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Crone Hellebron used so rarely people don't know what she does.

WardemonXIWardemonXI Registered Users Posts: 776

1:28:46

People in chat think she has witch elf ability to rampage enemies.......
people don't know that her AOE red mist buff does not buff her in any situation on ground or in the air.

I will just continue to hope for a day when she is not too expensive to be an actual competitive pick.

Comments

  • WardemonXIWardemonXI Registered Users Posts: 776
    Also in that match just to note Crone and her caster pts cost was 2574 for crone 937 for shadow caster on horse with 3 spells and item for more magic

    Malekith 2912 for his loadout with dragron and 2 spells

    Malekith side lord/hero pts total 2912
    Crone side Lord/hero pts total 3511
    When you factor in a caster crone is just too expensive to be a competitive pick.
  • Odysseus95Odysseus95 Registered Users Posts: 159
    edited February 13
    It just doesn't help either that she has to compete in a roster with such excellent lords. Malekith and Morathi have pretty much been dominating since launch. Speaking about The Madness of Khaine, maybe that could be a cool feature that makes her instantly viable? Think about it, people always pick a single unit of Witch Elves purely for the Madness of Khaine ability. It could make her more viable, at least on foot then. Might be too strong on the Manticore or the Altar, who knows. But yeah, she could really use some help. She's just really squishy and expensive, even though her buffs are all great. Her abilities buffing herself as well, might also be a good fix, if that is the case. Sounds more like a bug in that case.
  • ystyst Registered Users Posts: 7,683
    Shes just too expensive, I mean same price as malekith both at $1150, come on really.

    Hellebron needs -$125 at current state. Even at -$150 she may still never be picked due to the fact that u actually need to gear her up, buying all those abilities instantly put her more expensive than even malekith at times
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  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,505
    Does anyone know if her item that used to be bugged is any good now? It’s like a sword or something that triggers under certain conditions... I never buy it.
  • BovineKingBovineKing Registered Users Posts: 204
    Not to mention if you want different lore you can just put a caster lord on dragon. Even the other characters work better on foot. Altar wouldn’t be bad if she was more comparable to volkmar’s wagon or skaven on doombell. Shes in that spot with grimgor where I feel like -100 would instantly make them more competitive and wouldn’t affect faction balance in the least.
  • ReymReym Registered Users Posts: 565
    eumaies said:

    Does anyone know if her item that used to be bugged is any good now? It’s like a sword or something that triggers under certain conditions... I never buy it.

    Her sword item is pretty good yeah, due to the fact that it's a spirit leech effect it can be quite effective against anything even mounted on her coldron.

    I used it in mainly 2 match ups in the past. VS norsca when fimirs were a big thing (she kill them well with the sword DoT and her magic resist aura is nice vs those said fimirs) and vs Bret as it worked well vs grail knights.
    But is talking about what is appropriate to talk about in this thread appropriate to be talked about in this thread ?
  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 6,505
    Reym said:

    eumaies said:

    Does anyone know if her item that used to be bugged is any good now? It’s like a sword or something that triggers under certain conditions... I never buy it.

    Her sword item is pretty good yeah, due to the fact that it's a spirit leech effect it can be quite effective against anything even mounted on her coldron.

    I used it in mainly 2 match ups in the past. VS norsca when fimirs were a big thing (she kill them well with the sword DoT and her magic resist aura is nice vs those said fimirs) and vs Bret as it worked well vs grail knights.
    thanks so is it like a mortis engine effect but good vs larger/single entities in particular?
  • ReymReym Registered Users Posts: 565
    Not in particular, but because it's a spirit leech effect (so stronger ticks targeting one model at a time which is the opposite of the mortis engine DoT) it damages SE and kill cav models like a spirit leech. It's kinda decent vs everyone imo
    But is talking about what is appropriate to talk about in this thread appropriate to be talked about in this thread ?
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Registered Users Posts: 1,963
    Reym said:

    Not in particular, but because it's a spirit leech effect (so stronger ticks targeting one model at a time which is the opposite of the mortis engine DoT) it damages SE and kill cav models like a spirit leech. It's kinda decent vs everyone imo

    yeah its decent, but obviously much less damage than spirit leech. It does about 100 damage.
  • WardemonXIWardemonXI Registered Users Posts: 776
    eumaies said:

    Does anyone know if her item that used to be bugged is any good now? It’s like a sword or something that triggers under certain conditions... I never buy it.

    It can potentially be decent. I don't know if I would compare it to a spirit leech tho because from my understanding it can only affect 1 model per unit every 11 seconds.
    So for example if you are fighting skavenslave slingers it can do max 45 damage to the unit a tick/every 11 seconds.
    if the unit/units in its range are in combat and losing current combat and if Crone is in combat as well.

    It is better against smaller more elite units but these units are also a bit harder to put into losing combat state.
    Its most efficient against units that have 132 hp or more per model.

