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Making Sigvald Magnificent

GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203
I have been reading the Sigvald Novel, and it made me think... Sigvald needs some love (I know so does all Chaos) - I mean Slaanesh weeps at how much love he needs.

So I think there are 2 things he needs, first just a generally higher statline - he should really be one of the best duelists in the game and now he is just kinda a better Chaos Lord on foot, I guess this is a holdover from a more conservative approach in earlier days of the game. Second he needs an aura like Morathi to debuff an area around him to represent his beauty, maybe it would be weaker but also buff units related to Slaanesh a bit (or increase their MA and reduce MD, for example +4 and -2).

If his vanity could be done somehow that would be interesting but can't think of how without being super annoying.

Anyway what do people think about Siggy, any ideas?

Comments

  • SeanJeanquoiSeanJeanquoi Registered Users Posts: 2,663
    Doesn't he take a time out to just lounge/admire himself/do some Slaaneshi shenanigans sometimes?

    They could give him a Slacking type ability where hes super powerful but has a chance to also stop fighting.

    Could be kinda like Gotrek/Tyrions healing abilities but focused on damage.

    He needs to be far more sturdy as well. Foot Lords still aren't fixed somehow ;_;
  • DeathsDayOffDeathsDayOff Registered Users Posts: 479
    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203

    Doesn't he take a time out to just lounge/admire himself/do some Slaaneshi shenanigans sometimes?

    They could give him a Slacking type ability where hes super powerful but has a chance to also stop fighting.

    Could be kinda like Gotrek/Tyrions healing abilities but focused on damage.

    He needs to be far more sturdy as well. Foot Lords still aren't fixed somehow ;_;

    Yeah that is what I was refering to about vanity, I was thinking like rampage it might come out as a bit irritating. However it just occurred to me, maybe after each attack landed or hit taken (he needs to check himself for out of place hair, dirt etc of course) there could be a chance for a massive drop in Ma and MD (maybe -60%) for a few seconds.

    Yeah he should technically be one of the toughest LLs, he should also be an amazing duelist with high AP (his weapon is literally a part of Slaanesh's, I doubt there's much it couldn't cut).
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
  • RikRiorikRikRiorik Registered Users Posts: 8,420
    edited April 1
    I associate Slaanesh with speed and litheness so anything to represent that. Fast, hard hitting, evades with ease but can't take a hit.

    If you go full on personal skills with him he's got (with no additional gear except his own legendary stuff):

    152 armour
    110 melee attack
    102 melee defence
    702 weapon strength (when attacking)
    75 charge bonus

    I think he is pretty fine as is when it comes to stats but would maybe give him an ability like Wulfrik's Hunter of Champions that instead of making of making the target lose armour, melee defence and speed would instead increase his own or at least make the opposing enemy character lose armour penetration and melee attack whilst giving Sigvald a speed increase.
    Lord of the Undermountain and your friendly neighbourhood giant (Dwarf)
    Favourite campaigns: Clan Angrund, Followers of Nagash and the new Huntsmarshall’s Expedition
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 2,051
    Goatforce said:

    Doesn't he take a time out to just lounge/admire himself/do some Slaaneshi shenanigans sometimes?

    They could give him a Slacking type ability where hes super powerful but has a chance to also stop fighting.

    Could be kinda like Gotrek/Tyrions healing abilities but focused on damage.

    He needs to be far more sturdy as well. Foot Lords still aren't fixed somehow ;_;

    Yeah that is what I was refering to about vanity, I was thinking like rampage it might come out as a bit irritating. However it just occurred to me, maybe after each attack landed or hit taken (he needs to check himself for out of place hair, dirt etc of course) there could be a chance for a massive drop in Ma and MD (maybe -60%) for a few seconds.

    Yeah he should technically be one of the toughest LLs, he should also be an amazing duelist with high AP (his weapon is literally a part of Slaanesh's, I doubt there's much it couldn't cut).
    I think this is a bit exaggerated. He is good, but there are many on par or better, he's not on the level of Tyrion. Also, his weapon had no armour piercing effects on TT, not every single character needs to be anti-armour.

