Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.
In case you missed it, A Total War Saga: TROY was revealed today to be a one-year exclusive on the Epic Store.
Just so you know, CA, if WH3 turns out to be an Epic exclusive too, you'll face a far greater backlash than any you've had so far. Don't do this to your fans who stayed loyal for the Warhammer journey.
No, they won't. People will whine and complain, but they will still buy it from the Epic Store. They will do this because, at the end of the day, it is a minor inconvenience to have games in Epic and Steam rather than everything consolidated in Steam. If CA does their analysis and projects that they will make more $$$ through Epic rather than pay the charges that Steam imposes, they will go with Epic.
If the game is good, people really don't care if it is offered via Steam or Epic or something else. I agree it is annoying, but that's capitalism baby.
Say that to EA and DICE who said complainers are a minority and end up with a game which sold half than the previous game and was on promotion 6 days after the release date.
In case you missed it, A Total War Saga: TROY was revealed today to be a one-year exclusive on the Epic Store.
Just so you know, CA, if WH3 turns out to be an Epic exclusive too, you'll face a far greater backlash than any you've had so far. Don't do this to your fans who stayed loyal for the Warhammer journey.
No, they won't. People will whine and complain, but they will still buy it from the Epic Store. They will do this because, at the end of the day, it is a minor inconvenience to have games in Epic and Steam rather than everything consolidated in Steam. If CA does their analysis and projects that they will make more $$$ through Epic rather than pay the charges that Steam imposes, they will go with Epic.
If the game is good, people really don't care if it is offered via Steam or Epic or something else. I agree it is annoying, but that's capitalism baby.
Many won't buy it from the Epic Store though. We'll just move on instead. I can name about a half dozen games that I've wanted and passed over when they went Epic exclusive. Some are out but now they no longer interest me, while some still do, but I can wait a year to get them on Steam. A game is a game, we can go without for a time or even indefinitely, it's cutting our losses and moving on.
In case you missed it, A Total War Saga: TROY was revealed today to be a one-year exclusive on the Epic Store.
Just so you know, CA, if WH3 turns out to be an Epic exclusive too, you'll face a far greater backlash than any you've had so far. Don't do this to your fans who stayed loyal for the Warhammer journey.
No, they won't. People will whine and complain, but they will still buy it from the Epic Store. They will do this because, at the end of the day, it is a minor inconvenience to have games in Epic and Steam rather than everything consolidated in Steam. If CA does their analysis and projects that they will make more $$$ through Epic rather than pay the charges that Steam imposes, they will go with Epic.
If the game is good, people really don't care if it is offered via Steam or Epic or something else. I agree it is annoying, but that's capitalism baby.
Many won't buy it from the Epic Store though. We'll just move on instead. I can name about a half dozen games that I've wanted and passed over when they went Epic exclusive. Some are out but now they no longer interest me, while some still do, but I can wait a year to get them on Steam. A game is a game, we can go without for a time or even indefinitely, it's cutting our losses and moving on.
The explanation regarding diversity isn't bad, but they lost me at "and it’s relatively risk-free for you".
Personally I hate to install any game overlay / installer thingy / steam like stuff.
Each overlay eats performance. For each I have to remember accounts. For each I have to use personal data.
Hence I use only those which seem absolutely necessary.
Hence no epic for me.
Till shade is gone,
till water is gone,
into the Shadow with the teeth bared,
screaming defiance with the last breath,
to spit into Sightblinder's eye on the Last Day
In case you missed it, A Total War Saga: TROY was revealed today to be a one-year exclusive on the Epic Store.
Just so you know, CA, if WH3 turns out to be an Epic exclusive too, you'll face a far greater backlash than any you've had so far. Don't do this to your fans who stayed loyal for the Warhammer journey.
No, they won't. People will whine and complain, but they will still buy it from the Epic Store. They will do this because, at the end of the day, it is a minor inconvenience to have games in Epic and Steam rather than everything consolidated in Steam. If CA does their analysis and projects that they will make more $$$ through Epic rather than pay the charges that Steam imposes, they will go with Epic.
If the game is good, people really don't care if it is offered via Steam or Epic or something else. I agree it is annoying, but that's capitalism baby.
