Imrik!

Sarmatianns#6760

Words like "broken" have often been used here to make a point that something is too strong. In this case, I believe the word is completely justified. In fact, we might need a new word to emphasize just how broken Imrik looks.

Now, this is not just about powercreep, we are used to that at this point. This is just a fail in design. An extremely powerful Single Entity flyer, with insane stats for such a monster and incredibly powerful abilities. And in a roster where healing and WoM are plentiful.

We have a Star Dragon lord with 70 MA and 60MD, Dragonhorn item that gives map wide mini waaagh, Lance that imbues fire weakness on top of CB and AP damage increase (giving Imrik probably an effective increase of close to 50% in damage dealing) and also a debuff that reduced target's stats by 24 MA and 40 MD. It is a hex that can apparently be used on any unit, not just lord and heroes, and that lasts 30 seconds.

I do not think I have ever seen such a poorly designed unit. It doubles down on all toxic aspects of the game - it is flyer Single Entity with incredibly high stats and powerful items/abilities that just invite endless cycle charging. This is the closest this game has come to an "I win" button, in addition to also being "let me make the game not fun for my opponent button". It is a unit that has no weakness except cost.

I strongly urge the DLC/Balance team to severely nerf at least some of his abilities before release.

Imrik will make QB and multiplayer in general extremely toxic, and the outcry will force nerfs eventually anyway. Please do not make us suffer this for weeks or months before that inevitably happens.

WojmirVonCarstein

Sarmatians said:

Words like "broken" have often been used here to make a point that something is too strong. In this case, I believe the word is completely justified. In fact, we might need a new word to emphasize just how broken Imrik looks.

Now, this is not just about powercreep, we are used to that at this point. This is just a fail in design. An extremely powerful Single Entity flyer, with insane stats for such a monster and incredibly powerful abilities. And in a roster where healing and WoM are plentiful.

We have a Star Dragon lord with 70 MA and 60MD, Dragonhorn item that gives map wide mini waaagh, Lance that imbues fire weakness on top of CB and AP damage increase (giving Imrik probably an effective increase of close to 50% in damage dealing) and also a debuff that reduced target's stats by 24 MA and 40 MD. It is a hex that can apparently be used on any unit, not just lord and heroes, and that lasts 30 seconds.

I do not think I have ever seen such a poorly designed unit. It doubles down on all toxic aspects of the game - it is flyer Single Entity with incredibly high stats and powerful items/abilities that just invite endless cycle charging. This is the closest this game has come to an "I win" button, in addition to also being "let me make the game not fun for my opponent button". It is a unit that has no weakness except cost.

I strongly urge the DLC/Balance team to severely nerf at least some of his abilities before release.

Imrik will make QB and multiplayer in general extremely toxic, and the outcry will force nerfs eventually anyway. Please do not make us suffer this for weeks or months before that inevitably happens.

Do we know how much he will cost?

Zeblasky

WojmirVonCarstein said:

Do we know how much he will cost?

3369 fully kitted out on a star dragon. Considering all of his items are great, that would be his usual cost.

Wtfah114

He needs the Markus treatment

eumaies#1128

I heard 3300 fully kited?

personally, of all his items and abilities, the only one that really alarms me is that insane castable debuff. That is off the charts, especially for a flying lord.

A mini-waagh could actually be fun.

i do take Sarmatian's points though about the units many other strengths. he could be OP in multiple ways.

Noob_for_Life#5674

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

eumaies#1128

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

Yeah my assessment is Imrik on a horse is going to be the better choice. Still fast, still crazy good items, but lets you also go wide if you want.

TheShiroOfDalton

The Shredder of Lustria is weaker in stats other than health with no support auras other than basic encourage and hexes plus a much larger hitbox and yet costs 3700.

Zeblasky

eumaies said:

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

Yeah my assessment is Imrik on a horse is going to be the better choice. Still fast, still crazy good items, but lets you also go wide if you want.

Actually Dragon is quite viable too. HE prince on a Star dragon is ~3100 when kitted out with good items, and he is pretty good (although rare) pick. And getting much better version for just 200 gold more is quite a great deal.

Noob_for_Life#5674

CA hates LM that’s why they gave us Lords like Ten and Nakai not to mention all the other trash.

mightygloin#2446

His stats on paper might be acceptable considering his LL stature, named bird and disregarding other older lords who haven't got the same treatment. But them abilities on a flying monster and their potential combinations are insanity. He should cost way more if he stays like that.

Loupi#8512

problem will be the items not the stats; his stats are very similar to a prince on stardragon.

OrkLads

What is interesting is that in the 2 most recent pages of threads in the balancing section there are threads complaining about:

1. Super strong SEMs: Check
2. The Waaagh: Check
3. Grimgor's new debuff (on a footlord): Check

Imrik hits all 3 and then some. High Elves will jump from being counterpicked on ladder to being the new number 1 dodge faction.

TheShiroOfDalton

This DLC is a clear love letter to all the single player wonks who want their "fun" via effortless victories by OP monsters. It's fun how those guys constantly complain that MP is ruining their experience when the opposite is near always the case.

