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I genuinely think this is a wise decision for CA, business wise

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  • Rewan#2358Rewan#2358 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,859
    Again, the vocal minority can absolutely destroy a game reputation before its launch, even for the "casuals"
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  • YANGXuYANGXu Registered Users Posts: 55
    Rewan said:

    Again, the vocal minority can absolutely destroy a game reputation before its launch, even for the "casuals"

    Obviously, I don't doubt that possibility. But apparently it is not very probable. Because if that happans even remotely enough, shady corporations like EA and Tencent would collapse a long time ago. Instead, it is the the gaming corporations that have been domesticating players, both the hardcores and the casuals.
  • Misaka_ComplexMisaka_Complex Registered Users Posts: 3,707
    YANGXu said:

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.

    I would say that it is a huge problem when the overwhelming majority of the Chinese player who are speaking up are not happy with this situation. If you count everyone who aren't saying anything, you can argue that the people who are speaking up are the vocal minority, now if you aren't speaking up that is the same as abstaining from a vote which means that the people who are speaking up will be representing the fanbase as our opinions will dominate the scene.

  • RafSwi7#7492RafSwi7#7492 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,741
    In general yes, the full game will always sell better than even the best DLCs. This is why we have Saga titles, this is why "standalone expansions" like WH2 and WH3 have 2&3 in their titles.

    From leaked documents (Epic vs Apple) it seems that DLCs might generate around 6-10% of overall profits (during one year) for Total War title. The rest are sales from sold copies of the game.

    Completed EMPIRE, ROMEII, ATTILA, THRONES OF BRITANNIA, WARHAMMER, THREE KINGDOMS, TROY and ROME REMASTERED campaigns:
    EMPIRE
    France, Poland-Lithuania, Spain.
    ROMEII
    GC: Ardiaei, Arevaci, Athens, Baktria, Carthage, Cimmeria, Egypt, Epirus, Iceni, Kush, Lusitani, Macedon, Masaesyli, Massagetae, Massalia, Nabatea, Nervii, Odrysian Kingdom, Parthia, Pergamon, Rome, Royal Scythia, Saba, Seleucid, Sparta, Suebi, Syracuse.
    CiG: Arverni, Rome, Suebi.
    HatG: Arevaci, Carthage, Rome, Syracuse.
    IA: Antony's Rome, Dacia, Egypt, Marcomanni, Octavian's Rome, Parthia, Pompey's Rome.
    WoS: Athenai, Boiotian League, Korinthos, Sparta.
    ED: Armenia, Caledonii, Gallic Rome, Marcomanni, Palmyra, Rome, Saxoni, The Sassanids.
    RotR: Rome, Samnites, Senones, Syracuse, Taras, Tarchuna.
    ATTILA
    GC: Alans, Anteans, Eastern Roman Empire, Franks, Geats, Himyar, Jutes, Ostrogoths, Saxons, Venedians.
    TLR: Roman Expedition, Visigothic Kingdom.
    AoC: Kingdom of Asturias, Kingdom of Charlemagne, Kingdom of the Danes, Kingdom of Mercia.
    THRONES OF BRITANNIA
    Dublin, Gwined, Northumbria, Mercia, Sudreyar, West Seaxe.
    WARHAMMER 1 & 2 & 3
    W1: Belegar Ironhammer, Durthu, Karl Franz, Louen Leoncoeur, The Fay Enchantress.
    W2 - ME: Alith Anar, Count Noctilus, Ikit Claw, Imrik, Kroq-Gar, Louen Leoncoeur, Morghur the Shadowgave, The Fay Enchantress, Vlad von Carstein, Wulfrik the Wanderer, Wurrzag da Great Green Prophet.
    W2 - V: Eltharion, Lokhir Fellheart, Markus Wulfhart, Repanse de Lyonesse, Settra the Imperishable, Sisters of Twilight.
    W3 - RoC: Kairos Fateweaver, Tzarina Katarin, Zhao Ming.
    THREE KINGDOMS
    MOH: Liu Chong, Liu Hong, Lu Zhi, Zhang Bao.
    ROTW: Dong Zhuo, Gongsun Zan, He Yi, Liu Bei, Ma Teng, Sun Jian, Yuan Shao.
    AWB: Cao Cao, King Mulu, Liu Biao, Lü Bu, Meng Huo, Sun Ce, Yan Baihu.
    FD: Cao Cao, Liu Bei, Liu Zhang, Sun Ce, Yuan Shao.
    EP: Sima Ai, Sima Yong, Sima Yue.
    TROY
    Achilles, Aeneas, Agamemnon, Ajax, Diomedes, Hector, Hippolyta, Memnon, Menelaus, Odysseus, Paris, Penthesilea, Rhesus, Sarpedon.
    ROME REMASTERED
    RTW: Carthage, Egypt, Greek Cities, Macedon, Scipii, Scythia.
    BI: Eastern Roman Empire, Romano-British, Sarmatians, Slavs.
  • YANGXuYANGXu Registered Users Posts: 55

    YANGXu said:

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.