    It would be nice if he had some mechanic to make him a bit unpredictable, but CA has stayed away from such mechanics so far.
  • TsuyaraTsuyara Registered Users Posts: 244
    His statline is one of the best in the game, the only one with a better one is Tyrion. He is actually, if anything, overstatted. He was a WS8, same as Wulfrik, Belegar, Chaos lords etc. and worse than Ungrim, Tyrion and Archeon.
    He should most certainly not have AP. It's known for it's speed (it confered always strike first and +2attacks in the TT, neither helping against armour).
    There are so many in line that are more deserving of being AP (i.e. Boris with his runefang, which pretty much only has the purpose of cutting through armour), but if anything, we need to scale back on the whole AP inflation, it's getting silly.
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203
    RikRiorik said:

    I associate Slaanesh with speed and litheness so anything to represent that. Fast, hard hitting, evades with ease but can't take a hit.

    If you go full on personal skills with him he's got (with no additional gear except his own legendary stuff):

    152 armour
    110 melee attack
    102 melee defence
    702 weapon strength (when attacking)
    75 charge bonus

    I think he is pretty fine as is when it comes to stats but would maybe give him an ability like Wulfrik's Hunter of Champions that instead of making of making the target lose armour, melee defence and speed would instead increase his own or at least make the opposing enemy character lose armour penetration and melee attack whilst giving Sigvald a speed increase.

    Hmmm, good point, had another look at his stat profile and it is better than I originally thought (I had looked at it but not compared it much to others), though could perhaps do with a bit more speed.

    Yeah that would be good, he could do with some abilities.... maybe my issue is mostly that he seems a little bland - he is Slaanesh's favoured son and plays like a better chaos lord (but with no mount), some bells and whistles would be good, an aura, a targeted ability something to represent his getting distracted (I think the small chance to have a debuff I mentioned might be a good way to represent it, perhaps with a buff triggering afterwards to represent an enraged state from getting disheveled). He is be flambouyant and unpredictable and I think it would make him much more interesting if that was represented, as now he is a better but mountless Chaos Lord (admittedly with regen).

    .... perhaps Sliverslash could have a active ability that increases attack speed, I don't believe we have seen that before and would fit perfectly
  • DeathsDayOffDeathsDayOff Registered Users Posts: 479
    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    He went to Ulthuan and then **** off when he threw a hissy fit, very anticlimactic, and boring, just like him, his entire story is that he didn't work for anything, which as I said I get, but I don't like anything about him except the fact he got **** on after he died, getting handed power just sets him up to be as lame as rey, I don't demand a montage of him training, but if he even alluded to him having any problems until after he was given everything he'd be mildly interesting
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203

    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    He went to Ulthuan and then **** off when he threw a hissy fit, very anticlimactic, and boring, just like him, his entire story is that he didn't work for anything, which as I said I get, but I don't like anything about him except the fact he got **** on after he died, getting handed power just sets him up to be as lame as rey, I don't demand a montage of him training, but if he even alluded to him having any problems until after he was given everything he'd be mildly interesting
    He didn't throw a hissy fit (in that instance), he got angry at Bretonnia and went off to attack them, he has a short attention span. If you didn't like that thats fine but a lot of people like Sigvald because he is hilarious in how nuts and quicksilver he is.

    Besides your liking or disliking the character is fairly irrelevent to the discussion, which is about better representing a character.
  • DeathsDayOffDeathsDayOff Registered Users Posts: 479
    Goatforce said:

    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    Goatforce said:

    With what I know about sigvald I'd like if at the start of the battle there was 90% chance he'd put his **** in his ass so he could **** himself, because he was boring to me, as 80% of the lore I've heard was he was pretty, and he didn't really have to do anything, I get he's supposed to be spoiled, but that doesn't mean I have to like the outcome of it

