Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Categories

Old World Update: Greenskins Speculation & Breakdown (Italianspartacus)

BiesBies Junior MemberPosts: 1,636Registered Users

"I shivered at the sight of her - her beauty far beyond that of mortal man. But her soul glowed with an inner darkness that chilled my very core."









Tagged:

Comments

  • Deep_echo_soundDeep_echo_sound Posts: 330Registered Users
    edited August 23
    Interesting video.
    But greenskins do need new technologies for units. They unlock units via techs, which is already a big obstacle. And do not get tech buffs for arachnarok spiders and very low upgrades for some other units.
    They need staff like +5 melee attack, +5 melee defense, +10% weapon strength. Dwarfs have this, vampire counts, the Empire, Bretonnia, like everyone has these kinds of technologies for units. But greenskins does not. Which is very wrong. And arachnarok spider mounts as well as more monsters in the roster are great additions too!
  • NopeacejustwarNopeacejustwar Posts: 811Registered Users
    Im a big fan of his breakdowns and lore vids. Looking forward to this.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Posts: 3,922Registered Users
    More looking forward to his BM vid. Just like IS I'm not a fan of the GS.
  • Ares354Ares354 Posts: 1,800Registered Users

    Interesting video.
    But greenskins do need new technologies for units. They unlock units via techs, which is already a big obstacle. And do not get tech buffs for arachnarok spiders and very low upgrades for some other units.
    They need staff like +5 melee attack, +5 melee defense, +10% weapon strength. Dwarfs have this, vampire counts, the Empire, Bretonnia, like everyone has these kinds of technologies for units. But greenskins does not. Which is very wrong. And arachnarok spider mounts as well as more monsters in the roster are great additions too!

    Yea, Empire have such a good tech tree, locked behind buildings, even worse then GS do.
  • Deep_echo_soundDeep_echo_sound Posts: 330Registered Users
    edited August 23
    High elves has this too. But both the Empire and high elves has more overall technologies and more buffs for units in the late game.
    Greenskins may be the worst race in the game when it comes to stats buffs via technology.
    And overall, their tech tree like 3 times smaller than some other races. We can look at lizardmen for example, or dark elves, or many other factions. They all have good campaign growth and improvement potential. But greenskins waste their very few techs for unlocking units... It is just horrible.
    They need like 12 new techs, most of them for unit stats buffs. (Arachnarok spider I am looking at you!) And few for movement, upkeep, replenishment, etc.
  • sandercohensandercohen Posts: 145Registered Users
    Greenskins have a **** poor technology tree. At least with Empire you unlock the tech tree with buildings that are actually useful, like a Rally Field. And you have techs that at least provides a noticeable buff.

    Meanwhile Greenskins need to build a building just for the sake of researching. It really does nothing else. It clogs up a precious building slot and on top of that it's a tier 3 building, so you can't start building it immediately after starting the campaign. If you lose the settlement you lose your access to the technology tree.

    The techs that they do have are unsubstantial, often with only very minor stat boosts. Get that WHOPPING +5 LD bonus on Goblins that you have to spend like 6 turns researching, then spend another six turns researching a MASSIVE +5 LD bonus on ork units. Or unlock that AMAZING Doom Diver catapult that is hidden somewhere deep within the tech tree. Get that WHOPPING 5% extra speed on a goblin chariot. Yay. They have nothing for repenishment or growth rates even though they literally grow from spores.

    At least Empire techs typically buff units across the board.
  • davedave1124davedave1124 Senior Member Posts: 3,922Registered Users
    I get bored pretty quickly playing Empire.. compare the Dwarf and Empire's tech trees to start.. no competition.
  • Ares354Ares354 Posts: 1,800Registered Users

    Greenskins have a **** poor technology tree. At least with Empire you unlock the tech tree with buildings that are actually useful, like a Rally Field. And you have techs that at least provides a noticeable buff.

    Meanwhile Greenskins need to build a building just for the sake of researching. It really does nothing else. It clogs up a precious building slot and on top of that it's a tier 3 building, so you can't start building it immediately after starting the campaign. If you lose the settlement you lose your access to the technology tree.

    The techs that they do have are unsubstantial, often with only very minor stat boosts. Get that WHOPPING +5 LD bonus on Goblins that you have to spend like 6 turns researching, then spend another six turns researching a MASSIVE +5 LD bonus on ork units. Or unlock that AMAZING Doom Diver catapult that is hidden somewhere deep within the tech tree. Get that WHOPPING 5% extra speed on a goblin chariot. Yay. They have nothing for repenishment or growth rates even though they literally grow from spores.