Bet none of the campaign balance issues have been adressed either like doomstacking or braindead expansionism.

TheShiroOfDalton

Something else, Imrik has a way to increase fire vulnerability, HE get an RoR that has the same effect and there's of course kindleflame.

Bet they all stack too knowing CA. Lord sniped with a short fireball spam, especially guys like Throgg or TK lords.

griffithx#1314

I really don't like them handing out these huge MD/ATK debuffs so much.....still trying to put my finger on exactly why in this case.

yst#1879

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

He just have infinite synergy to the roster. I mean fire weakness with fireborn and buffs.

Becomes a funny lord where he outclass tyrion in leading cav. Then ascend to godhood on dragon.

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

CA hates LM that’s why they gave us Lords like Ten and Nakai not to mention all the other trash.

A complete garbage dlc choke full of useless crap. Engine of noobs, rubbish of sotek, trashzadon to name a few. And ya the very cute slann who thinks hes imrik hogging the slot.

Ppl gone elf mode on the useless 0 pick rate blood drag Lord screaming for +$700. We need 60 pages of those on imrik

Aerocrastic

It's a bird! It's a plane! It's Imrik Harkon!

Cirdan

Zeblasky said:

eumaies said:

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

Yeah my assessment is Imrik on a horse is going to be the better choice. Still fast, still crazy good items, but lets you also go wide if you want.

Actually Dragon is quite viable too. HE prince on a Star dragon is ~3100 when kitted out with good items, and he is pretty good (although rare) pick. And getting much better version for just 200 gold more is quite a great deal.

Prince good pick? He is never picked lol.

A good way to start imo would be removing the debuff item from MP, then see how he performs.

The_real_FAUST#6885

Imrik's abilities are totally unnecessary at current.

Absolutley overpowered and underpriced

Sarmatianns#6760

Cirdan said:

Zeblasky said:

eumaies said:

Lord_Of_Lothern said:

I like how he’s only 2000 on a horse fully kitted while chad boi Tyrion is like almost 2,600 full kit.

Yeah my assessment is Imrik on a horse is going to be the better choice. Still fast, still crazy good items, but lets you also go wide if you want.

Actually Dragon is quite viable too. HE prince on a Star dragon is ~3100 when kitted out with good items, and he is pretty good (although rare) pick. And getting much better version for just 200 gold more is quite a great deal.

Prince good pick? He is never picked lol.

A good way to start imo would be removing the debuff item from MP, then see how he performs.

I wouldn't say never, I'd say rarely picked. He's rarely picked because Larry absolutely dominates, not because he's bad pick. Imrik, on the other hand, looks like he will absolutely replace Larry.

NightOfTheDead#8509

What are you talking about? Regular prince has almost the same stats on star dragon. 68/54. This is a legendary lord on dragon with additional cost.

Theo91#7431

The HE this time got a ton of synergies with fire damage. Basically no point bringing any units weak to fire against HE

Sarmatianns#6760

+6 MD at this level is not insignificant. If something with 45 MA tries to land a hit, it will hit HE Prince in 1/4. It will hit Imrik in 1/5. Just that means Imrik will last 20% longer.

At the same time, HE prince doesn't have an ability to increase its damage for almost 50%, through weakness to fire and AP damage boost, and also can't debuff the target for -24MA and -40MD, for a whooping 30 seconds.

Oh, and HE prince doesn't have map wide Waaaagh.

Godefroy_de_Bouillon

Yeah first of all that ludicrous single target debuff should be just removed from him and then probably if needed his price increased.

instead of 3 uses of his waaghh limit it to 2. Then i see no problem

AENARlON

Yes, he does look crazily strong, but then 3369 for a non-caster lord with no native healing is a crazy amount. I'm not convinced he'll really be a better pick than each of Alarielle, Teclis, Eltharion, and the Archmage.

StupidIdiot

Ephraim_Dalton said:

Something else, Imrik has a way to increase fire vulnerability, HE get an RoR that has the same effect and there's of course kindleflame.

Bet they all stack too knowing CA. Lord sniped with a short fireball spam, especially guys like Throgg or TK lords.

Same exact effect doesn't stack but everything else definitely will. (i.e. Imrik fire vulnerability won't stack with RoR fire vulnerability, but they both stack with kindleflame/innate weaknesses)

I personally love synergies like this (I tried to do a Empire fire build before huntsmarshalls were a thing and it was pitifully not worth the effort then). It makes army picking substantially more fun and rewards coordinating your units. The only problem is that these unit interactions have been trickled into the game rather than being designed for from the outset. A full rework of resistances is never going to happen so this slow addition to rosters will have to do.

AErialRH

F

NightOfTheDead#8509

Let's put all our money into one non-caster lord with some good abilities. Definitely will be hard to counter that!

There wont be enough units to buff when you bring him to the table.

Lotus_Moon#2452

Where do you guys get thats his 3300 fully kitted as far as i know his 3900 fully kitted.