4 years of development. Maybe the multiple teams and projects was a bad idea

misunderstoodvampire

We know predevelopment for Warhammer 3 started at the latest March 2018 from this blog post
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/wttwo-03-18/
I acknowledge that Warhammer 3 will be bigger with more faction variety at the start than Warhammer 1 or 2 so it makes sense for more time needed. However 4 years seems a bit much.

This will be the first year since 2014 that CA has not released a new Total War Title and Rome 2 was release in 2013.


There was 16 months between Warhammer 1 release and Warhammer 2 release so they probably spent maybe a year on Warhammer 2 production. We are looking at 52 months between release of Warhammer 2 and 3 and 4 years of production. Perhaps in hindsight putting a little people onto the Warhammer "Team" would have been a better idea

mecanojavi99

Throwing more people at the game won't make it launch sooner, it may help, but it may as well cause more trouble.

Besides, what does it matter how long has the game been in development? It's been delayed to early next year, not 10.

RikRiorik

4 years and with the TWW2 DLC team cranking out far less than they did during the time it took for TWW2 to launch after the release of TWW1.

Seperate teams for sure. No one ever doubted that. But seperate most certainly never meant equal.

misunderstoodvampire

mecanojavi99 said:

Throwing more people at the game won't make it launch sooner, it may help, but it may as well cause more trouble.

Besides, what does it matter how long has the game been in development? It's been delayed to early next year, not 10.

Just my opinion but I would have rather they focused on completing the trilogy before adding too many projects like Troy and Thrones. I know people loved diplomacy in 3K and some quality of life improvements in Troy but I believe the Warhammer trilogy is the only Game with staying power and will keep people coming back using their hard earned cash. I'm not the owner of an AAA Company though. I don't mind Thrones and Troy or the Rome Remake but I wish they would have completed the Warhammer trilogy first

mecanojavi99

misunderstoodvampire said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Throwing more people at the game won't make it launch sooner, it may help, but it may as well cause more trouble.

Besides, what does it matter how long has the game been in development? It's been delayed to early next year, not 10.

Just my opinion but I would have rather they focused on completing the trilogy before adding too many projects like Troy and Thrones. I know people loved diplomacy in 3K and some quality of life improvements in Troy but I believe the Warhammer trilogy is the only Game with staying power and will keep people coming back using their hard earned cash. I'm not the owner of an AAA Company though. I don't mind Thrones and Troy or the Rome Remake but I wish they would have completed the Warhammer trilogy first

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

The Saga games are actually benefitial to TWH since they are used as test beds for new mechanics that can be latter added to the main games.

PLHenry

But does it have more "faction variety"? We have 6 races, but if Khorne is any indication, then about 40% of each of the other God races will reuse Warriors of Chaos/Beastmen content with new colours, which means that its more like we're getting 4.4 faces than 6 races.

What I'm curious is, if we have a Kislev which is mostly made up of weapon variants for a small selection of units (and lots of bears), and we have Khorne reusing 40% of its units from Warriors of Chaos/Beastmen, then what have CA spent the past 3 years working on for TWW3? There's a part of me that's hopeful they've done something unexpected, or the game is incredibly well optimised, but otherwise there's this question that hangs over my head whenever anyone speaks of TWW3, and I find it a struggle to get interested in its release.

JungleElf

Coughs because of Covid.

misunderstoodvampire

mecanojavi99 said:

misunderstoodvampire said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Throwing more people at the game won't make it launch sooner, it may help, but it may as well cause more trouble.

Besides, what does it matter how long has the game been in development? It's been delayed to early next year, not 10.

Just my opinion but I would have rather they focused on completing the trilogy before adding too many projects like Troy and Thrones. I know people loved diplomacy in 3K and some quality of life improvements in Troy but I believe the Warhammer trilogy is the only Game with staying power and will keep people coming back using their hard earned cash. I'm not the owner of an AAA Company though. I don't mind Thrones and Troy or the Rome Remake but I wish they would have completed the Warhammer trilogy first

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

The Saga games are actually benefitial to TWH since they are used as test beds for new mechanics that can be latter added to the main games.

