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Make War Not Love Grand Prize - Introducing... Isabella von Carstein

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  • JuiceJuice Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 75
    Canuovea said:

    For those complaining that Isabella is not a "Legendary Hero"... are you telling me that Lorewise if she came back without Vlad she wouldn't start leading an army to get his bones back and revive him? Because she totally would. She'd certainly work to become more powerful and able to do just that by any means necessary... and at the end of it I think Vlad himself would have to recognize her usefulness as a military leader (given that to get Vlad back she'd have to accomplish precisely what he could not) as well as a sidekick. As far as I'm concerned, that would make them equals... if not her his superior.

    Didn't she just give up and kill herself the second Vlad died for real? She didn't secure his remains and send out her agents in a frantic search for his ring to revive him, like the person you described would have. The only reason I could see her marching on Altdorf is for some assisted suicide in hopes that they bury her with her husband.
  • AnedonAnedon Registered Users Posts: 139
    First of I´m happy to see a new LL get announced and it´s cool we get a second female one. Also this mechanic of her and Vlad together recieving buffs is a nice idea, an idea I would love to see with other couples in the Warhammer world as well, like Tyrion and the Everqueen.

    But I´m wondering why we get another Vampire Lord, the Vampires already have 4 Lords to choose from more than any other faction at the moment. Do they really need a 5th one?

    Again I´ve no problem with Isabella being a Lord, she has lead armies during the Vampire Wars herself (although under Vlads supreme command). Making her just Vlads sidekick would be disrepectfull to the character.

    Its a cool ancouncement and I´m glad for it.
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,595
    Juice said:

    Canuovea said:

    For those complaining that Isabella is not a "Legendary Hero"... are you telling me that Lorewise if she came back without Vlad she wouldn't start leading an army to get his bones back and revive him? Because she totally would. She'd certainly work to become more powerful and able to do just that by any means necessary... and at the end of it I think Vlad himself would have to recognize her usefulness as a military leader (given that to get Vlad back she'd have to accomplish precisely what he could not) as well as a sidekick. As far as I'm concerned, that would make them equals... if not her his superior.

    Didn't she just give up and kill herself the second Vlad died for real? She didn't secure his remains and send out her agents in a frantic search for his ring to revive him, like the person you described would have. The only reason I could see her marching on Altdorf is for some assisted suicide in hopes that they bury her with her husband.
    At that point, yes, but if she knew there was a way to bring him back?
    -Forum Terms and Conditions: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
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  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,115
    I was hoping for the red duke and mousillon, so this is disappointing, but any new LL is still a good thing.

    As a long time warhammer fanatic i can say i hope we don't actually get legendary heroes, upgrading them to legendary lords makes more sense considering most of them could lead armies in the TT and their personal lore was usually more impressive than the anonymous lord characters each army could take.

    As someone mentioned earlier, unless they go for the skarsnik and gobbla route, a special ability to include two lords as a pair in one army (vlad and Isabella, kemmler and krell, etc.) Would be a perfect compromise
  • JuiceJuice Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 75
    Canuovea said:

    Juice said:

    Canuovea said:

    For those complaining that Isabella is not a "Legendary Hero"... are you telling me that Lorewise if she came back without Vlad she wouldn't start leading an army to get his bones back and revive him? Because she totally would. She'd certainly work to become more powerful and able to do just that by any means necessary... and at the end of it I think Vlad himself would have to recognize her usefulness as a military leader (given that to get Vlad back she'd have to accomplish precisely what he could not) as well as a sidekick. As far as I'm concerned, that would make them equals... if not her his superior.

    Didn't she just give up and kill herself the second Vlad died for real? She didn't secure his remains and send out her agents in a frantic search for his ring to revive him, like the person you described would have. The only reason I could see her marching on Altdorf is for some assisted suicide in hopes that they bury her with her husband.
    At that point, yes, but if she knew there was a way to bring him back?
    If Manny new about Vlad's ring, then Isabella probably did too, meaning she knew there was a way to bring him back. The point is that she didn't even try.
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,595
    Juice said:

    Canuovea said:

    Juice said:

    Canuovea said:

    For those complaining that Isabella is not a "Legendary Hero"... are you telling me that Lorewise if she came back without Vlad she wouldn't start leading an army to get his bones back and revive him? Because she totally would. She'd certainly work to become more powerful and able to do just that by any means necessary... and at the end of it I think Vlad himself would have to recognize her usefulness as a military leader (given that to get Vlad back she'd have to accomplish precisely what he could not) as well as a sidekick. As far as I'm concerned, that would make them equals... if not her his superior.

    Didn't she just give up and kill herself the second Vlad died for real? She didn't secure his remains and send out her agents in a frantic search for his ring to revive him, like the person you described would have. The only reason I could see her marching on Altdorf is for some assisted suicide in hopes that they bury her with her husband.
    At that point, yes, but if she knew there was a way to bring him back?
    If Manny new about Vlad's ring, then Isabella probably did too, meaning she knew there was a way to bring him back. The point is that she didn't even try.
    Yes, but she would have hope for actually making it work now, even if that means bypassing the ring and tossing Vlad's bones into a Black Coach for awhile. It could be assumed that the Vampire Counts seem to have gotten their hands on the ring again given that they can bring Vlad back just by raising Altdorf in the first place.

