Realms of Chaos should be in immortal empires...but not like they are in the base game..

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434

A few key points:

1. One thing that I feel is a big part of the Chaos gods is their fighting between themselves. I don't think this is well represented in immoral empires at the moment.
2. The battle maps for chaos realms are great and it is a shame we can't enjoy them in IE right now
3. I like the sandbox experience of IE, so I am not advocating for a narrative campaign (Just clarifying so ppl don't take this the wrong way)

What I therefore suggest is that IE gets the chaos realms added as land masses that have a few select portals in the northern and southern chaos realms for access (or they open for only short periods). The Chaos realms themselves will not be like in the base game but rather will have provinces and settlements. New Chaos LL's can then have campaign objectives to conquer another chaos realm of a rival god, eliminate a rival gods Herald faction etc. The main fort should of course be very hard to overcome and could have a survival type battle, but more themed as an offensive battle rather than defensive from the player side.

(Any non chaos factions going into the chaos realms in IE should suffer huge penalties for entering.)

Lord_Zarkov#7252

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434 said:

A few key points:

1. One thing that I feel is a big part of the Chaos gods is their fighting between themselves. I don't think this is well represented in immoral empires at the moment.
2. The battle maps for chaos realms are great and it is a shame we can't enjoy them in IE right now
3. I like the sandbox experience of IE, so I am not advocating for a narrative campaign (Just clarifying so ppl don't take this the wrong way)

What I therefore suggest is that IE gets the chaos realms added as land masses that have a few select portals in the northern and southern chaos realms for access (or they open for only short periods). The Chaos realms themselves will not be like in the base game but rather will have provinces and settlements. New Chaos LL's can then have campaign objectives to conquer another chaos realm of a rival god, eliminate a rival gods Herald faction etc. The main fort should of course be very hard to overcome and could have a survival type battle, but more themed as an offensive battle rather than defensive from the player side.

(Any non chaos factions going into the chaos realms in IE should suffer huge penalties for entering.)

Having armies of mortals even enter the Realms of Chaos was bad enough, but at least they attempted to loosely justify it with the campaign background (and the Gods may well even have facilitated it to take out Be’lakor as they’re unable to interfere in the Forge of Souls).

Having armies of mortals conquer territory in the Realms of Chaos is super dumb and against the lore. They’re not just places, each one is an actual part of its respective god. It’s like saying you can go conquer Khorne.

Rarely occurring random portals you have to fight a RoC battle could be cool as long as it’s in moderation. Daemon factions (and maybe WoC) taking shortcuts through the realms as a campaign mechanic might also be cool.

But people invading and conquering them is ridiculous.

DarthEnderX-#6513

Completely agree. The Realms should be in IE. The rifts and souls race should not.

SteelRonin#4832

I agree, Realm yes, Rifts and Souls nope.

Players should enter to ask favors, earn incredible items or army or campaign bonuses, challenge other champions to access these rewards.

Races that can pact with chaos (lore related) should enter the realm.

I doubt Vampire Counts will pact with Chaos, so, no reason for them to enter, but even Greenskins can enter, even for experience, items, gold, in exchange they have to send a stack every 10 turns to fight an army of chaos in the realm.

Captain_Rex#1635

Keep that trash out of IE.

Steph#6413

I''d like to see, in order of importance
- Chaos realm battle maps (with a way to fight there, not too intrusive)
- Rifts to fight said battle, and maybe teleport (a random chance to appear? Based on corruption)
- Chaos realms as province. Not really important if we have the battle maps in a way.

Itharus#3127

This game isn't about Chaos gods warring among themselves. It's about the world that Warhammer is set in. 1 tiny world is completely irrelevant to the dark gods of Chaos. It's one among an infinite number of things they are fighting over. It's also 100% irrelevant to a match of the game, because even if Chaos wins the campaign anything beyond that mortal world is superfluous.

RoC need to stay out of IE.

If you like RoC, go enjoy it in the minicampaign made specifically for it.

IE deserves to have its map tweaked and improved and the eastern factions given a better and more accurate home area.

