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Bretonnia's Faction Identity

Beytran70#7597Beytran70#7597 Registered Users Posts: 429
edited November 2022 in Campaign Ideas
I've seen this tossed around for a bit since WH3, so figured I'd put a post up here to further signal boost the idea. It's simple, really:

Bretonnia is falling behind.

Literally, in some aspects like their cavalry speed, but also in others like their supply lines bonus now being almost useless due to the global reduction for all factions. Their economy is still fairly strong, but their province sizes are so small compared to so many others. Their tech tree is still fairly weak, with the confederation techs still limited to only one chance to confederate when really they should simply UNLOCK the ability to confederate, not just give you a single chance to do so.

They lack lord and hero variety and to some degree unit variety as well, but the biggest issue that I have as a Bretonnia fan is that the core aspect of their identity, their superior cav, is no longer truly apt. Even early on their cavalry had at least some competition from Blood Knights and the like, but overall they were still the most cost efficient options. With all the new factions and balance changes, though, this is simply not the case. Bretonnia, as they should be the premiere cavalry faction, should have the best or at least tied for the best cavalry at every tier. Even Mounted Yeomen should be damn good light cav, and Grail Knights should be almost unbeatable except by the most elite anti-large units.

I don't care how CA goes about it, but something has to be done. Even if Bretonnia never gets another DLC, I hope they get a significant balance pass to at least bring them up to speed with modern factions.
Post edited by Beytran70#7597 on
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Comments

  • Cosmic_Lich#1188Cosmic_Lich#1188 Registered Users Posts: 662
    edited November 2022
    The Bretonnian tech tree wouldn't feel so bad if they gave Repanse's new techs to the others and gave the confederation techs to Repanse. This is especially confusing when they moved Alberic to Lustria, but let him keep the same techs.

    I haven't played Brets in a while so remind me. Do they have the ability to channel winds in any way? I know that the Fay's tower does something small, but, other than that, I didn't see Bretonnia included in the last update that specifically targeted the issue of factions not having the ability to increase their winds reserves. I also know they don't have the channel magic stance which is ridiculous.

    Edit: I finally checked. They have the ability to channel magic.
    Post edited by Cosmic_Lich#1188 on
    Agents of Change.
  • Beytran70#7597Beytran70#7597 Registered Users Posts: 429

    The Bretonnian tech tree wouldn't feel so bad if they gave Repanse's new techs to the others and gave the confederation techs to Repanse. This is especially confusing when they moved Alberic to Lustria, but let him keep the same techs.

    I haven't played Brets in a while so remind me. Do they have the ability to channel winds in any way? I know that the Fay's tower does something small, but, other than that, I didn't see Bretonnia included in the last update that specifically targeted the issue of factions not having the ability to increase their winds reserves. I also know they don't have the channel magic stance which is ridiculous.

    I don't think the Prophetesses or anything get any magic buffs except for the basic arcane conduit. I only had one recruited in my brief Louen campaign but I don't believe the Vows or Troths got updated in any way in IE. It would help if the Troths were changed so they included some actual spellcasting bonuses for the casters. Maybe change the Blessing of the Lady they get from phys resist for the army to casting boosts for her.
  • sandercohensandercohen Registered Users Posts: 525
    No they do not have access to channeling. Neither the fey nor the prophetesses do. Arcane conduit just increases WoM recharge on the field and doesn't add anything to your total WoM pool. The Tower of the Enchantress landmark does add extra power reserve, but if you're Alberic or Repanse that's a tall order to build. Especially if you are not going the 'unified Bretonnia' route like I did in my Alberic campaign. So yeah Bret needs a channeling stance.

    The way I see it, Bretonnia needs a full DLC with support from GW. Foot knights, Lost sons (magical, perhpas even ethereal cavalry) and questing beasts (monstrous cavalry unit, and maybe even mounts for paladins) hermit knights (hero infantry like aspiring champions) will be lore friendly additions to the current roster. In addition perhaps a lake lion (perhaps some sort of Bretonnia SEM) although not too fond of that since Helves already have a lion theme. There are still plenty of Bretonnia LLs that can be added, Behomond Beastslayer being the most likely candidate.

