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Steam: nonsense review-bombing strikes WH1 & WH2 ~ honest reaction

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  • Maedrethnir#1968Maedrethnir#1968 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 17,371
    edited September 2018
    Yes and let me say, there's no evidence of the Byzantines ever using a magical 'stick' with an animals head on it that could throw Greek Fire. Even in the modern era flamethrowers require more than a tube.

    Game simplification.

    Not really, as even if in the case of volunteers back-chatting changes to a 'mistake', if this poor behaviour did happen it would reflect on the company if they allowed this so called bad behaviour to continue it would obviously reflect on them, how is this not obvious? However, I know that CA disagree with you and they will back their employee, so as much as you want it - not going to happen.

    Really. It would reflect on a hiring person and it would be up to them to apologise. You are generalising in baid faith to prove a crooked point. And I know they are vile for doing it.

    He's not banned for the actual comment he made in #16 as it says banned on all his other comments. also he's not said anything worse than anyone else, so it follows that his worst comments were removed. just like other who we can't see because they may have only chipped in with a comment that's worth a ban.

    He is permanently banned for multiple transgressions. It follows that this or other offence finally got him out of the forum. You assume the only bans there are, are permanent. Which is not true. If Erick and company comments were not removed, there is no reason to think other were, especially considering his post concerns women. Remember, this thread was closed on 13th of August. Plenty of time for bans to wear off.

    I'm not sure where you come from but Ella does have a right to say what she feels is right. In past cases were employees did step out of line the company made an immediate statement. This will not happen.

    I come from the Earth. She does not. It is basic etiquette. You are right, it might not happen. More reasons to loathe CA.

    What's this got to do with anything? This doesn't disprove women had important roles in this period including leading armies and navies. Physically weak men have been leaders.

    Everything. Few women in span of centuries. Prove they were actually leading them instead of being at the head of an army or navy. But I do agree with the notion of important role. Leaders usually boost morale by their very presence. Most female leaders history knows, come from the fact their male rulers died. Sure they were, taught from early days in strategy and tactics. Also I have put both physical and psychological core.
  • KronusXKronusX Registered Users Posts: 2,464

    If you ever heard someone from customer service tell you ''if you are not happy with our services, you can go with a different bank/provider/etc'', I can guarantee you that this person would be fired not too long after.

    If people are speaking to each other or employees in a way that would get them banned from the company website about something that is painfully unimportant I can guarantee they wouldn't.

    But we are not employees, neither is reddit. The people on reddit do NOT work for CA, CA Ella does though. CA Ella is a community manager giving information back to the players, aka the costumers. She is the employee, the reddit joes posting are not. Painfully unimportant? Perhaps to you, but not to the other customers.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    edited October 2018
    Game simplification

    So with no sense of irony you're saying that females appearing in factions that had female leaders is more acceptable than a medieval soldier using a flamethrower? Stunning.

    Really. It would reflect on a hiring person and it would be up to them to apologise. You are generalising in baid faith to prove a crooked point. And I know they are vile for doing it.

    No, I'm using real world examples and applying them to your example, you're the one applying a simple idea to every context. Vile? How very dramatic, it's funny you didn't describe the threats Ella got as vile.. weird.

    I come from the Earth. She does not. It is basic etiquette. You are right, it might not happen. More reasons to loathe CA.

    Yes and it's someone's right to say something within the scope of her job whether you agree with it or not. Please don't go on about basic etiquette considering some of the trolls who feel oh so threatened about female leaders and females telling them things they don't want to hear (bless them). Loathe? More drama, I remember in novels were evil people were loathed who had done great wrongs, now apparently great wrongs involve.. Mod or don't play.. wow.

    Everything. Few women in span of centuries. Prove they were actually leading them instead of being at the head of an army or navy. But I do agree with the notion of important role. Leaders usually boost morale by their very presence. Most female leaders history knows, come from the fact their male rulers died. Sure they were, taught from early days in strategy and tactics. Also I have put both physical and psychological core.

    It's interesting I have to prove that women specifically leading rather than the head of the navy or army. Most male leaders come from male leaders dying, that's how it usually works, one ruler dies and a family member takes over.



    A few examples.

