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Allisara's Bane

BiesBies Junior MemberSwedenRegistered Users Posts: 5,207






"I shivered at the sight of her - her beauty far beyond that of mortal man. But her soul glowed with an inner darkness that chilled my very core."









Comments

  • lucibuislucibuis Registered Users Posts: 7,099
    We x de best dlc combo
    Ariel only, no fads allowed.

  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316
    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 17,625

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    well he got mother

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • Cadia101Cadia101 Registered Users Posts: 1,400

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316
    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 4,100

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
  • ArielAriel Registered Users Posts: 2,186

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    Bros before hoes :D

    The final rose has faded,
    The eaves will sing no more;
    The waxen ground will keep you bound,
    Death-pale until the thaw.
    Then she placed the rest of Orion's ashes into the bowl and turned to face the Oak of Ages.
    I used to go by many names here. Crazycrix, Dubinekdubajs, Yrellian and finally Ariel, one of my favourite characters in the setting. Still waiting for Finubar and Naieth!
  • RomeoRejectRomeoReject Registered Users Posts: 1,907

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    I don't know, have you seen Snorri? Daaaayum, Dwarf is fiiiiiiiine.
  • ArneSoArneSo Hamburg, Germany Registered Users Posts: 32,653

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    Bros before hoes I guess 😂
    Nurgle is love, Nurgle is life
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 17,625

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    He invented DE so seriously the guy has some questionable tendencies.

    But of all things a dwarf eww.

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • Sir_GodspeedSir_Godspeed Registered Users Posts: 3,522
    Eyh man, Dwarfs are thicc.
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,586

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    Plus it's just contrived to have Malekith's true start if darkness be triggered by a lost love instead of losing his friends to war or his mother's machinations. If the writers wanted a deeper relationship between the Dark Elves and Wood Elves, a few paragraphs of a late addition love storyline is not the way to do it.
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 4,451

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    I agree. I read 3 books about the split and there was not a single word about it. I didn't understand where it came from, it turns out it was invented later. To be honest after that I had even less respect for the fool Malekith. How stupid he is. I feel very sorry for Allisara.
  • PocmanPocman Registered Users Posts: 5,601
    Pointless love story, with edgy death for Alisara. Plus, I don't know, I would expect Malekith killing Morathi or something like that, at least. But no.

    Plus the whole, "Ariel is super angry but then decides to learn dark magic because she is tempted" is utterly stupid.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 4,451

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    She was to become the wife of Alit Anar and punish the traitor Malekith
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 4,100

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 4,100

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
  • CrossilCrossil Registered Users Posts: 14,872
    edited November 2020

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
    Perhaps the order of events is somewhat different. Maybe he went away expecting to come back to her after his excursion, but after having his mind corrupted and being persuaded by Morathi to start the rebellion, his former love meant little in such a condition. And Allisara for her part was forced into Athel Loren without even knowing what happened and the unease she felt is that she was leaving where he would've returned, without even finding out what was going on years later.

    I mean, Malekith didn't care for her until he literally went into a melancholic destitute from which little could rouse him. That's when he once again yearned for her return, and her death killed off any good or weakness he had in himself.

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    That might as well be because she didn't offer him enough comfort after his dwarf pal died, in order to prevent his eventual downfall. You can hardly call that proof of anything.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • CrossilCrossil Registered Users Posts: 14,872

    Pocman said:

    Pointless love story, with edgy death for Alisara. Plus, I don't know, I would expect Malekith killing Morathi or something like that, at least. But no.

    Plus the whole, "Ariel is super angry but then decides to learn dark magic because she is tempted" is utterly stupid.

    Is Malekith even able to kill her if they face off? I know he calls more or less the shots but when reading their background Morathi seemed for me to be the stronger.
    He imprisoned her after that and contemplated killing her. Eventually he relented as Allisara's death did indeed make him "stronger".
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
    I'll go with the former.

    She was already troubled before his rebellion, and after rebellion is addressed separately:

    In time she came to learn much of Malekith's deeds, and came to feel guilt for the path her husband had taken.


    Bad, bad wife.
    Crossil said:



    That might as well be because she didn't offer him enough comfort after his dwarf pal died, in order to prevent his eventual downfall. You can hardly call that proof of anything.

    Considering that she arrived in Athel Loren just before rebellion I say it is no coincidence.
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 4,100
    Crossil said:

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
    Perhaps the order of events is somewhat different. Maybe he went away expecting to come back to her after his excursion, but after having his mind corrupted and being persuaded by Morathi to start the rebellion, his former love meant little in such a condition. And Allisara for her part was forced into Athel Loren without even knowing what happened and the unease she felt is that she was leaving where he would've returned, without even finding out what was going on years later.

    I mean, Malekith didn't care for her until he literally went into a melancholic destitute from which little could rouse him. That's when he once again yearned for her return, and her death killed off any good or weakness he had in himself.

