people on both sides. Good, wholesome human people. All with the capacity for kindness and altruism. There are no monsters and if we fight each other, the only losers are us.

    My whole life everyone has been obessed with WW2. I found it dull. But they are right. I have seen this before. 100 years ago in the 20s. People picked sides. Nazis or Communists. Each convinced they were right - both monsters.

    We need to calm down and break the circle.

    Yeah, this isn't anything nearly as serious as that. This is one group of losers upset over lies they told themselves banging their heads against the wall that is CA. That's it. There's no grand message to be had here, there's no finding mutual ground, there's nothing good here.

    And while we're at it, no, there isn't always good people on both sides.
    There is good in all people.

    I promise you.

    My message is not grand. It is boring and quiet. Fighting: hating, they are the grand message. They are attractive and cool and satisfying.

    Peace? Peace is dull. Choose peace.
    What I don't like about that attitude is it serves to justify people who act badly. What's worse is it encourages this moral ambivalence where every side gets to claim they're in the right. It's not the case. Most of the time one time is acting badly and should be told so. Tip toeing around and pretending everyone is equally to blame only serves to embolden those at fault.
    I trust @dge1 will close this thread when ever he notices it. I trust and respect him.

    I am 'slightly' pushing things because I have long valued you as a person and I want to reach out to you now.

    I am old. So is DGE. He can tell you that policing the behavior of other humans is a thankless task. It is not as fun as you might think. My 'attitude' does not 'justify' any behavior. That is just wrong. My attitude is to review the behavior, and try if possible to stop it if it is bad.

    Part of being as old and wrinkly as DGE and I are (I am definitely better looking) is to realise this.

    All sides are 'in the right' because all sides are flesh and blood humans trying to make their way through being alive. More communication: less condemnation.
    You're old, but me, me, I'm both a good man, and an honest man. I call a stone a stone and a loser a loser.

    This is a case of a group of triggered people who have been looking for a reason to be upset who have not finding one invented one instead. I don't see why I'd describe it as anything else as anything else would be inaccurate.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    Crajoh said:

    HoneyBun said:

    HoneyBun said:

    All in all it's a storm in a teacup. It's a bunch of losers lead by a no name youtuber. It's not going to hurt CA i n any way, all it does is mildly irk us, the fans.

    Hopefully this is the last thread on this.

    Stop.

    Don't do this. Don't pick a side. Don't be human and think the best way to solve conflict is more conflict.

    There are people on both sides. Good, wholesome human people. All with the capacity for kindness and altruism. There are no monsters and if we fight each other, the only losers are us.

    My whole life everyone has been obessed with WW2. I found it dull. But they are right. I have seen this before. 100 years ago in the 20s. People picked sides. Nazis or Communists. Each convinced they were right - both monsters.

    We need to calm down and break the circle.

    Yeah, this isn't anything nearly as serious as that. This is one group of losers upset over lies they told themselves banging their heads against the wall that is CA. That's it. There's no grand message to be had here, there's no finding mutual ground, there's nothing good here.

    And while we're at it, no, there isn't always good people on both sides.
    There is good in all people.

    I promise you.

    My message is not grand. It is boring and quiet. Fighting: hating, they are the grand message. They are attractive and cool and satisfying.

    Peace? Peace is dull. Choose peace.
    What I don't like about that attitude is it serves to justify people who act badly. What's worse is it encourages this moral ambivalence where every side gets to claim they're in the right. It's not the case. Most of the time one time is acting badly and should be told so. Tip toeing around and pretending everyone is equally to blame only serves to embolden those at fault.
    Yea but the caution is not to act badly on both sides. A lot of good people die when two sides think they are right. Hold the moral high ground. Of course in TW the moral high ground doesn’t help, much better to hold a warp thrower
    One side is acting badly, the other is not. These triggered people were looking for a reason to be upset and upon not finding it have invented one instead.