Say that to EA and DICE who said complainers are a minority and end up with a game which sold half than the previous game and was on promotion 6 days after the release date.
Comparing CA with EA just isn't apples to apples. And really, you are giving the "complainers" way too much credit for the failures of Battlefield V, which is what I am assuming you are referring to. Also, consider that EA still makes hand-over-fist money for sports games.
It is just like anything else. If people are truly angry about this scenario, they won't buy the game. Since both of us know that they will buy it, there is little point in arguing. The bottom line for all game companies is just that: the bottom line.
Unlike EA, CA listens to feedback. However, listening to feedback and making multi-billion dollar decisions based on that feedback are two completely different things. Billion dollar decisions are often made using data, and if CA's internal data shows them that they will make more $$$ using Epic, that is where they will go. It's as simple as that.
Consider this: IMO, they are using Troy as a measure to see how Epic would work for TW: TW3. If lots of people buy Troy through the Epic store, I can guarantee you that is how TW:WH3 will get offered.
In case you missed it, A Total War Saga: TROY was revealed today to be a one-year exclusive on the Epic Store.
Just so you know, CA, if WH3 turns out to be an Epic exclusive too, you'll face a far greater backlash than any you've had so far. Don't do this to your fans who stayed loyal for the Warhammer journey.
No, they won't. People will whine and complain, but they will still buy it from the Epic Store. They will do this because, at the end of the day, it is a minor inconvenience to have games in Epic and Steam rather than everything consolidated in Steam. If CA does their analysis and projects that they will make more $$$ through Epic rather than pay the charges that Steam imposes, they will go with Epic.
If the game is good, people really don't care if it is offered via Steam or Epic or something else. I agree it is annoying, but that's capitalism baby.
Many won't buy it from the Epic Store though. We'll just move on instead. I can name about a half dozen games that I've wanted and passed over when they went Epic exclusive. Some are out but now they no longer interest me, while some still do, but I can wait a year to get them on Steam. A game is a game, we can go without for a time or even indefinitely, it's cutting our losses and moving on.
And if you do so, that is certainly your prerogative. However, I suspect you would be in a very small minority. And whatever loss they would have with missing your business could be offset by the amount of $$$ they are saving by not paying the high charges that Steam requires. There is also the common practice of making games "exclusive" on Epic for a period of time (6 months to 1 year) and then making them available on Steam. By then, they likely win back your business, expand their game's presence, and make more over 1 year than if they had just made it available via Steam at launch.
As I said in another post, I'm willing to bet dollars-to-donuts that Troy is the game they will use to gauge the data.
Yea all back-ground aside - eg. the reputation and ethics of Valve versus Epic- the cut on Steam is significantly higher than Epic. And they don't provide all that much in functionality to developers / publishers. Valve is, however, renowned for its better customer service these days (it used to be much much worse). For example its refund policy is quite popular and well received now.
It's tough for a lot of users here to really understand this. The cut Valve takes, while floating near the average across all venues, is pretty high. And the cut Epic takes is really low. Someone at CA must have crunched the numbers for Troy and determined that it's worth it. The question of course is if Epic proves to be scandalous as many fear (or predict) then how will this damage the reputation of publishers that opted for exclusivity.
Now, I'm gonna go on a lim and say that CA isn't run by a bunch of morons. TW Warhammer isn't like Borderlands where every single game is basically standalone, but instead the games build on each other, granting you access to all the content that you owned in the previous game. The folks at CA are perfectly aware that people would riot if all of the content they had for Wh1 and Wh2 would turn out to be utterly useless because it only got released on a different platform. Also, with Warhammer not being an ip they own but just a license they have, they'll also not want to risk that by creating additional controversy.
My guess as to the Troy situation is, they aren't 100% happy with how the game has turned out and so they go for the free Epic release, hoping that they can get more people playing it that way for long enough to sell them DLC.
Yea all back-ground aside - eg. the reputation and ethics of Valve versus Epic- the cut on Steam is significantly higher than Epic. And they don't provide all that much in functionality to developers / publishers. Valve is, however, renowned for its better customer service these days (it used to be much much worse). For example its refund policy is quite popular and well received now.
