Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Why is the TT Warhammer so expensive?

lucibuislucibuis Posts: 1,599Registered Users
TWW1: around 110-120 $ you get everything

TTW Age of Sigmar: army book 50$, 60$ hard cover, 3 kurnoth hunters 70$

What the hell?
«1

Comments

  • GingerRoeBroGingerRoeBro Senior Member Posts: 1,364Registered Users
    They're collecting on them Charlamanges bro :smiley:
    They need more milk for the khorne flakes.
    Shortly, they need dat cash money dough bro.
  • lucibuislucibuis Posts: 1,599Registered Users

    They're collecting on them Charlamanges bro :smiley:
    They need more milk for the khorne flakes.
    Shortly, they need dat cash money dough bro.

    who in their right mind would spend 1k dollars for a full army?
  • NemoxNemox Posts: 1,223Registered Users
    Yup, GW, bleeding the pockets of its fan base for years. There are even guides on how to save a lot of money by buying cheaper models and just converting.

    This has also led to people being very attached to their races because after spending so much money and time on them, you want them to be damn near perfect in Total War Warhammer etc.

    Don't blame them really.
  • GingerRoeBroGingerRoeBro Senior Member Posts: 1,364Registered Users
    lucibuis said:

    They're collecting on them Charlamanges bro :smiley:
    They need more milk for the khorne flakes.
    Shortly, they need dat cash money dough bro.

    who in their right mind would spend 1k dollars for a full army?
    Truefully said. It's why I definitely don't miss trying to find replacement beastmen or Chaos people. I love Skaven too but they cost sooo dang much cause of their higher model count :disappointed:
  • GingerRoeBroGingerRoeBro Senior Member Posts: 1,364Registered Users
    Nemox said:

    Yup, GW, bleeding the pockets of its fan base for years. There are even guides on how to save a lot of money by buying cheaper models and just converting.

    This has also led to people being very attached to their races because after spending so much money and time on them, you want them to be damn near perfect in Total War Warhammer etc.

    Don't blame them really.

    Even with the money, I wanted to cry trying to finally perfect painting them lol. Ain't nothing like screwing up the shield on your Chaos warrior model wanting a Nurgle/Khorne themed army :heartbreak:
  • Lord_NathanaelLord_Nathanael Posts: 1,412Registered Users
    well its a british table top game with a lot of tradition by now, and like all traditional british games, they are designed to be played by the upper anglo-saxon class, using a monocle and a cup of earl grey.

    no really, its just a failed attempt of money grabbing, GW makes a considerable amount of cash by selling their various licences. I have the personal believe, that AOS is an attempt to make another famous IP. focusing on unavailabillity to the masses, so they buy the "alternatives" provided by GWs partners later

  • PhilBowlesPhilBowles Senior Member Posts: 1,215Registered Users
    Warhammer Fantasy doesn't exist any more, which saves a lot of money...

    Seriously it's not a hobby to recommend to anyone new, as opposed to returning. I just started playing 40k 8th Edition, but only after I discovered I had a full infantry army I'd accumulated well over a decade ago in storage. Updating with a new rulebook and starter collection is a little over $160, but that's a reasonable enough investment for a game that can last 10 years with little need for maintenance or update from that point forward.

    Be thankful you weren't playing in GW's commercial 'golden age' - they churned out full model ranges and army books, complete with the latest often overpowered new unit types (so couldn't be represented with older figures), and on occasion new or fully revamped armies - at a rate of 4 a year (two per game system they then supported).

    They appear to have settled down a lot; coming back to the Eldar there have been only 5 new kits in a decade (four editions of 40k), two of them for the oldest models in the range (and which genuinely needed an update), and only about 4 new unit types. All my units' equipment options remain current. Better yet, vehicle kit prices have only increased in the order of 5 pounds over that period.

    A couple of hundred dollars outlay every few years for something you can play as often as you like until they eventually destroy the 40k universe as they did the Warhammer one seems moderately reasonable - by the time the full DLCs and trilogy are complete for TW Warhammer you'll have spent more than that.
  • psychoakpsychoak Posts: 644Registered Users
    Part of that is the joy of low volume. Costs are very very high when you're printing books in small numbers and shipping them all over the world.