    Nevermind that the actions one takes in the throes of despair are not the same ones one might take after thinking about things logically for a while.
    -Forum Terms and Conditions: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
    -Using all caps is the equivalent of shouting. Please don't.
    -The "Spam" flag is not a "disagree" flag. Have a care.
    -...No, no the "Abuse" flag isn't a "disagree" flag either!
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  • SaphironSaphiron Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 827
    Good choice... but I was really hoping for mousillon.

    The vamps, the empire, the beastmen (why is shadowglaive not it's own start???) and chaos all need a second start position for coop and versus multiplayer, and for diversity. Green skin have 3, dwarves 2, wood elves 2.

    We definitely need some more factions to pick for the major powers. The MP only lords like todbringer and the red Duke need to be added to the campaign...

    Also the vamps have so many LLs now, but only a single faction.

  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,595
    Saphiron said:

    Good choice... but I was really hoping for mousillon.

    The vamps, the empire, the beastmen (why is shadowglaive not it's own start???) and chaos all need a second start position for coop and versus multiplayer, and for diversity. Green skin have 3, dwarves 2, wood elves 2.

    We definitely need some more factions to pick for the major powers. The MP only lords like todbringer and the red Duke need to be added to the campaign...

    Also the vamps have so many LLs now, but only a single faction.

    May still get Mousillon later with the "New Lord" FLC. I say that because this doesn't really seem too likely to replace that.
    -Forum Terms and Conditions: https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/172193/forum-terms-and-conditions#latest
    -Using all caps is the equivalent of shouting. Please don't.
    -The "Spam" flag is not a "disagree" flag. Have a care.
    -...No, no the "Abuse" flag isn't a "disagree" flag either!
    -5.7 Summon a moderator if someone seems to be out of line, or use the report button. Do NOT become another party to misbehaviour
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,460
    each beastmen LL has his own starting position... you mean that each of these factions needs it's own sub-faction
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN!"

    CA hates the Empire confirmed. The FLC LL for the new Lord Pack is Gor-Rok. Meaning the Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. And no, moving Balthasar Gelt from Reikland, where he should be, DOES NOT COUNT. If they wanted a LL in the Southern Empire: Marius Leitdorf of Averland or maybe Elspeth von Draken in Nuln...

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?

    GHAL MARAZ IS THE WEAPON OF THE SETTING! YET SOME BRETONNIAN SWORD IS MORE POTENT?! BUFF GHAL MARAZ IN SIGMAR'S NAME!
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 10,877
    Xenos7 said:

    whatever_ said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    here we go. adding females just for the sake of having females. not only were there much better choices for LL but this is fifth LL for same faction and they all start in same location.

    i feel bad for voting for tw now. forced pc is something i'm against.
    Isabella's love story with Vlad is among the most famous ones in the Warhammer universe. As we can't obviously have Tyrion and Alarielle or Malekith and Morathi yet, for a Valentine themed DLC it was just her or Ariel.
    True, and Isabella had the edge on Ariel, by the fact that she an updated model on the tabletop.
    SiWI said:

    Grace_CA said:

    krunsh said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    I feel the same way, been waiting for a female LL for too long. Though I'm a little sad to see the first female LL (Or I guess coming along with the Brets one) is one who's gameplay mechanics rely on being paired with her male vampire partner. It seems a little ironic.

    I want to use her and will use her without Vlad because he's kind of a tool.

    Bitter sweet news, but I'll take it! <3</p>
    Right - which is why it's even more sad to see people saying she shouldn't be a lord at all and should be relegated to being a hero - even if I see their point, it just strikes a different note when paired with the first female LL.

    You can totally use her without Vlad though! Yes, she gets buffs from him on the battlefield (as he does her - so really they rely on each other) but that's not essential and I think she's badass in her own right
    It's a bit of a can of worm, isn't it? Like, I'm totally stoked and happy that we get a LLL (Lady Legendary Lord(I could get used to this... <3 )) but it being Specifically Isabella doesn't really remove much of the problems since she herself is subject to many of them, specifically being defined by her relation to a male character. That being said, it would've been worse if she was a Hero since that would make her subservient to Him even from a Gameplay perspective and that would've been kinda icky on its own right.

    still, as I said, super happy that it is happening. Now to wait for the Wonder-twins... as well *hint hint*</p>
    Well you get, if you get her, her with the Fay Enchantress which if anything is relying on another women.

    Yes the Fay Enchantress would fill that role, and as we know, "it's only an problem if it's an male".
    krunsh said:

    I can't say how much it means for me (And for a few others on here) to have you openly go through with that conversation about non-male LL characters on here, @Grace_CA

    It's been a taboo topic for so long whenever we bring it up, and your input feels very validating, even knowing it is only yours and not a statement on the behalf of CA (I assume).

