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CA Please, Anyone But Kroak or Gor-Rok

124

Comments

  • SeanJeanquoi#3490SeanJeanquoi#3490 Registered Users Posts: 3,440
    edited February 2019

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.

    Craventail actually bolsters the argument against you because he's a character that was added in without a request and without adding in all of the more important ones first. They haven't run out of Skaven and yet there he is.

    Ghorst may have been 8th but similarly he wasn't added because they ran out, there's plenty still to add.

    Even volkmar the grim can go in this category: he wasn't added because he's the most important guy, theres plenty that should have been before him. Does Ghorst have any rules I'm curious?
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid


  • Crossil#2134Crossil#2134 Registered Users Posts: 14,927
    edited February 2019

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    All a smaller footnote than the other. Only thing different is how much the fans can extrapolate from what they have. But no 6th edition characters that you could take on TT so it seems so CA made the choice because there were none from 6th ed which is still nowhere near the case of the Lizardmen. So yes, all those you listed are in fact not same as Lizardmen army list characters.

    And you seem to forget GW is still the one pulling shots. They won't just let CA effectively create a character for the game for no reason, especially for a race that has several fully developed characters.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602
    edited February 2019
    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid
    CA has said that the 8th edition is what the game is based around which means the 8th edition heroes and lords come first before lore and previous editions.

    "there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things"
    You mean when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list and Games Workshop wants the White Dwarf for a White Dwarf Promotion the issue is those "exceptions" relies on the chosen army book/list on running out of characters and there are seven lizardmen lords and heroes left in the army book along with none of those characters having a rule against leading which puts Nakai eighth in line due to being a lore character.

    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid
    CA has said that the 8th edition is what the game is based around which means the 8th edition heroes and lords come first before lore and previous editions.

    "there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things"
    You mean when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list and Games Workshop wants the White Dwarf for a White Dwarf Promotion the issue is those "exceptions" relies on the chosen army book/list on running out of characters and there are seven lizardmen lords and heroes left in the army book along with none of those characters having a rule against leading which puts Nakai eighth in line due to being a lore character.

    Vanpire coast didnt even have an 8th edition army book and sorry, but Nakai is mentioned in 8th edition, thus applying to your rule


  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602
    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid
    CA has said that the 8th edition is what the game is based around which means the 8th edition heroes and lords come first before lore and previous editions.

    "there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things"
    You mean when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list and Games Workshop wants the White Dwarf for a White Dwarf Promotion the issue is those "exceptions" relies on the chosen army book/list on running out of characters and there are seven lizardmen lords and heroes left in the army book along with none of those characters having a rule against leading which puts Nakai eighth in line due to being a lore character.

    Vanpire coast didnt even have an 8th edition army book and sorry, but Nakai is mentioned in 8th edition, thus applying to your rule
    Vampire Coast has an army list will you actually read what I put.
    "when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list"
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • Nyxilis#3646Nyxilis#3646 Registered Users Posts: 8,271
    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid
    CA has said that the 8th edition is what the game is based around which means the 8th edition heroes and lords come first before lore and previous editions.

    "there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things"
    You mean when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list and Games Workshop wants the White Dwarf for a White Dwarf Promotion the issue is those "exceptions" relies on the chosen army book/list on running out of characters and there are seven lizardmen lords and heroes left in the army book along with none of those characters having a rule against leading which puts Nakai eighth in line due to being a lore character.

    Vanpire coast didnt even have an 8th edition army book and sorry, but Nakai is mentioned in 8th edition, thus applying to your rule
    Barely, a footnote.

    Compared to those who were statted, on table, with figures and far more lore than a blurb.
  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771
    Nyxilis said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    Not 6th Edition though which is what CA used as a base for Bretonnia since that was their latest edition.


    But as you even pointed out, there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things, Vangheist was a lore Carachter yet he was replaced by a completely new Lord.

    CA decides what they want to do with their game there is no rules. If they decide they want a lord for each Lizardmen sub species then They will make Nakai a thing, and seing how popular he is and how cool he would be gameplay wise other than your self imposed rules, nothing is holding it back other than CAs final decision.

