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Thank you to the community for showing they won't accept full price early access releases anymore.

24

Comments

  • neverending#5226neverending#5226 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,948
    445Aas said:


    Just inform yourself, think about what you want to spend your money on and then do what you want. But don't be surprised when you get lied to.

    Yah, this has been going on since before Rome 2 (Empire was a super bad release too). This isn't really the worst release ever by a long shot. My problem is the game is obviously inferior to TWW2 in too many ways and it is clear there is tons of catchup work CA needs to do. It should have released with IME or at least the workshop IMO.

    Right now it feels grating to play with so much missing and apparently I'm getting dinged for some very civil discourse. What's the point in staying here? All the feedback from the vortex campaign apparently didn't go very far (they doubled down on it) and we're not getting IME soon probably nor possibly even mods and we *might* get a roadmap in a month.

    Usually I had at least mods to tide me over while waiting. Looks like I'll have to have something else to spend my game time with.
    5900x @ stock , 4x8gb 3600mhz 14-16-16-36
    ASUS TUF 3080 12 GB
    4TB Sabrent NVMe SSD PCIe 4.0 w/ Windows 10 Pro 64bit
  • neverending#5226neverending#5226 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,948
    445Aas said:


    Just inform yourself, think about what you want to spend your money on and then do what you want. But don't be surprised when you get lied to.

    Yah, this has been going on since before Rome 2 (Empire was a super bad release too). This isn't really the worst release ever by a long shot. My problem is the game is obviously inferior to TWW2 in too many ways and it is clear there is tons of catchup work CA needs to do. It should have released with IME or at least the workshop IMO.

    Right now it feels grating to play with so much missing and apparently I'm getting dinged for some very civil discourse. What's the point in staying here? All the feedback from the vortex campaign apparently didn't go very far (they doubled down on it) and we're not getting IME soon probably nor possibly even mods and we *might* get a roadmap in a month.

    Usually I had at least mods to tide me over while waiting. Looks like I'll have to have something else to spend my game time with.
    Atlas94 said:


    The game design decisions are what really get me. They're why I blame the management because they likely had to sign off on what was in the game. The game doesn't necessarily feel like a beta, more so it feels like bad design decisions were made. I can see why people say it feels like a beta due to the lack of content though.

    The lack of a robust mod workshop to very easily get around design decisions with disagree with isn't helping at all. The game feels like an early access TWW without mods. I know no TWW release has been perfect, however without mods the community might just bleed out far more than it needed to.
    5900x @ stock , 4x8gb 3600mhz 14-16-16-36
    ASUS TUF 3080 12 GB
    4TB Sabrent NVMe SSD PCIe 4.0 w/ Windows 10 Pro 64bit
  • mupmasmupmas Registered Users Posts: 54
    Agreed, just too bad that so many hyper-emotional young people exist on both sides of the spectrum. Half the complaint posts are from people who just live to cry and half the defense posts seem like they're on CA's payroll. Whole lotta sense missing from this forum.
  • Fingolfin_the-Golden#2157Fingolfin_the-Golden#2157 Registered Users Posts: 6,665
    I will spend my money how I want thanks.
    It will be on everything total war Warhammer, day 1 no matter what.
    I like the game.
    BEARS, Beets, Battlestar Galactica 🧝‍♀️ Pandas too please CA!
  • DVersion#4761DVersion#4761 Member Registered Users Posts: 349
    edited March 11
    It sold and reviewed really well... also I have 60 hours in it already and have been having a blast. No bugs or performance issues on my end that I noticed. While I can see the souls race getting boring I am on my third playthrough of it and have come up with different tactics. There's a real risk. Do I try and stop someone else? Dominate this opportunity attack an enemy I know just ran into chaos? Do I use a legion of heroes to close enemy portals before they can jump in? Take a sweet slaanesh temptation? I think I won't play it again until there's new content but then again I have a bunch of other games I need to catch up on.
    Post edited by DVersion#4761 on
  • LuciusCornelius#7004LuciusCornelius#7004 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,296
    Surge_2 said:

    Reeks said:

    Thank you?

    99% of this community pre-ordered or bought the game at release and will in all likelyhood do the same when the next DLC/Game releases...

