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Reminder: Turn times < Full Warhammer Map

IamNotArobotIamNotArobot Posts: 109Registered Users
Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.
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Comments

  • SephlockSephlock Posts: 1,563Registered Users
    Ideally, what with the magic of multithreading, we can have something a little closer to both.
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 20,622Registered Users

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.

  • SephlockSephlock Posts: 1,563Registered Users

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.
    But this way you can enjoy Rome 2 on mobile between turns!
  • IamNotArobotIamNotArobot Posts: 109Registered Users

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.
    ok
  • CrajohCrajoh Member Posts: 1,454Registered Users
    My word, I had to look up what NEET means.
    Live your life and try to do no harm.

    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Evelyn Beatrice Hall
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 20,622Registered Users
    edited November 10
    Sephlock said:

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.
    But this way you can enjoy Rome 2 on mobile between turns!
    I know you're probably being facetious, but when I want to play a game, I want to play that game, not do something else because then I'd do something else. A game that makes me wait a lot is not worth playing.

    CA;

    Shorter turn times >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "complete" map.

    Also, that "complete" map with the "correct" scale would probably be mostly empty anyway because, get this, most stuff does happen in a few select places.

  • BlaeysBlaeys Junior Member Posts: 786Registered Users
    edited November 10
    Agreed. I think it is more important long term that we have as big a map as makes sense. I have no problem with longer turn times. Part of a being a strategy gamer is accepting that you have to wait for your "opponents" to move - and how long that might take. You have to have a little patience. This isn't a first person shooter.

    The compromise I would like to eventually see in game 3 is "scenarios" that only use a portion of the map - so the player can choose to use the whole map or maybe just play certain continents. It just cant be at the expense of giving us a full map.

    The full experience is very important for game three and - no matter how long turn times take - that has to include a significantly larger map than the one currently in Mortal Empires.
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 20,622Registered Users
    Blaeys said:

    Agreed. I think it is more important long term that we have as big a map as makes sense. I have no problem with longer turn times. They are the longest of any TW game, but they are far from too long. Part of a being a strategy gamer is accepting that you have to wait for your "opponents" to move - and how long that might take.

    The compromise I would like to eventually see in game 3 is "scenarios" that only use a portion of the map - so the player can choose to use the whole map or maybe just play certain continents. It just cant be at the expense of giving us a full map.

    The full experience is very important for game three and - no matter how long turn times take - that has to include a significantly larger map than the one currently in Mortal Empires.

    They're already too long. ME is very unenjoyable because of this and horde faction are all but unplayable since their awful gameplay means you have very little to do between watching the AI creep about.

    Also, an AI as basic as TW's doesn't deserve to take up that much time.

  • MasariusMasarius Senior Member Posts: 612Registered Users
    edited November 10
    They could, for instance, give us the option to lower the graphics/settings for the campaign map. It taxes the cpu unnecessarily. This doesn't bother me, because my CPU doesn't care about that, but many people have low/mid cpus and would probably benefit from it.

    Also I did love to have a few more fps, because my gpu is the bottleneck at the moment.


    Options are always good. Give us options how large the map is. This way more people will be happy.

    Till shade is gone,
    till water is gone,
    into the Shadow with the teeth bared,
    screaming defiance with the last breath,
    to spit into Sightblinder's eye on the Last Day
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 20,622Registered Users
    Masarius said:

    They could, for instance, give us the option to lower the graphics/settings for the campaign map. It taxes the cpu unnecessarily. This doesn't bother me, because my CPU doesn't care about that, but many people have low/mid cpus and would probably benefit from it.

    Also I did love to have a few more fps, because my gpu is the bottleneck at the moment.


    Options are always good. Give us options how large the map is. This way more people will be happy.

    You can play with 1996 graphics and turn times will be just as long, because it's not the GPU that's the problem.

  • SephlockSephlock Posts: 1,563Registered Users

    Masarius said:

    They could, for instance, give us the option to lower the graphics/settings for the campaign map. It taxes the cpu unnecessarily. This doesn't bother me, because my CPU doesn't care about that, but many people have low/mid cpus and would probably benefit from it.