    Thank you.

    Yes I think that it wan nice to here @Grace_CA opinion on the matter, even though I am not fully agree with the complaints about not having enough in a war game, especially after the Wood Elves DLC, that already added plenty of female characters and units. Even now Total War: Warhammer have bigger percentage of female characters and units in it then Historical Total War Games, and Real Life Military History. I am fine with CA adding more females into the this game, but I do not expect CA to go overboard with it, if GW or CA was going overboard with it, it would had been too unrealistic, and it would was broken the suspension of disbelief for many Warhammer and Total War Players.
  • alex33alex33 Registered Users Posts: 1,094
    she is a vampire! there are billions of story ways to resurrect her. Chill out folks its not like they made something ridiculous and brought sigmar back from the dead. It's a fantasy game. She is undead. Isn't their big gimmick to return from the dead?
    Also it's free if we win. I love how people still whine about this. Like srsly that is the biggest problem? Free stuff? Wow
  • Arthas_MenethilArthas_Menethil Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 5,667
    alex33 said:

    she is a vampire! there are billions of story ways to resurrect her. Chill out folks its not like they made something ridiculous and brought sigmar back from the dead. It's a fantasy game. She is undead. Isn't their big gimmick to return from the dead?
    Also it's free if we win. I love how people still whine about this. Like srsly that is the biggest problem? Free stuff? Wow

    It's not about her being brought back it's more of another hero turned into a lord and that she can't join Vlad in a army.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • thesniperdevilthesniperdevil Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 1,929
    Ugh, after wading through this thread I feel like I need to wash...

    I'm super excited for this additional content and happy to see the liberally minded folks here standing their ground.

    I wonder what you need to do to unlock this new LL?
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 4,115
    Tayvar said:

    Xenos7 said:

    whatever_ said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    here we go. adding females just for the sake of having females. not only were there much better choices for LL but this is fifth LL for same faction and they all start in same location.

    i feel bad for voting for tw now. forced pc is something i'm against.
    Isabella's love story with Vlad is among the most famous ones in the Warhammer universe. As we can't obviously have Tyrion and Alarielle or Malekith and Morathi yet, for a Valentine themed DLC it was just her or Ariel.
    True, and Isabella had the edge on Ariel, by the fact that she an updated model on the tabletop.
    SiWI said:

    Grace_CA said:

    krunsh said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    I feel the same way, been waiting for a female LL for too long. Though I'm a little sad to see the first female LL (Or I guess coming along with the Brets one) is one who's gameplay mechanics rely on being paired with her male vampire partner. It seems a little ironic.

    I want to use her and will use her without Vlad because he's kind of a tool.

    Bitter sweet news, but I'll take it! <3</p>
    Right - which is why it's even more sad to see people saying she shouldn't be a lord at all and should be relegated to being a hero - even if I see their point, it just strikes a different note when paired with the first female LL.

    You can totally use her without Vlad though! Yes, she gets buffs from him on the battlefield (as he does her - so really they rely on each other) but that's not essential and I think she's badass in her own right
    It's a bit of a can of worm, isn't it? Like, I'm totally stoked and happy that we get a LLL (Lady Legendary Lord(I could get used to this... <3 )) but it being Specifically Isabella doesn't really remove much of the problems since she herself is subject to many of them, specifically being defined by her relation to a male character. That being said, it would've been worse if she was a Hero since that would make her subservient to Him even from a Gameplay perspective and that would've been kinda icky on its own right.

    still, as I said, super happy that it is happening. Now to wait for the Wonder-twins... as well *hint hint*</p>
    Well you get, if you get her, her with the Fay Enchantress which if anything is relying on another women.

    Yes the Fay Enchantress would fill that role, and as we know, "it's only an problem if it's an male".
    krunsh said:

    I can't say how much it means for me (And for a few others on here) to have you openly go through with that conversation about non-male LL characters on here, @Grace_CA

    It's been a taboo topic for so long whenever we bring it up, and your input feels very validating, even knowing it is only yours and not a statement on the behalf of CA (I assume).

    Thank you.

    Yes I think that it wan nice to here @Grace_CA opinion on the matter, even though I am not fully agree with the complaints about not having enough in a war game, especially after the Wood Elves DLC, that already added plenty of female characters and units. Even now Total War: Warhammer have bigger percentage of female characters and units in it then Historical Total War Games, and Real Life Military History. I am fine with CA adding more females into the this game, but I do not expect CA to go overboard with it, if GW or CA was going overboard with it, it would had been too unrealistic, and it would was broken the suspension of disbelief for many Warhammer and Total War Players.
    lol you think people who can suspend their disbelief for living dead and mad scientist rat men cant imagine female combatants, in a world where every human is completely surrounded by enemies their entire lives? Ridiculous.
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,460

    alex33 said:

    she is a vampire! there are billions of story ways to resurrect her. Chill out folks its not like they made something ridiculous and brought sigmar back from the dead. It's a fantasy game. She is undead. Isn't their big gimmick to return from the dead?
    Also it's free if we win. I love how people still whine about this. Like srsly that is the biggest problem? Free stuff? Wow

