Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Categories

How Will Chaos Dwarfs Be Balanced?

2»

Comments

  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,340Registered Users
    Well... someone's gotta be the Space Marines of the series... Little kids and noobs need to win, too :-P
  • saberslash117saberslash117 Posts: 223Registered Users
    Is it so hard to really balanced Chaos Dwarfs?


    They would literally be the Offensive to the Defensive strategy of the regular Dwarfs.

    Instead of relying on strong, cost-effect armored warriors that can take a beating, you'd have expendable light-armorerd Greenskin warriors backed up by a small expensive core of Chaos Dwarf warriors/Infernal Guard. They are offensive, so much so that their artillery should be THE GREATEST in the game.
  • Carl_BarCarl_Bar Posts: 500Registered Users
    Honestly i don't see the issue. Last army book they had that i'm aware of was ravening hordes. Where's they're basically dwarfs with bull centaurs replacing most elites, different arty, and the option to take a lot of orc and goblin units. They're not really that different from dwarves if dwarves had less range, some cav, and some cheap units. Which is a nice set of positives. But nothing game shattering.
  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,340Registered Users
    What edition was their latest codex, anyway? They're like the only race I don't currently have a book for o_O.
  • TennisgolfbollTennisgolfboll Posts: 7,924Registered Users
    edited October 2017
    Å
    Itharus said:

    What edition was their latest codex, anyway? They're like the only race I don't currently have a book for o_O.

    6th ed. Rav hordes

    CD were never the most OP army so i doubt any issue in TW
    Read all my replies as if we are having a pint and a good old time. I will always read your reply like that.
  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Posts: 6,111Registered Users
    Itharus said:

    What edition was their latest codex, anyway? They're like the only race I don't currently have a book for o_O.

    The last formal Chaos Dwarf list was in Ravening Hordes. Before that... late 4th, I think?

    There's a Chaos Dwarf list in Tamurkhan, as well, but it's intended to represent a specific list - there's a fair amount missing.
  • saberslash117saberslash117 Posts: 223Registered Users
    Draxynnic said:

    Itharus said:

    What edition was their latest codex, anyway? They're like the only race I don't currently have a book for o_O.

    The last formal Chaos Dwarf list was in Ravening Hordes. Before that... late 4th, I think?

    There's a Chaos Dwarf list in Tamurkhan, as well, but it's intended to represent a specific list - there's a fair amount missing.
    there are Monstrous Arcanum as well......Bale Taurus, Chaos Siege Giants, Lammasu, K'daii Fireborn, etc.
  • SultschiemSultschiem Posts: 1,646Registered Users
    Loo
    Itharus said:

    Well... someone's gotta be the Space Marines of the series... Little kids and noobs need to win, too :-P

    Ehm.... the "Space Marines" of the Warhammer Tabletop, from what I understand are actually the High Elves, no? Bunch of Elite units that are the best in everything. Best Archers, Best Infantry, one of the best Cavalry, the strongest Monster, one of the best magic...
  • saberslash117saberslash117 Posts: 223Registered Users

    Loo

    Itharus said:

    Well... someone's gotta be the Space Marines of the series... Little kids and noobs need to win, too :-P

    Ehm.... the "Space Marines" of the Warhammer Tabletop, from what I understand are actually the High Elves, no? Bunch of Elite units that are the best in everything. Best Archers, Best Infantry, one of the best Cavalry, the strongest Monster, one of the best magic...
    Thats debatable.....

    Best Archers? Yes

    Best Infantry? Maybe.....

    Best Cavalry? My Demigryph beg to differ

    Strongest Monsters? No....not at all...

    Best Magic? Nope....Empire has all the magic options...
  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Posts: 6,111Registered Users
    Best Archers? No. Wood Elves beat them on an individual basis, and a lot of things beat them on firepower for points.

    Best Infantry is debateable.

    Best Cavalry... a lot of things beat DPs. DPs do have high mobility and a nasty charge for their points, though.

    Strongest Monsters... not really.

    Best Magic... arguably. Better than Empire, anyway - lore-wise, the High Elves have access to everything the Empire has plus High Magic.

