[Theory] Be'Lakor set to be reworked and to replace the Deamon Prince in the Grand Campaign.

Gollummyprecious#7609

Hello everyone so here is my liitle theory concerning Be'Lakor and the GC going forward (pls do not torch me if you find it ridicuulous):

The argument is based on two things:

1. The Deamon Prince is not really fitting in a sandbox campaign.
The reason for that is narrative related, he is tied to the WH3 campaign, and nothing more justify his presence, also his lack of tech tree sets him back so much thazt unless he is reworked from top to bottom he wont be a good pick for the GC, let alone the vanilla campaign. However to me he would not disappear, to me he is more of an experimentation on how to introduce the deamon princes as a whole for a future WoC rework, and a lot of his features would be reused improved for other stuff and factions.

2. Be'Lakor is a much more credible candidate to lead the Deamons of Chaos undivided.
He is the first Deamon Prince after all. And i suspect CA adding him as a reward for beating the campaign with a terrible skill tree is a sign that they didnt had time to make him a proper LL with a proper skill tree, that you unlock once you beat him in the campaign, hence this barebone implementation. To me, had he a proper faction and skill tree, he would be a much more popular amongst chaos fans than the deamon prince. The fact that he looked rushed indicates to me that the devs were stretched between the two (DP and be'lkor) and ultimately didnt complete neither of those, however both of them are great bases to expand, the first one for the mechanics, the second for his overall design and impact in the campaign.


what do you guys think? i would love to hear your thoughts and arguments for/against it.

Surge_2#1464

They will have both.

To much effort to waste either of them.

Neodeinos#5871

I'm sure we'll get Be'Lakor with his own playable faction but he ain't gonna replace anyone. CA isn't going to remove content between RoC campaign and IE.

davedave1124#4773

1. I don’t think he is disadvantaged in the IE campaign and would still work.
2. Why would Bel’akor lead the Daemons of Chaos? He’s still considered a joke by the chaos gods and I can’t see them allowing him to lead their armies.
3. More likely Bel’akor would lead a renegade faction.

Rikis

The chaos Gods would never openly allow Belakor to lead the main daemon of chaos hordes. If anything he would be a renegade chaos faction similar to Arkhan vs the rest of the tomb kings.

TheMadTypist

I think Belakor is more at risk of being left out of IE on launch than Daniel. It’s not like Toddy made it in to mortal empires, despite being confederated as part of the normal campaign.

Right now, Daniel has an AI faction and start position, Belakor is a weird completion sticker tied to the story campaign. No reason or historical pattern suggesting to swap the two, to my mind. The favor mechanics will work just as well regardless of the maps involved.

I think it more likely that if they do give Belakor a place on IE, it’ll come later as FLC with a unique faction, and maybe unique mechanics. Depends on if they got Thorin to record voice lines for diplomacy and such.

Fingolfin_the-Golden#2157

‘Tell him he’s dreaming.’
Darryl Kerrigan - The Castle

ConstantineZAyn#4211

I wouldn't be surprised if Be'lakor was the original DoC lord, but then some suits came in and demanded the creation of this daemon prince gimmick. Be'lakor ended up in the dump.

Fingolfin_the-Golden#2157

ConstantineZAyn said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Be'lakor was the original DoC lord, but then some suits came in and demanded the creation of this daemon prince gimmick. Be'lakor ended up in the dump.

This sounds like the truth.

mecanojavi99#6562

Yes, because CA will confine the most expensive LL they have done to the less popular game mode of the game, not like they gave him his own faction and mechanics already...

Be'lakor will be in addition to Godslayer, giving DoC 2 LL.

DarthEnderX-#6513

He might be added, but no way he'll replace the DP.

Ben1990#8909

Surge_2 said:

They will have both.

To much effort to waste either of them.

THIS.

ConstantineZAyn#4211

mecanojavi99 said:

Yes, because CA will confine the most expensive LL they have done to the less popular game mode of the game, not like they gave him his own faction and mechanics already...

Be'lakor will be in addition to Godslayer, giving DoC 2 LL.

His faction and mechanics are awful. Clearly a rushed afterthought.

mecanojavi99#6562

ConstantineZAyn said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Yes, because CA will confine the most expensive LL they have done to the less popular game mode of the game, not like they gave him his own faction and mechanics already...

Be'lakor will be in addition to Godslayer, giving DoC 2 LL.

His faction and mechanics are awful. Clearly a rushed afterthought.

Clearly you aren't part of the Dev team so you don't know any of that.

Not to mention that the amount of work they had to make for him is not something you do for an afterthought, the amount of resources poured just into the different parts he can get is simply way beyond what a normal LL would get.

Fingolfin_the-Golden#2157

mecanojavi99 said:

ConstantineZAyn said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Yes, because CA will confine the most expensive LL they have done to the less popular game mode of the game, not like they gave him his own faction and mechanics already...

Be'lakor will be in addition to Godslayer, giving DoC 2 LL.

His faction and mechanics are awful. Clearly a rushed afterthought.

Clearly you aren't part of the Dev team so you don't know any of that.

Not to mention that the amount of work they had to make for him is not something you do for an afterthought, the amount of resources poured just into the different parts he can get is simply way beyond what a normal LL would get.

Agreed.
But what a god awful (pun intended) system his parts are. What a waste of resources.

mewade44#6520

Don't think so. They added that Customization for a reason. Build your own LL.

Mr_Finley7#4571

No way they leave out Daniel after working on the whole customization system

Zyllos#5582

Really, I hope in a later date that Demon Prince will be introduced into each Monogod faction that is customizable with only specific god and generic pieces.