    At least Empire techs typically buff units across the board.

    Yea, waste like 40+ turns, build like 4 buldings to unlock tech tree that give Greatsword units awesome buff that is useless.

    Empire tech tree ain better, and guess what, GS like BM should have bad tech tree, they arent tech experts you know.
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 15,405Registered Users
    The Orcs badly need fixing. They're really obviously one of the very first races made by CA.

    Their mechanics are mediocre and broken. They also lack some basic things like an Orc melee hero. It's stuff that I'd expect a rework to resolve. Though realistically they need another LP to get properly fixed.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • SakuraHeinzSakuraHeinz Junior Member Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    Ares354 said:

    Greenskins have a **** poor technology tree. At least with Empire you unlock the tech tree with buildings that are actually useful, like a Rally Field. And you have techs that at least provides a noticeable buff.

    Meanwhile Greenskins need to build a building just for the sake of researching. It really does nothing else. It clogs up a precious building slot and on top of that it's a tier 3 building, so you can't start building it immediately after starting the campaign. If you lose the settlement you lose your access to the technology tree.

    The techs that they do have are unsubstantial, often with only very minor stat boosts. Get that WHOPPING +5 LD bonus on Goblins that you have to spend like 6 turns researching, then spend another six turns researching a MASSIVE +5 LD bonus on ork units. Or unlock that AMAZING Doom Diver catapult that is hidden somewhere deep within the tech tree. Get that WHOPPING 5% extra speed on a goblin chariot. Yay. They have nothing for repenishment or growth rates even though they literally grow from spores.

    At least Empire techs typically buff units across the board.

    Yea, waste like 40+ turns, build like 4 buldings to unlock tech tree that give Greatsword units awesome buff that is useless.

    Empire tech tree ain better, and guess what, GS like BM should have bad tech tree, they arent tech experts you know.
    SO and how do you want to play the end game with no technology? at some point gameplay is more important than logic, if they make greenskins and beastmen units just stronger by nature and remove techs ,it will completely ruin the early game for the other races.
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Posts: 5,857Registered Users
    Virtually all TWW1 races bare the Dwarfs had pretty abyssmal tech trees. It’s better now. The Empire have theirs somewhat expanded, the Brets too, the Vamps slightly as well. The Greens are stuck in a rut and the Warriors of Chaos and the Beastmen have quite uninspiring ones. But everyone can be thankful they aren’t Wood Elves at least.

    Norsca is a strange rabbit. Their tech tree isn’t all that either but they have so much else going for them you don’t really notice it.
    Lord of the Undermountain
    Favourite campaigns: Clan Angrund, Followers of Nagash and the new Huntsmarshall’s Expedition
  • Vanilla_GorillaVanilla_Gorilla Posts: 15,405Registered Users

    Ares354 said:

    Greenskins have a **** poor technology tree. At least with Empire you unlock the tech tree with buildings that are actually useful, like a Rally Field. And you have techs that at least provides a noticeable buff.

    Meanwhile Greenskins need to build a building just for the sake of researching. It really does nothing else. It clogs up a precious building slot and on top of that it's a tier 3 building, so you can't start building it immediately after starting the campaign. If you lose the settlement you lose your access to the technology tree.

    The techs that they do have are unsubstantial, often with only very minor stat boosts. Get that WHOPPING +5 LD bonus on Goblins that you have to spend like 6 turns researching, then spend another six turns researching a MASSIVE +5 LD bonus on ork units. Or unlock that AMAZING Doom Diver catapult that is hidden somewhere deep within the tech tree. Get that WHOPPING 5% extra speed on a goblin chariot. Yay. They have nothing for repenishment or growth rates even though they literally grow from spores.

    At least Empire techs typically buff units across the board.

    Yea, waste like 40+ turns, build like 4 buldings to unlock tech tree that give Greatsword units awesome buff that is useless.

    Empire tech tree ain better, and guess what, GS like BM should have bad tech tree, they arent tech experts you know.
    SO and how do you want to play the end game with no technology? at some point gameplay is more important than logic, if they make greenskins and beastmen units just stronger by nature and remove techs ,it will completely ruin the early game for the other races.
    I don't see how Empire is relevant to this discussion.

    The BM have a better tech tree than the Orcs. That in and if itself justified improving the Orcs tree. Originally it made sense, low tech race getting a small tree. Now it's just a race with a bad tech tree.
    Game 3 must have variety in its core races. Ogres, Chaos Dwarfs, Kislev, and Demons of Chaos in its full iconic, glorious, undivided glory.
  • crazycakemancrazycakeman Posts: 166Registered Users
    I dont know about everyone else but I really wasnt a fan of Italianspartacus's WAAAAGGGHHHH rework... I think it would thematically make more sense if once you reach the state of a WWAAGGHHH and a free army appears, you get to keep that army and can control it, just like with the Skaven. Then your fightiness falls and you can build it back up for a second WAAGGHH which will give you a second, more powerful army. And so on.

