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The Green Knight !

AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users
hello fellas, so I just want to bring this to the forum and to the ears of CA.

I do believe that the Green knight is underpowered. HE is a 1900 gold unit, the thing is he is tanky, but if the enemy has magic damage he becomes extremely squishy, which makes him a huge risk. I don't have any problems with High risk High reward units, the thing is that the high rewards is not there. He struggles a whole lot to get to his preferred targets( Lords and Heroes) and he can be bogged down extremely quickly. There is pretty much never a situation where you would want to use him. he is playable in a match up like the greenskins, but mainly because the enemy simply never expects it.

What I would propose is giving him an ability like Kroq Gar has, with recharge in melee. so he at least can get out of chaff and is not condemned to fight zombies for the entire match. HE struggles to fight chaff and he is so expensive that he must do a whole lot to pay for himself. He has nothing to support his troops, so his only utility is his fighting prowess.

I also think that 400 WS for such an expensive unit is a bit low, maybe 430 would be more fitting.

just a quick reminder, this is NOT a discussion about bretonnia or do they deserve a buff on a unit, this is purely a discussion about the Greenknight himself, you can for sure take into account faction synergy, but no: Bretonnia is strong enough no buffs. As balance works with nerf to OP units and buffs to UP units, thats how we achieve a good balance.

Enjoy the discussion :)




«134

Comments

  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Posts: 4,443Registered Users
    The high reward is definitely there against factions that don’t have or armies that don’t take magic damage. He’s an assassin and almost unkillable with healing. He works as a late game terror causing survivor.

    Feels like most ethereal. Better than many.
  • OrkLadsOrkLads Posts: 1,388Registered Users
    He still has his uses, you can vanguard deploy him in a forest and keep a drawkite in your back pocket just in case.
  • Wyvern2Wyvern2 Posts: 1,358Registered Users
    I think a melee only CD verminous valour type spell would be nifty for sure. With Hippos getting their pathing changed and Bordeleaux getting his buffs I think Green Knight has fallen off as a desperation anti-large pick, and it leaves him being undesirable. The only target he does decent against is other heroes, except he literally has to be the one on said heroes since he doesn't have utility debuffs like someone such as wulfrik or red duke. Realistically, if you want to terror bomb someone reliably while getting a bunch of utility, you're gonna bring a hippo lord or hippogryphs, not the green knight.
    OrkLads said:

    He still has his uses, you can vanguard deploy him in a forest and keep a drawkite in your back pocket just in case.

    I think drawkiting shouldn't be used as a metric on whether or not a unit is OP. It's just a case of bad game mechanics, and while the green knight is probably one of the more easily abusable, he's hardly the only such unit. Even slayers can be annoying to catch, empire has 2 potentially abusive draw kiting tools(stank and volkmar), Wood Elves have Orion etc
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  • ystyst Posts: 6,075Registered Users
    ^ 1000% that. I had suggested him getting ability as vermin valor in the past for him just so he can be valuable. He likes to leap, usually getting himself way deeper into formation that ends him.

    His greatest problem is spell, afterall being THE MOST EXPENSIVE single model in game. No one has a base of $1900. Any cute leeches u be reaping like $500 per cast lol, which literally everyone has it. From emp to tombs to frikking almost every single faction.

    Love the work CA did for him, however he needs a bit more. Maybe its time finally look at price reduction.

    This guy needs to be feared. Hes pretty much never joining the game costing anything less than $2050s. Needs to perform greater work than those of ror drag prince in the 1800s, a shaggoth etc. hes still very much a death sentence on any engagement as he can hardly disengage
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  • CanuoveaCanuovea Posts: 13,131Registered Users, Moderators
    Could he get some kind of formation disruption spell like Kroq-Gar gets? So he can disengage? It could represent his mobility.
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  • ystyst Posts: 6,075Registered Users
    edited June 14
    Also wheres the vigor already, seeimg him exhausted is a joke. Afterall hes the king of grails, the greatest and first ever grail. So much so hes even immortalised.

    Long overdue that immune to vig and “bret valor” ability. Still god awful risky to pick vs everything. Maybe cept dwf and who else really.

    CA did give him a lot of things. Like steamtank, hes getting there, not yet but not that far

    Hes the symbol of bretonnia, can even say hes bretonnia himself tbh. Needs to be a serious threat, costs doesnt really reflect that yet
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  • CanuoveaCanuovea Posts: 13,131Registered Users, Moderators
    Doesn't he have Vigour Immunity after the Bret Update?