    Alongside that they need a FLC. Bertrand the Brigand - an archer LL like Markus - with herrimaults (think huntsmen but for Bretonnia with a less than savory reputation) and faceless (assassin-type hero that boosts movement speed and skills that boosts herrimaults) Bertrand will act more like a Bret rogue army than a regular Bretonnian sub-faction with a capital and things like that. This will have to be FLC because the units and mechanics can be easily copied from other factions and remade to fit Bretonnia at a relatively low cost and effort on the part of CA.

    Their tech tree either needs to give boosted benefits or have their prohibitively expensive costs for relatively minors boosts removed, along with a reduction to the time needed to research techs. Confederation techs aside there is barely anything special out there in their tech tree that isn't locked behind thousands of gold coins and chivalry points, not to mention time.

    Green knight needs to become a perma-summon on the battlefield once you are able to call upon him, and he gets progressively stronger the more tiers of chivalry you have reached. Starting off with some stat buffs and extra abilities, to giving army wide boons in the later stages if you summon him during battle. Because currently a level 15 paladin is better due to the mounts, skills, followers and items you can give him. Not to mention that the GK will leave your army at some point, which can unexpectedly leave your army in a weaker state.
  • Beytran70#7597Beytran70#7597 Registered Users Posts: 429

    No they do not have access to channeling. Neither the fey nor the prophetesses do. Arcane conduit just increases WoM recharge on the field and doesn't add anything to your total WoM pool. The Tower of the Enchantress landmark does add extra power reserve, but if you're Alberic or Repanse that's a tall order to build. Especially if you are not going the 'unified Bretonnia' route like I did in my Alberic campaign. So yeah Bret needs a channeling stance.

    The way I see it, Bretonnia needs a full DLC with support from GW. Foot knights, Lost sons (magical, perhpas even ethereal cavalry) and questing beasts (monstrous cavalry unit, and maybe even mounts for paladins) hermit knights (hero infantry like aspiring champions) will be lore friendly additions to the current roster. In addition perhaps a lake lion (perhaps some sort of Bretonnia SEM) although not too fond of that since Helves already have a lion theme. There are still plenty of Bretonnia LLs that can be added, Behomond Beastslayer being the most likely candidate.

    Alongside that they need a FLC. Bertrand the Brigand - an archer LL like Markus - with herrimaults (think huntsmen but for Bretonnia with a less than savory reputation) and faceless (assassin-type hero that boosts movement speed and skills that boosts herrimaults) Bertrand will act more like a Bret rogue army than a regular Bretonnian sub-faction with a capital and things like that. This will have to be FLC because the units and mechanics can be easily copied from other factions and remade to fit Bretonnia at a relatively low cost and effort on the part of CA.

    Their tech tree either needs to give boosted benefits or have their prohibitively expensive costs for relatively minors boosts removed, along with a reduction to the time needed to research techs. Confederation techs aside there is barely anything special out there in their tech tree that isn't locked behind thousands of gold coins and chivalry points, not to mention time.

    Green knight needs to become a perma-summon on the battlefield once you are able to call upon him, and he gets progressively stronger the more tiers of chivalry you have reached. Starting off with some stat buffs and extra abilities, to giving army wide boons in the later stages if you summon him during battle. Because currently a level 15 paladin is better due to the mounts, skills, followers and items you can give him. Not to mention that the GK will leave your army at some point, which can unexpectedly leave your army in a weaker state.

    Good points for all. I believe there is some Bretonnia content coming at some point in The Old World, so maybe CA can hit GW up early for some of that stuff to include, otherwise there are plenty of options like you have stated. I quite like Bretonnia's vibe and playstyle I just feel like the more new, powerful factions are added, the more older ones are left behind.
  • Cosmic_Lich#1188Cosmic_Lich#1188 Registered Users Posts: 662
    @sandercohen Bretonnia does have channeling. If they didn't have it before, they have it now. I turned off all of my mods to check.

    Agents of Change.
  • Beytran70#7597Beytran70#7597 Registered Users Posts: 429
    Bumping here again since this patch acknowledged concerns for Bretonnia, but didn't really do much.
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