    It's not about her being brought back it's more of another hero turned into a lord and that she can't join Vlad in a army.
    imho the problem isnt that she's a lord... but mostly that we can't have Husband and Wife in the same army, especially since they buff each other... that means to make complete use of Both of them you need to always have hteir armies close to each other... and you can't even use it in skirmish (and it worries some in regards of characters such as Krell that should be "bound" to others (Kemmler i.E.) and i guess some really wouldnt like ot have characters such as Malakai Makaisson as Legendary Lord but more as a Hero... the Spirit of Grugni would be a funny mount though i guess)
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN!"

    CA hates the Empire confirmed. The FLC LL for the new Lord Pack is Gor-Rok. Meaning the Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. And no, moving Balthasar Gelt from Reikland, where he should be, DOES NOT COUNT. If they wanted a LL in the Southern Empire: Marius Leitdorf of Averland or maybe Elspeth von Draken in Nuln...

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?

    GHAL MARAZ IS THE WEAPON OF THE SETTING! YET SOME BRETONNIAN SWORD IS MORE POTENT?! BUFF GHAL MARAZ IN SIGMAR'S NAME!
  • TayvarTayvar Registered Users Posts: 10,877

    Tayvar said:

    Xenos7 said:

    whatever_ said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    here we go. adding females just for the sake of having females. not only were there much better choices for LL but this is fifth LL for same faction and they all start in same location.

    i feel bad for voting for tw now. forced pc is something i'm against.
    Isabella's love story with Vlad is among the most famous ones in the Warhammer universe. As we can't obviously have Tyrion and Alarielle or Malekith and Morathi yet, for a Valentine themed DLC it was just her or Ariel.
    True, and Isabella had the edge on Ariel, by the fact that she an updated model on the tabletop.
    SiWI said:

    Grace_CA said:

    krunsh said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    I feel the same way, been waiting for a female LL for too long. Though I'm a little sad to see the first female LL (Or I guess coming along with the Brets one) is one who's gameplay mechanics rely on being paired with her male vampire partner. It seems a little ironic.

    I want to use her and will use her without Vlad because he's kind of a tool.

    Bitter sweet news, but I'll take it! <3</p>
    Right - which is why it's even more sad to see people saying she shouldn't be a lord at all and should be relegated to being a hero - even if I see their point, it just strikes a different note when paired with the first female LL.

    You can totally use her without Vlad though! Yes, she gets buffs from him on the battlefield (as he does her - so really they rely on each other) but that's not essential and I think she's badass in her own right
    It's a bit of a can of worm, isn't it? Like, I'm totally stoked and happy that we get a LLL (Lady Legendary Lord(I could get used to this... <3 )) but it being Specifically Isabella doesn't really remove much of the problems since she herself is subject to many of them, specifically being defined by her relation to a male character. That being said, it would've been worse if she was a Hero since that would make her subservient to Him even from a Gameplay perspective and that would've been kinda icky on its own right.

    still, as I said, super happy that it is happening. Now to wait for the Wonder-twins... as well *hint hint*</p>
    Well you get, if you get her, her with the Fay Enchantress which if anything is relying on another women.

    Yes the Fay Enchantress would fill that role, and as we know, "it's only an problem if it's an male".
    krunsh said:

    I can't say how much it means for me (And for a few others on here) to have you openly go through with that conversation about non-male LL characters on here, @Grace_CA

    It's been a taboo topic for so long whenever we bring it up, and your input feels very validating, even knowing it is only yours and not a statement on the behalf of CA (I assume).

    Thank you.

    Yes I think that it wan nice to here @Grace_CA opinion on the matter, even though I am not fully agree with the complaints about not having enough in a war game, especially after the Wood Elves DLC, that already added plenty of female characters and units. Even now Total War: Warhammer have bigger percentage of female characters and units in it then Historical Total War Games, and Real Life Military History. I am fine with CA adding more females into the this game, but I do not expect CA to go overboard with it, if GW or CA was going overboard with it, it would had been too unrealistic, and it would was broken the suspension of disbelief for many Warhammer and Total War Players.
    lol you think people who can suspend their disbelief for living dead and mad scientist rat men cant imagine female combatants, in a world where every human is completely surrounded by enemies their entire lives? Ridiculous.
    Yes, mad scientist rats still make more sense to me then full/half army of females in any race.
  • Arthas_MenethilArthas_Menethil Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 5,667

    alex33 said:

    she is a vampire! there are billions of story ways to resurrect her. Chill out folks its not like they made something ridiculous and brought sigmar back from the dead. It's a fantasy game. She is undead. Isn't their big gimmick to return from the dead?
    Also it's free if we win. I love how people still whine about this. Like srsly that is the biggest problem? Free stuff? Wow

    It's not about her being brought back it's more of another hero turned into a lord and that she can't join Vlad in a army.
    imho the problem isnt that she's a lord... but mostly that we can't have Husband and Wife in the same army, especially since they buff each other... that means to make complete use of Both of them you need to always have hteir armies close to each other... and you can't even use it in skirmish (and it worries some in regards of characters such as Krell that should be "bound" to others (Kemmler i.E.) and i guess some really wouldnt like ot have characters such as Malakai Makaisson as Legendary Lord but more as a Hero... the Spirit of Grugni would be a funny mount though i guess)
    Yeah in TT you could have Isabella and Vlad together but TWW nope just got to catch campaign AI or be silly outnumbered.
    So...the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived. Shall I lay down Frostmourne and throw myself at your mercy, Fordring?