    Or am I just crazy?
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  • Loupi_Loupi_ Posts: 1,297Registered Users
    I don't really get this argument of him getting bogged down easily, he has 84 speed and can be microed to avoid any engagement he doesn't like. He's not some helpless footlord who can't easily choose where/who they fight. He has amazing duelling power and mobility. I think giving him a "get out of jail free card" in the form of an explosion would be a bit much.

    I would support a small price drop and a bit more mass though.
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Posts: 1,297Registered Users
    Canuovea said:

    Could he get some kind of formation disruption spell like Kroq-Gar gets? So he can disengage? It could represent his mobility.

    surely his mobility is already represented by his 84 speed.
  • Disposable HeroDisposable Hero Posts: 3,726Registered Users
    Yeah he has 950 mass which makes it more difficult to push out of chaff. Nobles have 1000 and handmaidens 600. I don't know what's appropriate but having gotten handmaidens stuck in peasants I can see the problem. :smile:

    In general I think etherial trait should somehow help units push through things. Not without resistance, but when moving and not attacking it would be cool if they could slip through, but it would have to be by a mechanism that doesn't give them huge mass when charging, because that would also seem strange....
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Posts: 1,297Registered Users

    Yeah he has 950 mass which makes it more difficult to push out of chaff. Nobles have 1000 and handmaidens 600. I don't know what's appropriate but having gotten handmaidens stuck in peasants I can see the problem. :smile:

    In general I think etherial trait should somehow help units push through things. Not without resistance, but when moving and not attacking it would be cool if they could slip through, but it would have to be by a mechanism that doesn't give them huge mass when charging, because that would also seem strange....

    maybe it could be done like how the skaven summons used to have no hitbox in the first few seconds. I don't know if that's something that can be done via an active ability. It would definitely make all ethereals much more spooky.
  • Disposable HeroDisposable Hero Posts: 3,726Registered Users
    Loupi_ said:

    Yeah he has 950 mass which makes it more difficult to push out of chaff. Nobles have 1000 and handmaidens 600. I don't know what's appropriate but having gotten handmaidens stuck in peasants I can see the problem. :smile:

    In general I think etherial trait should somehow help units push through things. Not without resistance, but when moving and not attacking it would be cool if they could slip through, but it would have to be by a mechanism that doesn't give them huge mass when charging, because that would also seem strange....

    maybe it could be done like how the skaven summons used to have no hitbox in the first few seconds. I don't know if that's something that can be done via an active ability. It would definitely make all ethereals much more spooky.
    Maybe one could make an active ability that lasts for 10 seconds, disables the attack command, puts down attack speed to 60 seconds (i.e. no attack animation), no MA/CB/charge speed, and put radius to 0. Maybe someone could mod it to see if it would work? :smile:
  • keroro7keroro7 Posts: 220Registered Users
    edited June 14
    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.
  • another505another505 Posts: 1,010Registered Users
    keroro7 said:

    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.

    Not really. All you need is to zone him out from your heroes or SEM with chaffs

    And to op, yes his base is 1900, with dolorous blade it hits to 2200... more than rhk and extremely hard to use. Has no debuffs or any support element to other units. No mass to get out of chaffs so require constant support.

    He has only a few mu useful but recently:
    after lzm and skaven patch, lzm which is one of its main mu got removed since starchamber guardian are almost always present against bret mu.

    And vindicative gaze are still common and now hes also useless against GS

    Against emp, now it has death. Spirit leech is a common pick to remove bret cavs

    It really needs both immunity to vigor, he is the first grail knight and he needs to keep fighting to make value. Even other duelist lords have some basic support abilities but not him

    And what op said similar to kroq qar.
  • ystyst Posts: 6,075Registered Users
    I mean he just doesnt trade anything at all lol. He can fight a chaos knight with him down to 40% and knights down to 30% like thats a frikking $1900 trading $1500. Put in his blade and stuffs its over $2200.

    Not even sure which faction u can even bring him, literally 0 uses at all. Cant bring vs empire, dark elf, high elf, wood elf, beastman, chaos, nosca, tombs, voast, vamps heck i be listing the entire warhammer factions at this rate
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  • another505another505 Posts: 1,010Registered Users
    yst said:

    I mean he just doesnt trade anything at all lol. He can fight a chaos knight with him down to 40% and knights down to 30% like thats a frikking $1900 trading $1500. Put in his blade and stuffs its over $2200.

