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Increase Leadership penalties for only having Flyers left

OrkLadsOrkLads Posts: 713Registered Users
These penalties are far too low and recover far too quickly for minimal time spent on the ground. Especially because more often than not you will end up with Single Entity flyers as your last unit when this happens, so you can just endlessly aerial cycle charge with no penalties.

Please make this penalty actually have a bit of bite to it, not be something you can basically work around with no effort.

Comments

  • Green0Green0 Posts: 3,904Registered Users
    not always as easy as it sounds to cycle charge with flyers, but I agree this could be an improvement.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Posts: 6,465Registered Users
    The LD penalty should just not recover.
  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Posts: 3,542Registered Users
    You could make it effectively force you to stay on the ground. But right now it can trigger a little too fast before you even have a time to try to hit the ground. So maybe trigger a little later but make it permanent to essentially force you to stay down.

    All that said, I've found it pretty effective as is.
  • tank3487tank3487 Member Posts: 1,082Registered Users
    IMHO just some small additional delay before it would start to recover would be enough.
  • FerrousTarkusFerrousTarkus Posts: 431Registered Users
    This is the kind of things that should require a delay. Effects should rarely be instantaneous in video games, a small 5-10 seconds delay would mostly solve this issue. It would guarantee a couple of hits without forcing the flyer on the ground.
  • TlaxtlanSoothsayerTlaxtlanSoothsayer Posts: 2,048Registered Users
    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.
  • TennisgolfbollTennisgolfboll Posts: 6,657Registered Users
    OrkLads said:

    These penalties are far too low and recover far too quickly for minimal time spent on the ground. Especially because more often than not you will end up with Single Entity flyers as your last unit when this happens, so you can just endlessly aerial cycle charge with no penalties.

    Please make this penalty actually have a bit of bite to it, not be something you can basically work around with no effort.

    Well said
    Read all my replies as if we are having a pint and a good old time. I will always read your reply like that.
  • DandalusXVIIDandalusXVII Posts: 4,042Registered Users
    edited June 8

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Posts: 6,465Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
  • DandalusXVIIDandalusXVII Posts: 4,042Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Posts: 6,465Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
  • DandalusXVIIDandalusXVII Posts: 4,042Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
    I always bring a unit of poison warhounds as Chaos to counter the flying units. Cavalry isn't necessity. You can also have crypt ghouls, witch elves, there are tools on every faction.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Posts: 6,465Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
    I always bring a unit of poison warhounds as Chaos to counter the flying units. Cavalry isn't necessity. You can also have crypt ghouls, witch elves, there are tools on every faction.
    What...? this only happens end game, if they kill your hounds how can you do it? the units you mentioned dont force dragons to stay on the ground at all.
  • DandalusXVIIDandalusXVII Posts: 4,042Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
    I always bring a unit of poison warhounds as Chaos to counter the flying units. Cavalry isn't necessity. You can also have crypt ghouls, witch elves, there are tools on every faction.
    What...? this only happens end game, if they kill your hounds how can you do it? the units you mentioned dont force dragons to stay on the ground at all.
    Poison slows. I keep my hounds alive. Witch elves cause rampage so control loss.
  • Green0Green0 Posts: 3,904Registered Users

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
    I always bring a unit of poison warhounds as Chaos to counter the flying units. Cavalry isn't necessity. You can also have crypt ghouls, witch elves, there are tools on every faction.
    What...? this only happens end game, if they kill your hounds how can you do it? the units you mentioned dont force dragons to stay on the ground at all.
    Poison slows. I keep my hounds alive. Witch elves cause rampage so control loss.
    Hounds get terror routed instantly by any terror-causing flyer. 80% of flyers in this game cause terror.
  • DandalusXVIIDandalusXVII Posts: 4,042Registered Users
    Green0 said:

    Agreed.

    As it stands right now the penalty doesn't work.

    When you only have 1 flying unit such as a Terrorgheist or griffon or whatnot left, then it's still possible to cycle charge an infinite amount of time, because the leadership penalty doesn't mean anything, as long as you attack once in a while.

    I disagree, the penalty forces you to attack but doesn't kills you straight away for having only air units left but gives you the opportunity to plan your attack. It kills if you try to kite. I don't find it wrongly implemented as it is now. But as many of us supported in the past flyers should hover as they do in tabletop, not fly by default but walk on the ground by default. I hope CA will do this in TWW3.
    no you can just rotate cycle charging and never suffer the LD penalty.
    Yes but this works only vs noobs.
    no it works vs everyone because theres no way to stop it unless you got cav left.
    I always bring a unit of poison warhounds as Chaos to counter the flying units. Cavalry isn't necessity. You can also have crypt ghouls, witch elves, there are tools on every faction.
    What...? this only happens end game, if they kill your hounds how can you do it? the units you mentioned dont force dragons to stay on the ground at all.
    Poison slows. I keep my hounds alive. Witch elves cause rampage so control loss.
    Hounds get terror routed instantly by any terror-causing flyer. 80% of flyers in this game cause terror.
    No they don't get terror routed, I don't fight with them a lot, they can hit what I want, then run away from battle then come back to fight when I want.
  • sonofabhorashsonofabhorash Posts: 9Registered Users
    Its OK as it is now
    Just keep some cav or range in reserve
    To go air costs some money and not a little
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