It's tough for a lot of users here to really understand this. The cut Valve takes, while floating near the average across all venues, is pretty high. And the cut Epic takes is really low. Someone at CA must have crunched the numbers for Troy and determined that it's worth it. The question of course is if Epic proves to be scandalous as many fear (or predict) then how will this damage the reputation of publishers that opted for exclusivity.
If I remember right the cut Valve takes is 30%, while less might be an option for an agreement with big partners/huge titles that reel in a lot of customers. While Epic is taking 15%. Yes, that is less. But we can argue here about "so much less there".
However you look at it, these price cuts are NOT the problem of the customer in the end. There is no arguing in case of anyone here, so "defending" epic on this account is kinda stupid. That is a percentage which only profits the devs, which is kinda fine. But the vast majority of EGS devs who went that road are not giving a single cent they "save" back to the customer. So why should a customer start white knighting those acts? So from a customer perspective it only counts where you rather want to have your game and which launcher/support service proves more useful. As far as I know, Steam is still the better launcher, not owned by Tencent to make things worse.
If CA wants to try EGSclusive for a year for Troy, fine for them. Epic will spread enough money around to make it profitable. But that is the death sentence in my case. I don't touch EGS, and as with every EGSclusive title so far, they can shove it even if they finally come to Steam. Those games immediately drop into the 5€ and below category for me, if I even would want to play them two years after their prime. Devs did not want my Steam/GOG money at release, so they don't get it in the future. And yes, I share the fear some people here display for Warhammer III. Even if CA says now
We currently have no plans for any future games to be Epic exclusives. We do want to be more platform agnostic moving forward, and we would like future games to be available on the Epic Games Store, but that’s in addition to being available on other platforms such as Steam.
Can we really trust those words a year from now? Last year revealing Troy nobody was talking EGS to start with. But hey, now we know about the radio silence. better then the fuckery PGI did with MW5 but still a bit *meh*. Just think about it, what a giant FU would it be if we wait for the TWW trilogy to be finished and then it would become another EGSclusive and we would have to wait another year for the Steam release where we already have our previous games+dlcs for the unlocks? I give CA the benefit of the doubt here to not do that, but I am still worried for the future.
So a game I wasn't going to get is being given away for free?
Let me check the internet.... yep everyone is incredibly angry about it. Glad to know the world still has some things you can rely on.
No one's bothered by it being given away from free and you should know that. It's about the platform it's on and the exclusivity contract. Epic has serious issues and this is a common practice of theirs to try and draw people in. It looks good on the surface, but they run a terrible service anyone who doesn't think it's that bad simply aren't in the know about it.
Not to mention at the end of the day exclusivity contracts are just slimy, the game is ready and good to go, but they've paid off a ton of companies by now to only launch on their service for a time in an attempt to bottleneck people interested in those titles having to go through their service. It's anti-consumer and you should recognize that and not encourage it even if you don't care about any of the other points.
You can wrap up all these things under two main points: capitalism and commercialism. Nothing they are doing is against any law it's just, as you said, anti-consumer and the reason that companies are going along with it is because they offer much better revenue sharing than Steam or other platforms. If another competitor comes along and undercuts you it's time to start thinking about changing how you do business.
As to the entire point, I don't use Epic Games Store. Why? Because I don't like the exclusives as you said, but instead of complaining about it pointlessly, I do as many others here are doing, just ignore it and move on. Companies like CA and especially Sega listen to profits. So people have to vote with their wallet and unless they do that, none of it matters as they'll go where the money is best for them. Right now that's Warhammer and on Steam, but that isn't guaranteed to stay that way. I just don't get angry when a business does what's best for themselves even if I don't like it. I just then respond accordingly with my wallet.
SiWI: "no they just hate you and I don't blame them."
My guess as to the Troy situation is, they aren't 100% happy with how the game has turned out and so they go for the free Epic release, hoping that they can get more people playing it that way for long enough to sell them DLC.
My guess is that certain money for Troy from Epic is better then maybe money from you and me.
"Epic approached us and asked if TROY could be an Epic exclusive, as part of a commercial deal. That’s not to say that we immediately signed on the dotted line, or that money was the only reason that we did this (it’s not!)."
