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Bladesingers

eomateomat Junior MemberRegistered Users Posts: 1,911
I find Bladesingers to be too powerful for their cost. Going up against Chosen (1450) Bladesingers (1200) it's an even fight mostly from what I've seen. I love Wood Elves but Chosen should really be that hulking scary armoured threat. Chosen are a single focused unit whereas Bladesingers can augment their style by an ability to do more base damage at the cost of AP. The fact that they can do this should probably give them an increase in cost or imo CA should nerf them slightly to keep them tough but not as tough as an elite tier Chaos unit like Chosen.

As a disclaimer Chaos aren't my choice army of playing but I love fighting them. Empire, Wood Elves and High Elves are my thing but I do see that this last DLC like all is giving power creep too much in this regard.

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Comments

  • GhettobibleGhettobible Registered Users Posts: 79
    Chaos going to get a complete rework in the next game. I doubt they're going to spend much time tweaking something that's going to be changed in a year.
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Registered Users Posts: 4,435
    Bladesingers shouldn't have even been made in my opinion. CA just inflates rosters to give armies unit types they never had, this erodes army uniqueness and playstyle.
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 9,637

    Bladesingers shouldn't have even been made in my opinion. CA just inflates rosters to give armies unit types they never had, this erodes army uniqueness and playstyle.

    Definitely a shape shifters form older editions would have been a better choice, or meadow chariots.
    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc
  • eomateomat Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,911
    I was hoping for a Shadowdancer hero with Asrai spear so WE could've chosen Anti-Large Caster (Shadowdancer) on foot or a Spellsinger with acces to mounts.
  • eomateomat Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,911

    Chaos going to get a complete rework in the next game. I doubt they're going to spend much time tweaking something that's going to be changed in a year.

    This is my hope that CA will revise them in the Chaos Update
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,979
    The Bladesingers are the only real armour piercing option the WE have and they certainly have their weaknesses.. they're fine.
  • BlissBliss Registered Users Posts: 579
    edited January 16
    Chosen GW are the best target for bladesingers. The whole comparison BS / Chosen GW / Chosen (shields) topic has already been discussed in an other thread.

    Their dance is to shift their balance in way the WE roster / philosophy doesn't allow it : having a unit that will perform vs any Elite infantry unit without MR (often cost effective, and fast damage output in general) and fast but very vulnerable vs missiles and cav (missile cav included). Without this dance, they would be cost-effective only vs heavy armored infantry which no one brings vs WE. It's designed to be one of the ultimate melee damage dealer anti-infantry unit, considering their huge weaknesses. They pay for that versatility : no armor and lowish HP.


    Btw, you get far better results with regular chosen (1250) vs Bladesingers than Chosen GW (1450).
  • SchwarzhelmSchwarzhelm Registered Users Posts: 1,751
    edited January 16
    IIRC Chosen beat them quite handily, at least the GW typ.
    Not sure about the other variants.


    Edit:
    Maybe I am wrong with the GW, only found a video where they fought the shield variant and that was an even trait.


  • Darthplagueis13Darthplagueis13 Registered Users Posts: 429

    The Bladesingers are the only real armour piercing option the WE have and they certainly have their weaknesses.. they're fine.

    Apart from their basic spearmen, their more advanced spearmen, their fire archers, their elite archers, Zoats, Stag Knights, Wildwood Rangers, Hawk Rider melee, Tree Spirits, Forest Dragons and almost every single one of their lords provided the right mount?

    Yeah, WE are totally starved for AP, I see.
  • DyesevnDyesevn Registered Users Posts: 111
    is there a situation when you would bring wildwood rangers over bladesingers?
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 3,446
    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Registered Users Posts: 4,435
    edited January 16
    Dyesevn said:

    is there a situation when you would bring wildwood rangers over bladesingers?

    If you don't own the DLC.

    The Bladesingers are the only real armour piercing option the WE have and they certainly have their weaknesses.. they're fine.

    Wood Elves were never starved for AP options.
  • manpersalmanpersal Registered Users Posts: 1,332

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 3,446
    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
  • eomateomat Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,911
    I would have preferred that Wildwood Rangers got more AP plus that they would have had the White Lions of Chrace animations and stance rather than the Greatswords they currently have.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,979

    The Bladesingers are the only real armour piercing option the WE have and they certainly have their weaknesses.. they're fine.

    Apart from their basic spearmen, their more advanced spearmen, their fire archers, their elite archers, Zoats, Stag Knights, Wildwood Rangers, Hawk Rider melee, Tree Spirits, Forest Dragons and almost every single one of their lords provided the right mount?

    Yeah, WE are totally starved for AP, I see.
    Infantry option then drama queen, spears are hardly damage dealers so would lose out against armoured infantry that generally aren’t spears.

    They offer a new option, however, they’re nothing like perfect and gave weaknesses like any decent unit.
  • PocmanPocman Registered Users Posts: 4,114
    edited January 16

    Bladesingers shouldn't have even been made in my opinion. CA just inflates rosters to give armies unit types they never had, this erodes army uniqueness and playstyle.

    Except bladesingers are basically what wardancers were supposed to be. So no.

    Regarding the topic, bladesingers are weak and almost never used in MP. Them.beatinh chosen is the least you would expect from a 1200 unit that can be destroyed by goblin archers.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,979
    Blade Singers are expensive infantry so can be attacked with cav and magic making the a risk in multiplayer. However, they can be fun in campaign and used in specialised builds in MP.