    I would say that it is a huge problem when the overwhelming majority of the Chinese player who are speaking up are not happy with this situation. If you count everyone who aren't saying anything, you can argue that the people who are speaking up are the vocal minority, now if you aren't speaking up that is the same as abstaining from a vote which means that the people who are speaking up will be representing the fanbase as our opinions will dominate the scene.
    I sure hope so, but wouldn't count on it. I believe the silent mass are not so much as abstaning from a vote of disagreement or anger as a simple 'I don't really care'. Like I said, not many people actually follow the game development and news as we do.
  • Misaka_ComplexMisaka_Complex Registered Users Posts: 3,707
    YANGXu said:

    I sure hope so, but wouldn't count on it. I believe the silent mass are not so much as abstaning from a vote of disagreement or anger as a simple 'I don't really care'. Like I said, not many people actually follow the game development and news as we do.

    Remember, the masses also discuss and hear about the game from their peers even if they don't visit communities or speak up about their experience with the game. For example when the dominating voice on the scene for this game is "CA betrayed the fans and did the three kingdoms dirty by ditching the game without finishing it" and this is the only mainstream opinion in China, the silent masses will hear about it from their peers, family and friends and will definitely take this into consideration when making future purchases by CA so that's why I would argue that our voices matter.

    So when they see the next three kingdoms titles from CA, the dominant voice on the Chinese scene would be "CA didn't even finish their last game as it didn't even have Chibi or even a three kingdoms starting date, they added Nan Man and charged $20 for it without even adding a southern expedition starting date" the masses will hear this, and decide from there whether if they can trust CA with the next title or not. I am quite sure that this will effect their sales in China.

  • ComradCommodoreComradCommodore Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 919
    Amonkhet said:

    Rewan said:

    The one's that don't play the game?


    Except people played the game. The biggest reason people didn't want to play the game was the longstanding issues with the game (bugs & balance problems) - that couldn't be fixed with the snail pace patching process.

    I mean it's part of the reason on why there's such an uproar, people played this game, other people WANTED to play this game and were just waiting for a better quality experience. But now the game is forever stuck in limbo
    Enough people play the base game to justify a brand new game for the same audience. Not enough people bought new content to justify further developement. On ToB and Troy the plug was pulled a lot earlier so 3K is acutally viewed as success from CA.
    It might be true what the OP said and the 3K community just isn't used to DLC practice and what it means for further developement of a game like the western audience is normally alienated by gacha elements and in some western countries they are even illegal.

    So the players who like 3K will get more 3K games instead of DLCs so it might be a win-win for everybody or not, we will see what happens.
    What if people stopped playing TK because it has issues ?

    CA releases content that needs polish

    Polish does not occur

    People stop playing game because content needs polish / why start a new campaign when the next patch will just break it

    CA cans game

    It took 2 years before we finally got an attempt at unit balancing (cav/archers where extremely over powered) stuff like that is way more important then "wHeN iS kORea GEtTiNg AdDed?!?!?!" Adding more content to a game isn't going to keep people around when alot of what's there is broken or has issues.

    Guess it doesn't really matter now though huh?
    Thats the crux of the issue. DLCs released weren't great; it didnt keep players around and then they had to can the game because of it.

    If the game originally didnt sell well, CA would be dropping Three Kingdoms era completely.
    It's their own fault though. World Betrayed got one patch didn't it? ONE

    Then we had like,
    YANGXu said:

    YANGXu said:

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.

    I would say that it is a huge problem when the overwhelming majority of the Chinese player who are speaking up are not happy with this situation. If you count everyone who aren't saying anything, you can argue that the people who are speaking up are the vocal minority, now if you aren't speaking up that is the same as abstaining from a vote which means that the people who are speaking up will be representing the fanbase as our opinions will dominate the scene.
    I sure hope so, but wouldn't count on it. I believe the silent mass are not so much as abstaning from a vote of disagreement or anger as a simple 'I don't really care'. Like I said, not many people actually follow the game development and news as we do.
    CA is absolutely going to care when the Steam rating for TK absolutely tanks, that stuff matters
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    YANGXu said:

    One issue here, the Chinese playerbase is on fire with rage and we aren't going to just forget this with a snap of a finger.