No. Developers jump between “Teams” all of the time. The whole separate teams thing was a falsehood

mecanojavi99

misunderstoodvampire said:

mecanojavi99 said:

misunderstoodvampire said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Throwing more people at the game won't make it launch sooner, it may help, but it may as well cause more trouble.

Besides, what does it matter how long has the game been in development? It's been delayed to early next year, not 10.

Just my opinion but I would have rather they focused on completing the trilogy before adding too many projects like Troy and Thrones. I know people loved diplomacy in 3K and some quality of life improvements in Troy but I believe the Warhammer trilogy is the only Game with staying power and will keep people coming back using their hard earned cash. I'm not the owner of an AAA Company though. I don't mind Thrones and Troy or the Rome Remake but I wish they would have completed the Warhammer trilogy first

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

The Saga games are actually benefitial to TWH since they are used as test beds for new mechanics that can be latter added to the main games.

No. Developers jump between “Teams” all of the time. The whole separate teams thing was a falsehood

Yes because it's so easy to move people between different departments, if you don't know what you are talking about, don't say anything.

Loukarvic

We can't decide (maybe just speculate) about this decision, since we don't have inside informations about how they are working.
Looking just at the diferent teams as exemple: they are so many ways they could split up.
- Workers changing project time to time so the core TWW3 team is more or less filled up ?
- Does CA put all workers on one project at a time ?
- Do we have a separate DLC team and TWW3 team ? Or are they shared ?
- How many dev were at the beginning of production ?
etc...

Talking about the production, we don't know how this is managed too :
- Did they put all effort on TWW3 at the beginning ?
- Does the production increased as time passed ?
- Did they put all effort since last year ?
- etc...

Even if we know that the game has been in production since 4 years and CA have different teams working on different projects, their management is unknown. So as only forum members, it's hard to say if it is efficient or not.

Edit : I just want to add over this, that like @JungleElf said, Covid passed too, and it would probably have slowed the production.

Maelas

mecanojavi99 said:

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

Not to dispute that the teams are separate, but what does "knowing how to do fantasy games but not historical ones" means ? If you can model and animate a Hellpit Abomination, you can model and animate a Scythian spearman. If you know how to do a Total War game, you know how to do a Total War game. I fail to see what in historical total war could perplex the fantasy team, and vice-versa

DrownedHound

Maelas said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

Not to dispute that the teams are separate, but what does "knowing how to do fantasy games but not historical ones" means ? If you can model and animate a Hellpit Abomination, you can model and animate a Scythian spearman. If you know how to do a Total War game, you know how to do a Total War game. I fail to see what in historical total war could perplex the fantasy team, and vice-versa

Well considering Troy is made by a different studio in another country I'm going to go out on a limb that most of the fantasy team wasn't very involved with that.

Beargod

4 years is way too long... im out. no longer interested in the game and not buying it anymore.

Maelas

DrownedHound said:

Maelas said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

Not to dispute that the teams are separate, but what does "knowing how to do fantasy games but not historical ones" means ? If you can model and animate a Hellpit Abomination, you can model and animate a Scythian spearman. If you know how to do a Total War game, you know how to do a Total War game. I fail to see what in historical total war could perplex the fantasy team, and vice-versa

Well considering Troy is made by a different studio in another country I'm going to go out on a limb that most of the fantasy team wasn't very involved with that.

Troy is a special case. Thrones and 3K were done in the main studio. Besides, that wasn't my point, the discussion was about the fantasy and the historical team respective skillsets.

By the way, Troy having a Mythos mode is the proof that an historical team can do a fantasy game. It's litteraly the same skillset.

DrownedHound

Beargod said:

4 years is way too long... im out. no longer interested in the game and not buying it anymore.

davedave1124

Maybe it was; maybe it wasn’t, not enough knowledge to have an opinion.