    If you don’t like the fine, but don’t get upset when others like them.

  • lucibuislucibuis Registered Users Posts: 6,199
    eomat said:

    I find Bladesingers to be too powerful for their cost. Going up against Chosen (1450) Bladesingers (1200) it's an even fight mostly from what I've seen. I love Wood Elves but Chosen should really be that hulking scary armoured threat. Chosen are a single focused unit whereas Bladesingers can augment their style by an ability to do more base damage at the cost of AP. The fact that they can do this should probably give them an increase in cost or imo CA should nerf them slightly to keep them tough but not as tough as an elite tier Chaos unit like Chosen.

    As a disclaimer Chaos aren't my choice army of playing but I love fighting them. Empire, Wood Elves and High Elves are my thing but I do see that this last DLC like all is giving power creep too much in this regard.

    Blade singers by definition do well against armoured infantry, if you send chosen against them you’re wrong

    Check this video, their damage output is pretty mediocre

    Ariel only, no fads allowed.

  • tadakatsutadakatsu Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 775
    the person who made the video didnt even use the base damage stance vs the slaves which would have made the bladesingers do more damage than they did in video as slaves are unarmored lol
  • tadakatsutadakatsu Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 775
    lucibuis said:

    eomat said:

    I find Bladesingers to be too powerful for their cost. Going up against Chosen (1450) Bladesingers (1200) it's an even fight mostly from what I've seen. I love Wood Elves but Chosen should really be that hulking scary armoured threat. Chosen are a single focused unit whereas Bladesingers can augment their style by an ability to do more base damage at the cost of AP. The fact that they can do this should probably give them an increase in cost or imo CA should nerf them slightly to keep them tough but not as tough as an elite tier Chaos unit like Chosen.

    As a disclaimer Chaos aren't my choice army of playing but I love fighting them. Empire, Wood Elves and High Elves are my thing but I do see that this last DLC like all is giving power creep too much in this regard.

    Blade singers by definition do well against armoured infantry, if you send chosen against them you’re wrong

    Check this video, their damage output is pretty mediocre

    bladesingers do well vs armored or unarmored units as they have a toggle that gives more base damage at the cost of some ap so you use it if fighting things like slaves that have next to no armor which the person who made the video didnt do so it was frankly a bad test of dps output vs unarmored enemies
  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,509
    edited January 16
    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They still don't show as much flesh as TT models of Wardancers:



    To be honest I would have preferred if they looked like this guy:



    animacja-sygn-3.gif


  • General_HijaltiGeneral_Hijalti Registered Users Posts: 2,614

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 3,446

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,979

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    That’s BS.
  • tadakatsutadakatsu Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 775

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    That’s BS.
    i agree i use them in all my campaigns cause they are busted vs armored or unarmored elite inf. they rek everything except for monsters and chosen in which its a very close call. as much as i like them being busted i do hope CA nerfs them so they are not able to beat every elite inf
  • tadakatsutadakatsu Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 775

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    thats false as stated by the guy you quoted in 1 vs 1 they rek nearly all elite infantry and the ones they dont win against its a very close call despite some of them costing a fair bit more to field
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 3,446
    tadakatsu said:

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    thats false as stated by the guy you quoted in 1 vs 1 they rek nearly all elite infantry and the ones they dont win against its a very close call despite some of them costing a fair bit more to field
    This is not true, I tested them against different infantry, and they do more damage than the rest of the wood elf infantry, but due to their low armor, they are destroyed very quickly. Therefore, they do not make sense during the campaign. In network games, it is possible that they will be useful.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 11,979
    edited January 17

    tadakatsu said:

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    thats false as stated by the guy you quoted in 1 vs 1 they rek nearly all elite infantry and the ones they dont win against its a very close call despite some of them costing a fair bit more to field
    This is not true, I tested them against different infantry, and they do more damage than the rest of the wood elf infantry, but due to their low armor, they are destroyed very quickly. Therefore, they do not make sense during the campaign. In network games, it is possible that they will be useful.
    More BS. There’s been numerous videos of them destroying elite armoured infantry, 3 units of Empire swordsmen..

    Post edited by dge1 on
  • veresh1989veresh1989 Russia, Saint-PetersburgRegistered Users Posts: 3,446
    edited January 17

    tadakatsu said:

    manpersal said:

    The Bladesingers are just another garbage infantry that can't stand up to any elite infantry from other factions. I never used them in the campaign and I never will, they make no sense.

    You can argue if they were a relevant addition, but they're crazy powerful. Also, they're girls showing flesh. I thought that it was the only thing you cared about.
    They don't make sense. They die very quickly in close combat. It is impossible to play through them on high difficulty. The only combat-ready units are archers, hawk riders for sisters, sisters of thorns, dragons and ents. All infantry are just cannon fodder.
    They beat virtually every other elite infantry in a 1 on 1
    I checked this and it is not true. They lose to everyone in the vast majority of cases.
    thats false as stated by the guy you quoted in 1 vs 1 they rek nearly all elite infantry and the ones they dont win against its a very close call despite some of them costing a fair bit more to field
    This is not true, I tested them against different infantry, and they do more damage than the rest of the wood elf infantry, but due to their low armor, they are destroyed very quickly. Therefore, they do not make sense during the campaign. In network games, it is possible that they will be useful.
    More BS. There’s been numerous videos of them destroying elite armoured infantry, 3 units of Empire swordsmen..

    .
    So I filmed their battle with the black orcs, of course they lost

    Post edited by dge1 on
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