Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Categories

Spirit Leach versus Fate of Bjuna

Black_PhillipBlack_Phillip Registered Users Posts: 868
I've been noticing streamers using Fate of Bjuna on cavalary. Did something change where it's now worth using that spell over spirit leach on cavalry?

Comments

  • NakedCherubNakedCherub Registered Users Posts: 25
    In w2 spirit leach kills 7 cav models of 45, and fate took 40% HP from them instead of 70% of 60 models as in w3.
  • eumaieseumaies Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 9,219

    I've been noticing streamers using Fate of Bjuna on cavalary. Did something change where it's now worth using that spell over spirit leach on cavalry?

    ultra unit size if nothing else. but while i'm not familiar with the math it's definitely quite good vs elite cavalry now.
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 18,354
    eumaies said:

    I've been noticing streamers using Fate of Bjuna on cavalary. Did something change where it's now worth using that spell over spirit leach on cavalry?

    ultra unit size if nothing else. but while i'm not familiar with the math it's definitely quite good vs elite cavalry now.
    They changed how it worked based on unit model count.

    Essentially bjuna followed up sprit leech can delete cav

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • BloodyStreamBloodyStream Registered Users Posts: 164
    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Registered Users Posts: 12,204

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
  • AsamuAsamu Registered Users Posts: 1,444
    edited August 6
    eumaies said:

    I've been noticing streamers using Fate of Bjuna on cavalary. Did something change where it's now worth using that spell over spirit leach on cavalry?

    ultra unit size if nothing else. but while i'm not familiar with the math it's definitely quite good vs elite cavalry now.
    The way spells work changed.
    FoB, and all other spells specialized for targeting units with large numbers of entities, now deal full damage vs units with 25+ entities.
    Spirit leech damage was actually nerfed against cavalry, since it now deals the same damage vs mutli-entity units as against single entities. Spirit Leech used to have a 50% chance to deal 144 (~132 on large) damage per entity in the targeted unit on each tick, with 7 ticks of damage, to up to 1 entity (It dealt damage essentially every tick vs units with even 2 or 3 entities).
    IIRC, FoB used to deal 9(8) damage per tick to up to 9 entities with an 18% chance of damage per entity in the unit, with a tick every half second for 20 seconds (41 ticks), Totaling ~2952 damage vs units with ~50+ entities (~2800-2900 damage vs a full strength unit of 45 model cavalry).
    With a cost of 22 WoM for Bjuna vs 8 for spirit leech, FoB was better vs a full strength unit of cavalry, but spirit leech was cheaper to bring, didn't get weaker as the unit lost entities, and killed entities outright with each tick, preventing them from being healed or making attacks. It also let you get more value from the lore attribute giving a temporary 100% increase to recharge rate on each spellcast, so you could use your magic faster overall.

    The new damage is a random value from 35-67 per second for 13 seconds (14 ticks) for an average of ~714 damage to one unit (in game it says the damage is 34-67, but apparently they messed up the code and excluded the first value).
    FoB does 6-10 damage per second to up to 25 entities in a unit for 20 seconds, or ~4200 damage in total to units with 25+ entities.
    Due to the lore attribute generating 2.6 WoM per spellcast, the effective spell costs are 5.4 WoM and 19.4 WoM, so FoB comes out ahead in damage per WoM spent against units with at least 16 entities.
    Post edited by Asamu on
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 18,354

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
    Its pointless on dom which is probably what our freind is referring to at this point.

    Thats too much winds for unit that you can just resummon

    And gives no advantage

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • BloodyStreamBloodyStream Registered Users Posts: 164

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
    The suction effect is too much for a lot of slow or medium speed units to dodge actually (from what I can tell). You'd have to react instantly
  • GloatingSwineGloatingSwine Registered Users Posts: 1,790
    Asamu said:


    Spirit leech damage was actually nerfed against cavalry, since it now deals the same damage vs mutli-entity units as against single entities. Spirit Leech used to have a 50% chance to deal 144 (~132 on large) damage per entity in the targeted unit on each tick, with 7 ticks of damage, to up to 1 entity (It dealt damage essentially every tick vs units with even 2 or 3 entities).

    Spirit Leech in Warhammer 2 would start to get properly reliable at 4 entities. (93% chance of doing damage with every tick). At 2 it was still only 75% chance per tick.

    It was great on artillery, two casts would break all the artillery pieces (because dd applies damage to them not the crew).
  • Lotus_MoonLotus_Moon Registered Users Posts: 12,204

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
    The suction effect is too much for a lot of slow or medium speed units to dodge actually (from what I can tell). You'd have to react instantly
    Well dom is such a cluster **** that perhaps ppl cant dodge it but in proper battle you can thats why the wom differance
  • BloodyStreamBloodyStream Registered Users Posts: 164

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
    The suction effect is too much for a lot of slow or medium speed units to dodge actually (from what I can tell). You'd have to react instantly
    Well dom is such a cluster **** that perhaps ppl cant dodge it but in proper battle you can thats why the wom differance
    Yeah I almost feel like magic should have different properties between domination vs land battles
  • saweendrasaweendra Registered Users Posts: 18,354

    Why bother with either when you have pit of shades

    Coz it can be dodged
    The suction effect is too much for a lot of slow or medium speed units to dodge actually (from what I can tell). You'd have to react instantly
    Well dom is such a cluster **** that perhaps ppl cant dodge it but in proper battle you can thats why the wom differance
    Yeah I almost feel like magic should have different properties between domination vs land battles
    If we really wanna balance for it yes.

    But be realistic Ca can not have the band with to seperate Mp and sp there is no way they have the band with for this .


    Some things got a give.

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


Sign In or Register to comment.