    Artemisia - She ruled the area around Halicarnassis and was an ally of Xerxes. In battle she commanded a squadron of 5 ships. She was most well known for very wisely telling Xerxes that attacking the Greek navy at Salamis was a stupid plan. In the battle she was by far the most effective Persian commander, prompting Xerxes to note 'my men have become women, and my women have become men' Source: Herodotus.

    Boudicca - I'm sure you've heard of her but if you haven't she was the leader of the Iceni tribe in Britannia and led troops to raze many Roman cities including London and Colchester. Source: Cassius Dio, Tacitus.

    Cleopatra VII - The last pharoah of Egypt. She commanded the Egyptian navy as well as being a great politician (though not as great as Octavian obviously). Egypt generally had a lot of prominant women. Do note that there were 6 pharoahs named Cleopatra before her. Source: Appian of Alexandria, Julius Caesar.

    Olympias of Macedonia - The mother of Alexander the Great, who ruled Macedon after his death before dying in the wars of succession after winning a couple of battles. Source: Plutarch

    Arsinoe II - She was the Queen of Thrace and the Pharoah of Egypt in the early 3rd century BC. She ruled Thrace independently after she killed her Thracian husband, but fled to Egypt when she heard that said husband's friends had raised an army. Once in Egypt she married her brother Ptolomy II and became Pharoah. She was also a chariot racing champion. Source: Posidippus of Pella, Pausanias.

    Julia Domna - The wife of Septimus Severus, her power outlived her husband. The emperor Caracalla requested her guidance on campaigns and she was known as 'Mother of the Camp' - a sign that the men looked up to her. She committed suicide after the army she was with was defeated by the Parthians. Source: Cassius Dio.

    Julia Mamaea - Empress Regent of Rome and Julia Soaemias' sister. When Alexander Severus was installed after Julia Soaemias' son messed everything up, he was a minor. The senate and Praetorian Guard turned to his mother, Julia Mamaea, to rule in his place. She continued to rule even when Alexander grew up, because he totally relied on her for advice. She was praised for bringing stability to an empire on the brink of disintegration. When she died along with her son, that stability ended and the Third Century Crisis began. Source: Cassius Dio.

    Zenobia

    Livia Drusilla - The wife of Augustus and mother of Tiberius. When Tiberius became emperor he found himself being debated and sometimes overruled by this woman. In fact, he became so frustrated at her desire to control politics that Tibierius left her to it and moved off to Capri for a few years! Source: Tacitus, Suetonius.

    Agrippina the Younger - The great-granddaughter of Livia. She was to Nero as Livia was to Tiberius. Nero got so annoyed at people seeking her advice instead of his that he tried to drown her, and then had her beaten with clubs in an alley when that didn't work. Source: Tacitus, Suetonius, Cassius Dio.

    We also have Tacitus' Germania, an ethnographic survey of the Germanic tribes. In chapter 7 he discussed how women would sometimes accompany their husbands on campaign, usually just as camp followers, but they did sometimes fight. He also noted that leadership was done on merit rather than through birth, and that gender was nowhere near as important to them as it was to Romans. He also noted that Nordic tribes were typically ruled by women.

    Post edited by davedave1124#4773 on
  • Nyxilis#3646Nyxilis#3646 Registered Users Posts: 7,726
    Come up with weapon.... yeah, your getting pretty rich here. There is no psychological core, it's pixels on a screen. Unless your just of the end assertion 6hat females can't be soldiers and that just bothers you right down to your core. Pfffft haha.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    But we are not employees, neither is reddit. The people on reddit do NOT work for CA, CA Ella does though. CA Ella is a community manager giving information back to the players, aka the costumers. She is the employee, the reddit joes posting are not. Painfully unimportant? Perhaps to you, but not to the other customers.


    Professional companies will support their staff first especially if their staff did nothing to get excited about. If they'd have been face to face with her very few would've mouthed off like they do behind their computer screen. I'm sorry, but the management in Sega and CA know a little more about their own rules on customer interaction than the average angry man on the internet. Ella will not get into trouble for this, I'm pretty sure she will be backed up.
  • Maedrethnir#1968Maedrethnir#1968 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 17,371
    edited September 2018
    So with now sense of irony you're saying that females appearing in factions that had female leaders is more acceptable than a medieval soldier using a flamethrower? Stunning.