Ben1990#8909

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434 said:

A few key points:

1. One thing that I feel is a big part of the Chaos gods is their fighting between themselves. I don't think this is well represented in immoral empires at the moment.
2. The battle maps for chaos realms are great and it is a shame we can't enjoy them in IE right now
3. I like the sandbox experience of IE, so I am not advocating for a narrative campaign (Just clarifying so ppl don't take this the wrong way)

What I therefore suggest is that IE gets the chaos realms added as land masses that have a few select portals in the northern and southern chaos realms for access (or they open for only short periods). The Chaos realms themselves will not be like in the base game but rather will have provinces and settlements. New Chaos LL's can then have campaign objectives to conquer another chaos realm of a rival god, eliminate a rival gods Herald faction etc. The main fort should of course be very hard to overcome and could have a survival type battle, but more themed as an offensive battle rather than defensive from the player side.

(Any non chaos factions going into the chaos realms in IE should suffer huge penalties for entering.)

Yeah. They should add the RoC into IE. Would be a fun way to spice up the game. Bonus if you get gauntlets there to get additional exp, items, ancillaries and more for beating any challenge the Dark Gods will throw at you. That + extra options and capabilities for Chaos factions for interacting with the RoC.

Wyvax#7456

The work that went into campaign and battle maps for the Realms of Chaos is dang impressive, and it would be a shame to see them lost as most won't play the base WH3 campaign more than once. So, I'm all for them making it in. How to incorporate them properly I don't know; in the RoC campaign there was the plot requiring mortals to interact with it for Ursun's sake. So going forward, there needs to be a serious gameplay incentive for the player to interact with them, perhaps the rift system, but instead of hopping immediately out you start at one end of a random god's domain and need to cross for a few turns to get to the other rift's exit. Serious in realm rewards should exist to entice the player, but the lever of adversity and danger would have to increase, it's no mere walk in the park.

Additionally, don't stuff them in the corner of the map above Cathay, use that space to flesh out the Eastern Steppes and the Chaos Wastes there and have a separate 'theatre of war' dedicated for the Realms itself. It's a freaking alternate hell dimension after all, sticking it on the same base map is just cheap.

#55244

For lore reasons I am against having the chaos realms on the IE map.

1. There are also no real permanent settlements in them so implementing them would just be weird.
2. Most mortals will go straight up mad when entering them so having them actually settle them is even weirder.

They would also have be changed quite a bit to acutally fit the theme and I don't see that effort as being worth it. Just how would you change Tzeentch realm for example? Each island would be their own province?

I hated Survival battles and don't see them having any redeeming quality. The maps were bad (to play), the whole concept of recruiting addtional units and building defenses was bad. I don't think making them less defensive would change enough.

Surge_2#1464

Keep the RoC out of IE. Its an utter waste of time and space.

Itharus#3127

Surge_2#1464 said:

Keep the RoC out of IE. Its an utter waste of time and space.

I'd 100% have bought WH3 just for IE with no RoC campaign at all.

Maybe without RoC we'd have a great IE by now.

Shame that a minicampaign derailed The Grand Campaign portion of the game.

Surge_2#1464

Itharus#3127 said:

Surge_2#1464 said:

Keep the RoC out of IE. Its an utter waste of time and space.

I'd 100% have bought WH3 just for IE with no RoC campaign at all.

Maybe without RoC we'd have a great IE by now.

Shame that a minicampaign derailed The Grand Campaign portion of the game.

Without the flawed RoC, yeah actually, we would have Chaos Dwarves for sure by Christmas.

RoC, Rift Spam, Minor Settlement Hell...yikes CA, just yikes.

XxXScorpionXxX#2310

It would be kind of cool if they could get reworked into being the homebase of the MonoGod factions, only accessible via rift mechanic. From the Daemons side you'd basically be defending your realm from constant invasions while sending your forces out to sack and raze.

XxXScorpionXxX#2310

#55244 said:

For lore reasons I am against having the chaos realms on the IE map.

1. There are also no real permanent settlements in them so implementing them would just be weird.
2. Most mortals will go straight up mad when entering them so having them actually settle them is even weirder.

They would also have be changed quite a bit to acutally fit the theme and I don't see that effort as being worth it. Just how would you change Tzeentch realm for example? Each island would be their own province?

