How to BEST implement the Ogre Kingdoms

GreyKnightDantes#1402

So I got this idea going on how best to get the Ogre kingdoms implement well. Basically, there are two things in Ogre society, eating and fighting. So....I've come to the conclusion that the best way to make the Ogres feel like the hungry nomads they are is by implementing this.

Migratory Horde Faction

Ogres are nomads. There is no denying it. They are ALWAYS on the move. So, more than likely, the best way to implement this is to make a Horde faction. Now WAIT a minute before you call your local Witch Hunter and have me burned for heresy because this is a SETTLED HORDE type of faction. Think of the Horde factions in Attila. They are hordes yes, but they have the option of settle on lands they conquered. This should be PERFECT for the Ogres, as then they can be both a Horde and a Settled faction that can pop up ANYWHERE on the map. However, they should never be FULLY settled and so there should be an incentive to move to the next "grazing ground", which comes to my next feature.

FOOD! Feed Me! Feed me NOW!

Just like the Skaven, the Ogre campagin feature should focus on two things! Food and MONEY! Like the Skaven, the food meter can have great bonuse to an Ogre faction or a great negative should they not be fed, because they are OGRES afterall! As such, these twin resources must always be sought. One way is to continously attack, raid or loot armies and settlements for not only their money but hte food as well! Or perhaps they can implement a new trading feature where they can be allies or "hired mercenaries" for a faction, whereby they are given like a mission statement by one of the factions in return for their continued service and the Ogres get a constant supply of food in return. And, if the Horde/Mercenary life gets tiring, they can always settle down in a settlement and become a settled faction. However, they shouldn't be settled which brings me to my next feature.

FERTILITY AND GRAZING GROUNDS!

If an Ogre faction DOES decides to settle down, each province in the world map should have a deciding factor of how "fertile" it is. Basically, once an Ogre horde settles, for the first dozen turns, they get ample bonus of food which should feed that horde army. However, overtime this fertility will go to barren and cannot support the faction anylonger unless perhaps they heavily investe in research and buildings to make it so that its atleast "managable". This essentially introduces this idea of MIGRATORY HORDE, whereby these hungry Ogres would go from one grazing ground to another for food. As for the Ogre Kingdoms lands themselves I have this one last idea.

Ogre Homeland Bonus

I think they should implement where hte homeland of the Ogre Kingdoms have a SET fertility rate, whereby it allows the Ogres there to settle without having the move constantly. Basically, it is set so that it will provide ENOUGH food to feed the Ogres but NOT as abundant as if they were to go out West and look for new lands. This way, the Ogre Kingdoms is a spot where you can either fight your dominace against othe Ogres for territory or you can strike out west and make a new kingdom of your own!



BOOM! What yall think?

Nazjax#2857

Savage orcs have this mechanic of settlemends/horde ! They can both play as horde or take a settlement

BaronRodney#9956

I was initially reluctant to have them as a horde faction but reading your post and understanding that they still do hold the Ogre Kingdoms area of the map I’m actually behind this idea. I think it would work more or less!

Draculasaurus

If nothing else I expect their economy will be very weak and just staying in their native lands will not be enough to win the game. Like Norsca or the Greenskins a lot of their money (and food) will probably be acquired through raiding and sacking.

Beast_of_Guanyin#8747

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

Draculasaurus

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

Captain_Rex#1635

Ogres are famous for traveling so they would be perfect as a semi horde faction like Vampirates.

The player could normally conquer regions but at the same time also get the chance to build up the horde. That would make it possible to operate far away from the mountains of Mourn.

Basically like the ship building mechanic for Vampirates.

Federykx99

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

What if the whole purpose of the first two games was to test all the features the ogres will get and game 3 map features only an enormous version of the mountains of mourn with only ogres with 16 different racial mechanics?

SiWI#8629

I generally like what I read but oen thing missing is a special mercenary mechanic if not for them as a whole then for the Maneaters.

Something like "you can unlock more variants by having treaties with other races" or like that.

Captain_Rex#1635

A mercenary mechanic for more ogre variants would be awesome! I would love to get some kind of Samurai style ogres after treaties with nippon... wait

Bloodydagger#9716

Please, no more hordes. I hate the horde mechanic.

