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Ambush mechanic needs fixing

ScoshaScosha Junior MemberRegistered Users Posts: 5
edited April 2020 in Balancing Discussions
Currently playing a mortal engines campaign and this is the situation I find myself in:

I have a settlement with a 20 stack and another 20 stack outside the city, there are 2 x20 stacks of rats about to attacked the city one sieges it and the other sits beside it to assist.

So I have seen these armies approach and they are sitting outside my city in plan sight, but the one not sieging the city is magically able to ambush my army outside the city and the army sieging is able to join the fight as well but not my army in the city.

In the initial play through the army outside was in the encamped stance for additional stats, so I reloaded and put the army outside into ambush stance before the rats arrived. Sure enough as intendedmy army ambushed the stack of rats not seiging the settlement, it failed, but it meant I got a 1v1 fight. I won the fight, then the Rats proceeded to just ambush me immediately after the first battle with both their 20 stacks.

What is this toxic mechanic? This makes literally no sense and ruins the game if the AI can basically ignore your armies and destroy them one at a time with seemingly no counter-play, by ambushing you when they are right in front of you.

The ambush mechanic needs to be reworked/balanced, the AI should not be able to exploit it like the above.

How it should work:

- Ambush stance should not work if there enemy can see them.
- If you have vision of an army that has entered ambush stance, then you should be the one that gets the strategic advantage like you would in general strategy. (DOUBLE EDGED BLADE!!!)
- Also there should be a time for the stance to activate, i.e. 1 turn at least.
- Also it should come with more of a down side, nothing stops you changing stance and retreating from a fight you cant win, it should come with heavy movement penalty + fatigue.


If there is something I am missing please fill me.

Comments

  • TsuyaraTsuyara Registered Users Posts: 278
    They can always siege your city and attack armies outside without your city being able to reinforce, it's being blocked by the siege. This even works if the army doing the sieging is a single lvl1 lord. Your full 20 stack and garrison will be too afraid to leave the city gates.

    The ambush stance itself really isn't the issue here, though, is it? All your complaints seem to be focused on the skaven/beastmen mechanic of being able to ambush by just attacking normally without using the ambush stance. Really, i go most of my campaigns without ever using it. The only purpose to it seems to be to separate armies from their garrisons.
  • UagrimUagrim Registered Users Posts: 1,994
    The ambush attack rely shouldn't work against armies in encampment stance (or similar ones like raiding camp)

    That is my main gripe with it, everything else is pretty much working fine.
  • ScoshaScosha Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 5
    Its got nothing to do with the seiging of the settlement its the ambush mechanic that is totally broken, how are you meant to counter 2 x 20 stacks if they can literally ambush you when they are sitting in front of you???

    How can this possibly be balance, it is basically a free win mechanic being able to just single out an army and kill it.

    I like the ambush mechanic being in the game it shouldnt be something you can just magically do when you are literally beside an enemy army.
  • mightygloinmightygloin Karaz-a-KarakRegistered Users Posts: 5,634
    Uagrim said:

    The ambush attack rely shouldn't work against armies in encampment stance (or similar ones like raiding camp)

    That is my main gripe with it, everything else is pretty much working fine.

    Yes e.g. you put your 3 armies on top of each other in encampment stance, but somehow rats can isolate one of them and ambush said army with multiple stacks of their own. Makes no sense.
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