Welcome

Please register for Total War Access to use the forums. If you're an existing user, your forum details will be merged with Total War Access if you register with the same email or username. For more information please read our FAQ’s here.

Categories

C.A., dread saurian needs medium buff.

2»

Comments

  • RheingoldRheingold Posts: 179Registered Users
    I also want him to be the biggest bad around, but buffs now are silly. We go through this ever time new units are released. TK monsters are a prime example, I remember people complaining on both sides before release.
    Balance has to do with other issues as well as stats. Mass, hit box, splash attack’s and animations. All which might be tweaked before release anyways. And while it should be the strongest SEM in game by a way, it still has to have some weaknesses. Just wait a bit before calling for buffs/nerfs on units, any units...
  • Deep_echo_soundDeep_echo_sound Posts: 447Registered Users
    edited September 4


    Did you play Doom ever without IDDQD or IDKFA on?

    Nah. Only played 3 and 2016 reboot. For some time.
    F.P.S. is not my genre partly because it is constant reflex challenge. Even more. At the start game is easy, by the middle game usually harder.
    Much better like the games like "diablo 2". When you start fine and by spending a lot of time become demigod that kills hell Baal in 8 seconds. Or faster.
    And strategy with heroes, like "warhammer" is - closer to "diablo" then to reflex games of faster mouse win.



    you mean 67% of game buyers NOT 85% are single player players.

    Close to 15% of "total war warhammer" players played 10 or more games in multiplayer for more than 3 years.
    And only about 5% are somewhat active all the time.

    Game was bought for single player mode by majority of customers.
  • Overlord87Overlord87 Posts: 824Registered Users

    OdTengri said:


    They should get rid of the Howda variant and replace it with Dread Suarian's that are dedicated to certain gods like the where in TT and all versions of them should Rampage, possibly more than most units. Then you need to use cold blooded to issue commands to it, till you run out of cold blooded. Then you could make it maybe MP price friendly.

    Most buyers do not need rampage on super unit. They are great as they are! Just better attack and defense will do.

    If you're single player only then it really doesn't matter. The DS is clearly a level above everything.

    Star dragons have far better stats (attack and defense) and not that lower real A.P. damage. And they fly and have breath attacks. And cost 2400. Vs 3200. And I do not want dread saurian to be cheap. I want it to be the strongest unit in the game. Far stronger than star dragon.
    Far stronger. Not a bit.
    I would find anything far stronger than a Star Dragon absolutely lore inappropriate. Except for, like, a God or something of that sort.
  • RheingoldRheingold Posts: 179Registered Users
    My understanding is Dread Saurians eat star dragons for breakfast lore wise. But the lore is a mess.

    OdTengri said:


    They should get rid of the Howda variant and replace it with Dread Suarian's that are dedicated to certain gods like the where in TT and all versions of them should Rampage, possibly more than most units. Then you need to use cold blooded to issue commands to it, till you run out of cold blooded. Then you could make it maybe MP price friendly.

    Most buyers do not need rampage on super unit. They are great as they are! Just better attack and defense will do.

    If you're single player only then it really doesn't matter. The DS is clearly a level above everything.

    Star dragons have far better stats (attack and defense) and not that lower real A.P. damage. And they fly and have breath attacks. And cost 2400. Vs 3200. And I do not want dread saurian to be cheap. I want it to be the strongest unit in the game. Far stronger than star dragon.
    Far stronger. Not a bit.
    I would find anything far stronger than a Star Dragon absolutely lore inappropriate. Except for, like, a God or something of that sort.
  • Overlord87Overlord87 Posts: 824Registered Users
    Rheingold said:

    My understanding is Dread Saurians eat star dragons for breakfast lore wise. But the lore is a mess.

    OdTengri said:


    They should get rid of the Howda variant and replace it with Dread Suarian's that are dedicated to certain gods like the where in TT and all versions of them should Rampage, possibly more than most units. Then you need to use cold blooded to issue commands to it, till you run out of cold blooded. Then you could make it maybe MP price friendly.

    Most buyers do not need rampage on super unit. They are great as they are! Just better attack and defense will do.

    If you're single player only then it really doesn't matter. The DS is clearly a level above everything.

    Star dragons have far better stats (attack and defense) and not that lower real A.P. damage. And they fly and have breath attacks. And cost 2400. Vs 3200. And I do not want dread saurian to be cheap. I want it to be the strongest unit in the game. Far stronger than star dragon.
    Far stronger. Not a bit.
    I would find anything far stronger than a Star Dragon absolutely lore inappropriate. Except for, like, a God or something of that sort.
    Luckily I stopped playing before 8th edition. Things really started going downhill from there, or at least that's how I view it.

    Anyway, quoting from https://monster.fandom.com/wiki/Dread_Saurian:

    "On the field there is little that can match the sheer strength and physical might of these colossal beasts, save perhaps their age-old enemies, the dragons."

