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Disappearing Bodies

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  • LorenzohhLorenzohh Senior Member Posts: 675Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Its more to do with, my computer does not lag when the men are alive.... why would it lag when they are dead? Which is the excuse the CA tech guys come up with :/

    haha, I know right. But maybe the amount of arrows being stuck in shields ( we saw that in the trailer ) may contribute to lag. But making a seperate option is what this is all about.
    Welcome to the internet. Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents.
  • IponuIponu Senior Member Posts: 496Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Agreed.
    Rome II better become realistic and historically sensible:

    http://forums.totalwar.com/showthread.php/119555-So-Close-to-Being-a-Good-Game...
  • VordusVordus Senior Member Posts: 166Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Lorenzohh wrote: »
    Wouldn't it then just crash when they were still alive too ?

    yupp, he doesnt know what hes talking about.
  • CorporalCorporal Member Posts: 69Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Great American misunderstanding of movie quotes is as follows: I love the smell of napalm in the morning. It smells victory.
    Misundestanding is quite understandable, Few people have smelled napalm or other petroleum incendiary products. Napalm like most petroleum products contain many chemicals that have sweet odor or gasoline type of odors. Napalm smells tactical victory. Burned napalm and other burn chemicals are different matter. Back to the matter at hands, dead bodies...uuh.

    Human flesh, once left rottening, with excrement in bowels and other bodily fluids will create such stench that one never forgets, even if one would like to. The use of cow parts as ammunition is mild yet clear indication that rottening bodyparts can and will be used as weapons in total war series.

    Disappearance of dead bodies is not only traversty but it is complete and utter horror of not having rottening corpses and clowds of flies indicating smell of total victory. Equal only to denying victorious troops to rob the dead... aka spoils of war. Not to mention what bacteriological/psychological warfare does to people of sieged city when heads and limbs start flying over the walls instead of cowparts...that flies poorly when compared to sewered human head.

    Ancient Roman soldiers were not paid that well. Taking weapons and gear of enemy soldier and selling them, was natural thing. Not performing such cruel and in our time horrible war crime, would cause almost immediate mutiny...

    So if for no other reason but for Hallowenian fun
    "Dead rotten corpses and robbing the dead was part of war in ancient wars, it is part of contemporary war and it is likely to be integral part of future wars..."

    Ps...its the thing that makes a war total.
  • HardwaremasterHardwaremaster Senior Member In 3dsmax Los Angeles CaliforniaPosts: 6,390Registered Users, Tech Moderators
    edited October 2012
    It is one particular setting, if its under high there will be a max number of dead bodies, and after a certain amount the older ones will disappear so new ones can stay.

    If i play nappy on my laptop on medium they will disappear but on high (where it lags a fair bit) the bodies will stay, i doubt its to do with the memory or ram.


    I could be wrong of course, but I doubt it. I just tested it today, even on low settings the bodies stay for me. Until I fool the game into thinking I have much less video memory. Starts to kick in at 1GB.

    more to do with, my computer does not lag when the men are alive.... why would it lag when they are dead? Which is the excuse the CA tech guys come up with :/

    First of all, I don't work for CA. This should already be obvious since I don't have the CA staff tag. And second of all apparently you have never heard of Engine overhead. Stick to history stuff, your not so good at the tech stuff. If you want I can post another wall of text explaining the specifics. But quite frankly it always feels like a waste of time cause there are always more of you that don't read long posts.

    If you want a basic idea; and something you can test on your own you should check actual framerates and memory consumption with dead bodies. They do in fact have a massive drain on your proccessing power, which is interesting considering they no longer are animated or processed for pathfinding/collisions. I cant exactly tell why, but the facts are there, just gotta know where to look.

    Not only that, but dead bodies other than being a massive drain at frame call on DP's (drawcalls) but also for your triangulation passes. Its the most logical thing to swipe as you run low on mem, and processing power.