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.
    Please present the extensive market research you are basing this on.
    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.
  • XiaoSunRenXiaoSunRen Registered Users Posts: 53
    I don't know. I have 30 or so Chinese friends on steam, and almost all of them have all the DLCs. Almost all of them preordered Fates Divided as well.
    Sun Ren is love, Sun Ren is life.
  • Misaka_ComplexMisaka_Complex Registered Users Posts: 3,707
    Xenos7777 said:

    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.

    I'm not sure how big is the Italian fanbase is for Rome 2, CA has even said themselves that more than 50% of the game is played in simplified Chinese, and 3k is one of the four pillar of Chinese culture so CA is dealing with a different audience here. I can see the argument of western fans gobbling up Warhammer as if nothing had ever happened. Are you so sure about the Chinese side of things though? If this was really the case, then 8p would have been a huge success!

  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7777 said:

    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.

    I'm not sure how big is the Italian fanbase is for Rome 2, CA has even said themselves that more than 50% of the game is played in simplified Chinese, and 3k is one of the four pillar of Chinese culture so CA is dealing with a different audience here. I can see the argument of western fans gobbling up Warhammer as if nothing had ever happened. Are you so sure about the Chinese side of things though? If this was really the case, then 8p would have been a huge success!
    Lol, do you think Ancient Rome is popular just in Italy? Are you serious?
  • Rewan#2358Rewan#2358 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,859
    edited May 2021
    Rome 2 was fixed tho. It still took a good year to restore minimal faith into the game.
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    Wondering why you get some traits on your characters this may give you a vague idea

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  • Misaka_ComplexMisaka_Complex Registered Users Posts: 3,707
    Xenos7777 said:

    Lol, do you think Ancient Rome is popular just in Italy? Are you serious?

    It's a cultural thing in China, I don't know if Italians today feel the same way about Rome as modern day Chinese people feel about 3k but we take this quite seriously.

  • TheShiroOfDaltonTheShiroOfDalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 34,001
    edited May 2021
    Xenos7777 said:

    YANGXu said:

    One issue here, the Chinese playerbase is on fire with rage and we aren't going to just forget this with a snap of a finger.

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.
    Please present the extensive market research you are basing this on.
    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.
    They stuck with Rome2 and fixed the game until it became the most played historical TW title. I gave CA kudos for not just dropping R2 like a hot potato just because it got rough and they received death threats over it (including from this very forum).

    Well, I'm retracting those kudos now that they've pulled a PDX and just flat abandoned a title that still had potential.
  • MasterSlayeXMasterSlayeX Registered Users Posts: 1,004
    That’s only scratching the surface of what they will say

    Mandate of Heaven is a mess that should of Never been released in the state and definantly should of been fixed

    The fact they had 1 patch for world betrayed

    How half assed guan du was with not a single story event
  • Djau#5149Djau#5149 Registered Users Posts: 12,144

    I don't know. I have 30 or so Chinese friends on steam, and almost all of them have all the DLCs. Almost all of them preordered Fates Divided as well.

    Its not just purchasing it thats important, its playing it. CA looks how often the game is played on average by owners to decide on if DLC is worth to be sold.

    That's how Rome 2 after a long hiatus of no content ended up getting some extra DLC; cause significant number of people were still playing it.

  • steam_164511599602prOjRW7steam_164511599602prOjRW7 Registered Users Posts: 265
    edited May 2021
    *Disclaimer, I don't own 3k*

    If they weren't making another product in the Three Kingdoms era or with its characters, I might agree with you. When CA says it is though, they are signaling that they believe the setting itself is popular enough to be profitable, so if the reason for 3k's sudden demise is poor performance, it must be attributed to either poor design and/or marketing.

    If it's a 3k2, why should anyone who wasn't interested in the setting the first time care the next time around? Why should anyone who currently greatly enjoys 3k buy again? Should they hope CA doesn't feel it's a failure of basic design and pull the plug again? Perhaps they hope people will forget, and maybe they will, but it is hardly what I would call a good business decision.

    If it isn't a total war game, but something tangentially related, why should anyone care? I don't play only total war games, but I'm unlikely to come to CA for anything but a total war game.
  • kaihookaihoo Registered Users Posts: 1,097
    The base game sold well but it was unfinished and far from being completed. CA thought DLCs were the solution to that. But the DLCs failed miserably.