    Not even sure which faction u can even bring him, literally 0 uses at all. Cant bring vs empire, dark elf, high elf, wood elf, beastman, chaos, nosca, tombs, voast, vamps heck i be listing the entire warhammer factions at this rate

    The only one that can be brought is BM but not even that good... against bm i find you really need to spend gold on your front line

    And two units that are common pick against bret, the manripper ror and cygor ror has magic dmg
  • Wyvern2Wyvern2 Posts: 1,358Registered Users

    yst said:

    I mean he just doesnt trade anything at all lol. He can fight a chaos knight with him down to 40% and knights down to 30% like thats a frikking $1900 trading $1500. Put in his blade and stuffs its over $2200.

    Not even sure which faction u can even bring him, literally 0 uses at all. Cant bring vs empire, dark elf, high elf, wood elf, beastman, chaos, nosca, tombs, voast, vamps heck i be listing the entire warhammer factions at this rate

    The only one that can be brought is BM but not even that good... against bm i find you really need to spend gold on your front line

    And two units that are common pick against bret, the manripper ror and cygor ror has magic dmg
    manrippers dont do magic damage, sons of ghorros do, that said, lore of death isnt exactly a bad lore for ebastmen vs brettonia, so im not sure the GK is that great either.
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  • AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users
    OrkLads said:

    He still has his uses, you can vanguard deploy him in a forest and keep a drawkite in your back pocket just in case.

    Humm this is not something we should encourage of take into balancing 😂


  • AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users
    eumaies said:

    The high reward is definitely there against factions that don’t have or armies that don’t take magic damage. He’s an assassin and almost unkillable with healing. He works as a late game terror causing survivor.

    Feels like most ethereal. Better than many.

    I know all the he can be usefull sometimes, but lets be honest here he is never picked in high level play. Also I think this forum should change his mentality a bit. Recently almost all units are usable in certain condition, but now we should aim to make every units to its optimal role. The balance is so close atm that if we only buff units that are unusable, well there is barely nothing to change.

    Is the unit optimal ? I do not believe so, with a small buff he could become so, this is what we should aim now, otherwise there aint much to do other than nerf new units.


  • ystyst Posts: 6,075Registered Users
    Also death lore as they are common pick, i mean unless they r not prepared then should be punished. Insanely high risk unit, blade is pretty much compulsory so ur looking at a $2200 ish unit. This guy is even more expensive than shaggoth, its hard to imagine its nothing but a single cav sized model
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  • AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users
    keroro7 said:

    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.

    You could reduce his physical resistance to 50% and increase his HP, so he is still vulnerable to magic, but less squishy to it, while being a bit more vulnerable to normal units


  • ystyst Posts: 6,075Registered Users
    ^ should be applied to all ghosts. They all have too little hp for the resist to function properly.

    Extreme risks, very little limited rewards
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  • keroro7keroro7 Posts: 220Registered Users

    keroro7 said:

    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.

    Not really. All you need is to zone him out from your heroes or SEM with chaffs

    And to op, yes his base is 1900, with dolorous blade it hits to 2200... more than rhk and extremely hard to use. Has no debuffs or any support element to other units. No mass to get out of chaffs so require constant support.

    He has only a few mu useful but recently:
    after lzm and skaven patch, lzm which is one of its main mu got removed since starchamber guardian are almost always present against bret mu.

    And vindicative gaze are still common and now hes also useless against GS

    Against emp, now it has death. Spirit leech is a common pick to remove bret cavs

    It really needs both immunity to vigor, he is the first grail knight and he needs to keep fighting to make value. Even other duelist lords have some basic support abilities but not him

    And what op said similar to kroq qar.
    sorry, I was not a serious comment. It was a joke. i mean not much serious yes-yes :D .
    but if it seems serious, it is my fault and I will write a serious answer from now.

    before I compare it to the cursed paladin I think it can find good answer.

    the two are very similar.

    i.e)

    cursed pala -> green knight

    HP + 375
    LD + 55
    SP + 9
    MA + 15
    MD + 10
    WS + 40 (also green got more AP focused)
    CB + 15

    COST + 800

    yes, LD score is meaningless coz unbreakable.
    and stat.
    i compared to a tyrion,archaon with good stats(+AP) riding a horse like a green knight.
    the result is a price that is either not enough or not impressive.
    actually, I'm surprised. yes, u r right.

    but I think it is a reasonable price because of terror and phy-resistance.

    as i said, he got 75% physical resist.
    yes, some factions really hard to defeat him.

    my main is DE,LZ and fay-Green It is true that the pair is very difficult to deal with.
    at least I can try to resist with a double slan lol when I do LZ, but DE really does not have meaning tool in my view
    and im not sure, but Is it difficult for DW.