    Yes.


    No, I'm using real world examples and applying them to your example, you're the one applying a simple idea to every context. Vile? How very dramatic, it's funny you didn't describe the threats Ella got as vile.. weird.


    Because it is simple. Official representatives and volunteers fall under vastly different level of scrutiny. Yes, vile. I have described those threats as wrong. That is enough.

    Yes and it's someone's right to say something within the scope of her job whether you agree with it or not. Please don't go on about basic etiquette considering some of the trolls who feel oh so threatened about female leaders and females telling them things they don't want to hear (bless them). Loathe? More drama, I remember in novels were evil people were loathed who had done great wrongs, now apparently great wrongs involve.. Mod or don't play.. wow.

    I agree, it's someone's right to say something within the scope of their job. But it wasn't within it. It was very much outside of it. Basic etiquette 101 breach. Yes, loathe. Now apparently great wrongs involve passive aggressive and politically charged jabs that later evolve into political statements.


    It's interesting I have to prove that women specifically leading rather than the head of the navy or army. Most male leaders come from male leaders dying, that's how it usually works, one ruler dies and a family member takes over.

    Yes, with the exception that males were trained into leading position from youth. Women were not. Given examples are cute but prove nothing. Both male and female figureheads were guided by other men. Every leader has council/advisors, male council/advisors 99% of the time. Not to mention in some places it is pure propaganda. But that is irrelevant considering all things.

    Nyxilis said:

    Come up with weapon.... yeah, your getting pretty rich here. There is no psychological core, it's pixels on a screen. Unless your just of the end assertion 6hat females can't be soldiers and that just bothers you right down to your core. Pfffft haha.

    There is. As for the rest, I will respect sanctity of this thread and leave a suggestive emote :smile:
    Post edited by Maedrethnir#1968 on
  • KronusXKronusX Registered Users Posts: 2,464

    But we are not employees, neither is reddit. The people on reddit do NOT work for CA, CA Ella does though. CA Ella is a community manager giving information back to the players, aka the costumers. She is the employee, the reddit joes posting are not. Painfully unimportant? Perhaps to you, but not to the other customers.


    Professional companies will support their staff first especially if their staff did nothing to get excited about. If they'd have been face to face with her very few would've mouthed off like they do behind their computer screen. I'm sorry, but the management in Sega and CA know a little more about their own rules on customer interaction than the average angry man on the internet. Ella will not get into trouble for this, I'm pretty sure she will be backed up.

    I am sure they do, but it does not always mean they are right. DAI inquisition had obvious example of pandering and it was backed by the company, same for ME:Andromeda.

    As for management in Sega and CA, considering their complete silence on Warhammer news and the announcement of a 3K DLC 6 months in advance, I seriously doubt that they know much about their own rules on anything, let alone customer interaction.
  • WarlockeWarlocke Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,083
    edited October 2018
    dge1 said:

    Everyone needs to lighten up a little.

    Sage advice.

    I don’t think anybody is going to change anybody’s mind at this point. If you just want an excuse to be contentious then have it, but this whole thread seems to be a profitless enterprise.
    ò_ó
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    KronusX said:

    If you ever heard someone from customer service tell you ''if you are not happy with our services, you can go with a different bank/provider/etc'', I can guarantee you that this person would be fired not too long after.

    If people are speaking to each other or employees in a way that would get them banned from the company website about something that is painfully unimportant I can guarantee they wouldn't.

    But we are not employees, neither is reddit. The people on reddit do NOT work for CA, CA Ella does though. CA Ella is a community manager giving information back to the players, aka the costumers. She is the employee, the reddit joes posting are not. Painfully unimportant? Perhaps to you, but not to the other customers.
    Just because someone is in customer service does not mean they must put up with abuse. The thread this comes from was full of abuse. Ella was absolutely right to tell these trolls to mod it out or not play.

    People are trying to make it sound like she was speaking to the community as a whole but she simply wasn't. Even if she was it doesn't justify the reaction. The fact that she wasn't speaking to them makes the reaction which includes people wishing violence on her is frankly appalling.

