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Do every one think that slaanesh awar shrines is balanced

saweendra#3399saweendra#3399 Registered Users Posts: 18,935
I don't. I think it is really hard to kill in land battles . And are bit op specially since it doesn't really has to be in melee. Specially for the woc roster


I can see it being actually balanced in slaaanesh roster since they lack the healing potential of woc and require good anchor unit.



#givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


Comments

  • saweendra#3399saweendra#3399 Registered Users Posts: 18,935
    To fix this i belive it needs more strict caps like not having festus and slaanesh shrine plus nurgle shrine .


    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • saweendra#3399saweendra#3399 Registered Users Posts: 18,935
    My suggestion on caps for WoC only.

    War shrine cap 1.

    Have both festus and slaanesh war
    Hrine count towards mortis engine cap.



    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • Asamu#6386Asamu#6386 Registered Users Posts: 1,521
    The drain effect is, IMO 50-100% stronger than it should be.
    I don't think regular mortis engines or most AoE drain abilities (such as on Ku'gath and exalted Great Unclean Ones) are balanced either, and the stronger ones should probably be reduced to be more in line with the Fey Enchantress's mist ability (8-16 damage). They're oppressively strong if not killed right away.

    There was a weird mix of drain effects being nerfed by ~25-50% or buffed by ~50% in WH3. Mortis Engines were buffed by 50%; Pestilent Decay and the Slaanesh Warshrine are just as strong as the buffed mortis engine. Meanwhile, Mist of the Lady was nerfed by ~25%, and Plague Furnaces were nerfed by ~50%. Jabberslythes were the only unit with such an effect left dealing the same average DPS.

    It makes no sense to me, given that the Mortis Engine and Fey enchantress's abilities did exactly the same 4x4 dps (4 dps to 4 targets per unit) in WH2, and the Plague Furnace was only slightly worse at 3x5 (3 dps to 5 targets per unit), especially considering the Mortis engine was the most problematic such effect due to being combined with a passive heal aura, which was also effectively buffed from WH2 (from 4hp/s to 0.1%/s, which is around 10/s on most VC infantry. Even factoring in the change to ultra, that's still a significant buff).
  • saweendra#3399saweendra#3399 Registered Users Posts: 18,935

    The drain effect is, IMO 50-100% stronger than it should be.
    I don't think regular mortis engines or most AoE drain abilities (such as on Ku'gath and exalted Great Unclean Ones) are balanced either, and the stronger ones should probably be reduced to be more in line with the Fey Enchantress's mist ability (8-16 damage). They're oppressively strong if not killed right away.

    There was a weird mix of drain effects being nerfed by ~25-50% or buffed by ~50% in WH3. Mortis Engines were buffed by 50%; Pestilent Decay and the Slaanesh Warshrine are just as strong as the buffed mortis engine. Meanwhile, Mist of the Lady was nerfed by ~25%, and Plague Furnaces were nerfed by ~50%. Jabberslythes were the only unit with such an effect left dealing the same average DPS.

    It makes no sense to me, given that the Mortis Engine and Fey enchantress's abilities did exactly the same 4x4 dps (4 dps to 4 targets per unit) in WH2, and the Plague Furnace was only slightly worse at 3x5 (3 dps to 5 targets per unit), especially considering the Mortis engine was the most problematic such effect due to being combined with a passive heal aura, which was also effectively buffed from WH2 (from 4hp/s to 0.1%/s, which is around 10/s on most VC infantry. Even factoring in the change to ultra, that's still a significant buff).

    it isn't even how strong the drain effect its the fact you can have two mortis engines on feild and one of them doesn't even need to be in melee to drain . kind of unwinnble baring bring out AP missiles and only so many races have good ap missiles or some thing that hit hard as dread suarian

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • Loupi#8512Loupi#8512 Registered Users Posts: 3,683
    main issue is their ridiculously high HP pools (slaanesh one even heals a free apotheosis every time you cast), and no melee requirement for the mortis. the mortis damage itself is tolerable, but the 11k HP is absurd


  • BastileanBastilean Registered Users Posts: 2,910
    edited September 23
    I don' think the HP is absurd. They have less HP than a giant, and they look like the equivalent. They are going to draw a lot of fire.
  • BloodyStreamBloodyStream Registered Users Posts: 246
    I also don't like that a mortis distracts from the rush / glass cannon hammer & anvil nature of slaanesh and promotes blobbing. They should have done something else with it IMO.
  • saweendra#3399saweendra#3399 Registered Users Posts: 18,935
    I literally had a necrosphinkx ror whale on nurgle shrine for 7+ minutes to kill it in melee .

    This is literally not fun

    #givemoreunitsforbrettonia, my bret dlc


  • SarmatiannsSarmatianns Registered Users Posts: 4,904
    11000 HP is too much, no doubt.
  • BastileanBastilean Registered Users Posts: 2,910
    Zombies have 12320 health...
  • yst#1879yst#1879 Registered Users Posts: 9,907
    Its natural, monster same dmg, higher hp on ultra
    https://imgur.com/a/Cj4b9
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  • Spellbound1875#4610Spellbound1875#4610 Registered Users Posts: 1,909
    Bastilean said:

    Zombies have 12320 health...

    Distinct difference between a unit which is a glorified road block and a unit with a mortis effect, powerful self healing, and spellcasting (assuming you slap the lord on it). That said removing health from the unit is a think somewhat missing the biggest issues with the thing. It's most troublesome as a mount because of the benefit of giving those characters 11k hp. I'd much prefer CA to remove the inexplicable physical resistance and do something about the absurdly consistent heal for the hero, both of which would make the standard approach of shooting the unit to death more consistent as an answer.

    I'd guess you'll also need to do something about the mortis strength though as @Asamu#6386 pointed out that's already all over the place in game anyway. I'd probably lean towards a melee conditional for it rather than a damage nerf but I could easily be underestimating it's power here.
  • BastileanBastilean Registered Users Posts: 2,910
    We aren't just talking about the Slaanesh variant here, and even if we were that amount of health is what you expect for a big massive warshrine.
  • Spellbound1875#4610Spellbound1875#4610 Registered Users Posts: 1,909
    @Bastilean the thread is literally about the Slaanesh warshrine balance? I don't see how we're not focusing on that variant in this discussion. Especially given that Slaanesh's warshrine us so far above the power curve it's essentially the only variant which sees play.

    Mind you I'm agreeing that health isn't the primary issue with the unit (all of the other warshrines have a similar health and most aren't used) and that a giant health pool is a reasonable expectation. However that health layered with 10% physical resistance, a MA/MD debuff and a mortis effect all being attachable to a spellcasting character who heals every spell cast is going to cause issues almost categorically.

    The thread is talking about the Slaanesh warshrine because it's the only one that's a real balance issue. Nurgle's is the only other one which is remotely playable but it's still a support piece at the end of the day. The Slaanesh one is a win condition in and of itself and trying to remove it takes far more effort than one would expect looking at every other mortis effect in the game.
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