    it is not so scary enough to be able to play the game, but it is tricky.
    I am worried about what will happen if he more got some buff.

    but I know ur point.
    he is a cool guy and it is sad that he can not use it in various matchups.
    now the spirit units, including the Green-knight, are designed to be hard to find in good and bad match-ups only in good match-ups overall.

    umm... I think units are fine. but maybe one man heroes need some change.
    so, seriously, I think that it is the first time to stabilize by lowering physical resistance and adding armor point to achieve average performance than now.

    then I think it is better to look for a while, before give him buff.
    right now, paladins do not have immunity-Vigor.
  • another505another505 Posts: 1,010Registered Users
    edited June 14
    Wyvern2 said:

    yst said:

    I mean he just doesnt trade anything at all lol. He can fight a chaos knight with him down to 40% and knights down to 30% like thats a frikking $1900 trading $1500. Put in his blade and stuffs its over $2200.

    Not even sure which faction u can even bring him, literally 0 uses at all. Cant bring vs empire, dark elf, high elf, wood elf, beastman, chaos, nosca, tombs, voast, vamps heck i be listing the entire warhammer factions at this rate

    The only one that can be brought is BM but not even that good... against bm i find you really need to spend gold on your front line

    And two units that are common pick against bret, the manripper ror and cygor ror has magic dmg
    manrippers dont do magic damage, sons of ghorros do, that said, lore of death isnt exactly a bad lore for ebastmen vs brettonia, so im not sure the GK is that great either.
    my bad. All i remembered it was a magical anti large inf.

    But yea, with death, it proves the point that the green knight doesnt have a good mu against anything currently.
    His ethereal and large. so you want to bring magical anti large which is also the main tool against Bret. So hes not even really a surprise counter pick.
  • Wyvern2Wyvern2 Posts: 1,358Registered Users

    Wyvern2 said:

    yst said:

    I mean he just doesnt trade anything at all lol. He can fight a chaos knight with him down to 40% and knights down to 30% like thats a frikking $1900 trading $1500. Put in his blade and stuffs its over $2200.

    Not even sure which faction u can even bring him, literally 0 uses at all. Cant bring vs empire, dark elf, high elf, wood elf, beastman, chaos, nosca, tombs, voast, vamps heck i be listing the entire warhammer factions at this rate

    The only one that can be brought is BM but not even that good... against bm i find you really need to spend gold on your front line

    And two units that are common pick against bret, the manripper ror and cygor ror has magic dmg
    manrippers dont do magic damage, sons of ghorros do, that said, lore of death isnt exactly a bad lore for ebastmen vs brettonia, so im not sure the GK is that great either.
    my bad. All i remembered it was a magical anti large inf.

    But yea, with death, it proves the point that the green knight doesnt have a good mu against anything currently.
    His ethereal and large. so you want to bring magical anti large which is also the main tool against Bret. So hes not even really a surprise counter pick.
    Sons of ghorros are the centigor RoR, they're honestly not that great vs brets imo, tend to get dumpstered by knights on the charge. Khorroks manrippers are AL infantry, but get no magical attacks, so youre not gonna be killing GK anytime soon with them.
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  • another505another505 Posts: 1,010Registered Users
    keroro7 said:

    keroro7 said:

    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.

    Not really. All you need is to zone him out from your heroes or SEM with chaffs

    And to op, yes his base is 1900, with dolorous blade it hits to 2200... more than rhk and extremely hard to use. Has no debuffs or any support element to other units. No mass to get out of chaffs so require constant support.

    He has only a few mu useful but recently:
    after lzm and skaven patch, lzm which is one of its main mu got removed since starchamber guardian are almost always present against bret mu.

    And vindicative gaze are still common and now hes also useless against GS

    Against emp, now it has death. Spirit leech is a common pick to remove bret cavs

    It really needs both immunity to vigor, he is the first grail knight and he needs to keep fighting to make value. Even other duelist lords have some basic support abilities but not him

    And what op said similar to kroq qar.
    sorry, I was not a serious comment. It was a joke. i mean not much serious yes-yes :D .
    but if it seems serious, it is my fault and I will write a serious answer from now.

    before I compare it to the cursed paladin I think it can find good answer.

    the two are very similar.

    i.e)

    cursed pala -> green knight

    HP + 375
    LD + 55
    SP + 9
    MA + 15
    MD + 10
    WS + 40 (also green got more AP focused)
    CB + 15