  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,460
    Tayvar said:

    Tayvar said:

    Xenos7 said:

    whatever_ said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    here we go. adding females just for the sake of having females. not only were there much better choices for LL but this is fifth LL for same faction and they all start in same location.

    i feel bad for voting for tw now. forced pc is something i'm against.
    Isabella's love story with Vlad is among the most famous ones in the Warhammer universe. As we can't obviously have Tyrion and Alarielle or Malekith and Morathi yet, for a Valentine themed DLC it was just her or Ariel.
    True, and Isabella had the edge on Ariel, by the fact that she an updated model on the tabletop.
    SiWI said:

    Grace_CA said:

    krunsh said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    I feel the same way, been waiting for a female LL for too long. Though I'm a little sad to see the first female LL (Or I guess coming along with the Brets one) is one who's gameplay mechanics rely on being paired with her male vampire partner. It seems a little ironic.

    I want to use her and will use her without Vlad because he's kind of a tool.

    Bitter sweet news, but I'll take it! <3</p>
    Right - which is why it's even more sad to see people saying she shouldn't be a lord at all and should be relegated to being a hero - even if I see their point, it just strikes a different note when paired with the first female LL.

    You can totally use her without Vlad though! Yes, she gets buffs from him on the battlefield (as he does her - so really they rely on each other) but that's not essential and I think she's badass in her own right
    It's a bit of a can of worm, isn't it? Like, I'm totally stoked and happy that we get a LLL (Lady Legendary Lord(I could get used to this... <3 )) but it being Specifically Isabella doesn't really remove much of the problems since she herself is subject to many of them, specifically being defined by her relation to a male character. That being said, it would've been worse if she was a Hero since that would make her subservient to Him even from a Gameplay perspective and that would've been kinda icky on its own right.

    still, as I said, super happy that it is happening. Now to wait for the Wonder-twins... as well *hint hint*</p>
    Well you get, if you get her, her with the Fay Enchantress which if anything is relying on another women.

    Yes the Fay Enchantress would fill that role, and as we know, "it's only an problem if it's an male".
    krunsh said:

    I can't say how much it means for me (And for a few others on here) to have you openly go through with that conversation about non-male LL characters on here, @Grace_CA

    It's been a taboo topic for so long whenever we bring it up, and your input feels very validating, even knowing it is only yours and not a statement on the behalf of CA (I assume).

    Thank you.

    Yes I think that it wan nice to here @Grace_CA opinion on the matter, even though I am not fully agree with the complaints about not having enough in a war game, especially after the Wood Elves DLC, that already added plenty of female characters and units. Even now Total War: Warhammer have bigger percentage of female characters and units in it then Historical Total War Games, and Real Life Military History. I am fine with CA adding more females into the this game, but I do not expect CA to go overboard with it, if GW or CA was going overboard with it, it would had been too unrealistic, and it would was broken the suspension of disbelief for many Warhammer and Total War Players.
    lol you think people who can suspend their disbelief for living dead and mad scientist rat men cant imagine female combatants, in a world where every human is completely surrounded by enemies their entire lives? Ridiculous.
    Yes, mad scientist rats still make more sense to me then full/half army of females in any race.
    even the Amazonians?
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN!"

    CA hates the Empire confirmed. The FLC LL for the new Lord Pack is Gor-Rok. Meaning the Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. And no, moving Balthasar Gelt from Reikland, where he should be, DOES NOT COUNT. If they wanted a LL in the Southern Empire: Marius Leitdorf of Averland or maybe Elspeth von Draken in Nuln...

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?

    GHAL MARAZ IS THE WEAPON OF THE SETTING! YET SOME BRETONNIAN SWORD IS MORE POTENT?! BUFF GHAL MARAZ IN SIGMAR'S NAME!
  • SnikitSnikit Registered Users Posts: 233
    Tayvar said:

    Tayvar said:

    Xenos7 said:

    whatever_ said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    here we go. adding females just for the sake of having females. not only were there much better choices for LL but this is fifth LL for same faction and they all start in same location.

    i feel bad for voting for tw now. forced pc is something i'm against.
    Isabella's love story with Vlad is among the most famous ones in the Warhammer universe. As we can't obviously have Tyrion and Alarielle or Malekith and Morathi yet, for a Valentine themed DLC it was just her or Ariel.
    True, and Isabella had the edge on Ariel, by the fact that she an updated model on the tabletop.
    SiWI said:

    Grace_CA said:

    krunsh said:

    Grace_CA said:

    Bit surprised at everyone complaining she's not a hero/doesn't exist simply to reinforce Vlad. There are 20 male Legendary Lords to choose from and no one has ever complained about them not being heroes, but I for one am really excited to have a female Legendary Lord who can lead an army and isn't relegated to being a second in command. Isabella is bad-ass and I can't wait to play as her!

