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Lol Why Do Azure dragon force exist?

vapera29vapera29 MemberRegistered Users Posts: 80
edited August 2015 in Total War Eras Multiplayer
Why does the unit Azure dragon force even exist in multiplayer? they cost a whopping 10 koku more than a readbear (you could buy a...errrm lunch for that money) 760 to 750 koku
They have identical stats except they have a considerably lower melee stats. So they cost more and are identical to red bears but they don't know how to wield a katana. Can somebody explain to me why they exist and whether or not they have like a secret trait that I don't know about. I guess they have a better name.
Post edited by vapera29 on

Comments

  • zariptzaript Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 996
    edited May 2013
    Red bears were 800 before last patch, so Azure's were 40 koku cheaper.
  • vapera29vapera29 Member Registered Users Posts: 80
    edited May 2013
    Hmmm so Creative assembly forgot that the update would make azure useless...hmmm lol
  • William_the _ChaoticWilliam_the _Chaotic Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 413
    edited May 2013
    they have cool hats. Just ask AggonyRedWarrior
    There are benefits to being a noob. When you win, it's like Christmas all over again. It only happens once a year, and for some reason you never get sick of it.
  • TajlTajl Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 271
    edited May 2013
    They are here to help people in tournaments with max X same rules.
  • William_the _ChaoticWilliam_the _Chaotic Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 413
    edited May 2013
    Tajl wrote: »
    They are here to help people in tournaments with max X same rules.
    \

    lol A1C max 4 of a unit no limit on line, forgot about that lol.
    There are benefits to being a noob. When you win, it's like Christmas all over again. It only happens once a year, and for some reason you never get sick of it.
  • theDragonOfEchigotheDragonOfEchigo Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 27
    edited May 2013
    If you want a 150 equivalent to Red Bears as a Shogunate Clan, you can use Azure dragons.
    I'm not saying let's go kill all the stupid people. I'm just saying let's remove all the warning labels and let the problem sort itself out.

    I don't like making plans for my day because the word "premeditated" gets thrown around in the courtroom.
  • RTKMercuriusRTKMercurius Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 156
    edited May 2013
    I can conceive of a greatest conceivable dragon force.
    Such a force must exist in reality and not just in the imagination
    or it wouldn't be the greatest conceivable.
    Therefore, the Azure Dragon force exists in reality as well as the imagination.
  • The KestrelThe Kestrel Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 850
    edited May 2013
    ^^Nice ontological argument in favor of their existence.
  • bubby963bubby963 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1
    edited May 2013
    I can conceive of a greatest conceivable dragon force.
    Such a force must exist in reality and not just in the imagination
    or it wouldn't be the greatest conceivable.
    Therefore, the Azure Dragon force exists in reality as well as the imagination.

    Ahhh what a failure of an ontological argument.
    I mean if you look at the steps of an ontological argument the first step is

    1) It is possible that a maximally great (insert thing here) exists

    You can conceive that said "Azure Dragon Force" exists but that does not mean that it is possible that it exists. Also, if the Azure Dragon Force exists, it must be a maximally great being. The only way your failed attempt at mockery would work is if the following steps were your argument:

    1) It is possible that a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists
    2) If it is possible that a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists, then a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists in some possible world.
    3) If a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists in some possible world, then it exists in every possible world.
    4) If a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists in every possible world, then it exists in the actual world.
    5) If a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists in the actual world, then a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists.
    6) Therefore, a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists.

    Now your attempt is a failure because you missed out the first step
    1) It is possible that a maximally great Azure Dragon Force exists

    EVEN IF it was possible that an Azure Dragon Force existed, then it would not necessarily exist in this world as it is not maximally great. So it would have to be an Azure Dragon Force that is maximally great. So, for your argument to work all your have to do now is prove that it's possible that a maximally great Azure Dragon Force (i.e. if you can conceive anything greater than it then it won't be maximally great) exists. If you can prove that that is possible then the following points can be used to show that yes it does exist in this world. However, you provided no evidence for the first statement, in fact, you just ignored it completely. And on top of that, your statements didn't even follow the remaining steps 2-6 of the argument. Therefore your attempt at mockery just looks like another failure from a Dawkins book.

    Have a nice day
  • Ernesto_HErnesto_H Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,735
    edited May 2013
    well with last Patch this unit is useless, that all CA change cost of Bears but not of this unit.
  • SeiryūtaiSeiryūtai Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 1
    edited August 2015
    The Byakkotai (白虎隊, “White Tiger Brigade”) was one of four units, consisting of a few hundred youths, the sons of samurai, organised after the Battle of Toba-Fushimi in March 1868 by the Aizu Domain (会津藩 Aizu-han).The others were: Genbutai (Black Tortise), Seiryūtai (Azure Dragon), and Suzakutai (Vermillion Bird). Each was named after the protecting four spirits of the compass.

    The Byakkotai (West) were originally a reserve unit consisting of over 300 sons of the domain’s samurai, divided into upper (士中 shichū), middle (寄合 yoriai), and lower (足軽 ashigaru) ranks.

    The Genbutai(North) was another reserve unit consisting of some 400 troops aged over 50.

    The Seiryūtai (East) Consisted of some 900 samurai aged 36 to 49.

    Finally, the Suzakutai (South) Consisted of some 1,200 elite troops, mostly samurai aged 18 to 35.