    Clearly I don't expect a Sun Dragon to match a Dread Saurian. But Star Dragons are as old as the world.
  • mightygloinmightygloin Posts: 1,368Registered Users
    edited September 4
    Not sure if this thread is serious, but previous powercreeps were anything but "false". Even some devs admitted to it here. I'm glad they didn't go that way this time.

    Secondly DS has more than enough melee stats when you consider it had really low Weapon Skill on TT. You could even argue that 750 damage is over the top.
    However it could use some more toughness in the form of HP or resistances.

    And last of all you can buff the hell out of it in SP. Nuclear doomstacks consisting of 19x Saurians do already seem unbeatable as it is.
  • EarthDragonEarthDragon Posts: 137Registered Users
    I don't think the Dread Saurian should be hard to hit.

    I do think they should shrug off damage. The best fix currently (if needed) would be to give them a ward save and a missle save. The strength of Elephants in warfare is their hide is so think, arrows and javelins and the like rarely got deep enough to affect the thing. It shouldn't be hard to hit at all. 26 melee defense is fine to account for "flailing bulk". But hits need a lot of their mustard taken off beyond just a super deep hit point pool.
  • ValkaarValkaar Junior Member Posts: 1,767Registered Users

    Yes! Dread Saurian needs a buff!

    Valkaar said:

    I am single player gamer. Just as 85% of game buyers are.
    It is fair that his weakness is range fire. But super low melee defense and not that high for his apex-predator status melee attack is disappointing.
    And +4 attack and defense buff will change monster duels and general fight performance in campaign. It will.
    Carnosaur style bonus vs large is maybe too much. We have anti-large dino. We have anti-small dino. Now we have a strong all-around dinosaur. That is great!
    I like all-rounders. I like new sacred kroxigors for that reason too.

    Eh.

    If you're talking about single player...the buffs you're asking for WILL be on your lord's Red-Line skill tree and/or your research tech tree.

    and since I imagine Dread Saurians will take a level V building or two in order to be recruited...you should have a lord leveled up that high before you actually get one.

    Plus, you'll have a caster with 200+ winds of magic to buff/heal that Dread Saurian for days!!! by that point as well.

    So basically....yeah....for single player, for minor buffs.... you can basically just do it yourself and it will all work out fine.

    Fine-tuning buffs are way more of a multiplayer thing. Effective Campaign buffs/changes should be broad conceptual strokes. Not statistical nit-picks.
    How do you get 200+ WoM?
    I probably more accurately should have said, 200+ power reserve.

    But yes, it’s pretty standard for most mages to get 200+ power reserve by the late game. Similar to how almost every melee lord is creeping into the ‘almost 800 Weapon Strength’ thing by the late game due to stacked buffs thing.... even without the Sword of Khaine.

    Lots of items/research techs/base traits (like knowledgeable which stacks factionwide so the character(s) with it don’t even need to be nearby)/and skill points all stack and each add 10-20 power reserve at a time to the magic pool. Especially in armies where you have both the Lord and a Hero contributing traits and items into the WoM pool even if you’re only using the spells off of one of them. Which is pretty standard for Lizardmen since their mages can actually fight too once they get their Stegadon mounts.

    But yeah, by the late game, the battles are almost always over before you’ve actually used your winds up.
  • arcticmandalyarcticmandaly Posts: 217Registered Users
    edited September 4
    Really dont know what games u guy watched but i seen alot of the youtube videos yesterday and it seemed pretty damn powerfull. In Partyelites video i think it was ? high elfs had two bolt throwers set on him all match, 2 nets, 2 star dragon breathes and missles and it still racked up over 100 kills.
  • EarthDragonEarthDragon Posts: 137Registered Users

    Really dont know what games u guy watched but i seen alot of the youtube videos yesterday and it seemed pretty damn powerfull. In Partyelites video i think it was ? high elfs had two bolt throwers set on him all match, 2 nets, 2 star dragon breathes and missles and it still racked up over 100 kills.

    Yeah half the field was dedicated to tearing it down. The issue was more him wanting to showcase too much of the new stuff and just didn’t have the points to get some flyers in there for the bolt throwers. If that happened, it could stay in for another 25-30 kills honestly
  • AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users

    We've barely seem the Dread Saurian in action.

    Wait till it's actually out for the balance discussion.

    The problem with this line of thinking is fi he release and he is weak, hell stay weak for multiple months after release, if we see something clearly from footage, we have a chance to fix it before the release


  • MaedrethnirMaedrethnir Senior Member Posts: 5,269Registered Users
    Valkaar said:

    Yes! Dread Saurian needs a buff!

    Valkaar said:

    I am single player gamer. Just as 85% of game buyers are.
    It is fair that his weakness is range fire. But super low melee defense and not that high for his apex-predator status melee attack is disappointing.
    And +4 attack and defense buff will change monster duels and general fight performance in campaign. It will.
    Carnosaur style bonus vs large is maybe too much. We have anti-large dino. We have anti-small dino. Now we have a strong all-around dinosaur. That is great!
    I like all-rounders. I like new sacred kroxigors for that reason too.