    I wouldnt mind Gor Rok, but saying Nakai has no chance is simply stupid
    CA has said that the 8th edition is what the game is based around which means the 8th edition heroes and lords come first before lore and previous editions.

    "there is tons of exeptions to the 8th edition things"
    You mean when they run out of characters for the chosen army book/list and Games Workshop wants the White Dwarf for a White Dwarf Promotion the issue is those "exceptions" relies on the chosen army book/list on running out of characters and there are seven lizardmen lords and heroes left in the army book along with none of those characters having a rule against leading which puts Nakai eighth in line due to being a lore character.

    Vanpire coast didnt even have an 8th edition army book and sorry, but Nakai is mentioned in 8th edition, thus applying to your rule
    Barely, a footnote.

    Compared to those who were statted, on table, with figures and far more lore than a blurb.
    Yeah that I do know he doesnt have the more lore, but if CA decides that he is the best gameplay wise its not gonna stop them.

    There is no restrictions from him being implemented.

    Only thing I am saying is that he is wanted by the players, would bring much better gameplay than the others and that saying he has no chance is simply utterly stupid and doesnt make sense with what this game is: a total war game


  • Michael4537Michael4537 Registered Users Posts: 2,377
    If not Kroak or Gor-Rok, then Oxoytl, Tetto'eko, Tiktaq'to, or Chakax. Nakai is at the bottom of my list, as I would prefer characters with more than the occasional lore snippet as in-game LLs. And him being a lord and being a Kroxigor doesn't make much sense either. He would make an excellent hero or unique mechanic for the Lizardmen though, but a LL is not the best spot for him.

    Kroak is my top pick because of the potential for his battle and campaign mechanics, he starts in Itza, he has the some of the most extensive lore for the Lizardmen, and he is a lord on the table top and can lead armies. He doesn't have to be boring you know.
  • SeanJeanquoi#3490SeanJeanquoi#3490 Registered Users Posts: 3,440
    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    All a smaller footnote than the other. Only thing different is how much the fans can extrapolate from what they have. But no 6th edition characters that you could take on TT so it seems so CA made the choice because there were none from 6th ed which is still nowhere near the case of the Lizardmen. So yes, all those you listed are in fact not same as Lizardmen army list characters.

    And you seem to forget GW is still the one pulling shots. They won't just let CA effectively create a character for the game for no reason, especially for a race that has several fully developed characters.
    Cylostra was made out of thin air for no reason. VC didn't need 4 lords. Didn't even need 3. Prior DLC had 2,3 and 4 so there was no standard they had to meet there.

    You're right the bretonnia characters aren't comparable to Nakai, maybe you shouldn't have brought up alberic...
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    All a smaller footnote than the other. Only thing different is how much the fans can extrapolate from what they have. But no 6th edition characters that you could take on TT so it seems so CA made the choice because there were none from 6th ed which is still nowhere near the case of the Lizardmen. So yes, all those you listed are in fact not same as Lizardmen army list characters.

    And you seem to forget GW is still the one pulling shots. They won't just let CA effectively create a character for the game for no reason, especially for a race that has several fully developed characters.
    Cylostra was made out of thin air for no reason. VC didn't need 4 lords. Didn't even need 3. Prior DLC had 2,3 and 4 so there was no standard they had to meet there.

    You're right the bretonnia characters aren't comparable to Nakai, maybe you shouldn't have brought up alberic...
    "For those that missed it (and are interested in this because they're critical of Cylostra's addition) CA said that in working with games workshop on a Vampire Coast DLC, they were permitted to take one or two Lords from dreadfleet but not more because otherwise it would be a dreadfleet DLC and not a vampire coast DLC. Reading between the lines this would infer that because Dreadfleet is a seperate property, games workshop limited CA's freedom to pick intellectual property assets from it."