Ok I believe you CA!
"Embrace your hunger, your lust, your desire. The universe is ours for the taking."
I wouldn’t worry about that. No way in hell will Warhammer 3 be an Epic exclusive. There’s too many roadblocks.
1. The first two games are already on Steam. Why would they make Game 3 an epic exclusive and omit the last 2 games? Not happening.
2. They would need GW’s approval to do that since it’s their IP...so you also have them to consider.
3. Epic has no mod support - another big component of TWW games.
4. The TWW series is their most popular TW game to date. Would they really risk their golden goose egg by **** off their loyal customer base? 0% chance. TW Troy is a saga title and a self proclaimed experiment.
5. CA straight up said that no future titles will be an Epic exclusive.
So yeah, it’s not happening.
I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I’m all out of bubblegum.
I wasn't that interested in Troy anyway and I'm not touching it on Epic Store. Britannia I got as a gift and I managed less then an hour and I'm not going to touch Three Kingdoms. I'm in the camp of CA should have been concentrating on finishing Warhammer before going back to historical titles.
The only reason I'm even interested in the news is that it signals that CA are going to be doing it in the future. That statement is PR crap carefully worded to try appease us whilst not actually saying anything. I would applaud Total War going onto store fronts other then Steam, but picking the worst one going who just happen to be throwing you a ton of money to do it makes that sound extremely hollow.
The revenue split is better for CA but as a consumer I don't care, I've been gaming for decades and no one was getting anything approaching 70%/30% split so crying about it doesn't really wash with me. Maybe if prices fell I'd care but games are more expensive then ever. Maybe if the service was actually better then Steam/GoG/Origin/Uplay I'd care but it still isn't. This isn't 2004 or whenever Steam started out where there is no competition to be compared to.
Well the only thing i want is CA to find their balls or ovaries and come and say wether or bot wh 3 will be on steam , epic or both. Bot hide behind a curtain of silence like spineless worms.
This makes me sad on so many Levels. Why are there Publishers/Developers who still make exclusive Deals? When did the Community was happy about such a decision ever? They try to justify their hella stupid decision with "We wanna try out new things" and "We want to be on as many fronts as possible". Yet the Decision they made shows the exact opposite is the case. Not a single person would be bothered if they release TROY on Epic & Steam on the same day. I don't even think that the majority would be **** off if the Epic Release would be free while the Steam one isn't. People are **** off because we are kinda "forced" on so many releases lately to use EPIC, and fill our PC to the brim with Spyware, extremely unsafe safety measurements from EPICs site, the program even tries to get information about your Steam Folders on your Drives. Like wtf. CA / Sega / Braindamaged CEO that made this decision. If you read this, you have no idea how many Fans you will loose with these kinds of decisions in the Future. Right now they are just upset. But 1 maybe 2 more times something like this, and your Fanbase is gone.
I wonder how much influence Sega had in this, as CA is owned by Sega West. They have stated previously they want games on 'new platforms and services' but I would have thought a year-long exclusive to be a narrower rather than broader spectrum.
I wouldn’t worry about that. No way in hell will Warhammer 3 be an Epic exclusive. There’s too many roadblocks.
1. The first two games are already on Steam. Why would they make Game 3 an epic exclusive and omit the last 2 games? Not happening.
2. They would need GW’s approval to do that since it’s their IP...so you also have them to consider.
3. Epic has no mod support - another big component of TWW games.
4. The TWW series is their most popular TW game to date. Would they really risk their golden goose egg by **** off their loyal customer base? 0% chance. TW Troy is a saga title and a self proclaimed experiment.
5. CA straight up said that no future titles will be an Epic exclusive.
So yeah, it’s not happening.
Would CA risk their golden goose by **** off their loyal customer base? Ask Bethesda, EA and Naughty Dogs.