    We wouldn't be here today mourning the game if CA took their time and released a fully developed game instead of hastily releasing a half developed one.

    Their mistake was assuming DLCs could fix the game when in fact DLCs and chapter packs created more problems then they solved. My gut feel is that the DLC format is incompatible with the game engine and design technicalities.
  • kaihookaihoo Registered Users Posts: 1,097



    CA releases content that needs polish

    Polish does not occur

    People stop playing game because content needs polish / why start a new campaign when the next patch will just break it

    CA cans game

    It took 2 years before we finally got an attempt at unit balancing (cav/archers where extremely over powered) stuff like that is way more important then "wHeN iS kORea GEtTiNg AdDed?!?!?!" Adding more content to a game isn't going to keep people around when alot of what's there is broken or has issues.

    Guess it doesn't really matter now though huh?

    I think this is the lazy passive band aid mentality of CA's development team which ultimately led to the downfall of TW3K.

    They assumed they can fix everything with DLCs and fans are just going to happily spend more to have the game completed. Hence they went ahead to release a half completed game. How wrong they are!

    It's basically false advertising. Charging fans full price for a half completed game which in the end will never be completed! Absolutely shambolic.

  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7777 said:

    Lol, do you think Ancient Rome is popular just in Italy? Are you serious?

    It's a cultural thing in China, I don't know if Italians today feel the same way about Rome as modern day Chinese people feel about 3k but we take this quite seriously.
    I don't see how that's relevant. The point was that people on the internet vowed to boycott CA before, in multiple occasions. But they always forgot about it by the time of the next release. Why should Chinese customers be different?
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7777 said:

    YANGXu said:

    One issue here, the Chinese playerbase is on fire with rage and we aren't going to just forget this with a snap of a finger.

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.
    Please present the extensive market research you are basing this on.
    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.
    They stuck with Rome2 and fixed the game until it became the most played historical TW title. I gave CA kudos for not just dropping R2 like a hot potato just because it got rough and they received death threats over it (including from this very forum).

    Well, I'm retracting those kudos now that they've pulled a PDX and just flat abandoned a title that still had potential.
    Oh well, take the female generals controversy then. Youtubers going mad, customers being rude to CA devs, CA devs being rude to customers in return, review bombing so harsh that Steam had to delete it. Consequences on future releases? None.
  • united84#8186united84#8186 Registered Users Posts: 1,141
    Like it or not YANGXu makes some good analysis and argument.
  • TheShiroOfDaltonTheShiroOfDalton Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 34,001
    edited May 2021
    Xenos7777 said:

    Xenos7777 said:

    YANGXu said:

    One issue here, the Chinese playerbase is on fire with rage and we aren't going to just forget this with a snap of a finger.

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.
    Please present the extensive market research you are basing this on.
    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.
    They stuck with Rome2 and fixed the game until it became the most played historical TW title. I gave CA kudos for not just dropping R2 like a hot potato just because it got rough and they received death threats over it (including from this very forum).

    Well, I'm retracting those kudos now that they've pulled a PDX and just flat abandoned a title that still had potential.
    Oh well, take the female generals controversy then. Youtubers going mad, customers being rude to CA devs, CA devs being rude to customers in return, review bombing so harsh that Steam had to delete it. Consequences on future releases? None.
    Nope. That was a bunch of literal nazis incited by ArchWarhammer via doctored screenshots posted on far right forums. People who weren't part of the playerbase before, so irrelevant.

    Here it's Chinese players of the game going on the barricades and for a damn good reason.
  • TheTrue_LordAndyTheTrue_LordAndy Registered Users Posts: 985
    edited May 2021
    So those "filthy casuals" are just that, not loyal customers and will move on to the next flashy thing in a moments notice. But note casuals want their short experience to be entertaining and worthwhile, they will read reviews and information posted by the fanbase.

    By alienating loyal customers and fans of both the franchise and three kingdoms, CA is going down a slippery slope. Once you lose your support from the dedicated fans, why should casuals ever be interested to buy your future games? This push for quantity vs quality will end up creating games for no one. Some food for thought.

    Hopefully the higherups for once will stop being vein and conceited and remove the sticks up their butts and revise their strategy. CA should provide a final farewell DLC for the fans and Loyal customers to send the game off. Not this corporate anti consumer BS abrupt abandonment of the game.
  • Xenos777Xenos777 Registered Users Posts: 8,038

    Xenos7777 said:

    Xenos7777 said:

    YANGXu said:

    One issue here, the Chinese playerbase is on fire with rage and we aren't going to just forget this with a snap of a finger.