    Alberic as an example would work only really fit IF the Lizardmen had all of their 8th edition Heroes and lords ingame.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • Crossil#2134Crossil#2134 Registered Users Posts: 14,927
    edited February 2019

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Kranox said:

    /blockquote>



    What you need to understand is that it is not a GW game, it is a CA game, they will go for what fots the best gameplaywise, if the decide Nakai has enough popularity and brings enough to the game, nothing is gonna stop them

    What you need to understand is that CA will choose an 8th edition character not a lore one since the Lizardmen still have characters so Nakai has no chance.
    That is purely your opinion
    Not really as it is backed up by CA they focus 8th edition with only going outside (lore, previous editions and forgeworld) when they run of characters.
    Vlad Isabella 8th edition, Ghorst 8th edition expansion only added since the Vampire Counts ran out of characters that could lead armies.
    Alberic added since the Bretonnian 6th Edition ran out of characters.
    Direfin, Saltspite and Noctilus were added since the Vampire Coast army list ran out of characters.
    Grombindal was added by a Games Workshop promotion.
    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord and the Skaven have no 8th edition army book.
    Brettonia has plenty of other characters to choose from: Bohemond Beastslayer, Tancred due de Quenelles, Odo d’Outremer, Sir John Tyreweld, Repanse de Lyonesse, Chilfroy d’Artois, Armand d’Aquitaine, Reynard de Shasser and Barron thegan I think. That's not even all of them.
    All a smaller footnote than the other. Only thing different is how much the fans can extrapolate from what they have. But no 6th edition characters that you could take on TT so it seems so CA made the choice because there were none from 6th ed which is still nowhere near the case of the Lizardmen. So yes, all those you listed are in fact not same as Lizardmen army list characters.

    And you seem to forget GW is still the one pulling shots. They won't just let CA effectively create a character for the game for no reason, especially for a race that has several fully developed characters.
    Cylostra was made out of thin air for no reason. VC didn't need 4 lords. Didn't even need 3. Prior DLC had 2,3 and 4 so there was no standard they had to meet there.

    You're right the bretonnia characters aren't comparable to Nakai, maybe you shouldn't have brought up alberic...
    Except that VP are going by CA's standard of 4 LL per faction for game 2. So yes, if VP are here they would need 4 LLs. So she's in fact made with a reasonable explanation and don't even pretend that a lot of people don't dislike her as is, partially because of that.

    He's exactly like those characters. Not TT characters. Why are you pretending that's not the case? Also it wasn't me who brought up Alberic.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • SeanJeanquoi#3490SeanJeanquoi#3490 Registered Users Posts: 3,440
    edited February 2019
    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned are lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway
    Post edited by SeanJeanquoi#3490 on
  • Crossil#2134Crossil#2134 Registered Users Posts: 14,927

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    This is exaclty what its up to, wich is we go purely by lore, then the choice is obvious, but lore is not the only factor


  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771
    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂


  • Crossil#2134Crossil#2134 Registered Users Posts: 14,927
    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂
    Not lore = fanfiction

    You're not making any of these claims from lore so they are fanfiction.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • Michael4537Michael4537 Registered Users Posts: 2,377

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    I honestly don't see what the difference between Gor-Rok and Nakai would be. What makes Nakai so special other than the fact he is a Kroxigor. And what is "boring" about Kroak? Both would bring different things to the table, just like all the other LM characters would.

    Gor-Rok fulfills a very different role that Kroq-Gar. The former is a bruiser, a tank, an infantry grinder, and an anchor that will hold down your frontline. Kroq-Gar is a character and monster hunter, specialized for anti-large and with the mobility to prioritize high-value targets.

    There is a wide variety of options that CA could take with Kroak. He has a number of items that could turn him into an extremely effective army-buffer (similar to Thorgrim) with a powerful bound spell. The focus is more on support. Mazdamundi is a casting machine and a tank. Both bring different things to the table.
  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771
    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂
    Not lore = fanfiction

    You're not making any of these claims from lore so they are fanfiction.
    Not if its made by CA with GW approval, hence what he would bring if he is chosen wouldnt be fanfiction since it would make him official


  • Grom_the_Paunch#8146Grom_the_Paunch#8146 Registered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 2,741
    edited February 2019
    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    I read the exerpt @John_Kimble posted. I actually rather liked it. A wandering "forest spirit" type character that shows up in times of strife is so GW.