    Also I did love to have a few more fps, because my gpu is the bottleneck at the moment.


    Options are always good. Give us options how large the map is. This way more people will be happy.

    You can play with 1996 graphics and turn times will be just as long, because it's not the GPU that's the problem.
    That'd actually be kinda cool though.
  • MasariusMasarius Senior Member Posts: 612Registered Users

    Masarius said:

    They could, for instance, give us the option to lower the graphics/settings for the campaign map. It taxes the cpu unnecessarily. This doesn't bother me, because my CPU doesn't care about that, but many people have low/mid cpus and would probably benefit from it.

    Also I did love to have a few more fps, because my gpu is the bottleneck at the moment.


    Options are always good. Give us options how large the map is. This way more people will be happy.

    You can play with 1996 graphics and turn times will be just as long, because it's not the GPU that's the problem.
    Read again.

    "It taxes the cpu unnecessarily." & "but many people have low/mid cpus and would probably benefit from it. "

    Click an army and watch your fps go down on older cpus.

    I am quite aware of the difference between cpu and gpu but my statement is still true for older systems.

    Besides that I did not say anything about turn times ;)
    Till shade is gone,
    till water is gone,
    into the Shadow with the teeth bared,
    screaming defiance with the last breath,
    to spit into Sightblinder's eye on the Last Day
  • daelin4daelin4 Senior Member Posts: 16,221Registered Users
    Yeah, I prefer smaller maps with more stuff in it. The problem with super grand campaign maps is inevitably some parts are empty while others are not to scale.

    Turn times is dependent on actions taken by the AI, which is directly influenced by what actions they take, and indirectly how many factions.

    It is not like turn times is mutually exclusive to larger maps: Warhammer i had blazingly fast turn times compared with Warhammer 2, and I'm talking about Vortex map, not Mortal Empires. There is certainly room for improvement on the optimization area.

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
  • BlaeysBlaeys Junior Member Posts: 786Registered Users

    Blaeys said:

    Agreed. I think it is more important long term that we have as big a map as makes sense. I have no problem with longer turn times. They are the longest of any TW game, but they are far from too long. Part of a being a strategy gamer is accepting that you have to wait for your "opponents" to move - and how long that might take.

    The compromise I would like to eventually see in game 3 is "scenarios" that only use a portion of the map - so the player can choose to use the whole map or maybe just play certain continents. It just cant be at the expense of giving us a full map.

    The full experience is very important for game three and - no matter how long turn times take - that has to include a significantly larger map than the one currently in Mortal Empires.

    They're already too long. ME is very unenjoyable because of this and horde faction are all but unplayable since their awful gameplay means you have very little to do between watching the AI creep about.

    Also, an AI as basic as TW's doesn't deserve to take up that much time.
    And I am saying I disagree with your opinion on this matter.

    It worries me that they might compromise the scale of the game for this reason. Strategy games require patience - they have since the very first game of go or chess. I want an EPIC third game that doesn't cut corners for a reason like this (again, if they need to make this compromise, do so by adding scenarios or alternative maps for the players that can't wait the time between turns on a larger map).
  • SaborSabor Posts: 222Registered Users
    edited November 10
    I will say this. I work 2 jobs, one full time the other part time. I spend on average 50-60 hours a week working not including my hour long commute to my first job Monday through Friday. That being said every second to me that I do not have to spend working is precious. So in regards to a much larger game three map at the cost of drastically longer turn times all i can say is...I AM 100% ALL FOR IT! As it stands currently i can only enjoy the game on weekend (I just do not have time during the week to sit down and continue a campaign). However I am more than willing to wait a couple extra minutes if it meant that I could go from one side of the world to the other. That I could sail on the way around the coast of the southlands. That if i played Ogres could go and declare war on the dark elves without having to start travel to the other side of the map. A full encompassing spherical style world would be a dream come true. Be damn if the turn times take even five times as long, the experience would still be glorious!
  • gildagriffongildagriffon Posts: 298Registered Users
    edited November 10

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.</blockquote

    ca must load turn times using ssd. Then kt will be 10sec. Instead 3 min.