    Jokes on CA, I only play Warhammer. There wont be another game of their's which I will buy.
    or is the joke on you? since you will be giving CA money for the next 15 years as they release TW:40k its sequels and DLC. At which point they can make a Warhammer Old World fantasy TW and get you for another five years after that.
  • Steph_F_DavidSteph_F_David Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,493
    I pre ordered the game and don't regret it. It's not early access. I have no real bug, no real performance issue. Of course there a few things I don't completly like, for example Cathay not having a coast, or the rifts and soul race that could be boring after some time.

    But I'm trying to play the game "as it should" for the campaign, not against it. Game 3 campaign is a bit different than the previous one. It may be confusing at first, but it has nothing to do with an early access or badly made game.

    It needs some refining to be more enjoyable, and increase longevity. That's why we have DLC, patches, or mods. And later IE.


  • Steph_F_DavidSteph_F_David Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,493

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.

    Doesn't mean early access... I'm a software developper for work. The delivered product, even if it match the specification, almost never fully satisfy the customer. After some time using it, you always find things that could be faster, more efficient, or find a specific use case that doesn't work, or have new ideas.

    CA delivered a game that is working, with a campaign and mechanism which are "finished". We are not missing one of the 4 gods, there isn't a unit that has no animation or doing absolutly nothing in a battle...

    Now, the game is entering a real life use situation, which will bring a lot of feedback, which can be used to improve it. Normal life cycle of a product.

    The big difference is CA is working to gather this feedback and improve it. I much prefer this than some other games who barely have patches and very few expansions.

  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    I have no real bug, no real performance issue.

    I don't believe that you have actually played the game then. Either that or you have played a tiny amount and just aren't very observant. You can't disband an army without seeing the supply lines bug. You can't use a chariot unit without seeing that their damage output is completely broken. You can't use cavalry and not notice how most of the time they simply knock infantry around without dealing much damage. I also find it hard to believe that you didn't notice how sluggish simply moving infantry around is since they now pause and turn before moving, as this was one of the first things that I noticed when I first started the game. Have you really never experienced enemy units walking through your frontline? Since it happens to me in every siege defense and survival battle. And there is plenty of video documentation of it happening all over the internet. Or that you never had a unit fail to path correctly when navigating a minor settlement, since it seems to happen constantly to everyone else. There's also no way that you didn't experience the extreme bloom and lighting errors present on several maps.
  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.

    Doesn't mean early access... I'm a software developper for work. The delivered product, even if it match the specification, almost never fully satisfy the customer. After some time using it, you always find things that could be faster, more efficient, or find a specific use case that doesn't work, or have new ideas.

    CA delivered a game that is working, with a campaign and mechanism which are "finished". We are not missing one of the 4 gods, there isn't a unit that has no animation or doing absolutly nothing in a battle...

    Now, the game is entering a real life use situation, which will bring a lot of feedback, which can be used to improve it. Normal life cycle of a product.

    The big difference is CA is working to gather this feedback and improve it. I much prefer this than some other games who barely have patches and very few expansions.

    If the game doesn't yet have "a solid baseline" upon which gameplay patches and DLC can be added, then it isn't finished.

    If the game isn't finished, and they acknowledge that it isn't finished, yet are still selling it with the promise that they will fix it over time to reach an acceptable level of stability, then the game is early access. We were sold a beta with the promise that it will reach the level of quality expected of a standard release after 4 weeks of patches.

    Not that difficult to comprehend.
  • Mr_Finley7#4571Mr_Finley7#4571 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 8,415
    I think some of the people claiming not to have experienced frustrating bugs in TWW3 MIGHT be telling the truth. I was one of the lucky ones who had almost no bugs at launch with TWW and TWW2.

    No such luck this time around
  • Steph_F_DavidSteph_F_David Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,493
    edited March 11

    I don't believe that you have actually played the game then. Either that or you have played a tiny amount and just aren't very observant. You can't disband an army without seeing the supply lines bug. You can't use a chariot unit without seeing that their damage output is completely broken. You can't use cavalry and not notice how most of the time they simply knock infantry around without dealing much damage. I also find it hard to believe that you didn't notice how sluggish simply moving infantry around is since they now pause and turn before moving, as this was one of the first things that I noticed when I first started the game. Have you really never experienced enemy units walking through your frontline? Since it happens to me in every siege defense and survival battle. And there is plenty of video documentation of it happening all over the internet. Or that you never had a unit fail to path correctly when navigating a minor settlement, since it seems to happen constantly to everyone else. There's also no way that you didn't experience the extreme bloom and lighting errors present on several maps.