    Eh.

    If you're talking about single player...the buffs you're asking for WILL be on your lord's Red-Line skill tree and/or your research tech tree.

    and since I imagine Dread Saurians will take a level V building or two in order to be recruited...you should have a lord leveled up that high before you actually get one.

    Plus, you'll have a caster with 200+ winds of magic to buff/heal that Dread Saurian for days!!! by that point as well.

    So basically....yeah....for single player, for minor buffs.... you can basically just do it yourself and it will all work out fine.

    Fine-tuning buffs are way more of a multiplayer thing. Effective Campaign buffs/changes should be broad conceptual strokes. Not statistical nit-picks.
    How do you get 200+ WoM?
    I probably more accurately should have said, 200+ power reserve.

    But yes, it’s pretty standard for most mages to get 200+ power reserve by the late game. Similar to how almost every melee lord is creeping into the ‘almost 800 Weapon Strength’ thing by the late game due to stacked buffs thing.... even without the Sword of Khaine.

    Lots of items/research techs/base traits (like knowledgeable which stacks factionwide so the character(s) with it don’t even need to be nearby)/and skill points all stack and each add 10-20 power reserve at a time to the magic pool. Especially in armies where you have both the Lord and a Hero contributing traits and items into the WoM pool even if you’re only using the spells off of one of them. Which is pretty standard for Lizardmen since their mages can actually fight too once they get their Stegadon mounts.

    But yeah, by the late game, the battles are almost always over before you’ve actually used your winds up.
    To be honest I never look at those stats but 200+ WoM appeared impressive to me. Personally I always struggle with it but then I like to cast spells and to cast a lot of them. Maybe I'm just draining it fast.
    Drowned in stars, bloated we shine.
    ... .... .... --··-- -. --- - . .- .-. ... ·-·-·- --- -. .-.. -.-- -.. .-. . .- -- ... -. --- .-- ·-·-·-

  • AIMA_DracklorAIMA_Dracklor Posts: 4,372Registered Users

    Really dont know what games u guy watched but i seen alot of the youtube videos yesterday and it seemed pretty damn powerfull. In Partyelites video i think it was ? high elfs had two bolt throwers set on him all match, 2 nets, 2 star dragon breathes and missles and it still racked up over 100 kills.

    For such a High cost, not sure it really payed for himself. Sisters would have killed him much quicker, Bolt throwers are not the best at taking down big HP pools.


  • MonochromaticSpiderMonochromaticSpider Posts: 825Registered Users

    I am single player gamer. Just as 85% of game buyers are.
    It is fair that his weakness is range fire. But super low melee defense and not that high for his apex-predator status melee attack is disappointing.
    And +4 attack and defense buff will change monster duels and general fight performance in campaign. It will.
    Carnosaur style bonus vs large is maybe too much. We have anti-large dino. We have anti-small dino. Now we have a strong all-around dinosaur. That is great!
    I like all-rounders. I like new sacred kroxigors for that reason too.

    you mean 67% of game buyers NOT 85% are single player players.

    67% of game owners have gotten a hero to level 10. The percentages drop off a bit from there, but 55% got a lord to level 20 and 45% got one to level 30.

    On the MP side, 30% of game owners have played at least 1 MP game. Less than 15% have given enough of a poo about MP to actually win 10 MP games.

    So you are correct that 85% is absolutely the wrong number for SP, though I would also hesitate to say 67%. It depends on how you define "SP gamer", I guess. On the other hand it seems fair to say that at least 85% of game owners are not playing MP.
  • Lord_DistamorfinLord_Distamorfin Posts: 437Registered Users

    I am single player gamer. Just as 85% of game buyers are.
    It is fair that his weakness is range fire. But super low melee defense and not that high for his apex-predator status melee attack is disappointing.
    And +4 attack and defense buff will change monster duels and general fight performance in campaign. It will.
    Carnosaur style bonus vs large is maybe too much. We have anti-large dino. We have anti-small dino. Now we have a strong all-around dinosaur. That is great!
    I like all-rounders. I like new sacred kroxigors for that reason too.

    you mean 67% of game buyers NOT 85% are single player players.

    67% of game owners have gotten a hero to level 10. The percentages drop off a bit from there, but 55% got a lord to level 20 and 45% got one to level 30.

    On the MP side, 30% of game owners have played at least 1 MP game. Less than 15% have given enough of a poo about MP to actually win 10 MP games.

    So you are correct that 85% is absolutely the wrong number for SP, though I would also hesitate to say 67%. It depends on how you define "SP gamer", I guess. On the other hand it seems fair to say that at least 85% of game owners are not playing MP.
    And the multiplayer numbers are grossly over inflated by the fact that Co-op campaigns count towards the multiplayer achievements. So, if only 15% of players have won 10 or more multiplayer battles, it's probably safe to assume that maybe 8% of players at most are playing actual multiplayer, not co-op campaigns.
Sign In or Register to comment.