  • KelefaneKelefane Posts: 1,293Registered Users
    I personally don't mind the turn times. I'm used to them. It allows me to do other things for a 30-45 seconds or so.
  • Lin_HuichiLin_Huichi Posts: 265Registered Users
    I'll also point out faster cpus will decrease turn times, and like with all games technology will run it better with time (except for unoptimized games). I'd rather a bigger map that just gets easier to run than a small squished and cut one that I dont enjoy playing on.
    daelin4 said:

    Yeah, I prefer smaller maps with more stuff in it. The problem with super grand campaign maps is inevitably some parts are empty while others are not to scale.

    Turn times is dependent on actions taken by the AI, which is directly influenced by what actions they take, and indirectly how many factions.

    It is not like turn times is mutually exclusive to larger maps: Warhammer i had blazingly fast turn times compared with Warhammer 2, and I'm talking about Vortex map, not Mortal Empires. There is certainly room for improvement on the optimization area.

    Vortex is larger than Warhammer 1 and has more factions. Turn times are heavily dependent on how much you have to process.

    Also Mortal Empires is far from empty, and a lot more happens than on a smaller map.
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Posts: 6,474Registered Users
    Turn times are bound to increase even further. If they don’t one might wonder why we had to have slow arsed turn times in ME.

    I’m all for a bigger map. Having said that there is a sweet spot. And that sweet spot is probably closer to the smaller ”big map” than it is the ”big big map”.
    Lord of the Undermountain and your friendly neighbourhood giant (Dwarf)
    Favourite campaigns: Clan Angrund, Followers of Nagash and the new Huntsmarshall’s Expedition
  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,023Registered Users
    I'd be ok with a few minor factions trimmed here and there, just leave ruins or something in their wake.

    You could also re-consolidate some factions that were erroneously split...... despite the current trend not every single LL needs their own faction... I also think a lot could be done with those dynamic starts to help arrange this. If they know you are starting in a given area... why add so many minor factions somewhere all the way across the map? You could leave some ruins there or something to slow down the more important factions, or maybe seed many armies of some greenskins or beasty horde faction all over the map to serve as road blocks, instead of having 6 of those lil factions lol.

    And here's a thought - eradicate the pointless and negatively impacting DRM you have going on in these games!

    But yeah, I'd much prefer a more complete map - and I think the turn times can come down to boot! I do not believe they are mutually exclusive.
  • Arcani_4_EverArcani_4_Ever Junior Member Posts: 2,270Registered Users
    All i want is actual Multithread support. Fixes everything. Allows CA to expand the map, and it will improve turn times drastically.
  • mightygloinmightygloin Posts: 1,367Registered Users

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.
    At least there would be probably another smaller campaign map like Vortex for those that require faster campaigns.
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 20,622Registered Users
    edited November 10

    Just a reminder that despite the turn times being probably the worst aspect of ME, for WH3 I preffer the full map experience rather than having 3K-like turn times speed.

    Given that if they optimize turn times and figure out a way to make them ultra smooth, the complete east to west WH map experience would be a must.

    If they dont figure out a way to decrease the turn time speed, doesnt matter. Give us the full map exerperience too, Im willing to wait.

    The fast experience will be the WH3 Vortex/like scenario and the complete map would be in ME probably changed to immortal empires.

    I don't. If Super Complete Immortal Empires has even worse turn times than ME, then it's a bust and not worth bothering with.

    It's not only NEETs with unlimited time who want to enjoy the game, y'know.
    At least there would be probably another smaller campaign map like Vortex for those that require faster campaigns.
    Except I couldn't play 75% of all the factions on it and I don't really care much about the WH3 contenders outside Chaos Dwarfs.

