Legendary lords battles:Gor-Rok the Great White Lizard vs Tetto'eko Astronomer of the Constellations

Bies

Character overview

Potential character/faction mechanics :
Tetto'eko
- Dispel Chaos Moon (massive reduction of corruption on the entire campaign map, reduction in attack, defense, morals all of chaos armies during battles)

Chaos Moon and the Mage- Priests of Tlaxtlan

- Orbital bombardment (on the campaign map - summons comets to destroy cities)

The return of the ratman

- human slaves (he can recruit several empire units)

Slave warriors of the City of the Moon

Gor-Rok
- retrieving of relics stolen from lizardmen

The Star Stela

- unlocking powerful weapons (Old Ones vaults)

City of Itza

Starting positions in ME
Tetto'eko - Tlaxtlan, City of the Moon

Gor-Rok - Itza, The First City/ Naggaroth, Norsca regions

New units for LL
The are only few units left, Skink Oracles matching nicely with Itza, Tetto'eko maybe can get some new hero created by CA mage-priests but both should get the remaining units: Razordons, Troglodons and some big ones like Dread Saurian, Coatl

tyrannus

Don't we have enough skink lords already? Gor rok could be cool if they made him huge monstrous infantry like Trogg.

Lunaticprince

I love Tetto'eko but go with the white lizard this time.

Iokko

I love these threads!

Ideally we would see both of these, honestly i am biased towards gor rok but he does seem like a good option for a LP, based on the information from this thread.

I mean, he did fight dark elves a lot, so y9u could mske up a rivalry with a DE character, kinda like ikit and tehen were paired despite never fighting personally in lore, and he's been all over the world so you could justify almost any start position, maybe even Albion.

Also, as i learned from this thread, skink oracles originated in itza, so there's some common ground there, thematically speaking.

Tetto Eko seems like one of those characters that CA has described as "more isolated in lore", which according to them make for better FLC additions.

Crossil

Gor Rok for a second playable major LM settlement. Tetto'eko for a forum salt mine.

Eh, in my opinion Tetto'eko offers more in terms of gameplay but it's more fitting that Itza be made playable.

Draculasaurus

We have two Skink lords now, I agree something different is called for. Gor-Rok seems the most likely.

Incidentally, that entry about Tlaxtlan mentioning golden armored Kroxigors is interesting. I've wondered for a while if we might not eventually get a variant Kroxigor unit for the Lizardmen, just so their caste gets a little more presence in the roster. Wouldn't surprise me if at some point their TT unit champions, Kroxigor Ancients, got made into full on units. This bit of fluff about armored Kroxigors seems like the sort of thing CA could draw on.

Actually, that's a pretty solid lineup of units for Gor-Rok: Troglodons, Kroxigor Ancients, and Razordons.

The first two would be relatively easy to do, as you could re-purpose existing models/wireframes. I think Razordons would probably need a unique wireframe at this point, but you usually get at least one of those per side in a Lord Pack. All of them also tie in well with Gor-Rok's themes. You've got the albino Troglodons, who match him visually, you have Kroxigor Ancients, who are of similar age to him and maybe are a more defensive variant to go with his theme as the ultimate unyielding defender, and you've got the Razordon, who likewise got special rules on the TT for using its spikes to defensively hurt enemies that charged it.

Draxynnic

If it's Tetto'ekko, I get to upgrade my Aura Of Called It.

More seriously, for all you might say that Gor-Rok is distinct from Kroq-Gar through being a tanking-oriented foot character, strategically he's just another Saurus and can be expected to favour similar units to Kroq-Gar. Tetto'ekko's astromancy, prognostication, and links to Tepok seem to me to offer more potential for unique campaign mechanics.

Draculasaurus

Draxynnic said:

If it's Tetto'ekko, I get to upgrade my Aura Of Called It.

More seriously, for all you might say that Gor-Rok is distinct from Kroq-Gar through being a tanking-oriented foot character, strategically he's just another Saurus and can be expected to favour similar units to Kroq-Gar. Tetto'ekko's astromancy, prognostication, and links to Tepok seem to me to offer more potential for unique campaign mechanics.