    Yes, we have a few of those already. No, it doesn't invent the wheel. Still, no need to be fully dismissive of Nakai. It may not be the best option on the table, but that doesn't mean he should never see the light of day in this game.

    Remember, this thread here is technically about what LLs/characters we could see after the DLC. I know the title is a wee bit misleading, but the OP makes that clear.
  • Crossil#2134Crossil#2134 Registered Users Posts: 14,927
    edited February 2019
    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂
    Not lore = fanfiction

    You're not making any of these claims from lore so they are fanfiction.
    Not if its made by CA with GW approval, hence what he would bring if he is chosen wouldnt be fanfiction since it would make him official
    Yes and as far as CA making it you can't make a single claim about what he will be because he literally has no lore to indicate how he would play.

    What YOU have is fanfiction. What CA could make might as well be entirely different character from what you keep preaching about. The only thing we know is that he's a Kroxigor. That's nothing. Everything else you ascribe further is fanfiction and not an indicator of how he would play or be.

    I can do the same thing. Look at my signature. What do you know Surtha Ek would be like? Nothing, he's a fan creation and so is YOUR Nakai.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • Dracklor#9977Dracklor#9977 Registered Users Posts: 4,771
    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂
    Not lore = fanfiction

    You're not making any of these claims from lore so they are fanfiction.
    Not if its made by CA with GW approval, hence what he would bring if he is chosen wouldnt be fanfiction since it would make him official
    Yes and as far as CA making it you can't make a single claim about what he will be because he literally has no lore to indicate how he would play.

    What YOU have is fanfiction. What CA could make might as well be entirely different character from what you keep preaching about. The only thing we know is that he's a Kroxigor. That's nothing. Everything else you ascribe further is fanfiction and not an indicator of how he would play or be.

    I can do the same thing. Look at my signature. What do you know Surtha Ek would be like? Nothing, he's a fan creation and so is YOUR Nakai.
    Well thats simply false and funny, but its ok

    https://bibliotheque-imperiale.com/index.php/Nakai_le_Vagabond

    Here is a page that shows his magical weapon, his lore and that he is a powerfull jungle spirit, hinting that there is somethjng more to him than a dumb kroxigor.


  • Ol_Nessie#9894Ol_Nessie#9894 Registered Users Posts: 4,310
    edited February 2019
    Crossil said:

    Crossil said:

    Feels like a troll post, intentionally removing the two most likely options.
    Itza will 100% be the playable FLC faction, meaning that we'll get either Kroak or Gor-Rok with Kroak as a faction mechanic. Also, Kroak is heavily teased in Lokhir's intro speech when hovering over Itza...

    This is as far as I can tell false. The camera only zooms into Itza itself and Lokhir talks about LM tresures, no one in particular.
    Think they meant the adviser

    source https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/9y9u0b/hinting_at_the_venerable_lord_kroak_perhaps/
    Huh, I thought Lokhir's speech from Vortex, not ME intro scene. Ok, then. Well, a source of power, not a powerful character. That to me does say that Kroak will be implemented somehow, perhaps but probably not as an LL.
    I'm not sure how you can reach that conclusion from just that quote. I think you're reading way too much into the minutiae of the diction and finding things that aren't there. I doubt very much that the writers decided to include the hint, but wanted to ensure that it was understood from that hint that Kroak was not being referred to as a future playable LL and so carefully worded this ultimately throwaway sentence in order to convey that.You could just as easily reach the opposite conclusion stating," 'Rests' is an active verb and it suggests the subject of the sentence has agency, therefore the 'great power' is obviously a character!"

    Post edited by Ol_Nessie#9894 on
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602
    edited February 2019





    Craventail actually bolsters the argument against you because he's a character that was added in without a request and without adding in all of the more important ones first. They haven't run out of Skaven and yet there he is.

