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Pros and Cons (so far) of The New Lord Pack (Updated 04/09/19)

SaborSabor Registered Users Posts: 570
edited September 2019 in General Discussion
Greetings everyone, today I just wanted to sort out some of the pros and cons that are coming with the upcoming lord pack that have been showcased so far. I do this as their has been multiple thread started recently that give CA praise, to criticism, to outright insulting their integrity as a company. So I hope to make an unbiased list of the positives and negatives of the new DLC in case anyone is still on the fence about buying it. If I miss any please let me know in the comments, I will be happy to add any serious concerns or positive traits. This will be all encompassing, even if some of it is FLC CA has stated when releasing a new Lord Pack part of the budget goes to reworking old world factions.

Pros

  1. The biggest news out of this lord pack is without a doubt that cross game DLC is a reality. This opens the door to a whole plethora of new units and DLC's to Warhammers older races.
  2. Empire rework! Finally an elector counts system is added to the game. How it works exactly has yet to be seen, but it is a vast improvement above the offices system.
  3. Brand new Empire Legendary Lord after three years of waiting (yes grim and the grave released September 1st 2016).
  4. 4th edition war wagon was added as a new unit. This proves that CA is not afraid to draw from older source material for ideas.
  5. 13 new province units were added to the game for Empire. Giving a loreful and fun reason to unite the Empire.
  6. Nakai The Wanderer is a playable Legendary Lord after many people thought he would never be in game.
  7. Gor Rok is also now included as a Legendary Lord.
  8. Razordons have now been added to the game after many people were unsatisfied with their inclusion from the previous DLC.
  9. Dread Saurian was included giving definitive proof that CA will use Forgeworld models for base game races (previous examples were Vampire Coast and Norsca).
  10. Slanns received two additional lores of magic.
  11. Still have the surprise of the Old Friends being added in a few weeks.
  12. Several new territories were added included Albion.
  13. Nakai and Wulfhart both get narrative based stories.
  14. More interesting sieges with the inclusion of forts!
  15. Slanns are confirmed to get a decent rework to make them much stronger.
  16. No strong evidence of power creep (at least yet).

Cons

  1. Lackluster Empire inclusion of units except for the war wagon.
  2. Trogolodon will probably never be included.
  3. Empire has still not received their FLC Legendary Lord.
  4. Empire archers are rather lackluster.
  5. Foot lords received no buff or rework so lords like Nakai still get punted like footballs.
  6. Lustria is now fight club on steroids (not necessarily a bad thing).
  7. None of the new empire province units can be used in custom battles or multiplayer.
  8. Older lord packs pale in comparison via lack of story.
  9. Kroxigor lords leading armies is a disservice to the lore.
My conclusion is that there is so many more positive aspects of this DLC then negative. I strongly recommend to anyone still who has not purchased it to do so. Talk of delaying the DLC or calling CA lazy because some of the units are not perfect seems superficial to me. Did they cut corners? Yes, but when you consider all the other work that went into multiple other units I think it outweighs the negatives by a large margin. Also keep in mind that some of the units were probably held off because they plan to release another Empire lord pack eventually and if what they say is true then a decent portion of this DLCs budget went into the FLC rework for Empire this time around. Please let me know what you think and if the list needs anything added to it. I will edit as more information is released in the coming days as well.
Post edited by Sabor on

Comments

  • WaaaghCheifWaaaghCheif Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,095
    Without repeating you, first I can think of:

    Pros:

    Nakai and Wulfhart get their own narrative (including cutscenes)

    Cons

    :
    Nakai and Wulfhart getting their own narrative (cutscenes) makes the past LLs of Lord Packs seem to take a backseat in the Eye of the Vortex.


    Empire Engineer lost a rather obvious spot as a hero/lord with this dlc as a ranges support for artillery and ranged units. He could also be associated with th War Wagon.

    Instead we got a niché lord who will ne focusing on buffing archers and skirmishes.

    FLC: The effort shown to create the provisional units are lackluster. Steam Tank textures are still horrid.
  • crazycakemancrazycakeman Registered Users Posts: 197
    Slanns have received a rework and they have access to the lore of Fire AND life too. I'm not sure what their rework includes but I have read on reddit that they have received *something* to make them the best casters in the game.
  • xXF1aKOXxxXF1aKOXx Registered Users Posts: 968
    You forgot they didnt add ancient razordon :P
  • jgascoine011jgascoine011 Registered Users Posts: 64
    I honestly think this is shaping up to be one of the best LL packs.

    CA were kind of limited as to what they could add to the empire.
    They dont really have a lot of missing units. There is the Landship but that is a marienberg thing. And there is the possible addition of the huge demigryph mount that theodore has but he is a nuln character.

    Nakai on a mount would be rediculious and well a foot lord should get knocked about by a charging mammoth.
    Also monstrous infantry such as nakai and throgg dont suffer too much from this problem.

    My only big problems with this dlc is that they have not fixed sieges or chaos invasion.
    The chaos invasion is a huge problem as right now lustria just gets destroyed by them. There are so many fractions down there that none of them become strong enough to dominate and then defend lustria.
  • CrossilCrossil Registered Users Posts: 11,611
    "Lustria is now fight club on steroids" you're acting like this is possible to be wrong in any way. The only things missing are Spaniards and Women.