    This whole incident is fake. There's simply nothing real about it. The initial incident was fake, and the upset over Ellas comment is fake.
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • Maedrethnir#1968Maedrethnir#1968 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 17,371

    KronusX said:

    If you ever heard someone from customer service tell you ''if you are not happy with our services, you can go with a different bank/provider/etc'', I can guarantee you that this person would be fired not too long after.

    If people are speaking to each other or employees in a way that would get them banned from the company website about something that is painfully unimportant I can guarantee they wouldn't.

    But we are not employees, neither is reddit. The people on reddit do NOT work for CA, CA Ella does though. CA Ella is a community manager giving information back to the players, aka the costumers. She is the employee, the reddit joes posting are not. Painfully unimportant? Perhaps to you, but not to the other customers.
    Just because someone is in customer service does not mean they must put up with abuse. The thread this comes from was full of abuse. Ella was absolutely right to tell these trolls to mod it out or not play.

    People are trying to make it sound like she was speaking to the community as a whole but she simply wasn't. Even if she was it doesn't justify the reaction. The fact that she wasn't speaking to them makes the reaction which includes people wishing violence on her is frankly appalling.

    This whole incident is fake. There's simply nothing real about it. The initial incident was fake, and the upset over Ellas comment is fake.
    Of course not, they can issue a warning/ban or lock a thread. But they have no right to talk back. Sure, I agree, those comments did not observe steam rules and guidelines. But it was an itsy bitsy ilk of abuse. Everybody has a chance to read it: https://steamcommunity.com/app/214950/discussions/0/1698293068433895118/

    She was speaking to the community. CA_Ella copy/paste this comment in more than one post which proves it was not aimed at the participants of the first thread. Fact later further reinforced with political statement clearly addressed to everyone

    Firstly, I'll say it again: Total War games are historically authentic, not historically accurate - if having female units upsets you that much you can either mod them out or just not play. People saying they won't buy the game because there are too many women in it is fine with us - if that's their reason, we'd rather they didn't anyway.


    It is not fake at all.

    CA owes their playerbase a formal apology and CA_Ella a reprimand.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,759
    edited October 2018
    She wasn't speaking to the community and even if she was that doesn't justify the outrage.

    Of course the outrage is fake. It was based on a lie then jumped to a moderator reprimanding trolls. Even in the very worst case "Mod it out or don't play" is sensible advice, it's not CA's problem if that's grabbed by the outraged people as an excuse for said outrage. The worst case isn't relevant though as we know that didn't happen.

    If anyone it's Ella who deserves the apology for all the horrific abuse she's been subject to simply because she did her job.
    Post edited by Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 on
    There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • DerpyRoxasDerpyRoxas Registered Users Posts: 3,348

    It did. Greek fire is not a fiction.

    When did I say Greek Fire didn't exist? now who's arguing on bad faith? I said handheld battlefield flamethrowers didn't exist that used Greek Fire, it was usually fired through a large pump based on ships.

    You have ignored my previous comment. I have said that CA representative is immeasurably more under scrutiny than forum moderators. Professionals ought to live to higher standards than volunteers. Also, it needs to be stressed out that in case of volunteers, the responsibility lies on recruiter. You are arguing in bad faith, again.

    Nope, quite clearly I took your argument "they are immeasurably different" and gave clear examples of staff who work for free in other contexts and pointed out that they are under scrutiny in the same way paid staff are. In these other contexts those people are scrutinised because they represent a company. You haven't proven objectively your point is true, it's merely a subjective view of the world that isn't backed up with evidence. the many times I've seen mods on here 'talk back' to paying members of the community I've not heard a peep out of you, yet when Ella says something trivial the world ends.

    Someone on the first or second page remains banned. I imagine it was not their first offence. Erick and his partner in discussion also broke the rules but have not received a ban. It is not obvious at all. It is not basic at all. Sometimes comments are removed, sometimes they are not. It is political no matter the surprise.

    What comment got them banned? Where did eric break the rules? It's political in your own head.

    Daily Stormer was not the first one who came up with an article on the subject. It was One Angry Gamer, then both Arch Warhammer and Daily Stormer followed afterwards. I understand, it is easier to try to deflect the issue by claiming 'it is all about them Stormer troll baddies' but it is not the case in any way, shape or form.