Both would be good lords. I personally just like the variety of another non-Skink lord, whether it's Gor-Rok or not. I'd be fine with Chakax or Nakai.

PoorManatee6197

I personaly prefer Tetto'eko but i would be happy with any of them.

Deckardus

I hope we get both in future, Tlaxtlan and Itza need own legendary Lords.
I prefer Tetto'eko for Lord pack. He can have interesting campaign mechanics about Astronomy and prediction of future.
Gor-Rok is better for FLC. He is just tank version of Kroq-Gar withnout mount, nothing really extra for DLC.

Marker

U people might think we have given up on our Nakai, but he is still '' wandering'' around.

I want Nakai as a hero because people won't accept him as a LL like the White Dwarf.

Draculasaurus

Marker said:

U people might think we have given up on our Nakai, but he is still '' wandering'' around.

I want Nakai as a hero because people won't accept him as a LL like the White Dwarf.

The thing is, aren't he and Gor-Rok both giant albinos since they're both from the First Spawning? I want them to come as a pair, the Great White Bros.

Fossoway

It should have been Tetto'eko, not Tiktaq'to.

But enough skinks for now. We need some brute strength for the Lizardmen.

mightygloin

Seriously enough skinks, should be the Rok when the time comes.

Crossil

Ah, you know what? I'll stand with Tetto'eko since I already stood by him once before. Itza is more relevant but gameplay first.

For instance, in Vortex both Itza and Tlaxtlan are basically the central Lustria LM faction that's badly needed imo. But on ME Itza would I think get involved into the east coast FFA which Cult of Sotek already does. Tlaxtlan however can focus west as its eastern flank is covered by the Cult.

It honestly doesn't bother me that he would be a third Skink LL. And a third Palanquin riding character. And the third(and a half) spell casting character. Astromancy is already in the game with the stance and could easily be further expanded to play onto his mechanics.

Cortes31

Neither of them, I still want Nakai as LL but, if it comes down, Gor Rok. Not a third Skink please!

Maedrethnir

No strong opnion. I want the one that will bring 4/4 of these beauties.

Combat_Wombat

I love me some adorable skinkiboos but I need some more tough Saurus in my LL pool.

SeanJeanquoi

Gor'rok is Literally useless. Totally outclassed by Both Kroq'Gar and Nakai (even oldbloods and Scar Veterans because he has no mount) and he brings nothing new to the table in terms of what units he could buff, his role as a lord or anything.

Arthas_Menethil

SeanJeanquoi said:

Gor'rok is Literally useless. Totally outclassed by Both Kroq'Gar and Nakai (even oldbloods and Scar Veterans) and he brings nothing new to the table in terms of what units he could buff, his role as a lord or anything.

Well done you have ruled out Nakai because Nakai and Gor'Rok share the same role since they are both Tanks. You have now confirmed Tetto'eko.

Combat_Wombat

Arthas_Menethil said:

SeanJeanquoi said:

Gor'rok is Literally useless. Totally outclassed by Both Kroq'Gar and Nakai (even oldbloods and Scar Veterans) and he brings nothing new to the table in terms of what units he could buff, his role as a lord or anything.

Well done you have ruled out Nakai because Nakai and Gor'Rok share the same role since they are both Tanks. You have now confirmed Tetto'eko.

The fool! He's doomed us all!

SeanJeanquoi

@Arthas_Menethil

Good joke their Arthas mate.

in reality Nakai outclasses Gor'rok as a tank in every way and could offer far more as a lord and in what you could do with his campaign.

Tetto'Eko could be cool as well, he could bring a new Lore of magic to the LM potentially and as a lord, his implementation is more conducive to also bringing in the Skink Oracles and/or Troglodons.

Arthas_Menethil

SeanJeanquoi said:

Arthas_Menethil

Good joke their Arthas mate.

in reality Nakai outclasses Gor'rok as a tank in every way and could offer far more as a lord and in what you could do with his campaign.