    All these are minor and didn't prevent me from playing or enjoying the game. I'm not saying the game is perfect, it has flaws and bugs that will be corrected with time and patches, but not something completly broken or missing that would warrant an "early access" status.

    And you are wrong with some of your points. like "I also find it hard to believe that you didn't notice how sluggish simply moving infantry around is since they now pause and turn before moving".

    That's exactly the opposite. I just tried that in battle vs AI. I ordered my unit to move to a position with a different orientation. They immediately started moving and turning while moving there. And some youtuber (M4fgaming) spoke about that as soon as the first test they could do with the survival batlte: units being more responsive because of this. While in game 2, they would turn first, and move after.

    So... are you sure you are playing the same game?

  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,169

    Reeks said:

    Thank you?

    99% of this community pre-ordered or bought the game at release and will in all likelyhood do the same when the next DLC/Game releases...

    Yep, it’s the best way.
    Very happy with my pre-order.

    Like every single person on this forum I am a fan of the game.
    "It's no fun fighting people weaker than you." - The Beast"There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla Forum Terms & Conditions I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,169

    Haha. No.

    The game is on a factual level not in an early access state.

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.
    I think you quoted me by accident. I never claimed the game was finished.
    "It's no fun fighting people weaker than you." - The Beast"There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla Forum Terms & Conditions I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    Haha. No.

    The game is on a factual level not in an early access state.

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.
    I think you quoted me by accident. I never claimed the game was finished.
    "If the game isn't finished, and they acknowledge that it isn't finished, yet are still selling it with the promise that they will fix it over time to reach an acceptable level of stability, then the game is early access. We were sold a beta with the promise that it will reach the level of quality expected of a standard release after 4 weeks of patches."

    Learn to read.
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,169

    Haha. No.

    The game is on a factual level not in an early access state.

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.
    I think you quoted me by accident. I never claimed the game was finished.
    "If the game isn't finished, and they acknowledge that it isn't finished, yet are still selling it with the promise that they will fix it over time to reach an acceptable level of stability, then the game is early access. We were sold a beta with the promise that it will reach the level of quality expected of a standard release after 4 weeks of patches."

    Learn to read.
    You never said this in a response to me until now.

    Regardless I am only interested in civil discussion. Thanks.
    "It's no fun fighting people weaker than you." - The Beast"There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla Forum Terms & Conditions I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    Haha. No.

    The game is on a factual level not in an early access state.

    By their own admission the game is unfinished. They have said several times now that they are still working to "establish a strong baseline" for the game.
    I think you quoted me by accident. I never claimed the game was finished.
    "If the game isn't finished, and they acknowledge that it isn't finished, yet are still selling it with the promise that they will fix it over time to reach an acceptable level of stability, then the game is early access. We were sold a beta with the promise that it will reach the level of quality expected of a standard release after 4 weeks of patches."

    Learn to read.
    You never said this in a response to me until now.

    Regardless I am only interested in civil discussion. Thanks.
    So you have no argument? Got it. So we are in agreement that the game is, on a factual level, in an early access state.
  • Steph_F_DavidSteph_F_David Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,493
    So... Windows is an early access OS. It is not finished, it is updated regularly. So are most software actually.




  • SnakeMajinSnakeMajin Registered Users Posts: 601
    I have no bug or performance issues worthy of me calling it "early access". But I can't speak for others, so shouldn't anyone else.

    The most blatant issues are narrative campaign design issues. And these would have happened whatever the situation : whether one pre-orders or not, whether they delayed the game or not. The game obviously had to get into player's hands for these problems to be uncovered, because for a reason CA should take the time to discover, the Vortex feedback wasn't taken into consideration.

    I'm afraid they failed to find the middle ground between :
    - Letting speak their very own creativity or vision. The narrative campaign took form they felt it should, even if it's obviously not the right one for the community.
    - Taking into account the need of customers, that was more than enough shared at the time of Vortex.

    What is a shame is that in the very same game, they gave an example of a very strong narrative and immersive campaign that manages to not be "intrusive" : the prologue.

    We obviously don't all have the same expectations over a game. Some, like me, have genuine fun whether others like it or not. Criterias of fun are not the same for everyone.
  • HerrSignoreHerrSignore Registered Users Posts: 321
    STOP. PREORDERING. GAMES.