    Games Workshop is the Dell of TT gaming. The titan of the industry gets delusions of grandeur and opens stores all over the place, exclusively selling their own products, and goes tits up in short order because, surprise! No one can afford to bankroll their stores for them when they can't actually turn a profit. :)

    Instead of getting a clue and getting rid of their stores, going back to just selling their models where everyone else did, in hobby shops, duh, they dug in tooth and nail. It would have been massively cheaper to organize gaming events in third party shops.

    They've effectively been in a death spiral game wise, continually slighting and shrinking their customer base in a market already being largely replaced by video games. On the other hand, Total War: Warhammer is largely responsible for their stock almost tripling since it's release. :) The massive influx of interest due to successful video games has given them a huge boost to sales, along with doubling their royalties, and they've been gutting those idiotic stores to reduce their horrendous expenditures over the last few years. If they hadn't suicided fantasy just before releasing a hugely successful translation of the TT game, they'd probably be doing even better. Brilliant timing that, but then they space marined the crap out of everything because they never figured out space marine sales were so good because Dawn of War rocked the RTS market and idiots all over creation got a woody for a non-existent chapter. :)

    Their margins aren't actually very good, TT wise. Thanks to huge costs, they barely make a profit most years before royalties from video game sales get factored in, and that's with people just buying models to paint for fun.
  • wingren013wingren013 Posts: 723Registered Users
    Its a specialty product (low demand) that is also somewhat expensive and slow to produce.

    Its supply and emand in action.
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Posts: 590Registered Users
    Um, that "TT sales are doing bad and TWW is the driving source of GW income" is extremely wrong.

    TWW is doing amazing but it and the other royalties are only 1/6th of GW's profit and their TT sales having been skyrocketing of late:

    http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/01/gw-2016-17-half-year-financials.html

    Tabletop's expensive because you're paying for the machinery not just the mold costs. That's why despite it's kickstarters getting millions instantly the Dark Souls boardgame is $150 and alternative model companies or even just small businesses have to charge around $10 a plastic model.

    "Plastic moulds from the bigger toy firms cost between 5000£ and 15000£, not counting maintanence. Plus they need to be changed every three to six months, depending on useage.
    And thats not even counting the injection machine. Its just the molds."

    So yeah, niche hobby that's expensive to keep up with means high cost products.

    GW is selling things cheaper though and making amazing bundle deals like their Start collecting sets, Skirmish packs and Silver Tower hero packs. They've really been working on that entry barrier which is why they're doing so great.
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Posts: 590Registered Users
    My friend made a great thread showing their products and the deals and discounts they're doing.

    http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php/topic,51347.0.html
  • daelin4daelin4 Senior Member Posts: 13,947Registered Users
    They're expensive because you're not patient for sales price and bundling.

    Corrected action is the most sincere form of apology.
  • rhinoinsomniacrhinoinsomniac Member Posts: 950Registered Users
    @BaronKlatz - to be fair - yeh ignored the part psychloak said about them putting their stores all over the place and limiting their products in third party hobby shops - i can still get their products in hobby shops but i'm pretty sure they always have the exact same price as GW on their store website - didnt used to be that way

    i don't know how much that contributed - prolly not much - but it does show a bit of arrogance imo



    honey will catch more flies than vinegar

    Team Lizardmen


  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Posts: 590Registered Users
    Yeah sorry, talking on my phone and it's almost out of power along with me being without a recharge source right now so I'll have to address that in detail later.

    For right now, the GW stores are great because some places don't have other areas to play at or hobby stores at all which make them a godsend and GW only scaled back during Kirby's period as CEO. Now they're opening more up and expanding their business.

    I heard something positive about the third party thing recently but I'll have to get back to you on that.