    There's nothing wrong with saying it how it is. It's dangerous when you give the people with Tiki Torches the excuse of saying there are good and bad people on both sides.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Posts: 4,259Registered Users

    This was a nontroversy until CA stuck their foot in their mouth. What on Earth possessed you to get uppity and attack your own customers?



    Jesus, man/woman/other. What were you thinking?

    Wolfenstein's sales tanked by half from the previous game after they went down this road.

    Battlefield 5 pre-orders are lagging 85% behind Call of Duty's after they attacked their fans.

    Foolish is the strongest word that the forum will let me use, but frankly, this deserves a much stronger term. The only advice I will give you is to just get off social media if you can't handle it in a sensible fashion. Don't destroy the only company making historical wargames with decent (barely) battles.


    I could not agree more. Community managers responsible for this should get a reprimand. CA representatives ought to uphold higher standards than this. There is no place for such ill behaviour in professional practice.

    Proper etiquette is everything.
    Drowned in stars, bloated we shine.
    ... .... .... --··-- -. --- - . .- .-. ... ·-·-·- --- -. .-.. -.-- -.. .-. . .- -- ... -. --- .-- ·-·-·-

  • FranzSaxonFranzSaxon Posts: 2,357Registered Users
    edited September 2018

    This was a nontroversy until CA stuck their foot in their mouth. What on Earth possessed you to get uppity and attack your own customers?



    Jesus, man/woman/other. What were you thinking?

    Wolfenstein's sales tanked by half from the previous game after they went down this road.

    Battlefield 5 pre-orders are lagging 85% behind Call of Duty's after they attacked their fans.

    Foolish is the strongest word that the forum will let me use, but frankly, this deserves a much stronger term. The only advice I will give you is to just get off social media if you can't handle it in a sensible fashion. Don't destroy the only company making historical wargames with decent (barely) battles.


    I could not agree more. Community managers responsible for this should get a reprimand. CA representatives ought to uphold higher standards than this. There is no place for such ill behaviour in professional practice.

    Proper etiquette is everything.
    Wow that's pretty pathetic lol. That was a ridiculous post by whatever staffer it was
  • FranzSaxonFranzSaxon Posts: 2,357Registered Users

    This was a nontroversy until CA stuck their foot in their mouth. What on Earth possessed you to get uppity and attack your own customers?



    Jesus, man/woman/other. What were you thinking?

    Wolfenstein's sales tanked by half from the previous game after they went down this road.

    Battlefield 5 pre-orders are lagging 85% behind Call of Duty's after they attacked their fans.

    Foolish is the strongest word that the forum will let me use, but frankly, this deserves a much stronger term. The only advice I will give you is to just get off social media if you can't handle it in a sensible fashion. Don't destroy the only company making historical wargames with decent (barely) battles.


    Crazy stuff
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Posts: 3,124Registered Users
    This is getting boring. There's only so many times you can point out context.
  • LunosLunos Member Posts: 40Registered Users
    Just let them rant and rave themselves out. The true fans will always be here supporting CA. They either leave forever and the community is better for it or they stay and buy the next TW game supporting CA. It's a win-win either way. There will always be a few noisy troublemakers, it's the internet after all. Keep up the good work CA!
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    edited September 2018
    I don't see the issue with supporting not taking money from extreme groups.

    And ultimately if customers are going the extreme route of spouting the stuff that was said in that thread then telling them to mod it out or not play is the right route. Customer service doesn't mean nodding politely as the customer spouts of extreme abuse.
    Lunos said:

    Just let them rant and rave themselves out. The true fans will always be here supporting CA. They either leave forever and the community is better for it or they stay and buy the next TW game supporting CA. It's a win-win either way. There will always be a few noisy troublemakers, it's the internet after all. Keep up the good work CA!

    It's a storm in a teacup and next week they'll find something else to be mad about while we get on the HYPE TRAIN for the next campaign pack. It's pretty good timing, this is mild entertainment for the week.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Posts: 2,856Registered Users
    Well if they are reviewing the patching policy then I can't disagree with them on that.
  • Commissar_GCommissar_G Senior Member Posts: 9,916Registered Users

    Well if they are reviewing the patching policy then I can't disagree with them on that.