    COST + 800

    yes, LD score is meaningless coz unbreakable.
    and stat.
    i compared to a tyrion,archaon with good stats(+AP) riding a horse like a green knight.
    the result is a price that is either not enough or not impressive.
    actually, I'm surprised. yes, u r right.

    but I think it is a reasonable price because of terror and phy-resistance.

    as i said, he got 75% physical resist.
    yes, some factions really hard to defeat him.

    my main is DE,LZ and fay-Green It is true that the pair is very difficult to deal with.
    at least I can try to resist with a double slan lol when I do LZ, but DE really does not have meaning tool in my view
    and im not sure, but Is it difficult for DW.

    it is not so scary enough to be able to play the game, but it is tricky.
    I am worried about what will happen if he more got some buff.

    but I know ur point.
    he is a cool guy and it is sad that he can not use it in various matchups.
    now the spirit units, including the Green-knight, are designed to be hard to find in good and bad match-ups only in good match-ups overall.

    umm... I think units are fine. but maybe one man heroes need some change.
    so, seriously, I think that it is the first time to stabilize by lowering physical resistance and adding armor point to achieve average performance than now.

    then I think it is better to look for a while, before give him buff.
    right now, paladins do not have immunity-Vigor.


    Even if you forgot to bring the magic damage tool such as death magic(doomfire warlock and ror) or starchamber for de and lzm respectively. There are ways to zone him out.

    But i cant think of some factions that struggle with him. Even at the best MU for him, i think he struggles to recuperate 2200 gold.
    Think about it, he can't even recuperate his cost if he was able to solo a shaggoth. ( im actually not even sure if he can beat a shaggoth alone) Other duelist lords/hero can give buff or fight against medium targets to slowly recuperate the cost. The green knight at this HIGH price point still requires a lot of support and does one thing only that can make its gold back.

    Another unit similar to him is Grail Guardian. By paper they arent bad, but in practice, they are extremely niche use that in the best mu scenario is still debatable to bring them.

    I get what you mean that he can be toxic if overbuffed, similar to how i see hellstorm rockets could get a tiny buff and leave it be.
    He used to have armor and lower physical resistance. It was the way to go but I think CA wants to give some consistency to ethereal and that made it worse for him.
    I would love that to come back so he is more balanced against all MU which good for both the green knight and opponents. In the end, i still think he deserves immune to vigour and something to get out of chaffs
  • another505another505 Posts: 1,010Registered Users
    edited June 14
    Also, when he dies

    It shouldnt have a dead body.
    He should just goes *poof* same thing for other ethereals
  • keroro7keroro7 Posts: 220Registered Users
    edited June 14

    keroro7 said:

    keroro7 said:

    The Green Knight is already powerful enough for a faction without a SE with magic properties.

    There are two ways to make him stronger.

    1. no mp - only sp

    2. Physical resistance huge reduced.

    Not really. All you need is to zone him out from your heroes or SEM with chaffs

    And to op, yes his base is 1900, with dolorous blade it hits to 2200... more than rhk and extremely hard to use. Has no debuffs or any support element to other units. No mass to get out of chaffs so require constant support.

    He has only a few mu useful but recently:
    after lzm and skaven patch, lzm which is one of its main mu got removed since starchamber guardian are almost always present against bret mu.

    And vindicative gaze are still common and now hes also useless against GS

    Against emp, now it has death. Spirit leech is a common pick to remove bret cavs

    It really needs both immunity to vigor, he is the first grail knight and he needs to keep fighting to make value. Even other duelist lords have some basic support abilities but not him

    And what op said similar to kroq qar.
    sorry, I was not a serious comment. It was a joke. i mean not much serious yes-yes :D .
    but if it seems serious, it is my fault and I will write a serious answer from now.

    before I compare it to the cursed paladin I think it can find good answer.

    the two are very similar.

    i.e)

    cursed pala -> green knight

    HP + 375
    LD + 55
    SP + 9
    MA + 15
    MD + 10
    WS + 40 (also green got more AP focused)
    CB + 15

    COST + 800

    yes, LD score is meaningless coz unbreakable.
    and stat.
    i compared to a tyrion,archaon with good stats(+AP) riding a horse like a green knight.
    the result is a price that is either not enough or not impressive.
    actually, I'm surprised. yes, u r right.

    but I think it is a reasonable price because of terror and phy-resistance.

    as i said, he got 75% physical resist.
    yes, some factions really hard to defeat him.