    I feel the same way, been waiting for a female LL for too long. Though I'm a little sad to see the first female LL (Or I guess coming along with the Brets one) is one who's gameplay mechanics rely on being paired with her male vampire partner. It seems a little ironic.

    I want to use her and will use her without Vlad because he's kind of a tool.

    Bitter sweet news, but I'll take it! <3</p>
    Right - which is why it's even more sad to see people saying she shouldn't be a lord at all and should be relegated to being a hero - even if I see their point, it just strikes a different note when paired with the first female LL.

    You can totally use her without Vlad though! Yes, she gets buffs from him on the battlefield (as he does her - so really they rely on each other) but that's not essential and I think she's badass in her own right
    It's a bit of a can of worm, isn't it? Like, I'm totally stoked and happy that we get a LLL (Lady Legendary Lord(I could get used to this... <3 )) but it being Specifically Isabella doesn't really remove much of the problems since she herself is subject to many of them, specifically being defined by her relation to a male character. That being said, it would've been worse if she was a Hero since that would make her subservient to Him even from a Gameplay perspective and that would've been kinda icky on its own right.

    still, as I said, super happy that it is happening. Now to wait for the Wonder-twins... as well *hint hint*</p>
    Well you get, if you get her, her with the Fay Enchantress which if anything is relying on another women.

    Yes the Fay Enchantress would fill that role, and as we know, "it's only an problem if it's an male".
    krunsh said:

    I can't say how much it means for me (And for a few others on here) to have you openly go through with that conversation about non-male LL characters on here, @Grace_CA

    It's been a taboo topic for so long whenever we bring it up, and your input feels very validating, even knowing it is only yours and not a statement on the behalf of CA (I assume).

    Thank you.

    Yes I think that it wan nice to here @Grace_CA opinion on the matter, even though I am not fully agree with the complaints about not having enough in a war game, especially after the Wood Elves DLC, that already added plenty of female characters and units. Even now Total War: Warhammer have bigger percentage of female characters and units in it then Historical Total War Games, and Real Life Military History. I am fine with CA adding more females into the this game, but I do not expect CA to go overboard with it, if GW or CA was going overboard with it, it would had been too unrealistic, and it would was broken the suspension of disbelief for many Warhammer and Total War Players.
    lol you think people who can suspend their disbelief for living dead and mad scientist rat men cant imagine female combatants, in a world where every human is completely surrounded by enemies their entire lives? Ridiculous.
    Yes, mad scientist rats still make more sense to me then full/half army of females in any race.
    No Amazonians for you then. More to the point: WTF?
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  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,584
    edited February 2017

    I see reality. You on the other hand use arguments as You see fit. Sometimes You refer to "8th edition" for absolutely no reason, and then the next line You deny that CA promised to bring us all 8th edition armybook content. You're killing Your own arguments faster, then I can... Thanks for that, You humiliate Yourself without my assistance...

    Sorry mate but you prove once again incompetence.
    I argue that the 8th has the highest priority and CA action proves this once more, that they rather promoted a hero, then take one of your beloved background characters.
    If you take the count you will find very few things, announced or already in the game, who aren't 8th. All the LL who are in the game right now, are.
    Only Bretonnia seems to be a exception, but considering that they got the oldest armybook, it maybe not that surprising.

    Once again, mister "win by every mean necessary", doesn't include actual reading or reason.


    And You just killed Your another argument. In Warhammer world there are vampire factions beyond Sylvania, and actually only Vlad, Mannfred and Konrad ever had the ambitions of ruling the Empire. Vampire Counts faction in general consists of: Von Carsteins, Lahmians, Strigois, Necrarch, Blood Dragons and entire lore is build around those bloodlines, not just Carsteins. So decide: You want actual definition of word "count" which implies basically all nobility, or do You want reference from Warhammer World in which case Vampire Counts is a term refering to all mortarch families?


    Doesn't change the fact, that the race is cleary design as "the Van Carstein race" in the TT, and hence here.
    Otherwise they would have gotten, simliar to wild orcs or goblins, they own named characters.
    The fact that they doesn't tells you are alot of the importance of the other bloodlines,
    SiWI said:

    Sure if you want to put yourself up for disappointment, sure do that, let me prepare my popcorn...

    Sooo... In case we get any non-Carstein LL's or units ever (not that we only got some for Strigoi and Blood Dragon bloodlines anyway so I'm already right) and You choke with popcorn, can I have those last moments of Yours on tape?