    We ('we' being the anti-preorder crowd, regularly dismissed as cranks) tried to tell you, but you fell for marketing hype. We have now been vindicated. You saw the silly trailer of dancing Ogres and slammed your money on the table. If you pre-ordered this ****, you are at least partially responsible. CA have been pulling this crap for years because they keep getting away from it.

    Learn from it. DO NOT preorder their next product.
  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    So... Windows is an early access OS. It is not finished, it is updated regularly. So are most software actually.




    The point has been explained to you multiple times now, so at this point I'm just going to assume that you are intentionally ignoring the point and trolling.
  • Mazisky#3267Mazisky#3267 Registered Users Posts: 1,218
    Some of those "I never seen any bug" feel like the good old "the game runs perfectly smooth" from people playing at 13 fps
  • overtaker40#8926overtaker40#8926 Registered Users Posts: 1,144
    What passive aggressive nonsense. this isnt spyro launching on the ps1. the scope of This game is such that releasing without bugs would take decades. They need, us, the early players, the massess, to find the bugs. Becuase we try **** in mass, we try weird and unique things we break the game and we make those random annomalies happen so that the CA repair teams can find and fix it. There an infinate number of variables in making a game of this complexity.

    The response this time has been so much better than it was for 2 great and im sick of pretending that the naysayers in this forum are anything but impatient whiny Children.

    There are some problems with the narrative and, sure, the games flawed but it has had less crashes and bugs TW2 did at launch so honestly im impressed with its state. im looking forward to IM when it comes but im in no hurry, i got other **** i can do if i get sick of the portals.

    "the game shoudl have been delayed" if it had been delayedyou are the same people that would have been right here having a cry. grow up.
    I like all the races. Equally. Wood elves are just the first among equals.
  • Mazisky#3267Mazisky#3267 Registered Users Posts: 1,218

    What passive aggressive nonsense. this isnt spyro launching on the ps1. the scope of This game is such that releasing without bugs would take decades. They need, us, the early players, the massess, to find the bugs. Becuase we try **** in mass, we try weird and unique things we break the game and we make those random annomalies happen so that the CA repair teams can find and fix it. There an infinate number of variables in making a game of this complexity.

    The response this time has been so much better than it was for 2 great and im sick of pretending that the naysayers in this forum are anything but impatient whiny Children.

    There are some problems with the narrative and, sure, the games flawed but it has had less crashes and bugs TW2 did at launch so honestly im impressed with its state. im looking forward to IM when it comes but im in no hurry, i got other **** i can do if i get sick of the portals.

    "the game shoudl have been delayed" if it had been delayedyou are the same people that would have been right here having a cry. grow up.

    If you want to desperately get noticed by CA i suggest you to apply to the proper career page.

    Look at PR positions, there are some open

    https://www.creative-assembly.com/careers
  • HerrSignoreHerrSignore Registered Users Posts: 321

    What passive aggressive nonsense. this isnt spyro launching on the ps1. the scope of This game is such that releasing without bugs would take decades. They need, us, the early players, the massess, to find the bugs. Becuase we try **** in mass, we try weird and unique things we break the game and we make those random annomalies happen so that the CA repair teams can find and fix it. There an infinate number of variables in making a game of this complexity.

    The response this time has been so much better than it was for 2 great and im sick of pretending that the naysayers in this forum are anything but impatient whiny Children.

    There are some problems with the narrative and, sure, the games flawed but it has had less crashes and bugs TW2 did at launch so honestly im impressed with its state. im looking forward to IM when it comes but im in no hurry, i got other **** i can do if i get sick of the portals.

    "the game shoudl have been delayed" if it had been delayedyou are the same people that would have been right here having a cry. grow up.

    It never ceases to amaze me how well trained some consumers are. CA don't need you to white knight for them - they have a marketing department for that.

    There are other, arguably more complex games that release in much better states than CA's products do. By defending them, you are basically admitting they are incompetent.

    But you just keep your head in the sane and pretend anyone who disagrees with you are "impatient whiny children."
  • SneedGamingSneedGaming Registered Users Posts: 326

    They need, us, the early players, the massess, to find the bugs. Becuase we try **** in mass, we try weird and unique things we break the game and we make those random annomalies happen so that the CA repair teams can find and fix it. There an infinate number of variables in making a game of this complexity.