    I don't necessarily agree with the choice myself, but it does reduce significantly the load on the system. And significantly reduces the chances of memory faults.
    Total War Forum: Terms and Conditions
    "True redundancy is when you are writing a description to describe the word that describes the description you used to describe it." - Christopher Purches

    My PC: (2x 980GTX 4GB) (32GB DDR4 2133mhz) (I7 5980K OC 4.5Ghz) (512GB SSDs + 2TB storage drives)

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  • LorenzohhLorenzohh Senior Member Posts: 675Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    I could be wrong of course, but I doubt it. I just tested it today, even on low settings the bodies stay for me. Until I fool the game into thinking I have much less video memory. Starts to kick in at 1GB.




    First of all, I don't work for CA. This should already be obvious since I don't have the CA staff tag. And second of all apparently you have never heard of Engine overhead. Stick to history stuff, your not so good at the tech stuff. If you want I can post another wall of text explaining the specifics. But quite frankly it always feels like a waste of time cause there are always more of you that don't read long posts.

    If you want a basic idea; and something you can test on your own you should check actual framerates and memory consumption with dead bodies. They do in fact have a massive drain on your proccessing power, which is interesting considering they no longer are animated or processed for pathfinding/collisions. I cant exactly tell why, but the facts are there, just gotta know where to look.

    Not only that, but dead bodies other than being a massive drain at frame call on DP's (drawcalls) but also for your triangulation passes. Its the most logical thing to swipe as you run low on mem, and processing power.

    I don't necessarily agree with the choice myself, but it does reduce significantly the load on the system.

    I'm not arguing with that, but that's why it should be an OPTION. I would rather play on medium detail, but still have the option to have unlimited bodies, maybe even low settings! As much as I like nice graphics, I'd still go for immersion first.
    THAT is why it should be an option.
    Welcome to the internet. Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents.
  • HardwaremasterHardwaremaster Senior Member In 3dsmax Los Angeles CaliforniaPosts: 6,390Registered Users, Tech Moderators
    edited October 2012
    Oh I agree, never mentioned that because it should be the logical conclusion. But I wonder if it would be a simple task to make it an option. The reason the bodies disappear is because of an automated resource system that Shogun 2's engine has. Where it basically keeps track of system resources. And if your approaching memory faults due to clogging of the arteries so to speak it flushes the cache, and some dead bodies. That's a grossly over simplified explanation of course, but you get my drift I'm sure.

    Definitely a good idea to make it an option.
    Total War Forum: Terms and Conditions
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    My PC: (2x 980GTX 4GB) (32GB DDR4 2133mhz) (I7 5980K OC 4.5Ghz) (512GB SSDs + 2TB storage drives)

    "How on earth is a video game supposed to help you "feel the smell of ash"? Maybe CA could package some up with your disc." -Mackles
  • AlJabberwockAlJabberwock Moderator Posts: 7,266Moderators, Tech Moderators
    edited October 2012
    Have to say I agree with the opportunity to use the option for bodies, although it should be said that the general set-up of the newest iterations of the sytem are designed to prevent laggy/crashy behavior without the 'wires' showing... Hence settings that are ajudged too high or that cause saturation of available video ram are auto-turned down without a by-your-leave to the user. This should also be optional and at the moment can only be overridden by altering the preference script. Once THAT is handled, you can then go on to thinking about letting the system lag and be crashy with excess body-levels of your choice. :)
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  • LorenzohhLorenzohh Senior Member Posts: 675Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Oh I agree, never mentioned that because it should be the logical conclusion. But I wonder if it would be a simple task to make it an option. The reason the bodies disappear is because of an automated resource system that Shogun 2's engine has. Where it basically keeps track of system resources. And if your approaching memory faults due to clogging of the arteries so to speak it flushes the cache, and some dead bodies. That's a grossly over simplified explanation of course, but you get my drift I'm sure.

    Definitely a good idea to make it an option.

    I'm not an expert on the matter, but I know you mean. Maybe you should only be able to change the ''bodies option'' any higher if you have enough RAM/VRAM left, that's why I mentioned the ''I'd rather go for lower graphics'' thing. Now just hoping the guys at CA take a look at this thread :D
    Welcome to the internet. Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents.
  • Green JacketGreen Jacket Senior Member Melton Mowbray, Leicestershire, EnglandPosts: 1,512Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    I could be wrong of course, but I doubt it. I just tested it today, even on low settings the bodies stay for me. Until I fool the game into thinking I have much less video memory. Starts to kick in at 1GB.