They are both Tanks you called one utterly useless when they both aren't in the game then they are BOTH utterly useless.

Nakais campaign is going to be a reskinned Green Knight because that is what he is he'll be summoned by others.

But thanks for confirming Tetto'Eko since the tanks for Lizardmen are utterly useless.

Edit: Gor'Roks the better tank given he can resist killing blows and has stronger armour and CA gives tank characters more health that's why Boris Todbringer has more health then the Red Duke for example (remembering from a post I made about Boris and Red Duke being called LL ingame).

SeanJeanquoi

Even if Nakai wasn't a stronger tank, he would be more justified in buffing Krox, Beasts or both as a lord, where as Gor'rok buffs Saurus Warriors....and Saurus warriors....maybe temple guard.

Nakai is also an albino Kroxigor, the only Krox who hasnt been reduced to mindless muscle and our only shot at getting reps for every race of the LM in our lords in WH2 or WH3.

You could take his campaign in a number of directions (all unique for the LM). you also passed over Oxyotl who could do similar things to Nakai in terms of what could be done with him as a lord and what you could do with his campaign (he would buff Camelions and perhaps salamanders and other skirmishers...sooo much better than Saurus....again)

SeanJeanquoi

@Arthas_Menethil

He is useless. not because hes not in the game. not because hes a tank. but because hes a worse tank than Nakai (who would be more interesting) and because he is a bigger version of the generic LM lord we've had in the game for how long now? 2 ish years?! and the hero too! and hes got no mount so no raging dino for him.

so not only would he be underwhelming in that respect but he might actually under perform compared to his mounted generic counterparts (unless he transcends the foot lord problem because hes supposed to be immovable which is a possibility i suppose but still)

SeanJeanquoi

@Arthas_Menethil

I'm curious as to what you think Gor'rok could actually do that would be interesting outside of potentially being in Itza and Buffing saurus Warriors...sorry, i mean: buffing saurus warriors....as well as Kroq Gar.

What could he actually do that'd be interesting? because Itza seems like the a pretty missionary style campaign if I've ever seen one.

you could say that maybe he could fight the dark elves up north instead of sitting in Itza (like maz and Oxyotl *cough *cough) but most people ive seen say that they want him, only really want Itza and dat goldmine.

Arthas_Menethil

SeanJeanquoi said:

Even if Nakai wasn't a stronger tank, he would be more justified in buffing Krox, Beasts or both as a lord, where as Gor'rok buffs Saurus Warriors....and Saurus warriors....maybe temple guard.

Nakai is also an albino Kroxigor, the only Krox who hasnt been reduced to mindless muscle and our only shot at getting reps for every race of the LM in our lords in WH2 or WH3.

You could take his campaign in a number of directions (all unique for the LM). you also passed over Oxyotl who could do similar things to Nakai in terms of what could be done with him as a lord and what you could do with his campaign (he would buff Camelions and perhaps salamanders and other skirmishers...sooo much better than Saurus....again)

SeanJeanquoi said:

Arthas_Menethil

He is useless. not because hes not in the game. not because hes a tank. but because hes a worse tank than Nakai (who would be more interesting) and because he is a bigger version of the generic LM lord we've had in the game for how long now? 2 ish years?! and the hero too! and hes got no mount so no raging dino for him.

so not only would he be underwhelming in that respect but he might actually under perform compared to his mounted generic counterparts (unless he transcends the foot lord problem because hes supposed to be immovable which is a possibility i suppose but still)

Nakai is a worse tank then Gor'Rok since Gor'Rok has better armour, can resist Heroic Killing Blow and is the only Lizardmen character with Stubborn (which means when he's put in units they gain stubborn so he also buffs units in the frontline). Nakai is more offensive and less tanky you'd use him as a tanky Kroq'Gar.

Nakai is the Green Knight that's what Nakai is built around and given the Green Knight ingame Nakai is not coming as a Lord.