    So we, the paying customers, are required to do the playtesting that should have been done internally by CA, and was already done (with most of the feedback from it being ignored) by internet celebrities who were given prerelease copies of the game. If only there were some phrase that would succinctly describe a game that is released unfinished with the intention of having customers playtest the game for the developers... hmm... antecedent admittance? Premier passage? Initial introduction?
  • KronusXKronusX Registered Users Posts: 2,464

    What passive aggressive nonsense. this isnt spyro launching on the ps1. the scope of This game is such that releasing without bugs would take decades. They need, us, the early players, the massess, to find the bugs. Becuase we try **** in mass, we try weird and unique things we break the game and we make those random annomalies happen so that the CA repair teams can find and fix it. There an infinate number of variables in making a game of this complexity.

    The response this time has been so much better than it was for 2 great and im sick of pretending that the naysayers in this forum are anything but impatient whiny Children.

    There are some problems with the narrative and, sure, the games flawed but it has had less crashes and bugs TW2 did at launch so honestly im impressed with its state. im looking forward to IM when it comes but im in no hurry, i got other **** i can do if i get sick of the portals.

    "the game shoudl have been delayed" if it had been delayedyou are the same people that would have been right here having a cry. grow up.

    The explains why so many people are playing Elden Ring who has less bugs and it's overall a less buggy experience. Must be spyro launch on ps1 type of game, right?

    Your response just tells me that a lot of the CA's apologists either do not work a real job or do a mediocre job and pat themselves on their back and tell themselves ''at least I finished what I had to do''.

    If I delivered crappy responses/products like that to my customers, they will switch to the competition faster than lightning. The ONLY reason that is not happening to CA is because there is no product similar to Total war Warhammer, else the customers would bail out fast (oh wait, they already are from WH3, and that's without competition) .
  • Steph_F_DavidSteph_F_David Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 3,493

    The point has been explained to you multiple times now, so at this point I'm just going to assume that you are intentionally ignoring the point and trolling.

    You can repeat several times the same arguments, and "explain" things again and aigain, it doesn't mean I agree with you more than at the beginning, if I don't consider your points valid.
    I know this work both ways.

    Let's just say with have unreconciliable definition about what is an early access...

    For me early access is a game what is released while the list of features is not what the developpers plan to have at release.

    This is different from a game with bugs, or expansions planned in the future.

    I have the impression you consider a game with bug, or with a gameplay that the players are criticizing, early access.

    In that case, virtually any sofware is early access.




  • Mazisky#3267Mazisky#3267 Registered Users Posts: 1,218

    The point has been explained to you multiple times now, so at this point I'm just going to assume that you are intentionally ignoring the point and trolling.

    You can repeat several times the same arguments, and "explain" things again and aigain, it doesn't mean I agree with you more than at the beginning, if I don't consider your points valid.
    I know this work both ways.

    Let's just say with have unreconciliable definition about what is an early access...

    For me early access is a game what is released while the list of features is not what the developpers plan to have at release.

    This is different from a game with bugs, or expansions planned in the future.

    I have the impression you consider a game with bug, or with a gameplay that the players are criticizing, early access.

    In that case, virtually any sofware is early access.




    Ignore the "early access" word and change it with "beta", which means content complete but unpolished and not tested enough
  • Vanilla_Gorilla#8529Vanilla_Gorilla#8529 Registered Users Posts: 39,169

    I think some of the people claiming not to have experienced frustrating bugs in TWW3 MIGHT be telling the truth. I was one of the lucky ones who had almost no bugs at launch with TWW and TWW2.

    No such luck this time around

    Zero bugs in my playthrough. Though I can't claim I was looking for them.

    Found sieges and the narrative quite bad though.
    "It's no fun fighting people weaker than you." - The Beast"There are only two people better than me, and I'm both of them" - Vanilla Gorilla Forum Terms & Conditions I am The Beast, Descendant of Guanyin, The one who beasts 25 hours a day, 8 days a week, The Vanilla Gorilla, The great bright delight, Conqueror of Mountains, Purveyor of wisdom, Official forum historian, Master Tamer of energy, the one they fear to name, Beastradamus, The Teacher, Master Unbiased Pollster, The Avatar of Tuesday, Chief hype Train Conductor, Uwu Usurper, Pog Wog Warrior, Poggers Patroller, Alpha of the species, Apex protector, Praetor of Positivity, Drybrush Disciple, Sophisticated Savage.
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