    He has invaded Ulthuan, fought Galrouch and survived (just), wields a god weapon. Yeah he is a spoiled brat, lazy and vain, but he is supposed to be one of the best duelists in the WH world and that is not represented in the game.
    He went to Ulthuan and then **** off when he threw a hissy fit, very anticlimactic, and boring, just like him, his entire story is that he didn't work for anything, which as I said I get, but I don't like anything about him except the fact he got **** on after he died, getting handed power just sets him up to be as lame as rey, I don't demand a montage of him training, but if he even alluded to him having any problems until after he was given everything he'd be mildly interesting
    He didn't throw a hissy fit (in that instance), he got angry at Bretonnia and went off to attack them, he has a short attention span. If you didn't like that thats fine but a lot of people like Sigvald because he is hilarious in how nuts and quicksilver he is.

    Besides your liking or disliking the character is fairly irrelevent to the discussion, which is about better representing a character.
    Which is why my statement was orginally just placing my opinion on the character, as the point of a comment sections is to say your peace, I said mine, then we talked, nothing outside of the ordinary, beyond that he definitely threw a hissy fit, he got mad about the color of blood and walked off, that is most definitely a hissy fit, the only reason I know as much about him as I do is because loremaster of sotek has a great storytelling method.

    And I don't have a problem with how nutty as that got a few chuckles, it's more about in the end I find characters that are spoiled to be either boring or annoying
  • SchwarzhelmSchwarzhelm Registered Users Posts: 1,217
    edited April 2
    I also read the novel, it was fantastic!
    Sigvald is a great character and his background is quite tragic, like manfred he suffers from the bad end times story telling (imho).

    Maybe we could go another way with him and don't make him better in combat but more of an buffer?
    At least in his background story he draws people to him, he is unbelievable charismatic and his man seem to go the death for him in admiration.

    Sigvald is already hard to kill so he could be more valid in combat when he gets strong active and passive buffs,
    a bit like Volkmar.
  • andrewbh2003andrewbh2003 Registered Users Posts: 109
    afaik sigvald is nothing more than a tank

    he is a duelist that lacks AP meaning ANY actual duelist like tyrion queek wulfrik "even thorgrim" are gonna make him struggle even if his general stat-line is a bit bonkers but thats more to compensate for lack of AP

    another thing is he is a foot lord duelist characters like tyrion are good cause they have tools to sit on there target "sunfang" and the mobility to catch and force an engagement with there target "His horse and abilities like hunter of champions in wulfricks case"

    sigvald is in the same area as queek a duelist character that cant duel cause of mobility but at least queek gets verminous valour and trophy heads and while queek is a duelist he is also not bad at all at fighting infantry "105 MA base vs infantry decent splash HUGE AP 110 armour is nothing to scoff at" queek is more of a generalist rather than a specialist so he gets a pass

    what does sigvald get a good statline without AP and regeneration... thats it thats literally it he has no AOE slow/debuff he has no sunfang he has no hunter of champions he has a item "Not even a base ability" that gives him regen

    sigvalds entire niche is that he is a tanky footlord sure if your scared of getting lord-sniped then sure go for it but come on archaon and kholeak are some of the most powerfull lords in the game archaon with slayer of kings active literally DELETES anything in the game and archaon can actually go fight tyrion and depending on RNG and use of abilities can actually win one of the only characters in the game that can claim to do so

    siggy is basically the forgotten bastard child of legendary lords like in my chaos campaign i actually didnt even recruit him as a generic chaos lord on a dragon is actually straight up better as the dragon has breath attacks huge ap and charge bonus great mobility good stats and mobile fear and terror he is just so much more impactfull than sigvald

    like no matter if you are a campaign player or a MP player he sucks "his literal only saving grace is that he is cheap in MP at only 1300 gold but even then if you do use him as a lord you have to spend another 800+ to get a caster so your just better bringing a chaos sorcerer lord who is both cheaper and much more impactfull especially if on a dragon"

    lets just say theres a reason why sigvald is a massive meme

    like he straight up needs a rework being a tank is not a bad thing being a tank that can literally just be ignored IS like he should have abilities that mirror morathi and her aoe debuffs the heartrender sword + enchanting beauty