    My issue with Hellebron is her overall price when equipped and not using the chariot mount.
    She is just waaay too expensive for what you get.






  • ystyst Registered Users Posts: 7,683
    Shes simply overpriced, thats all there is. -$150 cut and there abouts should make her okayish. Ppl dont seem to realise her att is 98 vs inf, with poison. She will cut thru even iron breakers, not a single foot lord in game dare boast such feat





    U would think 100 armor would offer much different outcome but poison+20% isnt at all that squishy in melee, plus her def isnt low at all being 48
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  • Loupi_Loupi_ Registered Users Posts: 1,963
    yst said:

    She will cut thru even iron breakers, not a single foot lord in game dare boast such feat

    completely untrue, sniktch, queek, grimgor, gotrek and many other footlords will annihilate a unit of ironbreakers. Weirdly you say she cuts through ironbreakers then show a test where she loses fairly decisively. The ones i metioned actually beat ironbreakers convincingly (gotrek does the worst of these 4 i mentioned but still wins)
  • WitchbladeWitchblade Registered Users Posts: 702
    She's pretty terrible indeed, just too expensive both in base cost and in abilities. You pay for a dragon but get a manticore, basically. The new medusa cauldron has made even her cauldron pretty redundant.
  • rymeintrinsecarymeintrinseca Registered Users Posts: 864
    edited February 14

    eumaies said:

    Does anyone know if her item that used to be bugged is any good now? It’s like a sword or something that triggers under certain conditions... I never buy it.

    It can potentially be decent. I don't know if I would compare it to a spirit leech tho because from my understanding it can only affect 1 model per unit every 11 seconds.
    So for example if you are fighting skavenslave slingers it can do max 45 damage to the unit a tick/every 11 seconds.
    if the unit/units in its range are in combat and losing current combat and if Crone is in combat as well.

    It is better against smaller more elite units but these units are also a bit harder to put into losing combat state.
    Its most efficient against units that have 132 hp or more per model.
    In terms of the numbers it's most similar to other 132 per tick, 30m radius spells/abilities: Final Transmutation, Flensing Ruin and Soul Stealer.

    Even so, there is the rather dramatic difference that while those spells do a 132 damage tick every 0.5 secs, the Cursed Blade does one every 11 secs! This is partially mitigated by the fact each CB tick is guaranteed to damage, whereas it's a 50% chance for the spells (the CB tooltip is wrong when it says there's a chance to resist). So FT/FR/SS DPS is 11 times higher versus single entities (because they resist half the time) and 22 times higher versus high model count units.

    Due to that 100% damage chance and the fact it only targets one model per unit per tick CB is the only direct damage spell/ability in the game that has the same damage against SEs as against multi-entities. (Well, Kiss of the Deep as well if you want to count that, though its damage is feeble.)
  • AerocrasticAerocrastic Registered Users Posts: 468
    actually, the real problem is this

    her manticore: 45 armor
    everyone else: 80 armor
  • Odysseus95Odysseus95 Registered Users Posts: 159

    actually, the real problem is this

    her manticore: 45 armor
    everyone else: 80 armor

    So, what about the other options?
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Registered Users Posts: 1,963

    actually, the real problem is this

    her manticore: 45 armor
    everyone else: 80 armor

    I think this might have been intended becasue she has a base physical resistance but then they forgot to let her keep the physical resist on the manticore.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Registered Users Posts: 9,467
    what if she actually got given rampage like witch elves have, tho i guess thats way too strong on a flying character
  • rymeintrinsecarymeintrinseca Registered Users Posts: 864

    what if she actually got given rampage like witch elves have, tho i guess thats way too strong on a flying character

    She could lose it on the manti.
  • WitchbladeWitchblade Registered Users Posts: 702

    what if she actually got given rampage like witch elves have, tho i guess thats way too strong on a flying character

    Yeah, giving her this on horse and on foot would instantly make her competitive I feel. Maybe too much so. I think it would be good to imbue this with one of her abilities, as those currently suck for their price, other than Gaze of Khaine.
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Registered Users Posts: 1,963

    what if she actually got given rampage like witch elves have, tho i guess thats way too strong on a flying character

    Yeah, giving her this on horse and on foot would instantly make her competitive I feel. Maybe too much so. I think it would be good to imbue this with one of her abilities, as those currently suck for their price, other than Gaze of Khaine.
    perhaps it could be tied to the last stage of her blood frenzy ability.
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Registered Users Posts: 9,467
    Yeah so long as its not on manticore it should be quite good.
  • Loupi_Loupi_ Registered Users Posts: 1,963

    Yeah so long as its not on manticore it should be quite good.

    If its attached to her blood frenzy ability it requires her being in melee a long time to trigger, so if its done like that it would be fine. If its just attached to her base stats then yeah having it on manticore would be very strong indeed.

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