    Yeah it depends whats causing people to leave negative reviews.

    No patches is awful for the consumer. Making the consumer buy DLC to get the previous one patched to a functional standard is unacceptable.

    People are just getting more and more annoyed with CA, and the quality of their game is no longer covering for the failings at this point.
    "As a sandbox game everyone, without exception, should be able to play the game exactly as they see fit and that means providing the maximum scope possible." - ~UNiOnJaCk~
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    edited September 2018

    Well if they are reviewing the patching policy then I can't disagree with them on that.

    Yeah it depends whats causing people to leave negative reviews.

    No patches is awful for the consumer. Making the consumer buy DLC to get the previous one patched to a functional standard is unacceptable.

    People are just getting more and more annoyed with CA, and the quality of their game is no longer covering for the failings at this point.
    CA doesn't make consumers pay for DLC to get patches. They release patches (which are free) with DLC.

    What's causing people to post negative reviews is obvious; first they believed lies, then when the lies where shown to be lies they clung onto the "CA didn't respond to the horrible things people said in a thread nicely enough" line. We know exactly what has happened here, and frankly none of it is CA's fault.

    I find the narrative that people are "getting more and more annoyed with CA" to be false. If anything what I've seen here over the last couple days is the community backing CA in this. The community is irked by this attack and wants to get back to its usual business of speculation, memes and complaining about the usual things.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • endikuxendikux Posts: 473Registered Users
    edited September 2018
    No good reason.. except for having the company which makes the game they have been playing for 5 years, a game most of those people truly love, tell them "if you don't like it then don't play it" when some of them raised a complaint about game settings.

    Yup. No good reason. None at all.

    And to top it off having a fellow customer call for the censorship of other customers is really despicable. The people who made those reviews paid for that game. They own that game. Most have put hundreds of hours into that game.

    You'll notice that the game had very positive reviews for years. But thousands of people, literally thousands of people, just woke up one day and said "Duh, a website is telling me not to like this game that I have played for 5 years. I guess I shouldn't like it."

    People complain about bad behavior on these forums? About keeping things civil? What exactly is calling thousands of fellow players basically idiots and trolls? That isn't mean behavior? That isn't name calling?

    Those people felt slighted. They were slighted. And they then made reviews which expressed their unhappiness with CA treating them poorly. I believe that having the company treat your poorly as a customer might qualify as legitimate criticism in a review for a game which you have paid for and played.

    Or is it only positive reviews which are allowed? Otherwise other customers will also call you names and call for you to be silenced for daring to have a voice and a opinion.
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    endikux said:

    What happened yesterday? Some dumb mortals started review-bombing WH1 and 2 without a single good reason

    ..

    Steam should remove those "reviews-not-reviews".

    No good reason.. except for having the company which makes the game they have been playing for 5 years, a game most of those people truly love, tell them "if you don't like it then don't play it" when some of them raised a complaint about game settings.

    Yup. No good reason. None at all.

    And to top it off having a fellow customer call for the censorship of other customers is really despicable. The people who made those reviews paid for that game. They own that game. Most have put hundreds of hours into that game.

    You'll notice that the game had very positive reviews for years. But thousands of people, literally thousands of people, just woke up one day and said "Duh, a website is telling me not to like this game that I have played for 5 years. I guess I shouldn't like it."

    People complain about bad behavior on these forums? About keeping things civil? What exactly is calling thousands of fellow players basically idiots and trolls? That isn't mean behavior? That isn't name calling?

    Those people felt slighted. They were slighted. And they then made reviews which expressed their unhappiness with CA treating them poorly. I believe that having the company treat your poorly as a customer might qualify as legitimate criticism in a review for a game which you have paid for and played.