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    That might as well be because she didn't offer him enough comfort after his dwarf pal died, in order to prevent his eventual downfall. You can hardly call that proof of anything.
    Well, it's a bit problematic. The most detailed source on Malekith in this time is Time of legends: Malekith. It tells the whole story in a very nice and compelling way, clearly showing all the different events and feelings that caused Malekith's downfall. The problem is, this was written during 7th edition, before Alissara was invented. Her existence does not fit in with the book at all, and we don't have any other detailed lore about her, only the vague armybook stuff of which 100% is in this thread.

    In the novel, Malekith spends a long time on Ulthuan before rebelling. Initially he leads the crusade against the cults of pleasure, taking back Nagarythe which was under their control. During this crusade Morathi is discovered as the leader and imprisoned. Only later, after Malekith learns that Bel Shanaar will apoint Imrik as the leader of the next crusade, does Malekith panic. He consults Morathi, who tells him to go through with her already prepared assassination of Bel Shanaar.

    It also makes little sense since according to most sources, the elves did not start living in Athel Loren until the war of the beard, long after the civil war.

    Pocman said:

    Pointless love story, with edgy death for Alisara. Plus, I don't know, I would expect Malekith killing Morathi or something like that, at least. But no.

    Plus the whole, "Ariel is super angry but then decides to learn dark magic because she is tempted" is utterly stupid.

    Is Malekith even able to kill her if they face off? I know he calls more or less the shots but when reading their background Morathi seemed for me to be the stronger.
    It is not really known. Morathi is a more powerful sorcerer, but Malekith is a much more powerful physically and has some incredibly potent magical artifacts. I think Malekith would win in a direct duel, but Morathi is not exactly known for her honour. They both command enourmous resources, and each of them have their own networks of spies and assassins to find the other's weaknesses.

  • PocmanPocman Registered Users Posts: 5,601
    I would say Malekith>Morathi.


    I am but just talking about a direct duel, but how Morathi always seems to be walking in thin ice, while Malekith's authority seems indestructible even after his defeats.

    Like, if Malekith ordered Morathi dead through open war, most of the other DE lords would be happy to oblige. While on the contrary, Morathi would never be able to unite the DE lords.
  • CrossilCrossil Registered Users Posts: 14,872
    edited November 2020

    Crossil said:

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
    Perhaps the order of events is somewhat different. Maybe he went away expecting to come back to her after his excursion, but after having his mind corrupted and being persuaded by Morathi to start the rebellion, his former love meant little in such a condition. And Allisara for her part was forced into Athel Loren without even knowing what happened and the unease she felt is that she was leaving where he would've returned, without even finding out what was going on years later.

    I mean, Malekith didn't care for her until he literally went into a melancholic destitute from which little could rouse him. That's when he once again yearned for her return, and her death killed off any good or weakness he had in himself.

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    That might as well be because she didn't offer him enough comfort after his dwarf pal died, in order to prevent his eventual downfall. You can hardly call that proof of anything.
    Well, it's a bit problematic. The most detailed source on Malekith in this time is Time of legends: Malekith. It tells the whole story in a very nice and compelling way, clearly showing all the different events and feelings that caused Malekith's downfall. The problem is, this was written during 7th edition, before Alissara was invented. Her existence does not fit in with the book at all, and we don't have any other detailed lore about her, only the vague armybook stuff of which 100% is in this thread.

    In the novel, Malekith spends a long time on Ulthuan before rebelling. Initially he leads the crusade against the cults of pleasure, taking back Nagarythe which was under their control. During this crusade Morathi is discovered as the leader and imprisoned. Only later, after Malekith learns that Bel Shanaar will apoint Imrik as the leader of the next crusade, does Malekith panic. He consults Morathi, who tells him to go through with her already prepared assassination of Bel Shanaar.

    It also makes little sense since according to most sources, the elves did not start living in Athel Loren until the war of the beard, long after the civil war.
    Actually found another bit.



    So technically she left him after all, but seemingly due to some visions(presumably of Malekith's future deeds?). So I guess it is that she left him. Still, I think it's implied she left him before he ventured into the outside world, before he returned to Ulthuan after that point and before he started clearing out the cults and so on. She eventually ended up there, not immediately after their separation, so it is perfectly plausible she left him much sooner.

    Anyway, it's not clearly stated when she left, it could've been sooner than his return to Ulthuan and before his outward ventures.
    Furthermore, I consider that Daemon Prince must be removed.
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 15,316
    edited November 2020
    Crossil said:

    Crossil said:

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    When Malekith left on his travels, he never returned to the old world until long after the sundering. So either Alissara went to Uthuan on her own and then left Ulthuan again before the rebellion, or she stayed behind in the old world when Malekith left and never left there.

