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Let's talk about Waaagh

MORTUSMORTUS Posts: 67Registered Users
All are agree that the Waaagh mechanic need a change.

My suggestion is the fightiness to have much more levels and when fightiness increase to certain level to be spawned an aditional unit to the army. But in separate Waaagh niche where only the spawned units from the fightiness can exists, they will not have upkeep and will act like part of your army in battle

    Example for the fightiness levels
when fightiness drop below level 1(Quarrelsome 0-9 fightiness) Severe infighting attrition affects the army

when fightiness drop below level 2(Unruly 10-19 fightiness) Some infighting attrition affects the army and you losing all spawned units
    when fightiness drop below level 3(Dispersing 20-29 fightiness) each turn you will lose a spawned unit
when fightiness drop below level 4(Cowed 30-39 fightiness) No effect
    when fightiness increase above level 4(Eager 40-49 fightiness) better raiding and replenishment
      when fightiness increase above level 5(Gathering 50-59 fightiness) spawn a unit tier 1, better raiding and replenishment
        when fightiness increase above level 6(Recruitment 60-69 fightiness) spawn a unit tier 2, +1 buff in battle, better raiding and replenishment
          when fightiness increase above level 7(Muster 70-79 fightiness) spawn a unit tier 3, +2 buffs in battle, better raiding and replenishment
        when fightiness increase above level 8(Waaagh 80-89 fightiness) spawn a unit tier 4, +3 buffs in battle, better raiding and replenishment
      when fightiness increase above level 9(Great Waaagh 90-100 fightiness) spawn a unit tier 5, +4 buffs in battle, better raiding and replenishment

    Comments

    • PaulicusPaulicus Posts: 44Registered Users
      Waaagh... Waaagh never changes.
    • ROMOBOYROMOBOY Posts: 88Registered Users

      I'll just leave
    • CrajohCrajoh Member Posts: 1,609Registered Users
      I don't know what this would be good for though.
      Live your life and try to do no harm.

      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    • Pr4vdaPr4vda Senior Member Posts: 869Registered Users
      Waaagh need a total modification. I would like something else than what we have now. CA can be very creative and I really expect something better.
      Team Dawis

      Dawis shall purge all their fallen Karaks, with the blood of the Greeskins and the skavens !
    • PaulicusPaulicus Posts: 44Registered Users
      On-topic, it'd be nice if they at least addressed some of the more glaring issues with waaaagh-type mechanics: coordinating attacks with your partner army being a big one.
    • YannirYannir Posts: 26Registered Users
      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.
    • BorealBoreal Posts: 473Registered Users
      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
    • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 21,806Registered Users
      The current Waagh should be scrapped.

      There should be a separate Waagh pool for units that gets filled up over time depending on how many battles you fight and how well you do. Fightiness should become the currency you can use to pull units from that pool into your army and it should be possible to do so at any point of the map and in any stance, like Raise Dead.

    • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,875Registered Users
      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
    • SteelRoninSteelRonin Junior Member ChilePosts: 716Registered Users
      The Waaagh!!! mechanic should be a global bar to fill, and the way to fill it is by earning fightiness. Low level of fightiness should trigger negative bonuses.

      When the Waaagh!!! bar is full, you can click WAAAGH!!! to trigger the event, a big shout can be heard and you win tons of bonuses, including physical resistance, frenzy for all units, speed bonuses, anti-large bonuses, and all your garrisons are now usable by the player, big bonus to public orther.......and How you maintain the Waaagh!!!?, you need to destroy a lot, armies and cities, if you don't destroy something until the next turn, the Waaagh!!! bar will drop down to average. If you lose your LL your Waagh!!! will drop to very low, to negative bonuses.

      How you earn fightiness?, same way as now, fighting armies, settlements, raiding, looting, etc.
    • LayzanLayzan Posts: 921Registered Users
      Like the OP's suggestion, I simply would like additional units added to my actual force, so perhaps max six extra units. As the waaagh gets higher you get access to more better units perhaps at max waaagh you get two high tier ones which could include a hero with the four low tier ones.

