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Graphic Card Question

MizuBushidoMizuBushido Junior MemberPosts: 28Registered Users
edited February 2011 in Technology
Hi ,I'm building a new SandyBridge rig for STW2 and have come across a problem between two cards, both falling in my price range($170-$220). Its come down to choosing between the Sapphire 6850 or the Evga GTX460 Superclocked. Being my first build and not having the experience when it comes to these things. My question is how do these two cards stack up to each other and which one would I most likely get the best results from? Also any other suggestions would be appreciated, thanks.
Post edited by MizuBushido on

Comments

  • AlJabberwockAlJabberwock Moderator USAPosts: 7,729Moderators, Tech Moderators, Knights
    edited January 2011
    Salutations!

    Know you are not alone in this question...

    There is both a short answer and a long answer to this question. The short answer is achieved by me giving you a few links and you choosing for yourself based on that information. Those are primarily benchmarking sites, and will give you some notion in terms of synthetic tests and other titles. Because we don't have S2 to test these on however, we cannot know how that particular title would treat these two cards -at least know for sure. (Sites linked below)

    The long answer (which I will predictably also give) includes this information for REFERNCE CARD comparisons (obviously if you buy jacked up versions of either card, these particualr comparisons go out the window):
    1)The AMD cards are the REFERENCE cards for the title (S2). That is unusual as normally these are not specified by maker...This begs an interesting question - Will the bewildering, usually inefficient, over-kill of streaming processors in the traditional AMD architecture, be of some use? Hmmm!? Indeed I ask myself this question as I contemplate equipment buys for next month.
    2)In terms of aim, the 6850 is aimed above the 460 and generally performs just slightly better in benchmarks for most titles, although not all, and predictably for most cases, the overall FPS margin is really minimal- then the question is whether the price difference matters more than the performance gain. See the per-dollar value in second link (if you care about such measures)
    3)The 460s perform better in some of the synthetics - odd -
    4)6850 will probably perform at cooler temperatures.
    5)Overall, these cards are very similar, especially if you are comparing same level onboard ram versions (1gb)

    Links:
    A general overview of nearly every graphic solution in the known world, although there are no controls for other components
    http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/video_lookup.php?cpu=GeForce+GT+330M
    A Specific and more scientific Benchmark with detailed samples of title results and synthetics, also interesting per-dollar-chart
    http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6850/1.html
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Every so often things happen that can’t be rationalized in a conventional way. People wanna know their government has a response. I am that response.”
    ― Kent Mansley (in "Iron Giant")

    For most general problems, for which you have no idea of the culprit, your first port of call should be:
    https://support.sega.co.uk/hc/en-us/categories/200307381-Total-War-Support

    If you are aware of a bug or a specific issue for which you know the cause, post in the support section for the specific title on our forums. ~Al

    https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
  • MizuBushidoMizuBushido Junior Member Posts: 28Registered Users
    edited January 2011
    In terms of aim, the 6850 is aimed above the 460 and generally performs just slightly better in benchmarks for most titles, although not all, and predictably for most cases, the overall FPS margin is really minimal- then the question is whether the price difference matters more than the performance gain. See the per-dollar value in second link (if you care about such measures)
    Hi and thanks for the help Aljabberwock.Yes , I heard that in most cases the 6850 scores higher in Benchmarks, but in some cases laggs behind the gtx460 in gameplay..hmm? No not really,the price difference is not something that would warrent my scrutiny, rather the performence of the cards.I do have one questions concerning the compatibility of the new 1155 socket(mainly the asus p8p67 pro) and the amd graphic cards. I don't know if that would be a problem?Thanks again
  • AlJabberwockAlJabberwock Moderator USAPosts: 7,729Moderators, Tech Moderators, Knights
    edited January 2011
    No there is no issue with the 1155 CPU socket boards vis a vis the AMD 6850 (or any other current card to my knowledge), was there something that suggested there was a problem?

    There IS one issue with the new 1155s, and that is that so far the Intel Spec indicates their maximum graphic support is either 1x 16 or 2x 8. So either you want it with the use of one card or be satisfied with the fact you wll be cutting each cards' maximum potential bandwidth in half by using that socket if you go Sli or CrossFire.