    Considering that the units you named as "none carstein", are armybook units (who happily serve the Van Carsteins) and nothing else, no I won't choke. Sorry but your death wishes will be left unfulfilled.


    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • mw51630mw51630 Member Registered Users Posts: 1,593
    @Grace_CA
    Is Isabella the LL teased from the FLC schedule? Or is Isabella technically DLC because we need to win her freedom?
  • Lord_HenkusLord_Henkus Registered Users Posts: 1,475
    Haha, I feast upon the rage and tears of all those kids in this discussion. I love it.

    Anyway, I absolutely love this FLC. Thanks CA!
    How negative I may sound, game is stil 11 out of 10

    Also, please slow down combat!




  • Lord_XelosLord_Xelos Registered Users Posts: 1,806
    edited February 2017
    SiWI said:


    I argue that the 8th has the highest priority and CA action proves this once more, that they rather promoted a hero, then take one of your beloved background characters.
    If you take the count you will find very few things, announced or already in the game, who aren't 8th. All the LL who are in the game right now, are.
    Only Bretonnia seems to be a exception, but considering that they got the oldest armybook, it maybe not that surprising.

    Yeah "only" Brettonia... And "only" Grombrindal... And "only" Gorst from some "nobody cares about" forgotten book that is nowhere near close to actual faction armybook... Not to mention 9999 non-character things that are nowhere near 8th edition or accepted lore (like Brettonia and Estalia being smaller then Empire, lol)... And You have guts to say CA takes everything from 8th edition only? You are so ridiculous that it's no longer funny. Disgusting ignorance comes to mind as a way to describe Your statements.

    Btw. You only used word "priority" now so it doesn't count. So far You argued about Carsteins being one and only vampire family used in 8th Edition. Using words such as "priority" suggest You're giving up already by opening a door to get out of loss securely. And I'm not letting You out so easily.
    SiWI said:

    Doesn't change the fact, that the race is cleary design as "the Van Carstein race" in the TT, and hence here. Otherwise they would have gotten, simliar to wild orcs or goblins, they own named characters. The fact that they doesn't tells you are alot of the importance of the other bloodlines,

    VC design being a Von Carstein design is not a fact but an opinion. Opinion based on Your impression not facts. If You had at least as much knowledge You claim to have You'd know that there are already 8th Edition rules published for Neferata for example.
    SiWI said:


    Considering that the units you named as "none carstein", are armybook units (who happily serve the Van Carsteins) and nothing else, no I won't choke. Sorry but your death wishes will be left unfulfilled.

    Oh, I have time. Almost as much time as CA have to implement different bloodlines... Oh wait, I forgot about Red Duke. That kinda finishes You off. K.O. nice knowing You... not!
  • SiWISiWI Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,584
    edited February 2017

    SiWI said:


    I argue that the 8th has the highest priority and CA action proves this once more, that they rather promoted a hero, then take one of your beloved background characters.
    If you take the count you will find very few things, announced or already in the game, who aren't 8th. All the LL who are in the game right now, are.
    Only Bretonnia seems to be a exception, but considering that they got the oldest armybook, it maybe not that surprising.

    Yeah "only" Brettonia... And "only" Grombrindal... And "only" Gorst from some "nobody cares about" forgotten book that is nowhere near close to actual faction armybook... Not to mention 9999 non-character things that are nowhere near 8th edition or accepted lore (like Brettonia and Estalia being smaller then Empire, lol)... And You have guts to say CA takes everything from 8th edition only? You are so ridiculous that it's no longer funny. Disgusting ignorance comes to mind as a way to describe Your statements.
    Grombrindal is THE WHITE DWARF, enough said.
    Bretonnia armybook will be finish by CA with one go, hence the oppurtnity to take stuff which isn't in that armybook.
    Ghorst is, no matter if you care or not, from a 8th edition campaign book.

    Why the sizes of the countries have anything to do with the units/lords/heroes being base on the 8th, will be your own little mystery.


    VC design being a Von Carstein design is not a fact but an opinion. Opinion based on Your impression not facts. If You had at least as much knowledge You claim to have You'd know that there are already 8th Edition rules published for Neferata for example.

    Nope.
    the Vampire Counts, are the Van Carnstein race.
    Otherwise they would have named characters that are from the other blood lines. This is not a opinion, but a fact you apparently have problem with adjusting with.

    Neferatas "8th" rules don't happen to be the once where you see the big fat "THE END TIMES" on it?
    That is even a different sub IP as the standard Warhammer.

    SiWI said:


    Considering that the units you named as "none carstein", are armybook units (who happily serve the Van Carsteins) and nothing else, no I won't choke. Sorry but your death wishes will be left unfulfilled.

    Oh, I have time. Almost as much time as CA have to implement different bloodlines... Oh wait, I forgot about Red Duke. That kinda finishes You off. K.O. nice knowing You... not!


    Considering that you still think in "tapes" you time will probably run out before mine...
    And the Red Duke is nothing but a skirmish characters.
    Base the announcement for Isabella, he probably will stay this way.