      All of which you can pick yourself from a table a bit like what skaven have for upgrades so you can enjoy goblins etc with the elites you need later.
    • BorealBoreal Posts: 473Registered Users
      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
    • Lord_DistamorfinLord_Distamorfin Posts: 478Registered Users
      Boreal said:

      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
      So are Vampire Counts OP because you can flood the map with cheap necromancers and free zombies/skeletons? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying.
    • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 21,806Registered Users

      Boreal said:

      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
      So are Vampire Counts OP because you can flood the map with cheap necromancers and free zombies/skeletons? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying.
      Yep, it's BS and needs to be removed. No faction should have free troops it entirely controls.

    • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,875Registered Users
      Boreal said:

      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
      Good for you. Own your wrongness. I'm proud of you.
    • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,875Registered Users

      Boreal said:

      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
      So are Vampire Counts OP because you can flood the map with cheap necromancers and free zombies/skeletons? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying.
      Yep, it's BS and needs to be removed. No faction should have free troops it entirely controls.
      O rly.

      Tomb Kings?

      They're also not free with Supply Lines -- they add to the upkeep of everyone else. And those stacks are only powerful when used to abuse auto-resolve... which, tbh, is a non factor that should hardly even be considered. AR is so broken that gaming it happens just by using it.
    • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 21,806Registered Users
      edited January 19
      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Itharus said:

      Boreal said:

      Yannir said:

      I just wish the Waaagh! was spawned directly under your control as a 0 upkeep army, not as its own faction, but you couldn't move units to and from the Waaagh!. Recruiting new units for a depleted Waagh! would work like the Blessed Spawnings for the LM. Instant but limited by what's available. For example, in the Empire you would mainly get Gobbos and Savage Orks would be exclusive to the Badlands.

      Having it under your control for 0 upkeep would be too powerful
      It really actually wouldn't. Not even a little.

      We're not talkin' super powerful elites here, or even particularly well put together stacks. They're mostly fodder. It's the equivalent of bringing a stack of skavenslaves with a few clanrats mixed in. Maybe 1 rat ogre. They're meant to die.

      Please please please PLEASE remember that GS AI receive NUMEROUS bonuses over player GS, and any performance you see the GS AI getting is due to over-tuned insane buffs designed to keep them semi-relevant for a while in a campaign.

      And as for Black Orcs being what they are is also because they've been temporarily overtuned so that GS have at least ONE unit that can actually hold its own late game.

      And if you're an MPer... try to grasp the concept of having to actually worry about an economy in a campaign.

      MP is a totally different beast than SP and I really wish that MPers and CA Devs would realize that and balance the two on an entirely separate basis.
      I'm have played multi about once.
      A free stack is a free stack, and is op
      So are Vampire Counts OP because you can flood the map with cheap necromancers and free zombies/skeletons? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying.
      Yep, it's BS and needs to be removed. No faction should have free troops it entirely controls.
      O rly.

      Tomb Kings?

      They're also not free with Supply Lines -- they add to the upkeep of everyone else. And those stacks are only powerful when used to abuse auto-resolve... which, tbh, is a non factor that should hardly even be considered. AR is so broken that gaming it happens just by using it.
      TK actually cost you something since instead of money restricting you, it's the amount of armies you can have out at once restricting you. Although it's too generous at the moment like so many things in TWWH. VCounts free Skeletons and Zombies however are way more spammable and that's why that needs to be removed.

    • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,875Registered Users
      Why though? They're not over powered. You still have to buy them. Something TK don't have to do btw. If you don't have the funds, you cannot recruit them.
    • DraxynnicDraxynnic Posts: 6,577Registered Users
      One possibility possibly worth considering as an alternative to the WAAAGH stacks is an upkeep reduction and higher replenishment at higher fightiness - representing that the greenskins are getting what they need out of the fighting and don't need to draw as much from the faction's logistics system to keep them happy. This would allow more stacks to be recruited as long as they're kept happy, and as those stacks achieve high fightiness, more still. Might prove to be a better representation of the momentum of a greenskin WAAAAGH than the current system.
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