    Only 5% power left. :P
  • Blood_DragonBlood_Dragon Senior Member Posts: 815Registered Users
    edited July 17

    "Victory or death, there is no other outcome. Honour is everything. I am a knight of the Ordo Draconis, and I will achieve perfection."
  • RowYerboatRowYerboat Junior Member Posts: 817Registered Users
    lucibuis said:

    They're collecting on them Charlamanges bro :smiley:
    They need more milk for the khorne flakes.
    Shortly, they need dat cash money dough bro.

    who in their right mind would spend 1k dollars for a full army?
    There are people out there who spend multiple thousands on freaking Hearthstone, so....yeah.
  • CanuoveaCanuovea Posts: 6,540Registered Users
    You can get a starting army for AoS for about $100. But then you need the paints, the glue, etc etc. Its a different medium, and an expensive one at that.

    Though... that isn't to say GW doesn't hike the prices.
  • SindrissSindriss Posts: 263Registered Users
    GW better prepare themselves for a changing industry. In the near future 3d printers will be cheap enough and able to churn out minis that are just as good as sculpts. People will share their custom 3d models online and the market for minis will vanish.
  • Mr_Finley7Mr_Finley7 Junior Member Posts: 2,600Registered Users
    Its because GW is a soulless, greedy, penny smart dollar stupid type of company.

    Its been my dream since I was 14 that GW would go under and pass WHFB and 40k to more capable hands.
  • Blood_DragonBlood_Dragon Senior Member Posts: 815Registered Users
    Sindriss said:

    GW better prepare themselves for a changing industry. In the near future 3d printers will be cheap enough and able to churn out minis that are just as good as sculpts. People will share their custom 3d models online and the market for minis will vanish.

    If you think the arch-capitalists of the world will allow this, or not find some way to make LOADSAMONEY off it, you are, unfortunately, probably mistaken.

    "Victory or death, there is no other outcome. Honour is everything. I am a knight of the Ordo Draconis, and I will achieve perfection."
  • PatriksevePatrikseve Member Posts: 1,044Registered Users
    edited July 17
    Its a reason why im so inlove with Total War: Warhammer because its so cheap in comparrission I think if I calculated correctly you will still save money by buying all dlc, + trilogy compared to a medium-high cost army from the tt unless you took shortcuts and do as others suggested use alternatives and such. Now with that in mind I think its demand/supply and that they have become more or less collectors items aswell since the fantasy setting has been uppdated to age of sigmar. But I wanted to play the tt but lacked the deep pockets to do so properly and felt that this game was godsent I do miss a painter within the game. But im sort of hoping they will create an army painter for game 3 custom games. I do understand they might not for campaign and thats fair. But for custom games I think game 3 might at some point come with that and it might make it all even more aligned with the great stuff about the tt. Painting your own unique army and saving it... abit like the Dow games do.

    On topic If I had money for the tt I would def... try to assemble a vampire count or high elven army.

    I found this on a site its an average estimate from 2012 so things might have changed and it might not be fully accurate but I think its close but I could be wrong maybe someone has better knowledge on pricepoints than this person:
    "High Elves ~ $342.08 (316.25 with bits)
    Brettonians ~ $363.67
    Wood Elves ~ $391.00
    Tomb Kings ~ $401.58
    Lizardmen ~ $412.92
    Ogre Kingdoms ~ $420.00
    Dwarves ~ $421.25
    Beastmen ~ $428.17
    Dark Elves ~ $451.67
    Vampire Counts ~ $465.25
    The Empire ~ $498.33
    Skaven ~ $603.67 (539.50 with bits)
    Orcs & Goblins ~ $684.67"

    http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?331180-The-Average-Cost-of-Armies

  • PatriksevePatrikseve Member Posts: 1,044Registered Users
    This is the costst from a 2012 post that calculated an average I cant say if its accurate or not but it does look pricey. A reason why I love total war warhammer might save some money trough buying the games and dlc instead of an army. But on the other hand you miss the painting of them and reading the manualls and playing a tt game. :)