    Ghorst may have been 8th but similarly he wasn't added because they ran out, there's plenty still to add.

    Even volkmar the grim can go in this category: he wasn't added because he's the most important guy, theres plenty that should have been before him. Does Ghorst have any rules I'm curious?

    Missed this part due to your editing.

    Craventail is a 7th Edition lord not a lore character chosen over all other the Skavens latest edition characters like the argument with Nakai is (Which is lore character over latest edition characters) as Craventail is apart of the Lords and Heroes of the Skaven army book that CA is picking characters from (they didn't get an 8th edition so CA went for the latest Edition).

    Ghorst had rules because he was a character involved in the Sigmars Blood campaign which I have PDF of.


    Yes Ghorst was added because they ran out since the Vampire Counts army rule doesn't let characters without magic to lead armies and Vlad and Isabella were already planned as FLC (Vlad) and for the Make War not Love event (Isabella) which left in the army book Krell, Konrad Von Carstein (has no magic) and Mannferd the Acolyte (Mannfred but younger) and I very much doubt that they'd add the same character in twice.

    Volkmar is 8th Edition so him being added was more the theme of the lord pack which was Sigmars Blood
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • John_Kimble#3765John_Kimble#3765 Registered Users Posts: 1,647
    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    Kranox said:

    Crossil said:

    @Michael4537 the debate between Kroak and Gor'rok and between the others boils down to this: the two mentioned lore justified but not necessarily justified by what they'd bring in terms of gameplay, while the others like Nakai are the opposite. Kroak and Gor'rok would be the most boring to implement due to them just being the same but worse versions of maz and Kroq. Meanwhile alot could be done with Tetto'Eko, Oxyotl, Nakai and Tehenhuain. That's in essence my argument anyway

    The only thing Nakai is bringing is fanfiction.
    LOL keep it up with those pointless statements that are simply false 😂😂
    Not lore = fanfiction

    You're not making any of these claims from lore so they are fanfiction.
    Not if its made by CA with GW approval, hence what he would bring if he is chosen wouldnt be fanfiction since it would make him official
    Yes and as far as CA making it you can't make a single claim about what he will be because he literally has no lore to indicate how he would play.

    What YOU have is fanfiction. What CA could make might as well be entirely different character from what you keep preaching about. The only thing we know is that he's a Kroxigor. That's nothing. Everything else you ascribe further is fanfiction and not an indicator of how he would play or be.

    I can do the same thing. Look at my signature. What do you know Surtha Ek would be like? Nothing, he's a fan creation and so is YOUR Nakai.
    Well thats simply false and funny, but its ok

    https://bibliotheque-imperiale.com/index.php/Nakai_le_Vagabond

    Here is a page that shows his magical weapon, his lore and that he is a powerfull jungle spirit, hinting that there is somethjng more to him than a dumb kroxigor.
    SInce you actually don't even bother to do some 5 min research, i'll do it for you (it seems you'd rather trust Wiki pages and youtubers instead of actual sources).

    I did actually forget about his mention in the 6th edition armybook so here you go.


    Also, spoiler alert, the artwork used for Nakai is that used for generic Kroxigor units in the 6th edition. It has nothing to do with Nakai. Don't trust Wikis, go for the source material...

    And finally, here you go : http://sgabetto.free.fr/Telechargements/nakai.pdf

    This is where is item comes from. But are you ready for the plot twist? (i'm 100% you won't even bother reading everything on the page i linked); everything you see in that page (including the item) is fan-made and not an official GW ruleset.

    Now go ahead and use this as the biggest hint at Nakai coming ingame. :D
  • #705863#705863 Registered Users Posts: 182
    Disagree completely as a lizardman collector for almost 10 years I can tell you gorok is the best new character and kroak is the best ever.

    Oxy just got sucked into warp then got out... yawn.
  • SeanJeanquoi#3490SeanJeanquoi#3490 Registered Users Posts: 3,440
    @Michael4537 I've talked again and again about what could be done with Nakai or Oxyotl. Go back and read my original two posts at least if you want to get context.