Knight_Iran

3-4 years in development exactly for what? 7-8 races, new siege, couple of new modes, new map, maybe a better MP system. Any other huge feature?
Now, incomplete rosters, no sea battle, no army painter, probably another shrank ME map, probably a copy pasted diplomacy system, no fully synced combats, no graphical improvement. So exactly 3-4 years for what? Core game at 2016, final one 2022. Isn’t it too late?

mecanojavi99

Knight_Iran said:

3-4 years in development exactly for what? 7-8 races, new siege, couple of new modes, new map, maybe a better MP system. Any other huge feature?
Now, incomplete rosters, no sea battle, no army painter, probably another shrank ME map, probably a copy pasted diplomacy system, no fully synced combats, no graphical improvement. So exactly 3-4 years for what? Core game at 2016, final one 2022. Isn’t it too late?

Are you going to spam the same clueless comment everywhere?

davedave1124

I think there’s some serious ‘missing the point’ going on here.

Yes, they could’ve released WH3 a year or 2 after but we’d be getting the 4 Chaos Gods only as well as no VCoast, no upgrade for the BM/WE, no cross DLC Empire/GS and no TSatB.

Do I care they’ve built the trilogy more carefully with a lot more content? Don’t be silly.

saweendra

DrownedHound said:

Maelas said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Those games are made by the Historical team, the Fantasy team has nothing to do with them, because the Fantasy team knows how to make Fantasy games, not historical ones.

Not to dispute that the teams are separate, but what does "knowing how to do fantasy games but not historical ones" means ? If you can model and animate a Hellpit Abomination, you can model and animate a Scythian spearman. If you know how to do a Total War game, you know how to do a Total War game. I fail to see what in historical total war could perplex the fantasy team, and vice-versa

Well considering Troy is made by a different studio in another country I'm going to go out on a limb that most of the fantasy team wasn't very involved with that.

so how did those skin wolves ( lion men unit) and centigors ..etc ended up there cough ...

yeah fantsy team was helping them even a little bit

Beargod

Boy the gimmicky survival (click button to pull units out of thin air) mode to impress the game journalists was the right choice...its not like they could have used their precious development time for something like, I dont know, improved sieges???? (can you taste my salt ) New Blizzard incoming i can smell it.

Knight_Iran

mecanojavi99 said:

Knight_Iran said:

3-4 years in development exactly for what? 7-8 races, new siege, couple of new modes, new map, maybe a better MP system. Any other huge feature?
Now, incomplete rosters, no sea battle, no army painter, probably another shrank ME map, probably a copy pasted diplomacy system, no fully synced combats, no graphical improvement. So exactly 3-4 years for what? Core game at 2016, final one 2022. Isn’t it too late?

Are you going to spam the same clueless comment everywhere?

If my comments are wrong, prove then.

mecanojavi99

Beargod said:

Boy the gimmicky survival (click button to pull units out of thin air) mode to impress the game journalists was the right choice...its not like they could have used their precious development time for something like, I dont know, improved sieges???? (can you taste my salt ) New Blizzard incoming i can smell it.

They have confirmed the rework of sieges, what are you talking about?

mecanojavi99

Knight_Iran said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Knight_Iran said:

3-4 years in development exactly for what? 7-8 races, new siege, couple of new modes, new map, maybe a better MP system. Any other huge feature?
Now, incomplete rosters, no sea battle, no army painter, probably another shrank ME map, probably a copy pasted diplomacy system, no fully synced combats, no graphical improvement. So exactly 3-4 years for what? Core game at 2016, final one 2022. Isn’t it too late?

Are you going to spam the same clueless comment everywhere?

If my comments are wrong, prove then.

If yours are correct prove them.

How I know you are wrong? You don't know **** about what the game is going to have at release or how the development has been or anything.

You are just a little person thinking that it's big because it shouts very loud.