    Could it not be the case that Ella had dealt with many of these threads and been taking grief for a while? Impossible? The video by Arch Warhammer was utter garbage.

    Greek fire flamethrowers existed. Syracusae was one of the few cities of the Empire that was authorized to have the schematics to build them. I live at less than 70 km from it and I saw them in museums.
    Also, the Medieval 2 depiction of BE is unfairly archaic, but accurate.
    Recent archeological and bibliographical discoveries found out that the BE was at the top on research of firearms (grenades and even an archaic kinda of bazooka were found, but the use of the latter is still unknown) and was heavily inspired by chinese blueprints.
    Hand grenades were even common in BE navy, some with explosive or incendiary charges, as shown during reconquest of Sicily. However, all of this tech superiority was lost after the fourth crusade.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    Yes.

    So you're just arguing for the sake of it then as women appearing (rarely) is similar to past historical issues with accuracy, I'll assume that you have a special focus on women, just because.

    Because it is simple. Official representatives and volunteers fall under vastly different level of scrutiny. Yes, vile. I have described those threats as wrong. That is enough.

    Ah now it's 'official' rather than paid? Those people represent a company, paid or not and the way CA reacts to them is a reflection of CA. Simple.

    I agree, it's someone's right to say something within the scope of their job. But it wasn't within it. It was very much outside of it. Basic etiquette 101 breach. Yes, loathe. Now apparently great wrongs involve passive aggressive and politically charged jabs that later evolve into political statements.

    Oh so you know what's in the scope of Ella's job better than she does? Better than her line management? You see her comment as politically charged, I'm sure most people as someone saying 'it's a few females appearing in a game.. calm down'. On the plus side I can conclude that you've never had a real problems if you see what Ella's said as such a huge political issue.

    Yes, with the exception that males were trained into leading position from youth. Women were not. Given examples are cute but prove nothing. Both male and female figureheads were guided by other men. Every leader has council/advisors, male council/advisors 99% of the time. Not to mention in some places it is pure propaganda. But that is irrelevant considering all things.

    Given examples prove that women led backed by evidence. I think I should try that in a real debate, whenever someone backs what they say with facts I'll call it cute, interesting.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    Greek fire flamethrowers existed. Syracusae was one of the few cities of the Empire that was authorized to have the schematics to build them. I live at less than 70 km from it and I saw them in museums.
    Also, the Medieval 2 depiction of BE is unfairly archaic, but accurate.
    Recent archeological and bibliographical discoveries found out that the BE was at the top on research of firearms (grenades and even an archaic kinda of bazooka were found, but the use of the latter is still unknown) and was heavily inspired by chinese blueprints.
    Hand grenades were even common in BE navy, some with explosive or incendiary charges, as shown during reconquest of Sicily. However, all of this tech superiority was lost after the fourth crusade.


    You can read through Wikipedia as much as you like, but there is no way the Byzantines had anything like mobile battlefield flamethrowers.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    I am sure they do, but it does not always mean they are right. DAI inquisition had obvious example of pandering and it was backed by the company, same for ME:Andromeda.


    An obvious example of pandering would be to program out females due to a loud minority.

    As for management in Sega and CA, considering their complete silence on Warhammer news and the announcement of a 3K DLC 6 months in advance, I seriously doubt that they know much about their own rules on anything, let alone customer interaction.


    Yet 3 Kingdoms will sell well and you know it. In reference to being a business CA and Sega know what they're doing.
  • KronusXKronusX Registered Users Posts: 2,464

    I am sure they do, but it does not always mean they are right. DAI inquisition had obvious example of pandering and it was backed by the company, same for ME:Andromeda.


    An obvious example of pandering would be to program out females due to a loud minority.

    As for management in Sega and CA, considering their complete silence on Warhammer news and the announcement of a 3K DLC 6 months in advance, I seriously doubt that they know much about their own rules on anything, let alone customer interaction.


    Yet 3 Kingdoms will sell well and you know it. In reference to being a business CA and Sega know what they're doing.

    Do you see the future?If so, do tell us what is the upcoming DLC, since you seem to know already that 3K will sell well.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    Do you see the future?If so, do tell us what is the upcoming DLC, since you seem to know already that 3K will sell well.