    I was boiling it down so you could get the broader sentiment. Kroak and Gor'rok wouldn't be outright boring. I'd still love Itza, I still really like Kroak. But I'd rather play as another kind of lizardman with a different way to play and a different way of utilizing the roster. As far as I'm aware Kroak is on tabletop: a more fragile Mazda with no mount and only one spell. Similarly: Gor-Rok is Kroq-Gar with no mount and they both start in the same place.

    You say Kroak could buff his army and Gor-Rok could be a tank. Which is true but it's not all that different considering Kroq-Gar is one of the strongest lords in the game and maz is one of the strongest casters. I can't see the difference being that noticeable. What's more: that's it, all they seem to bring to the table is a slightly different role and a new starting position. Nothing else on the campaign map or in combat as far as I can tell (no one has suggested anything else).

    Meanwhile we could get a new breed of LL that could buff other parts of the roster and offer a unique playstyle with a new starting positiom as well as potentially give us new lores of magic for the lizzardmen, new lord mounts (Trogladon) and so on. They could offer everything Kroak and Gor'rok could plus much more.
  • SeanJeanquoi#3490SeanJeanquoi#3490 Registered Users Posts: 3,440
    @Arthasmenethril the vampire counts are still missing all the people plus more:

    Neferata, Abhorash, Walach Harkon, Melchior, Zacharias the Everliving, Konrad Von Carstein, Ushoran and W'Soran.

    I assume that rule is from tabletop and again I ask the question: does the adherence to the lore in this instance make the game better? If not, and we're still adding a character that's in the lore, just bending the rules slightly to include them in a way that works with the game, then I don't see why it matters.

    Konrad has no magic which would make the VC hero's (necromancer and vampire) not redundant like they kind of are now, to me anyway. Plus, in the lore didn't Konrad have to kind of be babysat by other casters and vampires because he was such a nutter and always going out of control, almost getting himself killed? In that case, his lack of magic and need to be supported by another army, lord or hero totally gels with the lore precisely because he shouldn't be allowed to be a lord.
  • Arthas_Menethil#3421Arthas_Menethil#3421 Registered Users Posts: 7,602

    @Arthasmenethril the vampire counts are still missing all the people plus more:

    Neferata, Abhorash, Walach Harkon, Melchior, Zacharias the Everliving, Konrad Von Carstein, Ushoran and W'Soran.

    I assume that rule is from tabletop and again I ask the question: does the adherence to the lore in this instance make the game better? If not, and we're still adding a character that's in the lore, just bending the rules slightly to include them in a way that works with the game, then I don't see why it matters.

    Konrad has no magic which would make the VC hero's (necromancer and vampire) not redundant like they kind of are now, to me anyway. Plus, in the lore didn't Konrad have to kind of be babysat by other casters and vampires because he was such a nutter and always going out of control, almost getting himself killed? In that case, his lack of magic and need to be supported by another army, lord or hero totally gels with the lore precisely because he shouldn't be allowed to be a lord.

    Neferata, Abhorash, Walach Harkon, Melchior, Zacharias the Everliving, Ushoran and W'Soran are not 8th edition characters so they are not missing as CA did say the game was based on the 8th edition.

    Konrad Von Carstein CANNOT be the general the Vampire Counts army book forbids it since their leadership is different to other races as the General is the one holding the army together with their own magic something Konrad lacks and since he'd be a hero ingame he won't be added since CA is not doing Legendary Heroes.

    Vampire Count Generals are the ones holding the army together which is why Konrad, Krell, Tomb Banshee, Wight King and Cairn Wraith cannot be generals as they won't be able to stop the army from crumbling which is why taking out the VC General is a valid strategy. This is a Vampire Count theme with Generals like the Empire has a theme with melee lords with only Gelt and Wulfhart as the only non-melee named characters for the Empire in the 8th Edition.

    Here's the thing CA have not gone against the cannot lead rule for any character so there is no precedent.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

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