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Missed potential

XajmaiXajmai Registered Users Posts: 10
I was sincerely disappointed when I learned there will be no new race packs for wh2. I was looking forward to have one human faction to play for the second installment of the game and got my hopes up when Vampirates were announced as it gave me hope there would be a DoW and potentially an Araby dlc since ca stated there would be more DLC for the second game than there was for the first.

Suddenly they are stating that the rest of the DLC will be only LL packs which to me is very boring and the factions left out have so much potential to be fun and interesting. I didn't find any recent threads about this.

What is the general opinion about this, do you all want Lord packs and don't care much for new races or do you share my concern with the missed potential this statement poses to me?

Happy to hear all kinds of ideas and opinions

Comments

  • Serkelet#1834Serkelet#1834 Member Registered Users Posts: 1,084
    I agree 100% with you.
  • BaronRodney#9956BaronRodney#9956 Registered Users Posts: 1,306
    Did I miss a post by CA? What have they said exactly?
  • SlipknotMaggotSlipknotMaggot Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 554
    Usually i like to have more LP-> the real warhammer races more fleshed out but vampirates was a weird choice. Southern realms or araby would have covered more important areas of the world. Vampire coast was okay with normal undeads. Estalia tilea and araby seems weird with empire troops.
    Team Lizardmen
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,455
    edited April 2019
    The extra lord packs are above the usual one lord pack for a race, so it would be interesting to see what the new lord packs would include, anyway it might be GW who don't allow to make more race packs for game 2( an race packs for minor factions), as it's GW who have the final say.

    https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/240466/the-reality-of-what-to-expect-for-warhammer-tw
  • Patrikseve#8733Patrikseve#8733 Member Registered Users Posts: 2,129
    Its not known if there will be a preorder faction for game 2, Like Norsca and Warriors of Chaos, its not unthinkable that one more faction might arrive trough this. While WoC was a bit bare bones due to how early it was in the games Norsca was one of the most fun factions. Time will tell what happens, we dont know how it will pan out. Game one miss southern realms and game 2 miss Araby. But who knows both might show up some day down the line for the grand mega campaign.
  • uriakuriak Registered Users Posts: 4,437
    The one thing that annoys me is that whole parts of the map will be still filled with weird empire clones. Or minor bretonnians.

    About LP, there are still many characters, but from a gaming perspective this is less appetizing than new factions. Even if you don't like the idea of playing southern realms or Araby, they woud have introduced interesting rosters to meet.
    The other thing being that a new LP would be perfect for an Empire/GS rivalry among their rework, but it's less than likely that such a DLC could aim at game 1 content.

    So if they do fill more game 2 factions, let be it, but that will still deepen the chasm. Even if Empire or GS are less "exotic" than sprawling factions such as the skaven, they still are the soul of warhammer and more general the struggle of human factions vs the various slavers, beasts and undead are interesting.
  • Goatforce#6625Goatforce#6625 Registered Users Posts: 8,466
    I would agree on the Empire clones problem this presents mentioned by @uriak.

    However think DoW have a good chance getting in in game 3 I think, and Araby was perhaps more of a long shot than the forum would like to admit...




    Whilst I would always love to see more races I am quite happy that the focus will be on completing established races rather than adding new ones that have little impact on the overall setting, I just hope that the dream of Cross-Game LPs is coming - in which case I am absolutely behind CA's decision.
  • RandomblondedudeRandomblondedude Registered Users Posts: 19
    The historians of the future will call our time "Total War: Warhammer - The Age Of Demanding Minor Lore Factions And Not Getting Any".
  • uriakuriak Registered Users Posts: 4,437
    Ha, you see, when TWW launched, it was one adaptation of warhammer in game, one among many. I was the later additions that started rousing people both into hoping for category B units and lords and category B factions.
    Just consider any other WH or WH40k game so far...

    That said, I've yet to heard about one DLC missing its mark. Norsca and Pirate Coast got huge reception. And GW themselves have treated each of their faction with varying degree before the end times. SO what was once major got progressively shelved (hey Bretonnia, WE) other got a larger role. Many people don't feel enthousiastic before being presented with a new thing.