    EDIT: Here is a benchmark showing the 6870 vs the newest cards out- this is a test of the current elite
    http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=606&Itemid=72&limit=1&limitstart=3
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Every so often things happen that can’t be rationalized in a conventional way. People wanna know their government has a response. I am that response.”
    ― Kent Mansley (in "Iron Giant")

    For most general problems, for which you have no idea of the culprit, your first port of call should be:
    https://support.sega.co.uk/hc/en-us/categories/200307381-Total-War-Support

    If you are aware of a bug or a specific issue for which you know the cause, post in the support section for the specific title on our forums. ~Al

    https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
  • MizuBushidoMizuBushido Junior Member Posts: 28Registered Users
    edited January 2011
    No there is no issue with the 1155 CPU socket boards vis a vis the AMD 6850 (or any other current card to my knowledge), was there something that suggested there was a problem?
    Thanks for some good news, I had posted awhile ago in the "can my computer handle STW2" Thread and I had gotten a reply that there could some interference with the onboard graphics on the cpu. Considering I had posted only soon after the the new Sandybridges had come out, its understandable that there was some uncertainty.
    There IS one issue with the new 1155s, and that is that so far the Intel Spec indicates their maximum graphic support is either 1x 16 or 2x 8. So either you want it with the use of one card or be satisfied with the fact you wll be cutting each cards' maximum potential bandwidth in half by using that socket if you go Sli or CrossFire.
    Theres no worries there, I'm just going to go with a single GPU.What I've heard is that going with Sli or crossfire can sometimes hinder the cards performance,in this case it would be guarantied. As far as power supplies goe would I need a 650w or 850w if I'm only using a single card like the sapphire 6850?
    Here is a benchmark showing the 6870 vs the newest cards out- this is a test of the current elite
    Thanks I'll check this out.
  • AlJabberwockAlJabberwock Moderator USAPosts: 7,729Moderators, Tech Moderators, Knights
    edited January 2011
    I am assuming you mean this overclocked Sapphire.
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102912
    The reference-version Sapphire 6850 would if anything be less energy intensive so anything we got for the OC version would be just a slightly safer choice for the standard version.
    Note that their suggestion is that the auxilliary connectors are going to draw about 150 watts or about 12.5 amps on the 12+v rail (12+v is one of the 'flavors' some of your components need to work- if they don't get enough of the right kind, bad things will happen! ;) ). Some additional current will be drawn directly through the PCIe interface on the mobo, but overall they are only calling for a 500 watt system.
    http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6850/26.html
    Looking at this benchmark for power consumption (which is more or less paralleled in other benchmarks, although a few are a bit higher) 500 watts would probably be enough, but I would feel better if you went with a 600 or even 650 because of the new CPU and the desire for it to hang around for a while. Because PSUs decline in ability over time, you have to build in a cushion for increasing age as well as an inherent inefficiency and variations in current. 650 would be a very good cushion and given the low energy consumption profile of the 6850, even an absurd peak of something like 16 amps (unlikely) would combine with a system max draw of between 10 and 14, for a need of around 30, so with inefficiency and age of three or four years, I would probably be looking for anything with about 40 plus amps on the 12+v - a pretty easy task in the 600 to 650 range of PSUs. If you are in the US, I would look at this page on Newegg:
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007657%20600014022&IsNodeId=1&name=601W%20-%20700W

    Even the 620 watt Antec is probably way more than adequate. I would stick with Corsair, Antec, and maybe Theramaltake and Coolermaster for PSU brands. There are others, but those I know with fair regularity and low failure rates. You have a number in the $60 to $100 range - all of which would be solid overbuilds (something I would advocate in a power system).
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Every so often things happen that can’t be rationalized in a conventional way. People wanna know their government has a response. I am that response.”
    ― Kent Mansley (in "Iron Giant")

    For most general problems, for which you have no idea of the culprit, your first port of call should be:
    https://support.sega.co.uk/hc/en-us/categories/200307381-Total-War-Support

    If you are aware of a bug or a specific issue for which you know the cause, post in the support section for the specific title on our forums. ~Al

    https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
  • Herodotus3091Herodotus3091 Junior Member Posts: 5Registered Users
    edited February 2011
    Would a ATI Radeon HD 5670 1GB PCI Express Graphics preform well on Ultra?
  • GodofCatsGodofCats Member Posts: 50Registered Users
    edited February 2011
    Would a ATI Radeon HD 5670 1GB PCI Express Graphics preform well on Ultra?

    Not likely, although the HD5670 1GB is not a bad card. I'm thinking it would do well enough on mid to high settings, but even for Napoleon Total War, Ultra can be a little demanding.
  • Herodotus3091Herodotus3091 Junior Member Posts: 5Registered Users
    edited February 2011
    Which graphics card would you recommend to play on Ultra without any lag?
  • AlJabberwockAlJabberwock Moderator USAPosts: 7,729Moderators, Tech Moderators, Knights
    edited February 2011
    Please start your own thread to ask a question rather than resurrect old threads that were based on someone else's question.
    Thanks! :)

    Al
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Every so often things happen that can’t be rationalized in a conventional way. People wanna know their government has a response. I am that response.”
    ― Kent Mansley (in "Iron Giant")

    For most general problems, for which you have no idea of the culprit, your first port of call should be:
    https://support.sega.co.uk/hc/en-us/categories/200307381-Total-War-Support

    If you are aware of a bug or a specific issue for which you know the cause, post in the support section for the specific title on our forums. ~Al

    https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
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