This makes me sad on so many Levels. Why are there Publishers/Developers who still make exclusive Deals? When did the Community was happy about such a decision ever? They try to justify their hella stupid decision with "We wanna try out new things" and "We want to be on as many fronts as possible". Yet the Decision they made shows the exact opposite is the case. Not a single person would be bothered if they release TROY on Epic & Steam on the same day. I don't even think that the majority would be **** off if the Epic Release would be free while the Steam one isn't. People are **** off because we are kinda "forced" on so many releases lately to use EPIC, and fill our PC to the brim with Spyware, extremely unsafe safety measurements from EPICs site, the program even tries to get information about your Steam Folders on your Drives. Like wtf. CA / Sega / Braindamaged CEO that made this decision. If you read this, you have no idea how many Fans you will loose with these kinds of decisions in the Future. Right now they are just upset. But 1 maybe 2 more times something like this, and your Fanbase is gone.
People were also upset about the Netease deal but after a little bit of time, nobody cares. It’s just overly-emotional internet outrage as usual.
Post edited by BillyRuffian#6250 on
I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I’m all out of bubblegum.
Oh well, that answers my question as to whether I'll get it or not. No, I shan't.
I'd be all for an alternative to Steam, just not such a one as Epic, that's becoming so simply by splurging money to get exclusives whilst giving a poor customer experience and an unfinished interface.
Yeah I don't understand why they can't just have it on other platforms at once, I hate Epic's attitude.
Comments
- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeSay that to EA and DICE who said complainers are a minority and end up with a game which sold half than the previous game and was on promotion 6 days after the release date.
- Report
2 · Disagree Agree- Report
7 · Disagree Agree- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
0 · Disagree AgreePersonally I hate to install any game overlay / installer thingy / steam like stuff.
Each overlay eats performance. For each I have to remember accounts. For each I have to use personal data.
Hence I use only those which seem absolutely necessary.
Hence no epic for me.
till water is gone,
into the Shadow with the teeth bared,
screaming defiance with the last breath,
to spit into Sightblinder's eye on the Last Day
- Report
2 · Disagree AgreeIt is just like anything else. If people are truly angry about this scenario, they won't buy the game. Since both of us know that they will buy it, there is little point in arguing. The bottom line for all game companies is just that: the bottom line.
Unlike EA, CA listens to feedback. However, listening to feedback and making multi-billion dollar decisions based on that feedback are two completely different things. Billion dollar decisions are often made using data, and if CA's internal data shows them that they will make more $$$ using Epic, that is where they will go. It's as simple as that.
Consider this: IMO, they are using Troy as a measure to see how Epic would work for TW: TW3. If lots of people buy Troy through the Epic store, I can guarantee you that is how TW:WH3 will get offered.
- Report
1 · Disagree AgreeAs I said in another post, I'm willing to bet dollars-to-donuts that Troy is the game they will use to gauge the data.
- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeIt's tough for a lot of users here to really understand this. The cut Valve takes, while floating near the average across all venues, is pretty high. And the cut Epic takes is really low. Someone at CA must have crunched the numbers for Troy and determined that it's worth it. The question of course is if Epic proves to be scandalous as many fear (or predict) then how will this damage the reputation of publishers that opted for exclusivity.
- Report
1 · Disagree AgreeMy guess as to the Troy situation is, they aren't 100% happy with how the game has turned out and so they go for the free Epic release, hoping that they can get more people playing it that way for long enough to sell them DLC.
- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeWhile Epic is taking 15%. Yes, that is less. But we can argue here about "so much less there".
However you look at it, these price cuts are NOT the problem of the customer in the end. There is no arguing in case of anyone here, so "defending" epic on this account is kinda stupid. That is a percentage which only profits the devs, which is kinda fine. But the vast majority of EGS devs who went that road are not giving a single cent they "save" back to the customer. So why should a customer start white knighting those acts? So from a customer perspective it only counts where you rather want to have your game and which launcher/support service proves more useful. As far as I know, Steam is still the better launcher, not owned by Tencent to make things worse.
If CA wants to try EGSclusive for a year for Troy, fine for them. Epic will spread enough money around to make it profitable. But that is the death sentence in my case. I don't touch EGS, and as with every EGSclusive title so far, they can shove it even if they finally come to Steam. Those games immediately drop into the 5€ and below category for me, if I even would want to play them two years after their prime. Devs did not want my Steam/GOG money at release, so they don't get it in the future.