    I'm afraid it's much an issue of getting ready for game 3 this time. But their DLC policy kinda condemn some factions to obscurity. Splitting the game in 3 was a bold marketing move but it did kick the can down the road.
  • #28957#28957 Registered Users Posts: 2,764
    Don't forget that CA once said that Bretonnia will be the last major addon for TWW1 only to release Norsca a few months later. They may change their mind, especially due to large community unrest.
    Now I am known as "numbers".
  • Bloodydagger#9716Bloodydagger#9716 Registered Users Posts: 4,818
    edited April 2019
    I'm of the opposite opinion. I think the races left are boring and bottom of the barrel scratching. LL packs excite me personally because there are so many possibilities. We may finally get key LLs and missing units for factions like Beastmen as an example.
  • uriakuriak Registered Users Posts: 4,437
    CA has never said that any pack would be for OW factions, and even less so for old DLC factions.

    I don't want to sound "bitter" but when they did the last TWW1 patch, would have you though "ha, I bet that 2 years down the line there won't have been a new addition to Empire or Greenskins".

    So unless there is a surprise, expect new DE/HE/LM/SK only. Which is fine... but those factions are not in the worst shape right now. (and stuff like a slaan rework is not DLC material)
  • capybarasiesta89#4722capybarasiesta89#4722 Senior Member Bath, UKRegistered Users Posts: 5,463
    I think the biggest problem is lack of Southern Realms and their poor Empire Clone not even full roster. Tilea/Estalia/BP deserves slot in Game 2 as they have big presence in Lustria, colonies and explorer coming from both Empire and South.

    One thing I miss is PIKEMEN I want them in the game, Tilean or Estalian like Lost Legion, and of course Pavise Crossbows.


    h1feizw8yzk6.jpg
  • XajmaiXajmai Registered Users Posts: 10

    I think the biggest problem is lack of Southern Realms and their poor Empire Clone not even full roster. Tilea/Estalia/BP deserves slot in Game 2 as they have big presence in Lustria, colonies and explorer coming from both Empire and South.

    One thing I miss is PIKEMEN I want them in the game, Tilean or Estalian like Lost Legion, and of course Pavise Crossbows.


    I totally agree with you on this. The pikemen will be an interesting addition would they be added. Also to answer some of the posts above. DoW pretty much had a full army list back in the day. Mostly ror but I'm sure considering what they did with norsca they could flesh it out and make it a great and interesting faction.

    I understand not all people find human factions interesting and prefer vampires or monsters. To me the human faction in the mix is what makes the monster factions interesting. I love being the underDOG humans trying to carve my place among monsters elves and skeletons. I'm tired of playing empire and brettonia in the same starting positions and was hoping at least one new human faction would be included in each game since there are alot of potential for it. My hopes were crushed by the statements regarding only LL packs.
  • SakuraHeinzSakuraHeinz Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,232
    well there is still hope for the warhammer 3 preorder beeing a game 2 race, like when norsca was the pre order race for game 2 but first only playable in game 1.
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 12,455
    Varintraz said:

    Usually i like to have more LP-> the real warhammer races more fleshed out but Vampirates was a weird choice. Southern Realms or Araby would have covered more important areas of the world. Vampire Coast was okay with normal undeads. Estalia Tilea and Araby seems weird with Empire troops.

    The Vampire Coast got new arts in the End Times, and they helped the Under-Empire mechanics.
  • DerpyRoxasDerpyRoxas Registered Users Posts: 3,348

    The historians of the future will call our time "Total War: Warhammer - The Age Of Demanding Minor Lore Factions And Not Getting Any".

    Or "Warhammer- The Age of Teasing but changing plans"
  • joaamikejoaamike Member Registered Users Posts: 141

    I think the biggest problem is lack of Southern Realms and their poor Empire Clone not even full roster. Tilea/Estalia/BP deserves slot in Game 2 as they have big presence in Lustria, colonies and explorer coming from both Empire and South.

    One thing I miss is PIKEMEN I want them in the game, Tilean or Estalian like Lost Legion, and of course Pavise Crossbows.


    My thoughts exactly. Empire clones are not good. I really really hope we get Southern Realms somehow and also Kislev (in game three).
  • Lexen_RapierLexen_Rapier Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 264
    There's always the possibility for CA To change their minds - it'll be based on projected sales and interest.