    Might be a little OP but I feel like it makes more sense, especially when a WAAGGHHH is supposed to be greenskins rallying to your cause, not spontaneously erupting and fighting everything they see...
  • Deep_echo_soundDeep_echo_sound Posts: 330Registered Users
    edited August 24

    SO and how do you want to play the end game with no technology? at some point gameplay is more important than logic, if they make greenskins and beastmen units just stronger by nature and remove techs ,it will completely ruin the early game for the other races.

    Beastmen are like academics compared to greenskins in tech trees comparison. For example minotaurs get +20% weapon damage from 1 single tech. Arachnarok spiders have absolute 0% to anything. Oh, and some other bonuses for units are just too small and too few like mentioned +5 leadership for orcs, and then only one tech with +10% weapon strength. And nothing like +10% movement speed bonus for orcs and like +5 attack for orcs? No, nothing?

    And no strong replenishment bonuses for greenskins? No campaign movement bonuses for their savage hordes? Just great...

    And in what state greenskins are clearly seen by just starting their campaign.
    3 buttons to interact with. And that's all. 2 of which are diplomacy and objectives. And 3rd is... Is? The best tech tree in the "total war warhammer 2"... Almost.
    Post edited by Deep_echo_sound on
  • SeanJeanquoiSeanJeanquoi Posts: 1,014Registered Users
    edited August 24
    felt like this was the weakest of his series so far (probably because there isn't much to work with)
    Post edited by SeanJeanquoi on
  • Deep_echo_soundDeep_echo_sound Posts: 330Registered Users
    edited August 24
    And to waaagh mechanics - I like it as is. But faction-wide bar that will give all your armies and settlements like public order, morale, movement and combat speed bonuses is potentially good thing to have. Closer to Bretonnia's chivalry or Allariel's "defender of Ulthuan" mechanics.

    But allied army that you can't control but that can rampage on your enemies is really fun! And sometimes have A.I. allies on the battlefield, and not only you vs enemy all the campaign, is double fun!

    Maybe, at the highest state of that faction-wide bonus bar, in addition, not as replacement to usual waaagh armies, but in addition, you can summon strong stacks for you. Like Bretonnia now have the option to summon green knight when on ultimate chivalry level. And like lizardmen can summon dinosaurs via rite.
    Like once in 20 to 40 turns you can summon that kind of strong elite greenskins stack for you, when your faction is at the highest achieved level of fightiness. (For like 200 won battles total, including no less than 50 decisive victories and 20 victories in a row for the starting legendary lord or faction leader.)
    Post edited by Deep_echo_sound on
  • Ares354Ares354 Posts: 1,800Registered Users

    Ares354 said:

    Greenskins have a **** poor technology tree. At least with Empire you unlock the tech tree with buildings that are actually useful, like a Rally Field. And you have techs that at least provides a noticeable buff.

    Meanwhile Greenskins need to build a building just for the sake of researching. It really does nothing else. It clogs up a precious building slot and on top of that it's a tier 3 building, so you can't start building it immediately after starting the campaign. If you lose the settlement you lose your access to the technology tree.

    The techs that they do have are unsubstantial, often with only very minor stat boosts. Get that WHOPPING +5 LD bonus on Goblins that you have to spend like 6 turns researching, then spend another six turns researching a MASSIVE +5 LD bonus on ork units. Or unlock that AMAZING Doom Diver catapult that is hidden somewhere deep within the tech tree. Get that WHOPPING 5% extra speed on a goblin chariot. Yay. They have nothing for repenishment or growth rates even though they literally grow from spores.

    At least Empire techs typically buff units across the board.

    Yea, waste like 40+ turns, build like 4 buldings to unlock tech tree that give Greatsword units awesome buff that is useless.

    Empire tech tree ain better, and guess what, GS like BM should have bad tech tree, they arent tech experts you know.
    SO and how do you want to play the end game with no technology? at some point gameplay is more important than logic, if they make greenskins and beastmen units just stronger by nature and remove techs ,it will completely ruin the early game for the other races.
    At very least try to make GS tech tree unique by forcing them to unlock tech only in battles or looting. And making GS or BM tech tree more powerfull or better then Dwarf, Empire, HE is just wrong and unlore.
Sign In or Register to comment.