And yes, I share the fear some people here display for Warhammer III. Even if CA says now
Can we really trust those words a year from now? Last year revealing Troy nobody was talking EGS to start with. But hey, now we know about the radio silence. better then the fuckery PGI did with MW5 but still a bit *meh*.
Just think about it, what a giant FU would it be if we wait for the TWW trilogy to be finished and then it would become another EGSclusive and we would have to wait another year for the Steam release where we already have our previous games+dlcs for the unlocks? I give CA the benefit of the doubt here to not do that, but I am still worried for the future.
------Red Dox
Missing units and other possible stuff (work in Progress)
- Report
4 · Disagree AgreeYou can wrap up all these things under two main points: capitalism and commercialism. Nothing they are doing is against any law it's just, as you said, anti-consumer and the reason that companies are going along with it is because they offer much better revenue sharing than Steam or other platforms. If another competitor comes along and undercuts you it's time to start thinking about changing how you do business.
As to the entire point, I don't use Epic Games Store. Why? Because I don't like the exclusives as you said, but instead of complaining about it pointlessly, I do as many others here are doing, just ignore it and move on. Companies like CA and especially Sega listen to profits. So people have to vote with their wallet and unless they do that, none of it matters as they'll go where the money is best for them. Right now that's Warhammer and on Steam, but that isn't guaranteed to stay that way. I just don't get angry when a business does what's best for themselves even if I don't like it. I just then respond accordingly with my wallet.
- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeOk
- Report
0 · Disagree Agree1. The first two games are already on Steam. Why would they make Game 3 an epic exclusive and omit the last 2 games? Not happening.
2. They would need GW’s approval to do that since it’s their IP...so you also have them to consider.
3. Epic has no mod support - another big component of TWW games.
4. The TWW series is their most popular TW game to date. Would they really risk their golden goose egg by **** off their loyal customer base? 0% chance. TW Troy is a saga title and a self proclaimed experiment.
5. CA straight up said that no future titles will be an Epic exclusive.
So yeah, it’s not happening.
- Report
1 · Disagree AgreeThe only reason I'm even interested in the news is that it signals that CA are going to be doing it in the future. That statement is PR crap carefully worded to try appease us whilst not actually saying anything. I would applaud Total War going onto store fronts other then Steam, but picking the worst one going who just happen to be throwing you a ton of money to do it makes that sound extremely hollow.
The revenue split is better for CA but as a consumer I don't care, I've been gaming for decades and no one was getting anything approaching 70%/30% split so crying about it doesn't really wash with me. Maybe if prices fell I'd care but games are more expensive then ever. Maybe if the service was actually better then Steam/GoG/Origin/Uplay I'd care but it still isn't. This isn't 2004 or whenever Steam started out where there is no competition to be compared to.
- Report
0 · Disagree Agree#givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc
- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeWhy are there Publishers/Developers who still make exclusive Deals?
When did the Community was happy about such a decision ever?
They try to justify their hella stupid decision with "We wanna try out new things" and "We want to be on as many fronts as possible". Yet the Decision they made shows the exact opposite is the case.
Not a single person would be bothered if they release TROY on Epic & Steam on the same day. I don't even think that the majority would be **** off if the Epic Release would be free while the Steam one isn't.
People are **** off because we are kinda "forced" on so many releases lately to use EPIC, and fill our PC to the brim with Spyware, extremely unsafe safety measurements from EPICs site, the program even tries to get information about your Steam Folders on your Drives. Like wtf.
CA / Sega / Braindamaged CEO that made this decision. If you read this, you have no idea how many Fans you will loose with these kinds of decisions in the Future. Right now they are just upset. But 1 maybe 2 more times something like this, and your Fanbase is gone.
- Report
2 · Disagree Agree- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
2 · Disagree Agree- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeI almost want CA to do it for the sheer thrill.
- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
0 · Disagree Agree- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeSmert move CA......
- Report
0 · Disagree AgreeThey do come out swinging the guy´s and gals over at Epic....That´s for sure.
Nurgle is love
Nurgle is life
#JusticeForNurglingForumAvatars
- Report
0 · Disagree Agree#givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc
- Report
1 · Disagree Agree- Report
1 · Disagree Agree