    This is not an issue. The loud ones might be on rage, but the silent mass are just indifferent. Only a fraction of the Chinese players who bought the game at release actually follow the DLC development. Only a fraction of those players actually follow the news and are care enough or angry enough to rage out on forums. Ironically, only a fraction of those people would actually carry on their rage and threat refusing to buy 3k saga or whatever will come later. So all in all, not a big deal.
    Please present the extensive market research you are basing this on.
    It's always like this. Remember Rome 2 launch? Lots of people said they wouldn't forget and promised not to buy other CA games anymore. It was even worse than this on the forums and in the reviews. Then lo and behold, Warhammer came out and it sold like hot cakes. Then Three Kingdoms came out and it sold even more. I don't see anything different happening this time.
    They stuck with Rome2 and fixed the game until it became the most played historical TW title. I gave CA kudos for not just dropping R2 like a hot potato just because it got rough and they received death threats over it (including from this very forum).

    Well, I'm retracting those kudos now that they've pulled a PDX and just flat abandoned a title that still had potential.
    Oh well, take the female generals controversy then. Youtubers going mad, customers being rude to CA devs, CA devs being rude to customers in return, review bombing so harsh that Steam had to delete it. Consequences on future releases? None.
    Nope. That was a bunch of literal nazis incited by ArchWarhammer via doctored screenshots posted on far right forums. People who weren't part of the playerbase before, so irrelevant.

    Here it's Chinese players of the game going on the barricades and for a damn good reason.
    If they weren't part of the playerbase how did the manage to review the games on Steam? They were customers before, obviously.

    And I'm not arguing about reasons being good or bad. I just said it will have very little impact like every other time.
  • united84#8186united84#8186 Registered Users Posts: 1,141

    So those "filthy casuals" are just that, not loyal customers and will move on to the next flashy thing in a moments notice. But note casuals want their short experience to be entertaining and worthwhile, they will read reviews and information posted by the fanbase.

    By alienating loyal customers and fans of both the franchise and three kingdoms, CA is going down a slippery slope. Once you lose your support from the dedicated fans, why should casuals ever be interested to buy your future games? This push for quantity vs quality will end up creating games for no one. Some food for thought.

    Hopefully the higherups for once will stop being vein and conceited and remove the sticks up their butts and revise their strategy. CA should provide a final farewell DLC for the fans and Loyal customers to send the game off. Not this corporate anti consumer BS abrupt abandonment of the game.

    We can only make assumptions based on our own bias and observation.
    However, CA as a company have the resources to collect DATA which they could make more accurate hypothesis.

    The truth is, the "filthy casuals" and silent majority as highlighted by TS are the biggest source of revenue and NOT the loyal fans. Just ask the Empire and MTW fans lol.

    Sad but true. Don't get me wrong though, I was looking forward to the Northern expansion and devastated by this sudden announcement. Thing is, life goes on and we need to see thing as it is.
  • TheTrue_LordAndyTheTrue_LordAndy Registered Users Posts: 985
    united84 said:

    So those "filthy casuals" are just that, not loyal customers and will move on to the next flashy thing in a moments notice. But note casuals want their short experience to be entertaining and worthwhile, they will read reviews and information posted by the fanbase.

    By alienating loyal customers and fans of both the franchise and three kingdoms, CA is going down a slippery slope. Once you lose your support from the dedicated fans, why should casuals ever be interested to buy your future games? This push for quantity vs quality will end up creating games for no one. Some food for thought.

    Hopefully the higherups for once will stop being vein and conceited and remove the sticks up their butts and revise their strategy. CA should provide a final farewell DLC for the fans and Loyal customers to send the game off. Not this corporate anti consumer BS abrupt abandonment of the game.

    We can only make assumptions based on our own bias and observation.
    However, CA as a company have the resources to collect DATA which they could make more accurate hypothesis.

    The truth is, the "filthy casuals" and silent majority as highlighted by TS are the biggest source of revenue and NOT the loyal fans. Just ask the Empire and MTW fans lol.

    Sad but true. Don't get me wrong though, I was looking forward to the Northern expansion and devastated by this sudden announcement. Thing is, life goes on and we need to see thing as it is.
    I am not debating the financial merits of the decision. Yes, re-packaging three kingdoms in another game is very likely going to sell better than a DLC (as long as there is hype and interest in that particular game) casuals will tend to buy base games and not DLC's. But I also doubt that the DLC's where necessarily making a loss. What the higher ups were seeing is the "opportunity cost" of not doing something else that could be more profitable with their time.