    Or is it only positive reviews which are allowed? Otherwise other customers will also call you names and call for you to be silenced for daring to have a voice and a opinion.
    That's false. That response was to a thread full of horrible abuse specifically to those abusers. Yes, if you take the quote completely out of that context -like you've just done- it sounds bad, but in context it's fine.

    The anger over this comment is as fake as the anger over the fake claim of more females ingame. People are absolutely allowed to speak their mind, but there's also a right of reply. I'm absolutely allowed to look at what's happened and call it what it is; fake outrage that absolutely reeks of sexism. Customers absolutely have not been "slighted" that's just preposterous. The only way you'd be "slighted" is if you counted yourself in a group that comment was directed at, specifically the group of trolls hurling abhorrent abuse on that thread.

    As to what Steam allows and does not. As far as I see reviews that are made on false information such as saying the game has higher female spawn rates than it does, or irrelevant information such as a perceived "slight" by a community manager speaking to trolls don't have a place. Much like a positive review talking only about how awesome fairy dragons are should be deleted.

    CA shouldn't be at the mercy of groups that are looking and choosing to be offended.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • TennisgolfbollTennisgolfboll Posts: 6,813Registered Users
    DarthKa said:

    I don't think anybody knows what "nazi" means anymore, it's tossed around everytime.

    Wrong from a part of the Rome community complaining from something that wasn't true and wrong from the CA moderator who doesn't know how to do the job.



    Well said.
    Read all my replies as if we are having a pint and a good old time. I will always read your reply like that.
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    At some point if people look to be offended hard enough they'll find it. First they were offended by the false claim of females spawning at a higher rate, then they chose to be offended by a moderator reprimanding a group of trolls. That they need to falsely represent the second incident as said moderator speaking to the community and not said group of trolls demonstrates how fake this outrage is.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • endikuxendikux Posts: 473Registered Users
    Whether the female percentages were accurate or not isn't the point. People voiced a complaint, maybe that complaint was completely incorrect, at which point CA could simply have said "We will look into that."

    But they didn't say that. They said "mod it out or don't play."

    People didn't like that tone of customer interaction. They can't exactly get a refund on a 5-year old game, so they put in bad reviews as a signal to CA of their displeasure at how they were treated.

    Instead of cooling down the entire thing with some peace making, CA instead doubled down.

    Now people like you just keep the heat up by calling people trolls and other hateful things.

    You think you are being a white knight but you are doing the exact opposite. You are just keeping the anger going and fueling it even more by disparaging people. Would you like for CA to lose half it's player base because they are unworthy to play the same game as you? This attitude will only end in complete self destruction.
  • TennisgolfbollTennisgolfboll Posts: 6,813Registered Users
    The problem is so many people are hateful and bitter. This especially true for those who claim they are tolerant. They hate as much as the worst people they "combat" in their warped world view. It is ironic that those who claim tolerance are among the absolutely least tolerant people there is.
    Read all my replies as if we are having a pint and a good old time. I will always read your reply like that.
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 14,127Registered Users
    endikux said:

    Whether the female percentages were accurate or not isn't the point. People voiced a complaint, maybe that complaint was completely incorrect, at which point CA could simply have said "We will look into that."

    But they didn't say that. They said "mod it out or don't play."

    People didn't like that tone of customer interaction. They can't exactly get a refund on a 5-year old game, so they put in bad reviews as a signal to CA of their displeasure at how they were treated.

    Instead of cooling down the entire thing with some peace making, CA instead doubled down.

    Why the insistence on trying to change the context? The context was not in response to players reasonably asking for clarification as its been made out to be. The context was in response to a pack of trolls saying abhorrent things.

    Context is -like my little brother- king. The insistence on changing the context to a false one demonstrates that this outrage is in its very nature fake. If it was real then the real context would be used, instead a demonstrably false one is.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • daelin4daelin4 Senior Member Posts: 16,176Registered Users
    First thing I thought about all this was OK Ill go get this

    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1522989335

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
This discussion has been closed.