Knight_Iran

mecanojavi99 said:

Knight_Iran said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Knight_Iran said:

3-4 years in development exactly for what? 7-8 races, new siege, couple of new modes, new map, maybe a better MP system. Any other huge feature?
Now, incomplete rosters, no sea battle, no army painter, probably another shrank ME map, probably a copy pasted diplomacy system, no fully synced combats, no graphical improvement. So exactly 3-4 years for what? Core game at 2016, final one 2022. Isn’t it too late?

Are you going to spam the same clueless comment everywhere?

If my comments are wrong, prove then.

If yours are correct prove them.

How I know you are wrong? You don't know **** about what the game is going to have at release or how the development has been or anything.

You are just a little person thinking that it's big because it shouts very loud.

Yea i am little, you be big and don’t kill your self for my comments! You will see the game features finally and find out if my comments are right.

Boria

In my honest opinion, Thrones of Brittania and Troy was a complete waste of time. the time and development used for those two games only there could have been another race pack.

Boria

RikRiorik said:

4 years and with the TWW2 DLC team cranking out far less than they did during the time it took for TWW2 to launch after the release of TWW1.

Seperate teams for sure. No one ever doubted that. But seperate most certainly never meant equal.

I agree, they were trying stuff out I don't blame them but the time it took to make Thrones or Britannia and Troy could have been used for another race pack.

KronusX

Boria said:

RikRiorik said:

4 years and with the TWW2 DLC team cranking out far less than they did during the time it took for TWW2 to launch after the release of TWW1.

Seperate teams for sure. No one ever doubted that. But seperate most certainly never meant equal.

I agree, they were trying stuff out I don't blame them but the time it took to make Thrones or Britannia and Troy could have been used for another race pack.

I do blame them for that. They put their biggest money maker on the side for puny projects.

MikhaelH

It's obviously a huge mess over at CA, with their marketing, late delay, no real sense when they will release (4+month window) and 3+ years of development for a sequel ... not a new game.

RikRiorik

davedave1124 said:

I think there’s some serious ‘missing the point’ going on here.

Yes, they could’ve released WH3 a year or 2 after but we’d be getting the 4 Chaos Gods only as well as no VCoast, no upgrade for the BM/WE, no cross DLC Empire/GS and no TSatB.

Do I care they’ve built the trilogy more carefully with a lot more content? Don’t be silly.

16 months. 2 LPs, Bretonnia fleshed out, Norsca, Beastmen, Wood Elfs + TWW2.

48 months and counting. 7 LPs, Tomb Kings and Vampire Coast + several reworks + TWW3.

I only take issue with the ’a lot more content’. At least compared to TWW1s lifecycle I don’t think that is valid. Sure there’s lots of very good content in TWW2. But it did take them three times as long to push it out and I don’t think there’s three times the content.

davedave1124

RikRiorik said:

davedave1124 said:

I think there’s some serious ‘missing the point’ going on here.

Yes, they could’ve released WH3 a year or 2 after but we’d be getting the 4 Chaos Gods only as well as no VCoast, no upgrade for the BM/WE, no cross DLC Empire/GS and no TSatB.

Do I care they’ve built the trilogy more carefully with a lot more content? Don’t be silly.

16 months. 2 LPs, Bretonnia fleshed out, Norsca, Beastmen, Wood Elfs + TWW2.

48 months and counting. 7 LPs, Tomb Kings and Vampire Coast + several reworks + TWW3.

I only take issue with the ’a lot more content’. At least compared to TWW1s lifecycle I don’t think that is valid. Sure there’s lots of very good content in TWW2. But it did take them three times as long to push it out and I don’t think there’s three times the content.

The original plan for game 2 was 3 cores plus Skaven and TK and one set of (2) lord packs.

For game 3 it was the 4 Chaos Gods, Ogres and CD’s

I think we’ve got a lot more content than was originally planned.

Cathay
Kislev
VCoast
BM and WE upgrade
Empire GS upgrade
DE vs Skaven
Possibly 2 extra detailed FLC

And that’s just the stuff we are aware of.