And Gor'Rok buffing Kroxigors makes sense considering the role of a tank especially when he buffs those around him. Gor'Rok has no ties to units (just like Nakai) he's a Tank and a commander it can literally be any damage dealing unit in his army. You do not have to be the same thing as the thing you are buffing or Alarielle should not buff handmaidens and the Sisters of Avelorn, Krog'Gar shouldn't buff the monsters of the Lizardmen, Franz shouldn't buff Reiksguard and Greatswords, Gelt shouldn't buff artillery units and unique skills for ranged units.

Also Beasts are already buffed by Krog'Gar or did you forget that Kroq'Gar gives leadership and armour to Segadons, Terradons, Bastiladons and Carnosaurs.

The thread didn't mention Oxyotl which is why Oxyotl was not mentioned as the thread is about Gor'Rok and Tetto'eko.

SeanJeanquoi

oh so Gor'rok gets to buff Krox does he? its funny to see you follow the lore to the letter until it starts disagreeing with you, then you speculate, twist and bend.

you don't have to be the same thing no, and yet the units lords buff are tied to them in some way or another. Alarielle isnt a handmaiden but they are specifically her handmaidens. alarielle isnt a sister of Avelorn but the sisters are her personal bodyguard.

Franz buffs Reiksguard by the same logic: they are his personal retinue. Gelt buffs Artillery because thats something he researched extensively: black powder. he even made new formula for making it and his experiments are the reason why he wears that mask, a freak explosion from his research burned his body. Kroq gar likely buffs beasts because he has a noteworthy Carnosaur mount, so he buffs himself with that.

Gor rok is a saurus who buffs his front line? Saurus are the LM front line infantry (who are tanky themselves) Krox are damage dealers who are a bit more glass cannons than saurus (similar to how you are framing Nakai)

SeanJeanquoi

Kroq gar buffs himself with the saurus buff and buffs grymloq with the carno buff

also, when you say better armour do you mean skaley skin? because he only has 1 more of that than Nakai. nakai would have a higher missile resistence being a Krox as well and also his Weapon has the ability to block attacks that he didn't even see coming.

perhaps your right, maybe Nakai would be a little less of a tank and more a tank esc damage dealer., but then he would still likely outperform Gor'rok, who himself would still likely under perform compared to those already in the game in terms of his usefulness. unless hes absolutely massive (almost like how you could describe another candidate...) i don't see his defensive properties outweighing the mass, disruption and damage that the others could put out.

SeanJeanquoi

@Arthas_Menethil

Nakai is at one with the jungle of lustria, hes a krox and skinks worship him. ergo: he could give leadership buffs to skinks, all manner of buffs to krox and Beasts of the jungle as well. his lore lends itself to this like Alarielle, Like gelt and you yourself just said that Gor'rok has no such justification...other than him being a saurus and buffing his front line (saurus)

Arthas_Menethil

SeanJeanquoi said:

oh so Gor'rok gets to buff Krox does he? its funny to see you follow the lore to the letter until it starts disagreeing with you, then you speculate, twist and bend.

you don't have to be the same thing no, and yet the units lords buff are tied to them in some way or another. Alarielle isnt a handmaiden but they are specifically her handmaidens. alarielle isnt a sister of Avelorn but the sisters are her personal bodyguard.

Franz buffs Reiksguard by the same logic: they are his personal retinue. Gelt buffs Artillery because thats something he researched extensively: black powder. he even made new formula for making it. Kroq gar likely buffs beasts because he has a noteworthy Carnosaur mount, so he buffs himself with that.

Gor rok is a saurus who buffs his front line? Saurus are the LM front line infantry (who are tanky themselves) Krox are damage dealers who are a bit more glass cannons than saurus (similar to how you are framing Nakai)

Franz is not a Knight he is a noble. Gelt is not Engineer he's a Mage, Alarielle isn't an Archer she's the Everqueen. The units are tied to their role not person so they could easily tie a Kroxigor buff to Gor-Rok because of how monstrous infantry are used in this game because they best work with a unit tanking for them hence sending them in after Temple Guard or Saurus Warriors.