    That said, the High Elves are the Craftworld Eldar of WFB (or, possibly more accurately, it's the other way around) - specialised, fragile units in theme (although there are some generalists, and some that are supposed to be specialised but are more generalist than they should be). There wasn't a direct equivalent to Space Marines in WFB. That's why they made Sigmarines.
  • Ephraim_DaltonEphraim_Dalton Senior Member Posts: 21,303Registered Users
    I'd argue that Bretonnian Knights and especially Grail Knights were the fantasy equivalent to Space Marines. Heavily armed and armoured humans who were given special powers by a higher being who pledged themselves to protect the weak and who ran their own feudal fiefs.

  • Carl_BarCarl_Bar Posts: 500Registered Users
    Itharus said:

    What edition was their latest codex, anyway? They're like the only race I don't currently have a book for o_O.

    As others said ravening hordes. Where they basically dwarfs with minor alterations.

    I did actually several years ago start writing my own CD revision, still got it now i think to look. Wow memories :p. It probably says somthing though that fans probably wrote more on them after 6th than GW ever did.
  • DraxynnicDraxynnic Posts: 6,111Registered Users

    I'd argue that Bretonnian Knights and especially Grail Knights were the fantasy equivalent to Space Marines. Heavily armed and armoured humans who were given special powers by a higher being who pledged themselves to protect the weak and who ran their own feudal fiefs.

    They're probably the closest on the Order side, with Chaos Warriors being an obvious analogy to Chaos Marines.

    However, Sultscheim was looking it at the approach of "best at everything" and both the Bretonnians and the Warriors of Chaos had distinct weaknesses.

    Compare this to AoS, where nobody in the Order battletome can be the best at anything without adding the qualifier "outside the Stormhosts".
  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Posts: 7,340Registered Users
    edited October 2017
    A bit OT, but it has been stated that High Elves will gain access to all their lores of magic over time. Just not right at release... so hold onto that "best magic" for a while -- as HE will take that prize eventually.

    There's still a bunch of roster stuff for the 4 game two races that hasn't been added in yet.
  • petertel123petertel123 Junior Member Posts: 744Registered Users
    TBH I expect them to be quite a lot better than normal dwarfs because of powercreep.
    Team Bretonnia
    Team Dark Elves
  • WalashWalash Posts: 340Registered Users
    edited October 2017
    Balance is just a matter of numbers and mechanics

    For example; here we have a slave/master relationship

    We can imagine a system where hobgoblins are really cost effective and the chaos dwarfs are really not, BUT, if you have too few Chaos dwarfs around, then hobgoblins loose a lot of leadership (you can even have a range from them).

    It means you want to take only hobgoblins, but you can't because without CD they will just flee.
    Also, if there is a range between the CD units and the Hobgoblin units for the Leadership debuff , then it means they can't send hobgoblins riders fare away = they can't be too mobile.

    It also opens a lot strategical thinking as an adversary. You have to choose between killing the easy hobgoblin, or go for the the hard to kill dwarfs (but get the chance to force the defuff on hobgoblin)
  • SedlinaSedlina Posts: 193Registered Users


    Best Magic? Nope....Empire has all the magic options...

    Well only because CA decided to make no difference between spellcaster Lords and Heroes. Otherwise petty humans would have all options - but aside from metal they would be fairly bad/weak at their jobs
  • JachymulusJachymulus Posts: 228Registered Users

    Plus they also got Obnoxious Prowess which gives them 100% ward save and a flat +400 AP damage (for every single CD as long as the unit is above 0% HP)

    On the other hand it would be against 42nd edition lore for them to be balanced so I think it is only fair and proper for them to be Invincible-tier

    Don’t forget the FireGlaives with 250 range Antilarge AP missiles.

    I suppose they’ll be balanced by the mountains making it harder for them to get to the Empire quickly.
    Well yeah only way to win against Chaos Dwarves should be to try to win the campaign before they kill you. After all their reach may be short and their legs even shorter, but once a Chaos Dwarf grabs you by his beard, you are a goner.

    It would be a nice way to reintroduce a time limits to the campaign without making it feel forced. Chaos Dwarves would be this time limit
    i just sign up only to like your comment
    But yeah, if i see that the Chaos dwarfs can actually loose battle, i swear CA......
Sign In or Register to comment.