    The Aizu clan of the Matsudaira (松平, part of the Hoshina clan 保科氏) was closely related to the Tokugawa and resisted the pro-imperial forces led by the Satsuma-Chōshū Alliance in the Boshin War. Aizu did not so much oppose the imperial restoration, but rather what it perceived to be a coup d’état by the domains of Satsuma and Chōshū.
  • GoslingGosling Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,887
    edited August 2015
    The last post before yours was over two years ago! If it's been left alone for that long, continue to leave it alone...nice necropesting
    "I'm gonna stomp 'em to dust. I'm gonna grind their bones. I'm gonna burn down dere towns and cities. I'm gonna pile 'em up inna big fire and roast 'em. I'm gonna bash heads, break faces, and jump up and down on the bits that are left.


    An' den I'm gonna get really mean."

    Grimgor Ironhide, Black Orc Warboss.
  • Mahmoud ben-ShareefMahmoud ben-Shareef Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 220
    edited August 2015
    nice history lesson tho ^^

    THIS IS CURRENTLY A DRAFT

    -in progress-

    gameplay enhancement proposals (HISTORICAL titles) that would imo improve tactical options
    that may also go well with the dogma 'easy to learn, hard to master'


    scouting and environment

    - forest less camo
    - decrease sight heavy units drastically
    - generally more slight hills
    - ponds, rivers
    - light troops move through forest, swamp much easier than main-line troops
    - formation has forest penalty
    - forest break cav charge
    - fundament set, but not utilized
    - changes would improve roster balance; light troops universal
    - most units cannot go into formation in forest

    skirmishing

    - ammunition (arena)
    - missile harrassement - applies movement penalty, morale penalty
    // expectation: skirmishers effective (can slow down rush or counter skirmishers), stacking missile fire no problem, no general sniping, catching skirmishers gets a bit harder (not necessarily bad => more zoning)

    unit balance

    - prevalence cavalry, mobile melee units
    - instead, mobile striking arm causes routs
    - a more differentiated block chance model may do wonders to the skirmishing part
    - - like; generally increased missile block for shields throughout board + slight missile damage increase + armour counting towards missile block (albeit minimally);
    - - armoured units without shield ~+ 10,
    - - armour clad units without shield ~+ 25
    - - units shielded ~+ 55-70, tower shield ~ 85 (may not stack with armor)
    - cav generally poor missile block (0-25) (except horse armor [counts towards shield])

    formations/drill

    - guard mode
    - cav repelling circle/carree/shiltron
    - shieldwall/spearwall/phalanx
    - elite, shock; flying wedge/boar snout - increase attack, drastically increase charge bonus, drastically decrease defense, stamina
    - formations crucial for main line units (sword, spear [in a tw world where non cheesy spears r viable] alike)
    - pls get rid of spaghetti lines PARTICULARLY pike spaghetti

    extensive morale

    - fear effect much greater (skirmishers easily scared due no drill perform defensive formation)
    - local superiority; stacking morale debuff
    - pronounced fear effect

    baggage encampement

    - rallying point
    - ammo refill
    - artillery target
    - eastern factions (camel baggage ammo refill)

    functionality

    - 40-units-host displayed in listing-room
    - 40-units quickmatch

    drawbacks

    - ai would have to consider some of it
    - budget (some/most features debatable whether feasable worth budget perspective)
    - may not correspond with expectations tw conformists/traditionalists

    proposals that may not b feasable but i still felt worth mentioning issues

    [+] unit pushing mechanic (reference; early stages of Arena has shown its possible)
    [+] less napoleon-esqe cuirassier cavalry engagements (much more loose spacing, charge in formation rare, pitched static melee between opposing cavalrymen rare)
    [+] perhaps wishful thinking but the game would greatly benefit from uniform unit sizes (altering sizes, altering gameplay [missiles get stronger/weaker; increased/decreased distances, et c.])


    check
    [c] reintroduction 40 units
    [c] reintroduction guard mode
    ...
    in progress

    nice to have
    [+] introduction mass system
    [+] introduction line of sight
    [+] introduction bracing mechanic
    ...
    in progress

    detriment
    [-] unit stiffness causes strange behaviour on individual soldiers on the charge as well as in protracted melee
    - - units occasionally stick out in order to keep formation like uncooked noodles instead of participating in the brawl (looking pretty is not the point of formation fighting)
    [-] second wind, ... other active abilities with poor context
    [-] pike phalanx currently broken (+ spaghetti lining) (also due to lack of pushing mechanic [reference; early stages of Arena])

    Attila changing proposals/speculation

    theres enough reason to believe that 2 handed axes + elite cavalry r so overly prevalent in this game for a reason

    hetaireia guards [+ 25]
    burgundian axemen [+ 50]
    nordic axe warriors [+ 50]
    huskarls [+ 75]
    royal huskarls [+ 75]

    nordic horse lords [+100]
    heroic cav [+ 25]
    noble horsemen [+ 50]
    noble alani cav [+ 50]
    alani mounted veterans [+ 25]
    noble germanic horsemen [+ 0]

    crossbows buff
  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USARegistered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 20,519
    edited August 2015
    Closed.
    "The two most common things in the universe are Hydrogen and Stupidity." - Harlan Ellison
    "The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously." - Hubert H. Humphrey
    "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin/Mark Twain
This discussion has been closed.