Or, at the bare minimum, a LL or hero that can pick skills that gives them some of the pieces the customizable demon prince can pick for the specific god.

Because, demon princes are, demonic, so should belong to the list of things to take.

ConstantineZAyn#4211

mecanojavi99 said:

ConstantineZAyn said:

mecanojavi99 said:

Yes, because CA will confine the most expensive LL they have done to the less popular game mode of the game, not like they gave him his own faction and mechanics already...

Be'lakor will be in addition to Godslayer, giving DoC 2 LL.

His faction and mechanics are awful. Clearly a rushed afterthought.

Clearly you aren't part of the Dev team so you don't know any of that.

Not to mention that the amount of work they had to make for him is not something you do for an afterthought, the amount of resources poured just into the different parts he can get is simply way beyond what a normal LL would get.

The faction has no interesting mechanics aside from that dress-up gimmick. There are just weaker versions of monogod mechanics. Plus, the skill trees are copied and pasted. You can't lead a true undivided army because each lord only buffs the troops of their god. The faction is clearly a rushed afterthought and a massive disappointment, and Daemons of Chaos are my favorite race.

Steph#6413

Disagree. The Daemon Prince, with his build-your-daemon mechanism, is very sandboxy. He has not reason to go, and I can't understand people who stil suggest that CA remove him, or remove the rifts, or remove the Soul Races, or the minor settlement, or the deployable. Why not remove Cathay or Kislev?
CA spent time to all this. They will not remove any of them. They could rework it a bit to correct flaws, but not scrap it.

They could however make Be Lakor playable from start, especially if IE doesn't have the soul race narrative.

Maybe they can also move the DP. For example have DP in the Southern Chaos Realms whome BeLakor ins on northern.

MiniaAr#5798

I really hope that we do get both as playable in IE.
This way, DoC would have 2 LLs, which is viable for a given race at least before LPs: Norsca has two, Beastmen and Wood Elves started with two, Ogre Kingdom have two, etc...

Deamon Prince - Faction: Legion of Chaos
-> specific mechanics: Glory system and access to marked mortals

Be'Lakor - Faction: Shadow Legion
-> specific mechanics: Renegade faction opposed to the chaos Gods, has to get loyalty from other deamons via a specific system. Only access to daemonic units.

Sultschiem#8734

Bel'akor is literally trying to oppose all 4 major chaos gods by taking over the forge of souls and make all demons that get banished into serving him as soul grinder.....:

He is pretty much taking Malal's role...

And the campaign they made for the Daemon Prince which is a player-choice faction serves as a model for Nagash, Valten, Archaon and propably more factions as we go further where it fits.

RamsesIII#4621

No reason we can't have both leading separate factions of the Daemons of Chaos. I do agree that CA should give god-aligned daemon princes some version of the customization mechanics though.

Captain_Rex#1635

Be’Lakor will get his own faction in IE but he obviously won’t replace Daniel.

Sillybilly#1412

I remember a thread where everyone was speculating whether or not Belakor would lead a new DoC faction or join WoC instead. Still amazed that CA managed to pick a third, worse option and totally squander him as a character. Daniel is cool and all but hardly worth missing out on Belakor as the faction lead. Especially when you could have had Belakor lead Demon Princes who were all customizable.

AxiosXiphos#9040

No.

DaGangster#8697

I thought they already said "the daemon prince" was going to be the realms of chaos campaign only?

DaGangster#8697

Steph_F_David said:

Disagree. The Daemon Prince, with his build-your-daemon mechanism, is very sandboxy. He has not reason to go, and I can't understand people who stil suggest that CA remove him, or remove the rifts, or remove the Soul Races, or the minor settlement, or the deployable. Why not remove Cathay or Kislev?
CA spent time to all this. They will not remove any of them. They could rework it a bit to correct flaws, but not scrap it.

They could however make Be Lakor playable from start, especially if IE doesn't have the soul race narrative.

Maybe they can also move the DP. For example have DP in the Southern Chaos Realms whome BeLakor ins on northern.

Why would the soul race be in the sandbox? It doesnt even make sense and they know people despise the unstoppable rifts.

Captain_Rex#1635

Sillybilly said:

I remember a thread where everyone was speculating whether or not Belakor would lead a new DoC faction or join WoC instead. Still amazed that CA managed to pick a third, worse option and totally squander him as a character. Daniel is cool and all but hardly worth missing out on Belakor as the faction lead. Especially when you could have had Belakor lead Demon Princes who were all customizable.

They only butchered Bel for the RoC campaign, which is irrelevant in the end since once IE is out nobody in his right mind will ever touch that mini campaign again.

And those who do (because they only own game 3) don’t know who he is anyways.

Only IE matters.

Red_Dox#2328

There is no way in hell CA put that much effort into a customizable Daemon Prince (a good idea!), while doing Be'lakor that dirty with its lackluster campaign reward, with any notion to "switch things" later.
Be'lakor will end up the 2nd LL for "Daemons of Chaos" [just IME, no actual storydriven campaign since that would demand some creativity for the story and after seeing the cutscens/epilogues so far, that seems not to be in the budget anyway] besides Daniel. And if we are really lucky, maybe Be'lakors Daemons will have NO pesky mortals around and being proper DoC. But at this point, that seems to be a lost cause since apparently it was too hard to do with the "Daemons of Chaos" race already -.-

-----Red Dox

Gunter_von_Stroheim#7916

It's funny, but it's actually the other way around. This Belakor is much less likely to appear in the form of LL than the Prince is to disappear. The main mechanic of the DoC faction is the gifts of the gods, while Belakor cannot get this mechanic, in order to introduce him as a lord for this faction, he will need a completely new mechanic.