    First of all, I don't work for CA. This should already be obvious since I don't have the CA staff tag. And second of all apparently you have never heard of Engine overhead. Stick to history stuff, your not so good at the tech stuff. If you want I can post another wall of text explaining the specifics. But quite frankly it always feels like a waste of time cause there are always more of you that don't read long posts.

    If you want a basic idea; and something you can test on your own you should check actual framerates and memory consumption with dead bodies. They do in fact have a massive drain on your proccessing power, which is interesting considering they no longer are animated or processed for pathfinding/collisions. I cant exactly tell why, but the facts are there, just gotta know where to look.

    Not only that, but dead bodies other than being a massive drain at frame call on DP's (drawcalls) but also for your triangulation passes. Its the most logical thing to swipe as you run low on mem, and processing power.

    I don't necessarily agree with the choice myself, but it does reduce significantly the load on the system. And significantly reduces the chances of memory faults.

    Hmmm interesting about the memory....

    Not a tech expert i admit but maybe it could be something CA could look into for Rome 2 then. I don't think it would be that hard making a dead body have less effect on your machine than an alive animated one. However i do understand in shogun 2 they introduced "wounded" soldiers slowly dying on the floor which could kind of explain this.

    Either way i think CA should work on this :)
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
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  • HardwaremasterHardwaremaster Senior Member In 3dsmax Los Angeles CaliforniaPosts: 6,390Registered Users, Tech Moderators
    edited October 2012
    This isn't something that can be worked on really. They have already optimized the living daylights out of the engine itself. Minus a few things here and there. Its more of a limitation on the current programming systems and the way that game engines have to work. The closest company right now to getting anything close to full streaming is Crytek with Crysis 3 and Cryengine 3.4.4 . And even that has a ways to go.

    But as I said, that is something that should be an option, if you want it to be a little more unstable and lag a little more as well thats fine. Let you have it. And as AL has stated I think that the current resource system should be entirely optional as well. Or at least make it more obvious so that people that can, will be able to edit it out.
    Total War Forum: Terms and Conditions
    "True redundancy is when you are writing a description to describe the word that describes the description you used to describe it." - Christopher Purches

    My PC: (2x 980GTX 4GB) (32GB DDR4 2133mhz) (I7 5980K OC 4.5Ghz) (512GB SSDs + 2TB storage drives)

    "How on earth is a video game supposed to help you "feel the smell of ash"? Maybe CA could package some up with your disc." -Mackles
  • LorenzohhLorenzohh Senior Member Posts: 675Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    This isn't something that can be worked on really. They have already optimized the living daylights out of the engine itself. Minus a few things here and there. Its more of a limitation on the current programming systems and the way that game engines have to work. The closest company right now to getting anything close to full streaming is Crytek with Crysis 3 and Cryengine 3.4.4 . And even that has a ways to go.

    But as I said, that is something that should be an option, if you want it to be a little more unstable and lag a little more as well thats fine. Let you have it. And as AL has stated I think that the current resource system should be entirely optional as well. Or at least make it more obvious so that people that can, will be able to edit it out.

    Taking the words right out my mouth!

    EDIT = well atleast that last part ;P
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  • MadSamuraiMadSamurai Senior Member Posts: 212Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    Just going to say it, but maybe add an option to keep arrows as well. There were a couple of mods for medieval 2 which did this (don't know if there's 1 for shogun) and it looked stunning. Bunch of arrows in a mass field of bodies makes the game feel real. Maybe a mod can be made for these options? wouldn't know how but it would be well worth the effort.
  • LorenzohhLorenzohh Senior Member Posts: 675Registered Users
    edited October 2012
    MadSamurai wrote: »
    Just going to say it, but maybe add an option to keep arrows as well. There were a couple of mods for medieval 2 which did this (don't know if there's 1 for shogun) and it looked stunning. Bunch of arrows in a mass field of bodies makes the game feel real. Maybe a mod can be made for these options? wouldn't know how but it would be well worth the effort.

    yes, just blended in with the bodies. like a general option for dissappearing stuff... that sounded silly, ah well.
    Welcome to the internet. Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents.
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