    It's called deductive reasoning. The chances of a major TW game flopping is unlikely as the evidence shows major lines sell better than previous, especially when 3K is going to open the Chinese market.
  • Maedrethnir#1968Maedrethnir#1968 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 17,371

    She wasn't speaking to the community and even if she was that doesn't justify the outrage.

    Of course the outrage is fake. It was based on a lie then jumped to a moderator reprimanding trolls. Even in the very worst case "Mod it out or don't play" is sensible advice, it's not CA's problem if that's grabbed by the outraged people as an excuse for said outrage. The worst case isn't relevant though as we know that didn't happen.

    If anyone it's Ella who deserves the apology for all the horrific abuse she's been subject to simply because she did her job.

    CA_Ella was speaking to the community, copy/paste of the response from the original thread reinforces it.

    It was not fake. Moderator sure can reprimand forum user by telling them to keep discussion civil, by issuing warning, ban or locking thread. It was not a sensible advice, neither was 'if having female units upsets you that much', not to mention 'People saying they won't buy the game because there are too many women in it is fine with us - if that's their reason, we'd rather they didn't anyway.'

    Making passive aggressive politically charged jabs is not community manager's job. CA_Ella failed.

    So you're just arguing for the sake of it then as women appearing (rarely) is similar to past historical issues with accuracy, I'll assume that you have a special focus on women, just because.


    10-15% is not rarely. If you avoid fielding female generals they will stack and occupy spots. Not to mention issue of technology is not the same as issue of biology.

    Ah now it's 'official' rather than paid? Those people represent a company, paid or not and the way CA reacts to them is a reflection of CA. Simple.

    One and the same withing context. Official(paid) representatives represent a company. Again, arguing in bad faith. Obviously there is a difference of between action of CA employee and volunteer. Simple.

    Oh so you know what's in the scope of Ella's job better than she does? Better than her line management? You see her comment as politically charged, I'm sure most people as someone saying 'it's a few females appearing in a game.. calm down'. On the plus side I can conclude that you've never had a real problems if you see what Ella's said as such a huge political issue.

    Unfortunately, I do. It is a fact that this comment is politically charged. Stating otherwise is arguing in bad faith, or worse, being unable to understand. Yes, it is vile and I loathe it.

    Given examples prove that women led backed by evidence. I think I should try that in a real debate, whenever someone backs what they say with facts I'll call it cute, interesting.

    Given examples prove women were at the head of armies. Prove they were commanders, strategists and tacticians. It was you who used word 'cute' few responses earlier. I have merely borrowed your word.

    Right, so just so I'm straight you believe that the Byzantine army had a flamethrower that could be used in a similar way to those used in WW1? That's cute.
  • TheShiroOfDaltonTheShiroOfDalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 34,001
    So far the great review-bombing campaign had little to no effect. Review-bombing a five year old game is already sad and ineffectual and the review bombing attempts on other TW titles fizzled since the neckbeards behind it got bored and probably went back to raging over all da womenfolk in Star Wars nowadays.

  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USARegistered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 23,787
    Folks, this conversation seems to have got on a merry-go-round. Same several folks have been making the same points for some time now, with only minor wording variations. That all are very controlled and within the T&C is the only reason why the conversation has been allowed to continue.

    We need to move on. Come up with something that adds to the conversation, and doesn't continue sounding like the same drumbeat. Agreeing to disagree is an honorable way to end a conversation.

    Thanks.
    "The two most common things in the universe are Hydrogen and Stupidity." - Harlan Ellison
    "The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously." - Hubert H. Humphrey
    "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin/Mark Twain
    “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”–George Santayana, The Life of Reason, 1905.

  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    It was not fake. Moderator sure can reprimand forum user by telling them to keep discussion civil, by issuing warning, ban or locking thread. It was not a sensible advice, neither was 'if having female units upsets you that much', not to mention 'People saying they won't buy the game because there are too many women in it is fine with us - if that's their reason, we'd rather they didn't anyway.'