    sigvald should debuff every enemy near him and buff everything around him give him aoe armour sunder under certain scenarios

    aoe leadership buff/debuff for enemies/friends

    and AOE MA debuff

    if you gave him that he would be actually decent at a AOE frontline support that is also really really hard to kill

    also in campaign while his stats may look juicy with a yellow line there is 1 stat that cant be changed and that is splash DMG sigvald due to the fact he is a "duelist" has very low splash AOE dmg and that straight up makes it take him forever to cut through stuff so even in campaign with a great stat-line he is still not that great
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Registered Users Posts: 3,758
    He needs more AP and an aura to debuff MA.
  • Xenos7Xenos7 Registered Users Posts: 5,663
    He should float above ground
  • yolordmcswagyolordmcswag Registered Users Posts: 2,051
    Several people in this thread are complaining that Sigvald is "just a better chaos lord", but that is exactly what he is suppoesed to be. They are also complaining about his lack of armour-piercing damage, but that is not something he should have to begin begin what.

    On TT, Sigvald was just a better chaos lord. His weapon warrants him being a decent infantry blender, not a good duellist at all. One of his other main advantages was his high leadership, rivalled only by Archaon in the chaos warriors roster. So if anything, Sigvald should have leadership bonuses for nearby troops, and good anti-infantry abilities, no duellist skills or debuffs, he did not have debuffs like Morathi has.

    To make him properly viable a rework of infantry characters in general is needed. More penalties for monster riders, and the ability to redirect damage to nearby troops of the same type for infantry/ regular cavalry lords is needed. Not artificial buffs to turn each individual infantry lord into something they are not supposed to be.
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203

    Several people in this thread are complaining that Sigvald is "just a better chaos lord", but that is exactly what he is suppoesed to be. They are also complaining about his lack of armour-piercing damage, but that is not something he should have to begin begin what.

    On TT, Sigvald was just a better chaos lord. His weapon warrants him being a decent infantry blender, not a good duellist at all. One of his other main advantages was his high leadership, rivalled only by Archaon in the chaos warriors roster. So if anything, Sigvald should have leadership bonuses for nearby troops, and good anti-infantry abilities, no duellist skills or debuffs, he did not have debuffs like Morathi has.

    To make him properly viable a rework of infantry characters in general is needed. More penalties for monster riders, and the ability to redirect damage to nearby troops of the same type for infantry/ regular cavalry lords is needed. Not artificial buffs to turn each individual infantry lord into something they are not supposed to be.

    Yes TT doesn't represent the character extremely well unfortunately. And the translation to TW has cut away more, sadly it seems quite hard to find the 8th Ed rules for him online but as I recall he had the stupidity rule to represent his stopping to admire himself which isn't in.

    Now I'm not saying that characters should just be the over the top ridiculousness that is in the lore but Legendary Lords should be just that, it would be fairly easy to add the flavour that would represent and differentiate his character by just adding a Morathi style aura, and maybe when he takes damage have there be a small chance af a temporary stat drop to represent him checking on himself with maybe a small temporary boost afterwards when he realises he's ok or is enraged at being defaced which would be flavourful and make him more unpredictable and fun to use, as he should be.
  • Mogwai_ManMogwai_Man Registered Users Posts: 3,758
    Just give him a horse already. Plenty of characters already got mounts that they shouldn't have anyway.
  • GoatforceGoatforce Registered Users Posts: 4,203

    Just give him a horse already. Plenty of characters already got mounts that they shouldn't have anyway.

    If he does get a mount some form of Slaaneshi steed would be better I think. I am happy him remaining as a foot lord but think he needs more flavour in his profile and stuff that is already in game would perfectly reflect his lore, even if he gets weaker or tweakedversions of stuff like Morathi's enchanting beauty aura.
  • Xenos7Xenos7 Registered Users Posts: 5,663

    Just give him a horse already. Plenty of characters already got mounts that they shouldn't have anyway.

    He's supposed to float like Spellsingers out of sheer vanity. That's why he doesn't have a horse in the lore.
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