    UNLEASH THE EVERCHARIOT

  • jgmasterjgmaster Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 613
    I think this is the wrong message you are giving. You say they cut corners because of the FREE rework of the Empire so for example:
    The next DLC is like a DE vs Skaven and they rework GS, it's in your opinion ok to say "oooh sorry guys we made some cheap units for this DLC because we have spend to mutch on the GS (FLC update)".
    I would like to have some more Empire DLC if it adds something useful and/or fun but that DLC needs to have some punch to it and not a 2 unit reskin fest (from Empire point of view).
  • Arcani_4_EverArcani_4_Ever Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,721
    Its too soon to give up on the Troglodon.

    The Dark Lands has one specific set of Islands, the Dragon Isles that have a large Lizardmen presence.

    I expect Oxoyotl to appear there in Part 3. After all we have a Slann LL, a Saurus LL (soon 2), a Skink LL, a Flyer LL and a Kroxigor LL.

    The only thing that the Lizardmen are missing is an LL that buffs Ranged Units. And Oxoyotl can fill that role, buffing Skink Skirmishers, Chameleon Skinks and the Ranged Monsters (Salamanders, Razordons and Howdahs for different monsters)
  • Arcani_4_EverArcani_4_Ever Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,721
    We also got several new variants of Slann both for Campaign and MP.
  • TWforumUN1989TWforumUN1989 Registered Users Posts: 221
    edited September 2019
  • MalalTheRenegadeMalalTheRenegade Registered Users Posts: 423
    Point 2,4,5,7,10,11,12 in "Pros" have nothing to do with the DLC. So even if you put a disclaimer about this, they are not arguments to buy this DLC (or at least to say that it is a good DLC).
  • Infinite_MawInfinite_Maw Registered Users Posts: 1,531
    I finally got a look at what archers and huntsmen looked like. Man do the huntsmen look bland in this game, originally I thought that what is now the hunter general was a huntsmen. Maybe it is just the faction colours, but the huntsman just don't feel very hunt-like.
  • alex33alex33 Registered Users Posts: 1,263
    And you know we‘ll never get the Troglodon cause? Same was said with the Bone Giant and we got it later.
  • PoorManatee6197PoorManatee6197 Registered Users Posts: 1,386
    Con:

    Kroxigor ancient is a lord despite the fact it doesn't make sense in the lore for a kroxigor to be smart enought to lead armies so he should have been a hero.
    #MakeDwarfsGreatAgain Josef Bugman, Thorek Ironbrow, Alrik Ranulfsson, Grimm Burloksson, Kazador Thunderhorn, Byrrnoth Grundadrakk, Malakai Makaisson, Gotrek Gurnisson, Garagrim, Dragon slayer, Deamon slayer, Doomseekers, Brotherhood of Grimnir, Giant slayers, Thunderbarge, Shieldbearer mount, Master brewer, Goblin Hewer, Norse dwarf war mammoth, Tractator engine, Rune golem, Shard dragon, proper Anvil of Doom, Ulther's dragon company, Lond Drong's slayer pirates, Everguard, Karak Varn, Karag Agrilwutraz, Silver Pinacle, Karag Dum, Karak Vlag, Kraka Dorden, Kraka Ornsmotek, Kraka Ravnsvake, Karak Vrag, Karak Azorn, Karak Krakaten.


    All those missing things are grudges in the great book, is in your hand to settle them, CA. Khazukan kazakit-ha!
  • mightygloinmightygloin Karaz-a-KarakRegistered Users Posts: 4,436
    Well written. Would also add few points:

    Pro: No crazy powercreep as far as we've seen and no arbitrary mounts.

    Cons:
    - Clone versions of LL's as generic lords diminish their uniqueness.
    - Mixed roles of Razordon and Salamander.
  • EarthDragonEarthDragon Registered Users Posts: 783
    Thinking that the new Empire units should be MP usable was foolhardy. This has been the standard folks. Why would they deviate? And how on earth could they ever keep MP under control or each faction unique with all campaign stuff added?

    This is honestly a bit of an ignorant mindset from folks griping about this. Its the best way to have broken units come to fruition without true consequence
  • SaborSabor Registered Users Posts: 570
    Edit: Removed several cons and added a few pros based upon CA's addressing of steam tank, knights of morr, and slann rework.

    @WaaaghCheif thank you. I added the narratives to pros and cons. I am not worried about Empire Engineer since I believe empire has a strong chance at another lord pack eventually.

    @crazycakeman Thank you for letting me know, upon checking reddit today they have confirmed the rework of Slanns/ Added to cons list accordingly.

    @jgmaster No, this is exactly the message I am trying to give. Unfortunately CA has stated that a portion of the budget for DLC's goes into old world reworks. If they did release a Skaven/Dark Elves DLC that was meh, but included a phenomenal Greenskins overhaul, that would be taken into my consideration for purchasing the product. CA does not need to do old world reworks, they do them because we begged them to. Only way that will still happen is through our continued support.

    @Arcani_4_Ever No necessarily giving up on the Trogolodon, I simply stated it will "probably" never happen. I am content with Lizardmen right now, if they never received another update I would be content with how they turned out. They have 6 lords, almost every possible unit from their last army book, AND the addition of their centerpiece Forgeworld model.

    @Jycce I disagree, all the points mentioned came from the DLC's budget. When I look at a DLC and consider its worth, I also consider the improvements to the game that CA has made and whether its worth it or not to continue supporting their efforts.

    @mightygloin Added your power creep pro, I considered your con about uniqueness, but i incorporated it into the con that Kroxigors are unloreful when leading armies.

    @EarthDragon I see your point of view, but it is still something the community as a whole disagrees about so I included it regardless.

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