I hated Survival battles and don't see them having any redeeming quality. The maps were bad (to play), the whole concept of recruiting addtional units and building defenses was bad. I don't think making them less defensive would change enough.

They could probably add capitals in for the MonoGods. Not settleble by anyone other than the daemons. That way you can have the great game where the daemons try to conquer each other's realms but the mortals/undead can't settle and can only raze it before being teleported out with a bunch of gifts.

Jo_Proulx#5293

By reusing the same codes (almost), they could make it so that chaos realms offer challenges every "X random turns" where each chaos factions remaining in the game can participate, totally optional, where they can each send one army to fight the challenge.

So here is more in dept idea:

Campaign is ongoing, after "x" turns, the game roll a random realm challenge, say it rolls Khorne this time.

Every remaining chaos factions is then given a mission, telling you in 5 turns the challenge will begin, after 5 turns have passed since the challenge is revealed, choose one army of your choice, if you so wish it, totally optional, to send to the realm of khorne to fight the challenge, fighting other challengers as well, that other factions sent (like in RoC race).

To send an army just accept the challenge like you would accept a quest battle, and a rift open and send your army to the realm of khorne. If victorious the army is sent back to world with the reward and the lord gain a tittle.

Now the thing is to make the reward very interesting, because sending an army for many turns is a huge deal after all.

hillbillymachinegun2#1031

Lord_Zarkov#7252 said:

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434 said:

A few key points:

1. One thing that I feel is a big part of the Chaos gods is their fighting between themselves. I don't think this is well represented in immoral empires at the moment.
2. The battle maps for chaos realms are great and it is a shame we can't enjoy them in IE right now
3. I like the sandbox experience of IE, so I am not advocating for a narrative campaign (Just clarifying so ppl don't take this the wrong way)

What I therefore suggest is that IE gets the chaos realms added as land masses that have a few select portals in the northern and southern chaos realms for access (or they open for only short periods). The Chaos realms themselves will not be like in the base game but rather will have provinces and settlements. New Chaos LL's can then have campaign objectives to conquer another chaos realm of a rival god, eliminate a rival gods Herald faction etc. The main fort should of course be very hard to overcome and could have a survival type battle, but more themed as an offensive battle rather than defensive from the player side.

(Any non chaos factions going into the chaos realms in IE should suffer huge penalties for entering.)

Having armies of mortals even enter the Realms of Chaos was bad enough, but at least they attempted to loosely justify it with the campaign background (and the Gods may well even have facilitated it to take out Be’lakor as they’re unable to interfere in the Forge of Souls).

Having armies of mortals conquer territory in the Realms of Chaos is super dumb and against the lore. They’re not just places, each one is an actual part of its respective god. It’s like saying you can go conquer Khorne.

Rarely occurring random portals you have to fight a RoC battle could be cool as long as it’s in moderation. Daemon factions (and maybe WoC) taking shortcuts through the realms as a campaign mechanic might also be cool.

But people invading and conquering them is ridiculous.

It's a sandbox game. Painting the map with virtually any faction in the game today is "ridiculous" and not lore accurate. Yet it's a core part of the Total War experience.

hillbillymachinegun2#1031

Realm of Chaos in IE:

Yes
- Add as a landmass with settlements.
- Enter through the Chaos wastes only.
- Include locations of interest and ways to acquire special items.
- Bring back extremely severe penalties for non-chaotic characters being corrupted by spending time in RoC, as it would no longer be a central part of the campaign narrative but more of an optional objective.
- Either insurmountable public order penalties or randomly spawned hostile armies in RoC regions held by factions not aligned to the Chaos god it belongs to, so as to reflect the impossibility of holding territory here.

No
- Arcady mini games.
- Big boss battles.
- Random portals everywhere.

Neodeinos#5871

hillbillymachinegun2#1031 said:

Realm of Chaos in IE:

Yes
- Add as a landmass with settlements.
- Enter through the Chaos wastes only.
- Include locations of interest and ways to acquire special items.
- Bring back extremely severe penalties for non-chaotic characters being corrupted by spending time in RoC, as it would no longer be a central part of the campaign narrative but more of an optional objective.
- Either insurmountable public order penalties or randomly spawned hostile armies in RoC regions held by factions not aligned to the Chaos god it belongs to, so as to reflect the impossibility of holding territory here.