  • ArneSoArneSo Posts: 1,390Registered Users
    Couldn’t agree more with this post!
    A bigger map is way more important than turn times. The size of the map has nothing to do with turn times anyways. The relevant factor is the number of factions. CA should reduce the number of factions, make existing ones bigger and keep more regions as ruins.

    People should also get a better PC for the final combined campaign. My PC has 4 cores and turn times are about one minute, what is perfectly fine.
  • CrajohCrajoh Member Posts: 1,454Registered Users
    Don’t forget that mods contribute significantly to turn times. It is one of the reasons that I believe some very popular mods (non-controversial) should be added as core to the game and other controversial mods get added as options.

    Yes I want the world and would be happy with an empire like implementation. In Empire TW I marched an army from France to India and sailed west around the globe.
    Live your life and try to do no harm.

    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Evelyn Beatrice Hall
  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,023Registered Users
    ArneSo said:

    Couldn’t agree more with this post!
    A bigger map is way more important than turn times. The size of the map has nothing to do with turn times anyways. The relevant factor is the number of factions. CA should reduce the number of factions, make existing ones bigger and keep more regions as ruins.

    People should also get a better PC for the final combined campaign. My PC has 4 cores and turn times are about one minute, what is perfectly fine.

    Telling people to get a better PC is just about the worst argument you can possibly make, man.

    Not everyone can just go drop a grand or more on equipment at the drop of a hat for a single bloody game. And if they raise the sysreqs for part of a stated trilogy that's supposed to be one intermeshed experience, it's a backhand to the face for a potentially large part of the player base that will generate a lot of flak. Contrary to popular belief held by those who are serious about their gaming hot rods - most people don't have gaming hot rods. Lots of folks have some pretty much off the shelf computers they got from a chain store somewhere. Hand crafting strong machines is not the norm. And there's more of those people than there are hardcore gaming rig peeps.

    The whole "LAWL GET BETTER STUFF" argument is just... so god damned asinine and chock full of entitled that I just kind of want to smack people who go there.

    I mean really. You were sounding fine until you went on about a better PC.

    Oh... and at this point just about every PC in the last 10 years has 4 cores. Number of cores is NOT the deciding factor for performance.
  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,023Registered Users
    Crajoh said:

    Don’t forget that mods contribute significantly to turn times. It is one of the reasons that I believe some very popular mods (non-controversial) should be added as core to the game and other controversial mods get added as options.

    Yes I want the world and would be happy with an empire like implementation. In Empire TW I marched an army from France to India and sailed west around the globe.

    *scratches head*

    So... mods make the turn times worse. So your answer is to fold them into the base game to improve turn times.

    The hell are you smoking?
  • CrossilCrossil Posts: 4,467Registered Users
    How about this, then. Make the Old World a third of its size so that the rest of the world can fit in already intended dimensions. It's supposed to be smaller compared to the rest of the world, anyway. Not like we need every single Empire province.
    UNLEASH THE EVERCHARIOT
  • CrajohCrajoh Member Posts: 1,454Registered Users
    edited November 10
    Itharus said:

    Crajoh said:

    Don’t forget that mods contribute significantly to turn times. It is one of the reasons that I believe some very popular mods (non-controversial) should be added as core to the game and other controversial mods get added as options.

    Yes I want the world and would be happy with an empire like implementation. In Empire TW I marched an army from France to India and sailed west around the globe.

    *scratches head*

    So... mods make the turn times worse. So your answer is to fold them into the base game to improve turn times.

    The hell are you smoking?
    :) yea got it but hopefully, there is a difference between mods and the core game implementation like reducing errors, etc.
    Live your life and try to do no harm.

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  • ron1404nlron1404nl Junior Member Posts: 191Registered Users
    The end turn times are a big issue and Imo it's due to optimization. Also less factions doesn't matter at all, look at turn 300+ most factions have long gone except some of the main ones and the end turn is worse. That would suggest it's due to all the armies and heroes.

    For me I would rather have shorter and turn times then a bigger map. TBH I never even see the dark elves and lizards when I play on the other side of the map (like orcs).
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