    I would buy Araby or Cathay straight away, as I would like to see actual new content developed for the Warhammer world.
  • BrightestLightBrightestLight Registered Users Posts: 549
    The problem with dogs of war is their codex was literally just a bunch of mercs, they included rugluds armored orcs, which were a unit of crossbow black orcs, and other such non-human things.

    in reality, what people want isn't dogs of war, it's an unnamed faction that encompasses tilea, estalia, border princes, and many old world colonies many of which are empire, many brettonian, and many are 'other') and until recently i would have said sartosa could be under this banner....you could call it free nations or city states or something, but it wouldn't be dogs of war going by the codex.
    kislev, imo, are deserving of their own roster--the problem is that they have even less of a presence than wood elves, who already have no presence save for one..and a half parts of the world
  • XajmaiXajmai Registered Users Posts: 10

    The problem with dogs of war is their codex was literally just a bunch of mercs, they included rugluds armored orcs, which were a unit of crossbow black orcs, and other such non-human things.

    in reality, what people want isn't dogs of war, it's an unnamed faction that encompasses tilea, estalia, border princes, and many old world colonies many of which are empire, many brettonian, and many are 'other') and until recently i would have said sartosa could be under this banner....you could call it free nations or city states or something, but it wouldn't be dogs of war going by the codex.
    kislev, imo, are deserving of their own roster--the problem is that they have even less of a presence than wood elves, who already have no presence save for one..and a half parts of the world

    Well i would say youre somewhat correct. It would be cool to get southern realms as a pike oriented faction where you would take the human units from the army list and make them standard units, then taking the units from other races and making them ROR. So pizzarros lost legion would be a recruitable unit and the crossbow orcs would be ROR. Something along those lines would be really cool and different from all other races in the game. I realize however that implementing pikes is not the easiest in a warhammer game since you cant have it work like in rome 1, but it would suck if they work just like usual WH human spearmen, they need more stopping power than normal spearmen but they cant be an inpenetrable wall like in rome 1.
  • Red11sgb#3690Red11sgb#3690 Registered Users Posts: 167
    I agree, what huge mistake on CAs part to cash out on additional races. I imagine the only reason they are doing LP now and not RP is that it's easier for them to create 6 new units and two LL than it is for them to create a new race. What a disappointment
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,745
    I'm disappointed. That said it depends which LP's we get. If it's generic generic blade and the Vanilla hero then no thanks. If it's the right crossovers then I'm down for it.
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  • uriakuriak Registered Users Posts: 4,437
    The RoR that constitutes DoW proper wouldn't be that interesting. People were more attracted both to the possible rules for such mercenary armies (and we somewhat got them as opponent through rogue armies) and the italian inspired nations, as said above.

    As gameplay element, both Araby and TEB would have offered some new elements probably.
    TEB are not monster heavy but would bring in the kind of heavy infantry humands don't have, with pikes being a gamechanger
    Araby design is less certain, in warmaster they had a trickster quality through their magic, but those armies were less defined. Like Kislev there is an importance about light cavalry and skirmishers. For the fantasy element, magic carpets and djiinis were something different (carptes less so, they would have been in terradon territory, probably) Djiinns being fast mounts imbued with different powers.

    About monsters in general, they are a very cool element of the game but are even more important when confronted to armies made of varied regiments. I think we've kinda covered all the generic kinds of units so far (maybe monstrous chariots ? But lords on chariot do play that role, and don't get me started about flying artillery, :X) what's missing are specific combined elements in varied rosters

    Daemons have a lot of rather fragile troops with much more hitting power than most undead, plus a few incredibly badass lords types. Ogres are a full large faction, with kinda OP charges, CD have expendable greenskins plus quite resilient dwarf elite units with a few monsters and weird weird artillery. A kinf of in between dwarfs, skavens and greenskins. They could end up with one the most interesting roster in battles.

    Note than none of the remaining canon factions have a regimental oriented army. Those were Empire, Bretonnia, elves, essentially. Others do make usage of monsters, magic and other weird technology as their strengths. I do understand that italian/arabic/est european themed armies are less easy to market but hey they are badass in their own ways and can be the unsung heroes of an age of darkness.
  • Goatforce#6625Goatforce#6625 Registered Users Posts: 8,466
    Enforest said:

    Don't forget that CA once said that Bretonnia will be the last major addon for TWW1 only to release Norsca a few months later. They may change their mind, especially due to large community unrest.

    Yeah they probably don't include pre-order bonus in that statement. I would be very suprised if the pre-order for game 3 is a LP for game 2 - most likely it will be a Race Pack, Kislev or DoW perhaps (depending on Cores for 3).
  • Walkabout#1505Walkabout#1505 Member In a houseRegistered Users Posts: 2,998

    The historians of the future will call our time "Total War: Warhammer - The Age Of Demanding Minor Lore Factions And Not Getting Any".

    or "Total War: Warhammer - The Age Of Trying to Give a Game Company More Money and Them Refusing to Take it"
    Live your life and try to do no harm.

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