    my main is DE,LZ and fay-Green It is true that the pair is very difficult to deal with.
    at least I can try to resist with a double slan lol when I do LZ, but DE really does not have meaning tool in my view
    and im not sure, but Is it difficult for DW.

    it is not so scary enough to be able to play the game, but it is tricky.
    I am worried about what will happen if he more got some buff.

    but I know ur point.
    he is a cool guy and it is sad that he can not use it in various matchups.
    now the spirit units, including the Green-knight, are designed to be hard to find in good and bad match-ups only in good match-ups overall.

    umm... I think units are fine. but maybe one man heroes need some change.
    so, seriously, I think that it is the first time to stabilize by lowering physical resistance and adding armor point to achieve average performance than now.

    then I think it is better to look for a while, before give him buff.
    right now, paladins do not have immunity-Vigor.


    Even if you forgot to bring the magic damage tool such as death magic(doomfire warlock and ror) or starchamber for de and lzm respectively. There are ways to zone him out.

    But i cant think of some factions that struggle with him. Even at the best MU for him, i think he struggles to recuperate 2200 gold.
    Think about it, he can't even recuperate his cost if he was able to solo a shaggoth. ( im actually not even sure if he can beat a shaggoth alone) Other duelist lords/hero can give buff or fight against medium targets to slowly recuperate the cost. The green knight at this HIGH price point still requires a lot of support and does one thing only that can make its gold back.

    Another unit similar to him is Grail Guardian. By paper they arent bad, but in practice, they are extremely niche use that in the best mu scenario is still debatable to bring them.

    I get what you mean that he can be toxic if overbuffed, similar to how i see hellstorm rockets could get a tiny buff and leave it be.
    He used to have armor and lower physical resistance. It was the way to go but I think CA wants to give some consistency to ethereal and that made it worse for him.
    I would love that to come back so he is more balanced against all MU which good for both the green knight and opponents. In the end, i still think he deserves immune to vigour and something to get out of chaffs
    Honestly, my LZ is sucks, I just use them coz skinks so cute lol.
    but DE is fine.
    yes, ROR definitely works. But it's hard to take it because of GK. In Bretonia, it's hard to take GK because of SP, it's funny situation to worry about each other :D . And mass-SP is not very effective. It's actually hp5400-5500 when fay's support regrowth. Another way is to cast a magic attribute with a fire mage, but this depends on the luck, and if i miss the green-knight, it's hard time come lol.

    I also experimented with it. the conclusions that I just ignore him and I had to take another.

    And I also hope that green knight,cursed paladin, etc.... heroes will be used more widely. Good night
  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Posts: 4,443Registered Users
    He has a good matchup vs dwarfs for sure, and then for other races I don't think it's fair to always assume you're going to be facing death magic, particularly vs empire. And on the flip side brettonia can always plan to bring life magic so there's more upside than downside.

    Basically, brettonia has a very limited roster in terms of unit types but can still go wide and give themselves another avenue to win through ethereal end-gaming and still field a pretty strong army.

    He's pricey enough that you could afford to make him cheaper as that's not going to be game-breaking even if you push it too far.

    But making his stats or abilities to avoid his weaknesses would be a big problem since then you have the classic unit that can't be caught, can't be shot, and you either brought direct damage spells / magic attacks or you can't kill him. That's bad design.

  • Wyvern2Wyvern2 Posts: 1,358Registered Users
    eumaies said:

    He has a good matchup vs dwarfs for sure, and then for other races I don't think it's fair to always assume you're going to be facing death magic, particularly vs empire. And on the flip side brettonia can always plan to bring life magic so there's more upside than downside.

    Basically, brettonia has a very limited roster in terms of unit types but can still go wide and give themselves another avenue to win through ethereal end-gaming and still field a pretty strong army.

    He's pricey enough that you could afford to make him cheaper as that's not going to be game-breaking even if you push it too far.

    But making his stats or abilities to avoid his weaknesses would be a big problem since then you have the classic unit that can't be caught, can't be shot, and you either brought direct damage spells / magic attacks or you can't kill him. That's bad design.

    I wouldn't call him good vs dwarfs. He's "good" in the sense that dwarfs cant kill him quickly(unless grombi is on the field, since hes a pretty common pick in that MU), the problem is that he can't kill the dwarfs particularly quickly either, so you're better off putting another squad of hippogryphs on the field.

    Empire might have hammer of witches, silver bullets, fireball, final transmutation etc, so the risk of bringing him into that matchup is pretty huge, and once again, you're probably better off coughing up the cash for far more consistent hippogryphs.
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