FinishingLast#1402

Kelefane said:

Please, no more hordes. I hate the horde mechanic.

Considering that the other potential horde races have all had a more limited horde option since Beastmen shows that CA doesn't want to do strict hordes either in my opinion. It's why Norsca can populate capitals and ports or Vampire Coast operates as both a horde and regular faction.

If Ogre Kingdoms or DoC are implemented in any horde fashion, I'd bet they'd be these style of partial hordes. Same goes for DoW if they happen and aren't just TEB with mercenaries.

yolordmcswag#6132

Federykx99 said:

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

What if the whole purpose of the first two games was to test all the features the ogres will get and game 3 map features only an enormous version of the mountains of mourn with only ogres with 16 different racial mechanics?

I mean, I'd propably buy it

Eldrick#6807

Sounds interesting.

Beast_of_Guanyin#8747

Federykx99 said:

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

What if the whole purpose of the first two games was to test all the features the ogres will get and game 3 map features only an enormous version of the mountains of mourn with only ogres with 16 different racial mechanics?

Still a better idea than Mono cores.

The Ogres do have A LOT of potential mechanics. That and them being one of the final races really sets them up to potentially be awesome. CA's had a lot of practice.

Draculasaurus

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Federykx99 said:

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

What if the whole purpose of the first two games was to test all the features the ogres will get and game 3 map features only an enormous version of the mountains of mourn with only ogres with 16 different racial mechanics?

Still a better idea than Mono cores.

The Ogres do have A LOT of potential mechanics. That and them being one of the final races really sets them up to potentially be awesome. CA's had a lot of practice.

If you had to winnow down the options to two or three, what would you most want to see in WH3? What aspects of the ogres are so quintessential that they need to be represented in mechanics, and can't be represented otherwise?

Beast_of_Guanyin#8747

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Federykx99 said:

Draculasaurus said:

Vanilla_Gorilla said:

Ogre Kingdoms aren't a horde. That said I wouldn't mind the option to move.

It really feels like there are a lot of potential mechanics the Ogres could get. Vampire Coast style semi-horde armies, Skaven food mechanics, some sort of mechanic based around sending out ogres as mercenaries and getting them back as veterans, some sort of mechanic based around guarding trade caravans, a migration mechanic, etc, etc.

Presumably CA has already had some brainstorm sessions along these lines, and will eventually narrow all these options down to the 2-3 strongest options. Most factions, after all, don't have more than two or three major mechanics of this sort.

What if the whole purpose of the first two games was to test all the features the ogres will get and game 3 map features only an enormous version of the mountains of mourn with only ogres with 16 different racial mechanics?

Still a better idea than Mono cores.

The Ogres do have A LOT of potential mechanics. That and them being one of the final races really sets them up to potentially be awesome. CA's had a lot of practice.

If you had to winnow down the options to two or three, what would you most want to see in WH3? What aspects of the ogres are so quintessential that they need to be represented in mechanics, and can't be represented otherwise?

You make good points. And I think you're right on the sort of mechanics.

In no particular order
Food
Mercenary
Migration.

Food and migration being the top 2. How CA does that is up to them. At this point I trust CA.

Azurian#4207

I think ogres like Norsk, there seems to be a settlement, but not with walls.

#326161

Good post.

DavidTWWH#4143

What a great post and good discussion!

Love the idea of a settled race with the option / need to migrate.

Maybe you could give the players freedom to choose how to play them by having a building chain that improves Fertility or food production, but it would have some downsides too. If you want to play settled, you're free to do so but you need to invest in those buildings.

If you don't, Fertility or food or whatever would decrease over time, as the ogres consume every last edible thing, and need to move on to new lands. Maybe it could also be restored over time or with rites, events or tech.

Either way this is just an idea, whatever they do, as an ogre fan i hope they make them awesome.

Wyvax#7456

In order to get around the issue of building up a province over and over again each time you move, you could make the buildings "prefabricated" and transfer between horde and settled modes, each with their own bonuses and drawbacks. I don't know how they'd accomplish this given you always have more cities than armies though.