    I see, whenever I say anything that disagrees you just state bad faith like that means something. 'Politically charged' is in your head not Ella's or anyone else's, just take it for what it is, an employee mildly bored with the same childish comments and made a throwaway suggestion that she probably didn't give any thought to as probably did the other staff at CA.

    In that statement Ella was talking to some angry user who was calling her sexist and probably being a pain in the..

    10-15% is not rarely. If you avoid fielding female generals they will stack and occupy spots. Not to mention issue of technology is not the same as issue of biology.

    I've answered this. If you look there's a 65/35 birth rate in favour of male characters. there is a 1 in 10 chance but it's up to the player to make this choice. Someone has already said on this thread could people show a save game of vast amounts of women appearing it's just not happened. Whether women did appear 1 in 10 or not it doesn't matter as any less would mean they don't appear full stop and that would make it pointless. It's a sandbox game. Now you've never dealt with these points you've just repeated yourself or used the 'bad faith' line which is pretty meaningless.

    Unfortunately, I do. It is a fact that this comment is politically charged. Stating otherwise is arguing in bad faith, or worse, being unable to understand. Yes, it is vile and I loathe it.

    Yet here we are, CA doesn't agree with you so I have to wonder, who should I take advice from, CA and their management team, or an angry man on the internet? I don't think it's vile when a company backs their employee. So this very dubious position of claiming to be in the know is a clear delusion.

    Given examples prove women were at the head of armies. Prove they were commanders, strategists and tacticians. It was you who used word 'cute' few responses earlier. I have merely borrowed your word.

    But in your case you use the word to counter an argument and not to finish one. Your argument being well maybe women did have important roles but I'll bet it was a man who advised them. Yet you say this without evidence which seems to run through most of your arguments - don't let evidence get in the way of an entrenched view, eh?
  • KronusXKronusX Registered Users Posts: 2,464

    Do you see the future?If so, do tell us what is the upcoming DLC, since you seem to know already that 3K will sell well.

    It's called deductive reasoning. The chances of a major TW game flopping is unlikely as the evidence shows major lines sell better than previous, especially when 3K is going to open the Chinese market.

    Deductive reasoning works when we are discussing something that follows a continuous line. Deductive reasoning also did not take into account the fact they just announced a DLC 6 months in advance which might or might not work on the Chinese market. You are right, the game was pre-ordered but pre-orders can be canceled as well. That is the beauty of adding that option half a year in advance.

    I pre-ordered monster hunter world and one week before release I decided to cancel it because I had enough games and the game did not warranted my money due to potential bugs despite the fact that I pre-ordered it two months in advance.
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    Premise 1: Warhammer 1 had release DLC
    Premise 2: Warhammer 1 sold well
    Conclusion: Release DLC is not a reason for a game selling badly

    Premise 1: All CA's major TW lines have all topped the PC charts
    Premise 2: 3 Kingdoms is a major TW release
    Conclusion: 3 Kingdoms will top the PC charts
  • WarlockeWarlocke Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,083
    I miss the early 2000s, back when the internet was new and fun and every corner of it was permeated by political tribalism.
    ò_ó
  • Maedrethnir#1968Maedrethnir#1968 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 17,371
    edited October 2018
    I see, whenever I say anything that disagrees you just state bad faith like that means something. 'Politically charged' is in your head not Ella's or anyone else's, just take it for what it is, an employee mildly bored with the same childish comments and made a throwaway suggestion that she probably didn't give any thought to as probably did the other staff at CA.

    In that statement Ella was talking to some angry user who was calling her sexist and probably being a pain in the..

    It means precisely what it says, you are arguing in bad faith. It is a fact, it was a passive aggressive and politically charged jab. Then you agree it was toughtless. Good. We are getting somewhere. Just our directions at different.

    Again, like a person of truly positive outlook you misinterpet quote chain in favour of CA_Ella. What-a-surprise-!

    Also ella will lock this thread when she sees for being 'sexist' #3

    User THEDOSSBOSS clearly suggests censorship of threads under pretense of sexism, not that CA_Ella is sexist.

    Not that it would excuse this comment under any circumstances.

    People saying they won't buy the game because there are too many women in it is fine with us - if that's their reason, we'd rather they didn't anyway.