No
- Arcady mini games.
- Big boss battles.
- Random portals everywhere.

Better way to reflect the impossibility to hold territory here would simply be to have only the Chaotic races able to occupy those settlements.

Passthechips#4366

Jo_Proulx#5293 said:

By reusing the same codes (almost), they could make it so that chaos realms offer challenges every "X random turns" where each chaos factions remaining in the game can participate, totally optional, where they can each send one army to fight the challenge.

So here is more in dept idea:

Campaign is ongoing, after "x" turns, the game roll a random realm challenge, say it rolls Khorne this time.

Every remaining chaos factions is then given a mission, telling you in 5 turns the challenge will begin, after 5 turns have passed since the challenge is revealed, choose one army of your choice, if you so wish it, totally optional, to send to the realm of khorne to fight the challenge, fighting other challengers as well, that other factions sent (like in RoC race).

To send an army just accept the challenge like you would accept a quest battle, and a rift open and send your army to the realm of khorne. If victorious the army is sent back to world with the reward and the lord gain a tittle.

Now the thing is to make the reward very interesting, because sending an army for many turns is a huge deal after all.

This and ideas like it seem like a whole lot of work for very little payoff. A whole series of maps and realms added for the benefit of only four races with no real outcome for the main map.

While potentially cool, the realms of chaos should probably stay in the RoC map and be improved there. In general implementing the realms could be more effort spent in expanding the landmasses that are currently on the map like a fully fledged Eastern Steppes, or not-Korea, or Khuresh/Ind.

Jo_Proulx#5293

#640471 said:

Jo_Proulx#5293 said:

By reusing the same codes (almost), they could make it so that chaos realms offer challenges every "X random turns" where each chaos factions remaining in the game can participate, totally optional, where they can each send one army to fight the challenge.

So here is more in dept idea:

Campaign is ongoing, after "x" turns, the game roll a random realm challenge, say it rolls Khorne this time.

Every remaining chaos factions is then given a mission, telling you in 5 turns the challenge will begin, after 5 turns have passed since the challenge is revealed, choose one army of your choice, if you so wish it, totally optional, to send to the realm of khorne to fight the challenge, fighting other challengers as well, that other factions sent (like in RoC race).

To send an army just accept the challenge like you would accept a quest battle, and a rift open and send your army to the realm of khorne. If victorious the army is sent back to world with the reward and the lord gain a tittle.

Now the thing is to make the reward very interesting, because sending an army for many turns is a huge deal after all.

This and ideas like it seem like a whole lot of work for very little payoff. A whole series of maps and realms added for the benefit of only four races with no real outcome for the main map.

While potentially cool, the realms of chaos should probably stay in the RoC map and be improved there. In general implementing the realms could be more effort spent in expanding the landmasses that are currently on the map like a fully fledged Eastern Steppes, or not-Korea, or Khuresh/Ind.

There is already 13 chaos factions that could play into it, I dont think its little pay off, but thats your opinion, I respect it, though I suspect your bias by not being much into chaos in general, though I accept I could be wrong.

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434

Lord_Zarkov#7252 said:

TheTrue_LordAndy#1434 said:

A few key points:

1. One thing that I feel is a big part of the Chaos gods is their fighting between themselves. I don't think this is well represented in immoral empires at the moment.
2. The battle maps for chaos realms are great and it is a shame we can't enjoy them in IE right now
3. I like the sandbox experience of IE, so I am not advocating for a narrative campaign (Just clarifying so ppl don't take this the wrong way)

What I therefore suggest is that IE gets the chaos realms added as land masses that have a few select portals in the northern and southern chaos realms for access (or they open for only short periods). The Chaos realms themselves will not be like in the base game but rather will have provinces and settlements. New Chaos LL's can then have campaign objectives to conquer another chaos realm of a rival god, eliminate a rival gods Herald faction etc. The main fort should of course be very hard to overcome and could have a survival type battle, but more themed as an offensive battle rather than defensive from the player side.

(Any non chaos factions going into the chaos realms in IE should suffer huge penalties for entering.)

