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So what is your opinion of Vampirates DLC now?

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  • AmonkhetAmonkhet Registered Users Posts: 4,294
    Xenos7 said:

    Could DoW be instead a mechanic for all order factions + Dark Elves? Like a mercenary system?

    When people ask for DoW they mean DoW+Southern Kingdoms; the full lore package. DoW as a race on its own just isn't the same.
  • Xenos7777Xenos7777 Registered Users Posts: 6,265
    Amonkhet said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Could DoW be instead a mechanic for all order factions + Dark Elves? Like a mercenary system?

    When people ask for DoW they mean DoW+Southern Kingdoms; the full lore package. DoW as a race on its own just isn't the same.
    But they aren't even on the map.
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Registered Users Posts: 9,849
    Xenos7 said:

    Amonkhet said:

    Xenos7 said:

    Could DoW be instead a mechanic for all order factions + Dark Elves? Like a mercenary system?

    When people ask for DoW they mean DoW+Southern Kingdoms; the full lore package. DoW as a race on its own just isn't the same.
    But they aren't even on the map.
    Sudenburg, New World Colonies and then pop two wherever all of it done in true TWW2 anyone can be anywhere style. None of the Skaven characters bar Skrolk have any real connection to where they have been placed for example and the DoW lords would make more sense to spread out given their more mercenary inclinations.
    Lord of the Undermountain and your friendly neighbourhood giant (Dwarf)
    Favourite campaigns: Clan Angrund, Followers of Nagash and the new Huntsmarshall’s Expedition
  • NyxilisNyxilis Registered Users Posts: 4,529
    Crossil said:

    I guess we should cart Dark Elves out of Naggaroth then. Why keep them there when their actual objectives are everywhere else? Like how GW did it in the End Times, just leave Naggaroth and go wreck Ulthuan and the Old World. It's just secondary to their main objective.

    In fact I don't even see why CA bothered adding Naggaroth in the first place. We don't really need it for them to be added to the game.

    I just don't understand how you can want a faction that you don't even understand. Their point was not Venitian politics, or their local fights. Those are less than a tiny portion of any of their lore mentions. They constantly try in all their lore to show they make names for themselves explording, raiding, treasure hunting, and things that require being out and about.

    This is not true of the DE, or the fact that the internal fighting is a point. Inner feuds and politics killing them off is quite common and features in all our current lords. Even Lokhir is noted that his ascension was unusual because it didn't require backstabbing

    And you know what? Naggaroth wasn't actually a must. Did you ever participate in the story battles they would set up? Or did you pay attention that most major plot points rarely happened on most races home turf? Yeah, that's right. DE do in fact spend a lot of their time burning down locations far from their home borders. Be it a far flung HE fortress south of the Kingdom of Ind, invading Ulthuan again and again.

    When was the last time that the Warriors of Chaos, Daemons of Chaos, or Norscans have to actually fight on their home turf? Pretty rare actually. The stories of all their military invasion rarely involve where they are from. And that's kind of their point. Beastmen don't really have a home point either, just the vague area they're hoofing it at the moment.

    Did the entire Albion plotline really need the Altdorf? Naggaroth? No, neither mattered. Their militaries showed up with their lords, that's all that mattered.

    Tilea is not vital to anything story for the DoW to be there and fighting. It would just be for the plot device.

    In the new Mortal Empires they'd be there and I still say they'd put only one, or two at tops in that location. As they'd rather take the other lords to fill blank areas. That's the map for the 'representative locations' and even that for a lot of lords is sorta. And as they continue spreading out lords from game 1 on ME that's only going to grow.

    But go on, tell me home territory is necessary for the story. It's not.
  • uriakuriak Registered Users Posts: 3,421
    @Nyxilis

    The fact is both in game 1 and ME, the area of estalia tylea and border prince has been an empty zone filled with sub empire factions, whereas, bretonnia itself, Lustria etc are filled with competing playable factions. When people think of DoW there has been the regiments, most of which could be honestly done with RoR, but also the Tilean roster with its aesthetics and specificities. Tilean infantry would bring pikes, a pretty big deal ( I mean monsters are fancy and all, but the way you play them is not that much different , we have the infantry shreeder, anti large and fire support types)

    This is only the game side of things, people may consider that a whole nation of warring princes is a valid faction rather than just some roaming mercenaries, but the vampires pirates thing has shown CA isn't afraid of making lone warbands their own faction.

    As for Araby we can only speculate on what their playstyle would have been.

    About the OP, I won't lie and say I'm not sour. Of course I am. The pirate theme can be fun, but they were destined to be spekles on the borders of the big land nations (Harkon excepted) It shows a probable lack of enthousiasm from the devs and a lack of conviction about what is marketable that two possible factions with more historical grounds are ignored.

  • NyxilisNyxilis Registered Users Posts: 4,529
    uriak said:

    @Nyxilis

    The fact is both in game 1 and ME, the area of estalia tylea and border prince has been an empty zone filled with sub empire factions, whereas, bretonnia itself, Lustria etc are filled with competing playable factions. When people think of DoW there has been the regiments, most of which could be honestly done with RoR, but also the Tilean roster with its aesthetics and specificities. Tilean infantry would bring pikes, a pretty big deal ( I mean monsters are fancy and all, but the way you play them is not that much different , we have the infantry shreeder, anti large and fire support types)

    This is only the game side of things, people may consider that a whole nation of warring princes is a valid faction rather than just some roaming mercenaries, but the vampires pirates thing has shown CA isn't afraid of making lone warbands their own faction.

    As for Araby we can only speculate on what their playstyle would have been.

    About the OP, I won't lie and say I'm not sour. Of course I am. The pirate theme can be fun, but they were destined to be spekles on the borders of the big land nations (Harkon excepted) It shows a probable lack of enthousiasm from the devs and a lack of conviction about what is marketable that two possible factions with more historical grounds are ignored.

    Yeah, but lets break down some points.

    1. Game 1 doesn't matter anymore. No patches are going to it so that doesn't solve anything for game one.

    2. Vortex and ME are not the same thing. ME can have lords placed where they are not in the main story line. They did this with Ikkit and others.

    3. The Tilean area is now more crowded than people think. They've added Ikkit claw of Clan Skyre, and Arenessa of the whatever not Sartosan pirates but now owns Sartosa a formerly Tilean area. If you plop down even one lord there. It's now more crowded than Bretonnia in ways. This means they're not going to cram it full of all 4 DoW lords. In fact they might very well only put one for that reason.

    4. They're more likely to add more Tilean city states and make the Border Princes fodder. People expecting the Border Princes to be fleshed out were asking for a lot. They're a hodge podge mish mash of lords from nearly every realm. Be they empire areas, lil Bretonnia feifs, undead enclaves, minwaahs, or unculled beastmen. It'd be more of a minicampaign than a race. And on ME they're fodder for some eventual race or faction.

    I'm absolutely 100% for the Dogs of War. Second favorite army behind Skaven. However, people drastically overestimate Tilea or its overall importance to the plot device or even on ME. A likely 1 lord area, two at most. It was only just going to be T of the TEB. Estalia and Border Princes were never going to happen and are food for the real powers.
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