    But here is the thing with attributing costs and data analytics to a certain project/ cost center, it does not consider other factors such as cross selling potential. By maintaining good faith with the Three kingdoms and Chinese player base they can try to cross sell them other games like Warhammer 3 etc. So there is a bigger picture here that you are missing. The casuals are more profitable and more numerous but are influenced by the louder and more active fans who review the game. It's smart business to realize that it's not necessarily just about what's the spread between the cost of the dlc vs the revenue from the dlc.

    This is more about how they just ditched their game suddenly without a last DLC to have some semblance of completion. If their research shows a declining player base for the game etc, sure I understand that multiple DLC is unreasonable, but don't come out and just ditch the game you spent so much time building up like that. Tie up some loose ends, and release I final DLC , that's all most people want.

  • united84#8186united84#8186 Registered Users Posts: 1,141

    united84 said:

    So those "filthy casuals" are just that, not loyal customers and will move on to the next flashy thing in a moments notice. But note casuals want their short experience to be entertaining and worthwhile, they will read reviews and information posted by the fanbase.

    By alienating loyal customers and fans of both the franchise and three kingdoms, CA is going down a slippery slope. Once you lose your support from the dedicated fans, why should casuals ever be interested to buy your future games? This push for quantity vs quality will end up creating games for no one. Some food for thought.

    Hopefully the higherups for once will stop being vein and conceited and remove the sticks up their butts and revise their strategy. CA should provide a final farewell DLC for the fans and Loyal customers to send the game off. Not this corporate anti consumer BS abrupt abandonment of the game.

    We can only make assumptions based on our own bias and observation.
    However, CA as a company have the resources to collect DATA which they could make more accurate hypothesis.

    The truth is, the "filthy casuals" and silent majority as highlighted by TS are the biggest source of revenue and NOT the loyal fans. Just ask the Empire and MTW fans lol.

    Sad but true. Don't get me wrong though, I was looking forward to the Northern expansion and devastated by this sudden announcement. Thing is, life goes on and we need to see thing as it is.
    I am not debating the financial merits of the decision. Yes, re-packaging three kingdoms in another game is very likely going to sell better than a DLC (as long as there is hype and interest in that particular game) casuals will tend to buy base games and not DLC's. But I also doubt that the DLC's where necessarily making a loss. What the higher ups were seeing is the "opportunity cost" of not doing something else that could be more profitable with their time.

    But here is the thing with attributing costs and data analytics to a certain project/ cost center, it does not consider other factors such as cross selling potential. By maintaining good faith with the Three kingdoms and Chinese player base they can try to cross sell them other games like Warhammer 3 etc. So there is a bigger picture here that you are missing. The casuals are more profitable and more numerous but are influenced by the louder and more active fans who review the game. It's smart business to realize that it's not necessarily just about what's the spread between the cost of the dlc vs the revenue from the dlc.

    This is more about how they just ditched their game suddenly without a last DLC to have some semblance of completion. If their research shows a declining player base for the game etc, sure I understand that multiple DLC is unreasonable, but don't come out and just ditch the game you spent so much time building up like that. Tie up some loose ends, and release I final DLC , that's all most people want.

    We have to move on though. I dislike what CA did but I dont think it will change much, maybe they will leave a small team for support at the expense of TW3K-2 ? I have approximately 3K hrs in TW3K. I am not really sure which category I belong to but I am looking forward to TW3K-2 and my biggest concern is the direction and quality of TW3K-2.
  • TheTrue_LordAndyTheTrue_LordAndy Registered Users Posts: 985
    edited May 2021
    united84 said:


    We have to move on though. I dislike what CA did but I dont think it will change much, maybe they will leave a small team for support at the expense of TW3K-2 ? I have approximately 3K hrs in TW3K. I am not really sure which category I belong to but I am looking forward to TW3K-2 and my biggest concern is the direction and quality of TW3K-2.

    @united84 TW3K 2 won't come out for several years. My main concern is that game may not follow the TW format and instead of a strategy game it is more of a dynasty warriors type game like spartan total warrior.

    I also would be opposed to continuing the timeline from TW3K1 without having all of the first games content. The fact that they went out of their way to explicitly state that it will not be connected to the first game is very suspicious.(Unless it will be on a new engine, in which case there are compatibility issues, that I could accept, but only that.).
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