    I've answered this. If you look there's a 65/35 birth rate in favour of male characters. there is a 1 in 10 chance but it's up to the player to make this choice. Someone has already said on this thread could people show a save game of vast amounts of women appearing it's just not happened. Whether women did appear 1 in 10 or not it doesn't matter as any less would mean they don't appear full stop and that would make it pointless. It's a sandbox game. Now you've never dealt with these points you've just repeated yourself or used the 'bad faith' line which is pretty meaningless.


    Notpicking female generals might end up with general pool bloated with female generals. Any less would mean that female generals would be truly rare, as they were. They would still have a chance to pop out. Bad faith continues.


    Yet here we are, CA doesn't agree with you so I have to wonder, who should I take advice from, CA and their management team, or an angry man on the internet? I don't think it's vile when a company backs their employee. So this very dubious position of claiming to be in the know is a clear delusion.


    I'm sure you will figure it out. When company backs employees in the wrong then yes, it is vile. Delusion? Oh, the irony.

    But in your case you use the word to counter an argument and not to finish one. Your argument being well maybe women did have important roles but I'll bet it was a man who advised them. Yet you say this without evidence which seems to run through most of your arguments - don't let evidence get in the way of an entrenched view, eh?

    It wasn't a counter but reaction. Not maybe, women did have important roles. Being a ruler is important. That is basic history. Councilors/advisors were in 99% cases males. Women did not receive management and military education. That is all there is to it. Yep, I'm all fine in me cozy trenches. I hear no whistle I see no reason.

    Post edited by Maedrethnir#1968 on
  • davedave1124#4773davedave1124#4773 Senior Member St Helens UKRegistered Users Posts: 22,074
    It means precisely what it says, you are arguing in bad faith. It is a fact, it was a passive aggressive and politically charged jab. Then you agree it was toughtless. Good. We are getting somewhere. Just our directions at different.

    Most people don't consider in some detail everything they say. You make it sound like it's some how a planned political strategy when it's just a way of saying. Calm down mod or don't play. That offends you? An example of 'arguing in bad faith' is believing what you say is obviously right without evidence. That's a perfect description of your argument.

    Again, like a person of truly positive outlook you misinterpet quote chain in favour of CA_Ella. What-a-surprise-!

    User THEDOSSBOSS clearly suggests censorship of threads under pretense of sexism, not that CA_Ella is sexist.

    Not that it would excuse this comment under any circumstances


    That's the only thing that was said? That one thing was said and that's why Ella shut it? I think not.

    I'm sure you will figure it out. When company backs employees in the wrong then yes, it is vile. Delusion? Oh, the irony.

    You don't run a business, you're not a community manager, you are unaware of the rules that govern the community manager position in CA.. yet you believe you know more than a successful company that's about 30 years old? Yes - everyone else is wrong...

    Notpicking female generals might end up with general pool bloated with female generals. Any less would mean that female generals would be truly rare, as they were. They would still have a chance to pop out. Bad faith continues.

    Puckle Guns were truly rare.. your point? Again your making a statement without evidence a if it's true - bad faith.


    "But the person who was chiefly instrumental in rousing the natives ... and who directed the conduct of the entire war, was Boudica, a Briton woman of the Royal family and possessed of greater intelligence than often belongs to women".
    Cassius Dio - Roman Historian. Unknown



    It wasn't a counter but reaction. Not maybe, women did have important roles. Being a ruler is important. That is basic history. Councilors/advisors were in 99% cases males. Women did not receive management and military education. That is all there is to it. Yep, I'm all fine in me cozy trenches. I hear no whistle I see no reason.

    Women in the tribes that CA gave this option did have females who fought and led. Yep, no evidence is enough for a dose of good old dogmatism.



  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USARegistered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 23,787
    edited October 2018
    Well I did post a warning. Apparently it was overlooked in pursuit of individual agenda, or possibly just ignored. Be that as it may, the thread is closed for any further discussion.

    Send me a PM if there are any questions or comments.

    Thanks.

    dge1
    Post edited by dge1 on
    "The two most common things in the universe are Hydrogen and Stupidity." - Harlan Ellison
    "The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously." - Hubert H. Humphrey
    "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin/Mark Twain
    “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”–George Santayana, The Life of Reason, 1905.

This discussion has been closed.