    And I think anyone would be troubled if their husband committed mass murder on the nation's leaders, tried to seize power by force, and died immediately afterwards (most elves thought Malekith died for a long time).
    Perhaps the order of events is somewhat different. Maybe he went away expecting to come back to her after his excursion, but after having his mind corrupted and being persuaded by Morathi to start the rebellion, his former love meant little in such a condition. And Allisara for her part was forced into Athel Loren without even knowing what happened and the unease she felt is that she was leaving where he would've returned, without even finding out what was going on years later.

    I mean, Malekith didn't care for her until he literally went into a melancholic destitute from which little could rouse him. That's when he once again yearned for her return, and her death killed off any good or weakness he had in himself.

    Cadia101 said:

    Ungrateful wench. Malekith deserved better.

    Your constant roll play is starting to be tiring.
    That's what Allisara is, her petulence, her absence has played no small role in Malekith's descent.into midnight.
    Malekith is the one who left her in the old world though, not the other way around.

    Anyway, her being invented was my least favorite part of 8th edition lore, as it undermines Malekith's charcter arc. He left the old world because there was nothing there for him after Snorri died, Alissara's existence makes this somewhat nonsensical. So either it's a plot hole, or Malekith loved Snorri way more than he ever loved Alissara.
    It doesn't say that Malekith left her in the Old World. She should have followed him no matter what.
    Here's exactly what it says, 8th edition dark elf armybook.



    It's pretty clear that Malekith is the one who left, of his own decision. And he probably would not want to take his wife to the chaos wastes anyway. I really don't understand how you can blame Alissara in all this.
    It isn't. Those are two different events. It's understandable that Malekith didn't take her on his many journeys.

    She had come to Athel Loren shortly before Malekith began his rebellion, and had ever since dwelt in solitude, seeking to still her troubled heart.


    I say that this implies that she left him.
    That might as well be because she didn't offer him enough comfort after his dwarf pal died, in order to prevent his eventual downfall. You can hardly call that proof of anything.
    Well, it's a bit problematic. The most detailed source on Malekith in this time is Time of legends: Malekith. It tells the whole story in a very nice and compelling way, clearly showing all the different events and feelings that caused Malekith's downfall. The problem is, this was written during 7th edition, before Alissara was invented. Her existence does not fit in with the book at all, and we don't have any other detailed lore about her, only the vague armybook stuff of which 100% is in this thread.

    In the novel, Malekith spends a long time on Ulthuan before rebelling. Initially he leads the crusade against the cults of pleasure, taking back Nagarythe which was under their control. During this crusade Morathi is discovered as the leader and imprisoned. Only later, after Malekith learns that Bel Shanaar will apoint Imrik as the leader of the next crusade, does Malekith panic. He consults Morathi, who tells him to go through with her already prepared assassination of Bel Shanaar.

    It also makes little sense since according to most sources, the elves did not start living in Athel Loren until the war of the beard, long after the civil war.
    Actually found another bit.



    So technically she left him after all, but seemingly due to some visions(presumably of Malekith's future deeds?). So I guess it is that she left him. Still, I think it's implied she left him before he ventured into the outside world, before he returned to Ulthuan after that point and before he started clearing out the cults and so on. She eventually ended up there, not immediately after their separation, so it is perfectly plausible she left him much sooner.

    Anyway, it's not clearly stated when she left, it could've been sooner than his return to Ulthuan and before his outward ventures.
    I was just looking for it, thank you. I remembered that it is said somewhere that she fled, but couldn't pinpoint the exact source. I'm glad I haven't started to imagine things.

    My point stands, what an ungrateful, despicable wench!
    Post edited by Maedrethnir on
  • DraculasaurusDraculasaurus Registered Users Posts: 4,771
    Unrelated to whether the Allisara/Season of Retribution plotline is well written, it occurs to me that for all the talk of Morathi already being in the game we actually have precedent with a similar situation.

    In the Vampire Coast campaign it's hinted repeatedly that some other mystery pirate is working behind the scenes against your goal to conquer Amanar. Lo and behold in the final battle it's revealed that this mystery pirate isn't one of your fellow Vampirate rivals, but Lokhir Fellheart.

    If Ariel was the LL for the DLC it would be pretty easy to reconstruct the Season of Retribution plotline, in which she initially doesn't know who'se responsible for the death of Allisara. In the lore she initially raids Ulthuan before realizing Morathi is the real culprit. In TW this could be represented with her starting in Ellyrion or Tiranoc, at war with the High Elves, but as you follow her campaign goals and progress her campaign narrative it ultimately leads to a scripted final battle where you fight Morathi. After all, as long as it's a scripted final battle, it doesn't matter if Morathi is still alive on the campaign map or not. Same with Lokhir Fellheart and the Vampirate campaign.
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