Having armies of mortals even enter the Realms of Chaos was bad enough, but at least they attempted to loosely justify it with the campaign background (and the Gods may well even have facilitated it to take out Be’lakor as they’re unable to interfere in the Forge of Souls).

Having armies of mortals conquer territory in the Realms of Chaos is super dumb and against the lore. They’re not just places, each one is an actual part of its respective god. It’s like saying you can go conquer Khorne.

Rarely occurring random portals you have to fight a RoC battle could be cool as long as it’s in moderation. Daemon factions (and maybe WoC) taking shortcuts through the realms as a campaign mechanic might also be cool.

But people invading and conquering them is ridiculous.

Then make it just rival chaos factions able to invade, no need to open it up to non chaos if that is too lore breaking

DarthEnderX-#6513

#640471 said:

This and ideas like it seem like a whole lot of work for very little payoff. A whole series of maps and realms added for the benefit of only four races with no real outcome for the main map.

A. Those maps and realmsare already in-game assets.

B. At least 6 races(Monogods, WoC, DoC) and possibly even 8(BM, Norsca).

#640471 said:

In general implementing the realms could be more effort spent in expanding the landmasses that are currently on the map like a fully fledged Eastern Steppes, or not-Korea, or Khuresh/Ind.

I am more interested in Ind/Khuresh than the RoC, but ideally I'd like both.

Maedrethnir#1968

I wouldn't mind it if it was limited to Chaos races only. Make it their playground.

AxiosXiphos#9040

I would add the realms as a Deamon / WoC (maybe) specific battleground. Those maps are too good to be unplayable in IE.

SteelRonin#4832

It is better to have the realm of chaos in IE than not having it. Having more things is always better.

If you dont want to enter there, don't enter, period.

Looks like we all agree that the battlegrounds shouldn't be lost on RoC campaign only.

I would really love to pact with Chaos, with a specific Chaos God, to complete their challenges in exchange of bonuses, like gold, items, diplomacy bonuses, replenishment and growth, and a lot of other ideas.

Not only defeating armies in their specific realm, but also outside of the realm, like killing a faction because Tzeentch wants that.

saweendra#3399

The only thing thatshohld happen to roc is taking it behind the barn and shooting it



The base game must be IE if any one wants to add more land mass

Add nippon and lost isels.


Still more worth than the realms

DarthEnderX-#6513

saweendra#3399 said:

The base game must be IE if any one wants to add more land mass

Add nippon and lost isels.

Still more worth than the realms

Orontes#2247

Itharus#3127 said:

Surge_2#1464 said:

Keep the RoC out of IE. Its an utter waste of time and space.

I'd 100% have bought WH3 just for IE with no RoC campaign at all.

Maybe without RoC we'd have a great IE by now.

Shame that a minicampaign derailed The Grand Campaign portion of the game.

I agree with the quote above

Oddzilla#9930

I'd say add them, but they should function differently for non-demonic races and characters.

Mortal races take heavy attrition there, but can maybe gain temporary "resistance" for like 3 turns by defeating a chaos army or 10 for defeating a chaos LL, which would reduce but not eliminate attrition. They can destroy settlements there, but can't occupy them.

Mortal chaos aligned units still take attrition in the ROC, but maybe reduced by various means. Only daemonic units and lords can exist there without penalty.

They shouldn't be large, or have many settlements, but perhaps offer strong bonuses to daemons that control the settlements, or to mortals that destroy them.

I'd say have them accessible through the portals certain parts of the map, again mortals would need to defeat a chaos army to survive there for any amount of time, so going there wouldn't be trivialized.

Steph#6413

I like the idea of Chaos faction fighting each other in the Chaos Realm, and the occasional move between Chaos Realms and main map.

The Chaos Realms would have a benefit : each monogod faction can only be destroyed if their Realm is defeated.
So Khorne would start as he is now in the Badlands, would also own a settlement in the Chaos Realm.
If he is defeated in the Badlands, he can still respawn in the Chaos Realms.
Moving between Chaos Realms could be done by a rift (one rift in each realm leading to each other one).
Plus some events, ritual or whatever to open rift between Chaos Realms and main map.