    "So here’s the list from cheapest to most expensive:
    Daemons of Chaos ~ $329.38
    Warriors of Chaos ~ $333.25
    High Elves ~ $342.08 (316.25 with bits)
    Brettonians ~ $363.67
    Wood Elves ~ $391.00
    Tomb Kings ~ $401.58
    Lizardmen ~ $412.92
    Ogre Kingdoms ~ $420.00
    Dwarves ~ $421.25
    Beastmen ~ $428.17
    Dark Elves ~ $451.67
    Vampire Counts ~ $465.25
    The Empire ~ $498.33
    Skaven ~ $603.67 (539.50 with bits)
    Orcs & Goblins ~ $684.67"

    http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?331180-The-Average-Cost-of-Armies

  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Posts: 1,245Registered Users
    edited July 17
    I have probably spent at least $10,000 on Warhammer models, magazines and books. Dwarfs, Slayers of Karak Kadrin, Tomb Kings, Chaos Dwarfs, Empire, Blood Angels, Imperial Guard and Word Bearers. Then almost all army books and a majority of supplements since 4th edition Fantasy and 3rd edition 40k.

    Oh and have some Mordheim, Epic Armageddon and Warmaster as well.
    Lord of the Undermountain
  • Wargol5Wargol5 Posts: 495Registered Users
    Why is the TT Warhammer so expensive?

    Because there is always some people in the fanbase with more money than common sense.
    GW adapt their price to them.
    And on top of that, they increase their prices more than necessary and justify it by saying the quality is better (everyone remember the failcast figures? ).
  • SindrissSindriss Posts: 263Registered Users

    Sindriss said:

    GW better prepare themselves for a changing industry. In the near future 3d printers will be cheap enough and able to churn out minis that are just as good as sculpts. People will share their custom 3d models online and the market for minis will vanish.

    If you think the arch-capitalists of the world will allow this, or not find some way to make LOADSAMONEY off it, you are, unfortunately, probably mistaken.
    They said the same thing about color printers.
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Posts: 590Registered Users
    Okay, I'm back.

    About the third-partystore thing. GW is letting them give discounts prices in both store and online. They also encourage them throwing events and gaming events.

    During the Summer campaign the regular hobby stores could post their results just as like the GW stores for the global competition.
    Sindriss said:

    GW better prepare themselves for a changing industry. In the near future 3d printers will be cheap enough and able to churn out minis that are just as good as sculpts. People will share their custom 3d models online and the market for minis will vanish.

    Near future is still heavily expensive printers that everyone won't be able to afford and costs for making models and competant transportation of the products will still result in GW being superior. (Say what you will but there product delivery and customer service are beyond top-notch)

    The far future sees easily affordable printers and also the steps GW has taken to greatly increase their fanbase and IP so they can take advantage of cheaper and top-of-the-line printers for amazing sculpts, equipping their GW stores with printers to give people places to play and have bits on demand, franchises lore affected by global tournaments making players attached and eager to buy the new board games, books and models made by those events and them selling official online model blueprints for fans with printers and models for fans without.

    GW stands to gain from a cheaper model medium as much as everyone else does. They'll have to make some changes but they are holders of the official franchises and that has more weight to it than a basement recaster's questionable quality space marines.
  • SultschiemSultschiem Posts: 745Registered Users
    And now you know why Warhammer fans don't whine about the DLC-prices XD
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Posts: 1,245Registered Users
    How could I forget my latest army the one I'm currently building up for Age of Sigmarines? Disciples of Tzeentch, Daemon focused with crossover capabilities for 40k.

    Just in my time I think model prices have gone up around 30-40% over the past 15 years.
    Lord of the Undermountain
  • BaronKlatzBaronKlatz Posts: 590Registered Users
    I think that's prices for everything, though. :P
  • TheGuardianOfMetalTheGuardianOfMetal Senior Member Posts: 5,833Registered Users
    Every wrong is recorded! Every slight against us! Page after Page, etched in blood! Clan Gunnison! Karak Eight-Peaks! Josef

    Yes! to Boris Todbringer as playable, subfaction leading Legendary Lord with Starting Position Middenheim instead for the Empire! NO to the lazy way of moving Gelt and Volkmar who both belong to Reikland!

    Where is Boris Todbringer? Have you seen him?
«1
Sign In or Register to comment.