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New forum feature-take two

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  • ShiroAmakusa75ShiroAmakusa75 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 31,771
    Itharus said:

    This is why republics > pure democracies, lol.

    Ah, a fellow veteran player of Sid Meier's first Civilisation title! "Republic" and "democracy" concern different matters entirely. Democracy means the government justifies its mandate to rule by popular acclamation (whether that's actually true is irrelevant), republic just means that the state isn't a hereditary monarchy, so any autocratic banana republic run by some tinpot dictator is a republic as long as the dictator's offspring doesn't have a right to succeed their parent.

  • ItharusItharus Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 12,341

    Itharus said:

    This is why republics > pure democracies, lol.

    Ah, a fellow veteran player of Sid Meier's first Civilisation title! "Republic" and "democracy" concern different matters entirely. Democracy means the government justifies its mandate to rule by popular acclamation (whether that's actually true is irrelevant), republic just means that the state isn't a hereditary monarchy, so any autocratic banana republic run by some tinpot dictator is a republic as long as the dictator's offspring doesn't have a right to succeed their parent.
    TBF it's muddier than that, even, depending on what definitions you're looking at.

    Republics are by nature democratic (indirectly), as it is citizens (or certain classes of citizens) who elect representatives and the like and they are beholden to some fundamental laws that limit what can and cannot be done (in theory). See: Roman Republic.

    A democracy, traditionally, refers to a direct-democracy in which the voting citizens directly control everything by vote and is fully under the thumb of the majority of the voting class. Who counts as eligible to vote can be broad or narrow, the key is that they have a direct vote, not votes issued via representatives. See: Athenian Empire.

    That's the difference I was going for. And yes there are hybrids for days... but I can't go into examples without offending a snowflake somewhere and calling down the wrath of the moderators over the new silly rules that try to make sure no one ever sees something they find averse.
  • ShiroAmakusa75ShiroAmakusa75 Senior Member Registered Users Posts: 31,771
    edited April 15
    Itharus said:



    Republics are by nature democratic (indirectly), as it is citizens (or certain classes of citizens) who elect representatives and the like and they are beholden to some fundamental laws that limit what can and cannot be done (in theory). See: Roman Republic.

    No, that's a rechtsstaat or constitutional state. Rome became a republic by virtue of expelling its kings. If they had gone down the same path but crowned Lucius Brutus king, it would be a Roman Kingdom, but could still be a constitutional state if said king was subject to the same laws.
    Itharus said:

    A democracy, traditionally, refers to a direct-democracy in which the voting citizens directly control everything by vote and is fully under the thumb of the majority of the voting class. Who counts as eligible to vote can be broad or narrow, the key is that they have a direct vote, not votes issued via representatives. See: Athenian Empire.

    That's a direct democracy, which is a type of democracy, but not the only one. And Athens, on account of chasing out its last king, Peisistratos, and replacing him with an eligible govermnent was also a republic. And the greater polity that came to be led by Athens was called the Delian League. "Athenian Empire" is an informal term to mock the tyrannical way Athens treated the other member-states in said league.

    But yeah, if we want to debate pol-sci, we better keep it to PMs.




  • dge1dge1 Moderator Arkansas, USARegistered Users, Moderators, Knights Posts: 21,636
    edited April 16
    Certainly not a Warhammer discussion. Moved
    "The two most common things in the universe are Hydrogen and Stupidity." - Harlan Ellison
    "The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously." - Hubert H. Humphrey
    "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin/Mark Twain
    “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”–George Santayana, The Life of Reason, 1905.

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