    I will happily eat my popcorn when CA announces the next LP featuring VC.
    Ratling_Guns.gif?t=1554385892
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Registered Users, Moderators Posts: 13,595
    Ghorst is 8th edition, he's from a supplement. Which is pretty sad, when you think about it. They'd rather go with a hero from an 8th edition supplement who was arguably worse than an actual necromancer on the actual Table Top.

    Brettonia in my mind still counts as 8th because that army book was used in 8th edition, despite being older. It would have been replaced, but alas...

    And it doesn't make sense to bring non-character things into a discussion about character things. Fact is, for the most part, CA have stuck to using 8th edition as their inspiration for characters and armies. Not exclusively, but heavily. That is changing, and I'm fine with that, but lets not kid ourselves about the current reality.


    8th Edition Vampire Count Army book was disappointingly focused on the VonCartseins. I could have sworn that, for instance, Neferata was on that list, so I went and checked and... nope. In fact, Kemmler was basically the only named Lord there who wasn't, if I recall correctly, plus a few heroes. Thankfully other rules were published elsewhere, but the fact remains the blokes in Sylvannia are very very Carsteiny and I wouldn't expect Neferata until Tomb Kings.


    The Red Duke is great. I'm hoping we get him and a new starting position. It is one of the positive ways that CA has moved away from 8th edition. He is not playable yet, but I hope he ends up that way soon! And at least his start position already exists. Interestingly enough, I'm pretty sure he also "should" be "dead".
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  • alex33alex33 Registered Users Posts: 1,094
    edited February 2017
    This is why can't have nice things. I made a pause from the forums here after the wood elves. I think i will need this again now
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,460
    Canuovea said:

    Interestingly enough, I'm pretty sure he also "should" be "dead".

    i think he made a return durin the Times that shall not be named... here from the Warhammer lexicanum
    "End Times

    Rumours of his continued existence persisted for many centuries but the last confirmed sighting was towards the closing days of the End Times. When Duke Jerrod, leader of the Bretonnian contingent at the Council of Incarnates was exposed to a horrific truth about the Lady of the Lake he was determined to take his troops and marched back into the ruined and devastated remains of Bretonnia to see-out the end of the world there. The vampire count Vlad von Carstein told Jerrod that a small group of warriors, led by Gilles le Breton and an immortal warrior implied to be Abhorash, still fought in Bretonnia. He sent the Red Duke to act as a guide and escort Jerrod's knights to the abbey where they were making their great last stand. "
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN!"

    CA hates the Empire confirmed. The FLC LL for the new Lord Pack is Gor-Rok. Meaning the Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. And no, moving Balthasar Gelt from Reikland, where he should be, DOES NOT COUNT. If they wanted a LL in the Southern Empire: Marius Leitdorf of Averland or maybe Elspeth von Draken in Nuln...

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?

    GHAL MARAZ IS THE WEAPON OF THE SETTING! YET SOME BRETONNIAN SWORD IS MORE POTENT?! BUFF GHAL MARAZ IN SIGMAR'S NAME!
  • Lord_XelosLord_Xelos Registered Users Posts: 1,806
    a) Skirmish or not Red Duke is in the game.
    b) There is no "enough said". Grombrindal isn't represented in 8th edition rules so, end of story. You can't pick Your data selectively, take it all or leave.
    c) End Times are part of 8th Edition whether You like it or not. By terms understandable to video-game-player it is an expansion to Warhammer Fantasy Battle 8 game. Probably the same way Your little Ghorst campaign book is an expansion... Take both or leave both, Your choice...
    d) Sizes of the countries have a lot to do with the subject. If they did change something away from the 8th Edition established lore then they can do the same with anything else, which they do.
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Registered Users Posts: 7,465
    An unexpected choice of character but I am quite happy it was her. Though I suspect I would have liked just about any named character. Just hope we get her either at the end of MWNL or soon afterwards in a DLC because I'd love to have her in my VC campaign as I have yet to finish an campaign play through with the VC and I am ready to ditch my 200 turn campaign progress on Very Hard just because it has been too long since I actually played it and I feel no connection to it anymore.
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  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 10,460
    d) isnt the Empire the largest Human faction in lore?
    Every wrong is recorded. Every slight against us, page after page, ETCHED IN BLOOD! Clan Gunnisson! Karak Eight Peaks! JOSEF BUGMAN!"

    CA hates the Empire confirmed. The FLC LL for the new Lord Pack is Gor-Rok. Meaning the Empire still hasn't gotten their FLC LL. And no, moving Balthasar Gelt from Reikland, where he should be, DOES NOT COUNT. If they wanted a LL in the Southern Empire: Marius Leitdorf of Averland or maybe Elspeth von Draken in Nuln...

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?

    GHAL MARAZ IS THE WEAPON OF THE SETTING! YET SOME BRETONNIAN SWORD IS MORE POTENT?! BUFF GHAL MARAZ IN SIGMAR'S NAME!
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