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Beastmen and changing how they deal with large targets.

OndjageOndjage Junior MemberPosts: 544Registered Users
So with the addition of norsca one of the glaring issues of beastmen has become a little more prevalent. Dealing with monsters and armoured monsters.

Beastmen got several ways to deal with cavalry etc but they struggle a bit vs armoured monsters because the minotaurs have a tendancy to die very fast because of their low armour and gorebulls are slightly overpriced if you take more then the base model atm.

One of the biggest changes i think thats needed for beastmen is a change to how Ungor Raiders work, Right now they are a mediocre ranged unit that can hold slightly in combat but because of the units pricing it doesnt do any of those roles very well.

What beastmen need is for this unit to be closer to goblin archers in terms of melee capability and cost, thus inadvertedly making them more powerfull in the ranged compartment because they are going to be cheaper.

I would initially propose to lower their cost to 400 and nerf melee stats appropriately, as what beastmen needs is a solid ranged unit that can help them deal with large single target monsters, like giants, Mammoths, spiders etc. This unit could fill that role without breaking too much with lore or making the unit seem out of place as ungors are not very strong in lore.

Most other changes involve changing their spearmen a bit as right now they tend to lose to everything because of their low LD and low damage vs everything. By changing their spearmen with higher leadership and slightly higher Anti large/WS you could improve beastmens chances of fighting off units like wild riders, skinwolves etc because you can screen your own centigors/minotaurs with cheap cost effective spears.

When all of that is said the Beastmen ror units are great, Their design and roles are brilliantly mixed into the roster and was exactly what the beastmen needed. I feel like all their ROR units are well balanced and serve a specific role in the army that they needed so great work on these units.

Comments

  • TlaxtlanSoothsayerTlaxtlanSoothsayer Posts: 2,322Registered Users
    Yes, Ungor Raiders need some love.
    They're one of the few options the Beastmen have to deal ranged damage. They cost almost the same as Empire Crossbowmen but are inferior because of their short range.
    A cost reduction and a small increase to their range will help the Beastmen to deal with large targets.
  • c0rvusc0rvus Posts: 203Registered Users
    Like what I said in another thread, unless someone can convince me that the vanguard+stalk has made them even just a little bit better at time when it comes to supporting your main units. There is no point for them to be priced any differently from other ungor unit, for such low base stats. They're hardly accessible yet I need them to do the simplest job. 440 & 475 cost are just ridiculous and they get booted easily when compare them with norscan units.
  • irurobinirurobin Posts: 1,826Registered Users
    edited August 2017
    Buffing Ungor raiders is one of the right way to go but I don't like making them 400 with nerfing melee stats. They have 90 models after all and they can shred giants and treemen even now. The stalk on them neglects a lot of range advantage of the opponent. I don't think it is a good idea to set a 90 models stalk archer on 400.

    I would prefer a cap of 2 (or 3 ?) on single model monster.
  • BlissBliss Posts: 519Registered Users
    Does the cap you're talking about take into accound Lords on Mounts (Mammoth for instance) ?
  • OndjageOndjage Junior Member Posts: 544Registered Users
    irurobin said:

    Buffing Ungor raiders is one of the right way to go but I don't like making them 400 with nerfing melee stats. They have 90 models after all and they can shred giants and treemen even now. The stalk on them neglects a lot of range advantage of the opponent. I don't think it is a good idea to set a 90 models stalk archer on 400.

    I would prefer a cap of 2 (or 3 ?) on single model monster.

    Their damage is barely higher then Goblins at 2 more missile damage but with a 0.8 Second slower reload. They have 1 AP damage on their arrows, im sorry but the furthest i could go for this unit is 425 Any higher then that and its still never gonna be worth it. And they really dont shred treemen, the are bad vs any armoured unit, and their stalk is completely negatable vs any faction with a flying unit because beastmen have none of their own so its very easy for empire, we, gs, brets to counter that. And dwarfs wont bother 2 seconds with these guys on account of their low damage and low range. This is the only unit you can change without significantly altering the beastmen roster to be OP in some other area.
  • KhorneFlakesKhorneFlakes Posts: 3,373Registered Users
    i agree with what have been said

    i think one unit could probably solve this problem a centigor with anitlarge missile damage

    Balance Is A Lie

  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Posts: 2,994Registered Users
    Reducing the cost to 400 would be a great improvement.

    Add a poison variant to the roster as well, not sure why bretonnia gets access to poison arrows but the beastmen don't.

    The centigor RoR unit should have a bonus against large.

    Chaos spawn need an actual bonus against infantry.

    Razorgor's need an actual bonus against infantry.

    The manticore should have been added to the beastmen roster.

    The faction overall is too reliant on minotaurs.
  • ArchonPrimeArchonPrime Posts: 1,087Registered Users
    irurobin said:



    I would prefer a cap of 2 (or 3 ?) on single model monster.

    2
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